Archive-Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 18:18:51 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 18:19:55 -0700
From: Ric Goldman <timelord01-AT-
sprynet.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Update on Northern California Renaissance Faire day of dance
To: List - Morris Dancing Discussion List <MORRIS-AT-
LISTSERV.IUPUI.EDU>, BACDS Squires <bacds-squires-AT-
bacds.org>
CC: Bay Area Community Dance <ba-community-dance-AT-
bacds.org>, BACDS Announce <bacds-announce-AT-
bacds.org>, other-morris-contacts-AT-
rgoldman.org, Greg Hamburg <ghamburg-AT-
vom.com>
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sprynet.com>
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Folks,

Here's a reminder and new news about Apple Tree Morris' day of dance, October 6, 2001, at the Northern California Renaissance Faire at Nut Tree in Vacaville California.

Now instead of a long email, there's a web page with the latest info on schedule, how to sign up, things to bring, stuff to do, and how to get there.  We've included links to stuff about the Faire, about the event, and stuff general nonsense, and even a service to send you a personal email when the web page changes.

   http://timelord01.home.sprynet.com/renfaire_morris.htm

We're looking forward to making this as big and as fun an event as possible.  Feel free to sign up as a team or as an individual.  Squires - please pass this info on to your teammates.  Everyone else - please check out the web page and pass this notice on to anyone who might be interested.

Thanx very much.

Ric Goldman
timelord01-AT-
sprynet.com
http://connect.to/ric

On behalf of Greg Hamburg, Apple Tree Morris
ghamburg-AT-
vom.com

P.S.  Apologies in advance for any list duplications

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 21:19:52 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:12:30 -0500
From: Paul Stamler <pstamler-AT-
pobox.com>
Subject: Contra or ECD in TN or NC?
To: ecd list <ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
CC: Mac McKeever <macmkvr-AT-
aol.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
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paulstam>
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Hi folks:

Is anyone on the list aware of either ECD or contra groups in eastern
Tennessee or northwestern North Carolina? Thanks in advance!

Peace,
Paul

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 15:14:59 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 18:15:32 -0400
From: "Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Contra or ECD in TN or NC?
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B97F584.D3D5A73-AT-
sprintmail.com>
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paulstam>


Dear Paul,
    There is an ECD group in Konoxville, TN. It meets Sundays and
Mondays. Call Jubillee Community Arts (423-522-5851) or Mark Smith
(423-220-5480) for details. Last time I was there, some years ago, the
band was loaded with period instruments; it was great. There's also a
group in Nashville, if you want to go that far west. I don't know
anything about it. You might try the CDSS web site for more information.
    In North Carolina, there's a long standing group at the John C.
Cambell Folk School in Brasstown. Email Bob Dalsemer (bob-AT-
folkschool.com)
for more information and give him my regards. Also there are groups in
Ashville to my knowledge but I haven't danced with them. Again try CDSS
to learn more.

Happy dancing,
Albert

Paul Stamler wrote (in part):

"Is anyone on the list aware of either ECD or contra groups in eastern
Tennessee or northwestern North Carolina? Thanks in advance!"


--
Albert Blank
e-mail: fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 17:39:04 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 20:45:07 -0400
From: Brown David <dbrown-AT-
usit.net>
Subject: RE: Contra or ECD in TN or NC?
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <4120019570457290-AT-
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Paul

    There is ECD at the Laurel Theatre in Knoxville,Tn. 
Call Karen at to 865-522-5851. This is a fun group and we do performances also. 
Good luck

    dave


----- Original Message ----- 

From: Paul Stamler  


To: ecd list 
Cc: Mac McKeever 

Sent: 9/6/2001 12:19:56 AM 

Subject: Contra or ECD in TN or NC?





Hi folks:

 

Is anyone on the list aware of either ECD or contra groups in eastern

Tennessee or northwestern North Carolina? Thanks in advance!

 

Peace,

Paul

 




 

--- Brown David

--- dbrown-AT-
usit.net 

--- EarthLink: It's your Internet.

--Boundary_(ID_UINbkOZP3yj6lUSecKsatA)
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=windows-1251">
<META content="MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV>Paul</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;There is ECD at the Laurel Theatre in Knoxville,Tn. Call Karen at to 865-522-5851. This is a fun group and we do performances also. Good luck</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;dave</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=pstamler-AT-
pobox.com href="mailto:pstamler-AT-
pobox.com">Paul Stamler</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To: </B><A title=pstamler-AT-
pobox.com href="mailto:pstamler-AT-
pobox.com">ecd list</A>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc: </B><A title=pstamler-AT-
pobox.com href="mailto:pstamler-AT-
pobox.com">Mac McKeever</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> 9/6/2001 12:19:56 AM </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Contra or ECD in TN or NC?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT size=2>
<P>
<DIV>Hi folks:</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Is anyone on the list aware of either ECD or contra groups in eastern</DIV>
<DIV>Tennessee or northwestern North Carolina? Thanks in advance!</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Peace,</DIV>
<DIV>Paul</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<P></P></FONT>
<P></P></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>--- Brown David</DIV>
<DIV>--- <A href="mailto:dbrown-AT-
usit.net">dbrown-AT-
usit.net</A></DIV>
<DIV>--- EarthLink: It's your Internet.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 04:19:54 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 08:21:24 -0300
From: John Wood <johnwood-AT-
accesscable.net>
Subject: Draw Poussettes
To: English Country Dancing <ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
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Hi, Folk:

Please can you help me with the titles
of dances which contain the formation

"draw poussette"?

Regards, John

Bedford, Nova Scotia

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 05:11:36 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 05:10:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing <winston-AT-
SLAC.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <01K81KZPN3IWAA0RTA-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
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> Hi, Folk:

> Please can you help me with the titles
> of dances which contain the formation

> "draw poussette"?

The First Lady
Evergreen
The Road to Ruin

are some.  Why do you ask?

-- Alan



===============================================================================
 Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
 Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056
 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025
===============================================================================

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 09:54:01 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 09:52:31 -0700
From: Chris Sackett & Brooke Friendly <friendsack-AT-
opendoor.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B98FB4E.23EAF7CA-AT-
opendoor.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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References: <01K81KZPN3IWAA0RTA-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>

Heather Towers
A Health to All Honest Men
Braye's Maggot
Cupid Disarm'd

are some others

Brooke

Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:

> > Hi, Folk:
>
> > Please can you help me with the titles
> > of dances which contain the formation
>
> > "draw poussette"?
>
> The First Lady
> Evergreen
> The Road to Ruin
>
> are some.  Why do you ask?
>
> -- Alan
>
> ===============================================================================
>  Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
>  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056
>  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025
> ===============================================================================

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 10:31:29 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 19:27:16 +0200
From: Antony Heywood <antony-AT-
iae.nl>
Subject: RE: Contra or ECD in TN or NC?
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <LPBBKMBNMCGKNDDELPCMKEILDAAA.antony-AT-
iae.nl>
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John Wood  wrote:

>  Please can you help me with the titles of dances which contain the
formation "draw poussette"?

My database of 4870 dances (and growing) shows up the following as having
got a DRAW POUSSETTE although I haven't cross checked with the original
dance descriptions to see if it's a proper draw poussette or just something
similar (e.g. you sometines come across one couple doing a U-movement while
the other couple does a normal in-and-out poussette). --- Antony Heywood

Vermont Friends

Shepherd's Delight

Gentleman Caller, The

Man was for Woman Made

Juliana 3

Cupid Disarm'd 2

Jerbourg

One is One and all alone

Mr Englefield's New Hornpipe

Wallington Diamond Jubilee

Marli Water Works

Hampstead Heath

Christine, Come Dance with us

Prince William's Return

Hampstead Manor

Road to Ruin, The

Duchess of Grafton

Heather Towers

Jain's Balance

First Lady, The

Captain Macintosh

Sulking Virgin

Jog On

John the Madman

Princess, The

Saucy Sailor 2, The

Spectator Special

Queen Bess's Dame of Honour

Fleur de Lis

Bottle Brush, The

Boys of Wexford, The

JDK's Festival

March Hare, The

Priory Gardens, The

Wingletang Down

Somesuch

Health to All Honest Men, A

Old World and the New, The

Evergreen

To Have and to Hold

Aunt Kit's Reel

Polly's Waltz

Gloup, The

Great Hall, The

Lovelorn

Sleeping in the Attick

Watkin's Ale

Have & To Hold, To

Maggott for Mr Purcell, A

Garden Assembly, The

Bright with Joy



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<BODY>
<DIV>
<P><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT face=Arial>John Wood<SPAN 
class=670453713-07092001>&nbsp;&nbsp;</SPAN><SPAN 
class=670453713-07092001>wrote:</SPAN></FONT></FONT></P><SPAN 
class=670453713-07092001>
<P><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><SPAN class=670453713-07092001>&gt; 
&nbsp;</SPAN>Please can you help me with the titles<SPAN 
class=390374413-07092001> </SPAN>of dances which contain the formation<SPAN 
class=390374413-07092001> </SPAN></FONT></FONT><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff>"draw poussette"?</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff><SPAN class=390374413-07092001>My database of 
4870 dances (and growing) shows up the following as having got a DRAW POUSSETTE 
although I haven't cross checked with the original dance descriptions to see if 
it's a proper draw poussette or just something similar (e.g. you sometines come 
across one couple doing a U-movement while the other couple does a normal 
in-and-out poussette). --- Antony Heywood</SPAN></FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff><SPAN 
class=390374413-07092001></SPAN></FONT><FONT color=#0000ff><SPAN 
class=390374413-07092001><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Vermont 
Friends</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Shepherd's Delight</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Gentleman Caller, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Man was for Woman Made</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#000000>Juliana 3</FONT></FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Cupid Disarm'd 2</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Jerbourg</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>One is One and all alone</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Mr Englefield's New Hornpipe</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Wallington Diamond Jubilee</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Marli Water Works</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Hampstead Heath</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Christine, Come Dance with us</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Prince William's Return</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Hampstead Manor</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Road to Ruin, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Duchess of Grafton</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Heather Towers</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Jain's Balance</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>First Lady, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Captain Macintosh</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Sulking Virgin</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Jog On</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>John the Madman</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Princess, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Saucy Sailor 2, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Spectator Special</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Queen Bess's Dame of Honour</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Fleur de Lis</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Bottle Brush, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Boys of Wexford, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>JDK's Festival</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>March Hare, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Priory Gardens, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Wingletang Down</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Somesuch</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Health to All Honest Men, A</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Old World and the New, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Evergreen</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>To Have and to Hold</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Aunt Kit's Reel</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Polly's Waltz</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Gloup, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Great Hall, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Lovelorn</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Sleeping in the Attick</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Watkin's Ale</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Have &amp; To Hold, To</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Maggott for Mr Purcell, A</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Garden Assembly, The</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial color=#000000>Bright with Joy</FONT></P><SPAN 
class=670453713-07092001>
<P><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff></FONT></P></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 13:01:23 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 17:02:51 -0300
From: John Wood <johnwood-AT-
accesscable.net>
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes [2]
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <3B9927EB.3D71D667-AT-
accesscable.net>
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References: <01K81KZPN3IWAA0RTA-AT-
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Thank you, Alan:

> Why do you ask?

I spent a week at Pinewoods and came across
"draw poussette" in two dances during the week--
and failed to note down the names of the dances!

The movement intrigued me and I would like
to try it out in my class.

regards, John

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 13:12:57 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 17:14:26 -0300
From: John Wood <johnwood-AT-
accesscable.net>
Subject: Draw Poussettes [2]
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <3B992AA2.7C3DF5E0-AT-
accesscable.net>
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Hi, Antony:

> Please can you help me with the titles of dances which contain the formation"draw poussette"?

I could not ask for anything more!!

Thank you for taking the trouble to reply to my request.

Regards, John

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<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
Hi, Antony:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF">Please can
you help me with the titles of dances which contain the formation"draw
poussette"?</font></font></blockquote>
I could not ask for anything more!!
<p>Thank you for taking the trouble to reply to my request.
<p>Regards, John</html>

--Boundary_(ID_+U2FSuzjvPKWC0uB5nIZRg)--
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 15:58:14 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 16:06:07 -0700
From: Janet Arnold <jimjanet-AT-
home.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <00bb01c137f1$ad6359e0$a1070518-AT-
elcjn1.sdca.home.com>
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Not to seem ignorant but......What is a Draw Poussette?
Janet

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing" <winston-AT-
SLAC.Stanford.EDU>
To: <ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2001 5:10 AM
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes


>
> > Hi, Folk:
>
> > Please can you help me with the titles
> > of dances which contain the formation
>
> > "draw poussette"?
>
> The First Lady
> Evergreen
> The Road to Ruin
>
> are some.  Why do you ask?
>
> -- Alan
>
>
>
>
============================================================================
===
>  Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
>  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:
650/926-3056
>  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA
94025
>
============================================================================
===
>

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 16:52:21 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 15:58:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing <winston-AT-
SLAC.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <01K829GIABVWA9U0TP-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
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Janet Arnold wrote:

> Not to seem ignorant but......What is a Draw Poussette?

Well, you know how in a regular poussette (as interpreted in modern  ECD; let's
not confused with RSCDS dance or any historical poussette) both people stay
facing the same floor direction all the time, but spend half the time traveling
diagonally forward and half the time traveling diagonally back?  (This has
caused some people to call a half poussette "a back to  back for couples.")

And you know how the floor track of the couple (not the individuals) is
more-or-less a half circle?  (Or in some interpretations, a pointy thing like
/\.)

In a draw poussette, the floor track is pretty much the same as in a regular
poussette, but one partner backs up along the track all the way while the other
goes forward along the track all the way.  (The thinking is that the partner
backing up is drawing the other one along.)  As a result, after half a draw
poussette, the couple has changed sides - gone from proper to improper, or vice
versa.

This turns out to be very handy choreographically, if you've got one couple
proper and one improper and need to get both to be the same; you can specify
that one couple do a half poussette and one do a half draw poussette (as seen
in "The First Lady"), and you get everybody progressed and proper in 
(usually) four satisfying bars of music with everybody moving.

Whole poussettes, regular or vanilla, end up in the same place and same
orientation as they start in, so this choreographic benefit isn't available
for a whole draw poussette - that may be why you don't see many of them.

-- Alan




===============================================================================
 Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
 Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056
 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025
===============================================================================

================================================================================
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Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2001 15:09:20 -0700
From: Janet Arnold <jimjanet-AT-
home.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
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SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>

thank you.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing" <winston-AT-
SLAC.Stanford.EDU>
To: <ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2001 3:58 PM
Subject: Re: Draw Poussettes


> Janet Arnold wrote:
>
> > Not to seem ignorant but......What is a Draw Poussette?
>
> Well, you know how in a regular poussette (as interpreted in modern  ECD;
let's
> not confused with RSCDS dance or any historical poussette) both people
stay
> facing the same floor direction all the time, but spend half the time
traveling
> diagonally forward and half the time traveling diagonally back?  (This has
> caused some people to call a half poussette "a back to  back for
couples.")
>
> And you know how the floor track of the couple (not the individuals) is
> more-or-less a half circle?  (Or in some interpretations, a pointy thing
like
> /\.)
>
> In a draw poussette, the floor track is pretty much the same as in a
regular
> poussette, but one partner backs up along the track all the way while the
other
> goes forward along the track all the way.  (The thinking is that the
partner
> backing up is drawing the other one along.)  As a result, after half a
draw
> poussette, the couple has changed sides - gone from proper to improper, or
vice
> versa.
>
> This turns out to be very handy choreographically, if you've got one
couple
> proper and one improper and need to get both to be the same; you can
specify
> that one couple do a half poussette and one do a half draw poussette (as
seen
> in "The First Lady"), and you get everybody progressed and proper in
> (usually) four satisfying bars of music with everybody moving.
>
> Whole poussettes, regular or vanilla, end up in the same place and same
> orientation as they start in, so this choreographic benefit isn't
available
> for a whole draw poussette - that may be why you don't see many of them.
>
> -- Alan
>
>
>
>
>
============================================================================
===
>  Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
>  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:
650/926-3056
>  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA
94025
>
============================================================================
===
>
>

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 09:19:51 PST
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Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 17:19:32 +0100
From: Alan Corkett <alan-AT-
bcorkett.freeserve.co.uk>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Fw: Information please !
To: EngCountryDance <ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
CC: Geoff Elwell <geoff-AT-
gelwell.freeserve.co.uk>
Message-ID: <003101c1394b$37578ea0$186187d9-AT-
default>
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

--Boundary_(ID_8QgnQ/KQ/+hnUkf33GlAfw)
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Can anyone oblige here!
Alan
-----Original Message-----
From: Geoff Elwell <geoff-AT-
gelwell.freeserve.co.uk>
To: Alan Corkett <alan-AT-
bcorkett.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: 09 September 2001 12:05
Subject: Information please !


Hi Alan do you happen to have an e-mail address for Ken McFarland who has visited Halsway with groups from America in the past? If so could you let me have it.
Thanks Geoff.

--Boundary_(ID_8QgnQ/KQ/+hnUkf33GlAfw)
Content-type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=text/html;charset=iso-8859-1 http-equiv=Content-Type><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content='"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>

</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT color=#0000ff size=2>Can anyone oblige 
here!</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></STRONG><STRONG><FONT 
color=#0000ff size=2>Alan</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><B>-----Original Message-----</B><BR><B>From: 
</B>Geoff Elwell &lt;<A 
href="mailto:geoff-AT-
gelwell.freeserve.co.uk">geoff-AT-
gelwell.freeserve.co.uk</A>&gt;<BR><B>To: 
</B>Alan Corkett &lt;<A 
href="mailto:alan-AT-
bcorkett.freeserve.co.uk">alan-AT-
bcorkett.freeserve.co.uk</A>&gt;<BR><B>Date: 
</B>09 September 2001 12:05<BR><B>Subject: </B>Information please 
!<BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi Alan </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>do you 
happen to have an e-mail address for Ken McFarland who has visited Halsway with 
groups from America in the past? If so could you let me have it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thanks Geoff.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

--Boundary_(ID_8QgnQ/KQ/+hnUkf33GlAfw)--
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 10:16:18 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 13:10:44 -0400
From: Beatrice Huppert <bhuppert-AT-
juno.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Fw: Information please !
To: ECD-AT-
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juno.com>
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Ken McFarland's e mail

farland-AT-
ptlalaska.net
________________________________________________________________
GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
Join Juno today!  For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
================================================================================
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Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 18:03:32 -0300
From: John Wood <johnwood-AT-
accesscable.net>
Subject: Re: Fw: Information [2]
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
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--Boundary_(ID_0INiwm9pI5sq/xIX0d8/sw)
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Hi, Alan:

>  Alan do you happen to have an e-mail address for Ken McFarland who has visited Halsway with groups from America in the past? If so could
> you let me have it.

Yes:

Ken McFarland <farlands-AT-
ptialaska.net>

Cheers, John
 
 
 

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<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
<body bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
Hi, Alan:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>&nbsp;Alan do you
happen to have an e-mail address for Ken McFarland who has visited Halsway
with groups from America in the past? If so could you let me have it.</font></font></blockquote>
Yes:
<p>Ken McFarland &lt;farlands-AT-
ptialaska.net>
<p>Cheers, John
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
</body>
</html>

--Boundary_(ID_0INiwm9pI5sq/xIX0d8/sw)--
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 16:31:28 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 19:34:55 -0400
From: Sharon Green <mls-AT-
panix.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Fw: Information please !
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <4.1.20010909193326.00c86500-AT-
popserver.panix.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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At 01:10 PM 9/9/01 -0400, you wrote:
>Ken McFarland's e mail
>
>farland-AT-
ptlalaska.net

I believe this actually is Ken's address: I copied it from his last email
to me.

farlands-AT-
ptialaska.net

================================================================================
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Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 21:40:58 -0700
From: Laurie Andres <lcandres-AT-
earthlink.net>
Subject: Pousettes
To: ECD Discussion List <ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
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Does anyone out there in the ether have historical source directions
for the travelling direction of pousettes? I find reconstructions
where the first man always starts by pushing, without regard to if he
is in 1st or 2nd place, unsatisfying. My feeling is pousettes should
always start in the same direction, clockwise, irregardless of
anyone's position.

Laurie Andres


================================================================================
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Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 10:45:56 -0400
From: "Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Pousettes
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
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Dear Laurie,
    In Cuckolds All a Row, which C# timidly renamed Hey Boys, Up Go We,
the explicit directions for the interrupted poussette are:

            "Men put the Co. We. back by both hands, fall even on the Co.
side ... ."

Then, after the first cast back to place,

            "put them back , fall on your owne side, ... ."

(The English Dancing Master, 1651.)
So, in this dance, the traveling direction is clearly clockwise. (Oddly,
Playford has the first cast to the right, the second, to the left. We do
both to the right nowadays, avoiding collisions.)

    In Orleans Baffled (The Dancing Master II, ed. 1, 1710) the
instruction is

            "The first couple cast off and draw Hands, below the third
couple, then cast up again and draw Hands above the second above the
second couple, ..."

Whatever the interpretretation of "draw Hands" (I think W1 puts M1 back
both times), the two poussettes are in opposite senses. Nowadays, we do
both in the clockwise sense, of course.

    In short, I think original sources give no hard and fast rules.
Anyhow, the old country dances are notoriously witty and we might imagine
that their choreographers would ring all the changes on an idea.

Laurie Andres wrote (in part):

> Does anyone out there in the ether have historical source directions
> for the travelling direction of pousettes?

--
Albert Blank & Nancy DeVore
102 Loring Avenue
Pelham, NY 10803-2014

Tel. 914 738-7678
e-mail: fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 08:10:20 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 11:09:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: susan-AT-
generalist.org (Susan)
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Pousettes
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
CC: susan-AT-
generalist.org
Message-ID: <20010910150935.CDC7067C9-AT-
generalist.org>
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Laurie Andres <lcandres-AT-
earthlink.net> writes:
>Does anyone out there in the ether have historical source directions
>for the travelling direction of pousettes? I find reconstructions
>where the first man always starts by pushing, without regard to if he
>is in 1st or 2nd place, unsatisfying. My feeling is pousettes should
>always start in the same direction, clockwise, irregardless of
>anyone's position.

In the early 19thc Thomas Wilson's various country dance manuals 
describe two figures, the "Half pousette or draw" and the "Whole
pousette".  

His "half" involves going once counter-clockwise around the 
other couple.  Each couple returns to their own place; this
is not a progressive figure.  The direction of motion is clearly
marked on his diagrams as CCW.

His "whole" is a progressive figure; the couples circle 1.5
times to change places.  Again, they move CCW.  

I took this out of his "Complete System of English Country Dancing"
but his other manuals (published c1805-1825) give the same figures.  I
believe these are different from the MECD interpretations of the
figures, which must give rise to some peculiar reconstructions of
early 19thc dances.

I'm afraid it's not helpful if you want to go clockwise, either.  :)

Susan



================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 08:26:06 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 11:25:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: susan-AT-
generalist.org (Susan)
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Pousettes
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
CC: susan-AT-
generalist.org
Message-ID: <20010910152528.33E2F67C9-AT-
generalist.org>
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"Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com> writes:


>    In Cuckolds All a Row, which C# timidly renamed Hey Boys, Up Go We,
>the explicit directions for the interrupted poussette are:
>
>            "Men put the Co. We. back by both hands, fall even on the
>Co.  side ... ."
>
>Then, after the first cast back to place,
>
>            "put them back , fall on your owne side, ... ."
>
>(The English Dancing Master, 1651.)
>
>So, in this dance, the traveling direction is clearly
>clockwise. (Oddly, Playford has the first cast to the right, the
>second, to the left. We do both to the right nowadays, avoiding
>collisions.)

I can't speak to MECD practice, but there seems to be something
weird about this reconstruction.  I don't think this is an
interrupted poussette in the sense of a full circle.  The
directions (usually aimed at the men) say to "put back" twice,
not to put once and pull once.  I interpret this as first a
clockwise place change then a counter-clockwise place change 
in the same "track" as the first.  We also do the casts 
first to the right and then to the left without any collision
problem; I'm totally at a loss as to how they could both be done 
to the right.

>    In short, I think original sources give no hard and fast rules.
>Anyhow, the old country dances are notoriously witty and we might
>imagine that their choreographers would ring all the changes on an
>idea.

I think it may be more that they hadn't actually standardized
many of the figures yet, but I certainly agree on the results.

Susan
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 09:08:47 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 12:10:15 -0400
From: SUSAN B BOOKER <susantiq-AT-
prodigy.net>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Mime format - suggestion
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <002901c13a13$14cc2f80$6802ffd1-AT-
oemcomputer>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

I just received the latest ECD digest, and about half of the bandwidth is
taken up with MIME gobbledygook. So if your e-mail is set up in this format,
would you please turn it off, in the interests of making your messages more
readable? Many thanks!

Susan Booker

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 14:34:19 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 17:34:58 -0400
From: "Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Pousettes
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B9D3202.F54EA184-AT-
sprintmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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References: <20010910152528.33E2F67C9-AT-
generalist.org>

Sorry, Susan,
     You are right. I was asleep at the switch. So, like the original of
Orleans Baffled, Hey Boys calls for a reversal of the sense between the two
half-poussettes.

    I wonder if the "draw Hands" in the original of Orleans baffled is the
same as the draw in Wilson. Do you have any thoughts on that?

Susan wrote (in part):

> "Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com> writes:
>
> >    In Cuckolds All a Row, which C# timidly renamed Hey Boys, Up Go We,
> >the explicit directions for the interrupted poussette are:
> >
> >            "Men put the Co. We. back by both hands, fall even on the
> >Co.  side ... ."
> >
> >Then, after the first cast back to place,
> >
> >            "put them back , fall on your owne side, ... ."
> >
> >(The English Dancing Master, 1651.)
> >
> >So, in this dance, the traveling direction is clearly
> >clockwise. (Oddly, Playford has the first cast to the right, the
> >second, to the left. We do both to the right nowadays, avoiding
> >collisions.)
>
> I can't speak to MECD practice, but there seems to be something
> weird about this reconstruction.  I don't think this is an
> interrupted poussette in the sense of a full circle.  The
> directions (usually aimed at the men) say to "put back" twice,
> not to put once and pull once.  I interpret this as first a
> clockwise place change then a counter-clockwise place change
> in the same "track" as the first.  We also do the casts
> first to the right and then to the left without any collision
> problem; I'm totally at a loss as to how they could both be done
> to the right.

--
Albert Blank


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 15:12:35 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 18:11:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: susan-AT-
generalist.org (Susan)
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Pousettes
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
CC: susan-AT-
generalist.org
Message-ID: <20010910221154.679E967CA-AT-
generalist.org>
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"Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com> writes:
>Sorry, Susan,
>     You are right. I was asleep at the switch. So, like the original
>of Orleans Baffled, Hey Boys calls for a reversal of the sense between
>the two half-poussettes.

'sokay.  I'm coming from a very different perspective in that I do
a lot of historic ECD for various periods and almost no MECD.

>    I wonder if the "draw Hands" in the original of Orleans baffled is
>the same as the draw in Wilson. Do you have any thoughts on that?

Looking at the original dance, I'm a little, err, Baffled.  :)  If
we take it to be the same as in Wilson (which it isn't necessarily,
that being 100 years later), then we have

1's cast below 2's
1's and 3's circle each other back to places
1's cast up to top again
1's and 2's circle each other back to places

I'm not sure I see there being enough music for that to happen,
even with three beats to the measure (which suggests to me a
bourree or minuet step in the original).  The original music
looks like a 4-bar A and an 8-bar B, with the directions saying
to repeat A twice and B once.  Logically that would mean
that a cast and a "draw hands" would have to be done in four
measures.  That seems awfully fast for the full circle.  

It's quite possible that either Wilson was confused in his
terminology, he was trying to standardize what wasn't standardized, or
that he was current for his time but not for 100 years earlier.  Given
that and the music, I think I'd vote for the "draw hands" being a
place-change rather than a full circle back to places.  I'm not
sure if I'd go by Wilson's CCW diagrams or the older "put them
back" movement, which would be a bit tricky in a set with all
couples proper.

I'd be happier if I looked at a bunch of other dances of the period to
see how "draw hands" is typically used.  But I don't have time for
that particular research project right now so I'll have to
stay baffled.  :)

Susan






================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 15:14:38 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 18:14:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: susan-AT-
generalist.org (Susan)
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Pousettes
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, susan-AT-
generalist.org
Message-ID: <20010910221408.30A5267C9-AT-
generalist.org>
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Following myself up, it's also possible that in 1710 "draw
hands" meant something else entirely.  Terms like allemande
underwent gigantic mutations over the years, maybe "draw"
did too, although no other interpretation suggests itself
to me right off the bat.

Susan
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Susan wrote (IN PART):

> "Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com> writes:
>
> >    I wonder if the "draw Hands" in the original of Orleans baffled is
> >the same as the draw in Wilson. Do you have any thoughts on that?
>
> Looking at the original dance, I'm a little, err, Baffled.  :)  If
> we take it to be the same as in Wilson (which it isn't necessarily,
> that being 100 years later), then we have
>
> 1's cast below 2's
> 1's and 3's circle each other back to places
> 1's cast up to top again
> 1's and 2's circle each other back to places
>
> I'm not sure I see there being enough music for that to happen,
> even with three beats to the measure (which suggests to me a
> bourree or minuet step in the original).  The original music
> looks like a 4-bar A and an 8-bar B, with the directions saying
> to repeat A twice and B once.  Logically that would mean
> that a cast and a "draw hands" would have to be done in four
> measures.  That seems awfully fast for the full circle.

I agree. That's why I asked. I haven't thought of  any early dances besides
Cuckolds and Orleans that have poussettes but I'll try again when I can
unclutter my mind for other things. Maybe we should pursue this off list
until we have some conclusions.

Albert


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"Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com> writes:

>I agree. That's why I asked. I haven't thought of any early dances
>besides Cuckolds and Orleans that have poussettes but I'll try again
>when I can unclutter my mind for other things. Maybe we should pursue
>this off list until we have some conclusions.

I'm happy on list or off.  I've only been on the list a week
or so - are we on-topic?  1700's dance is not a major focus
of mine, and as I said I don't have time for a new research
project, but I do a great deal of pre-1700 and a great deal
of 1800's, which may or may not be useful.

I'd also be careful about lumping together the early stuff; there
are distinct differences between the Really Early Stuff, the
Baroque stuff, the later 18thc/early 19thc stuff, and the
later 19thc stuff.  Cuckolds is in the early bit, Orleans I'd
say well into Baroque, and Wilson into the next group.  We
may have not merely apples and oranges but a whole basket
of fruit here.

Susan


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From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing <winston-AT-
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Subject: Re: Pousettes
To: ECD-AT-
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Susan wrote:

> I'm happy on list or off.  I've only been on the list a week
> or so - are we on-topic?  

You very definitely _are_.  ( As far as I know, there's no other forum where
this would be on-topic - certainly not rendance.)

-- Alan (list owner)

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I've seen some dances where clockwise is specified and others where
counterclockwise is. Setting aside historic research for a moment (and
certainly for modern dances), my vote for ECD pousettes is for variety
rather than a hard and fast rule about either direction or who
'pushes'/'pulls'...

Brooke Friendly

Laurie Andres wrote:

> Does anyone out there in the ether have historical source directions
> for the travelling direction of pousettes? I find reconstructions
> where the first man always starts by pushing, without regard to if he
> is in 1st or 2nd place, unsatisfying. My feeling is pousettes should
> always start in the same direction, clockwise, irregardless of
> anyone's position.
>
> Laurie Andres

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From: Andrew Peterson <lyrlsbro-AT-
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Subject: Re: Pousettes
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--- Susan <susan-AT-
generalist.org> wrote:
> In the early 19thc Thomas Wilson's various country dance
> manuals describe two figures, the "Half pousette or draw" and
> the "Whole pousette".  
> 
> His "half" involves going once counter-clockwise around the 
> other couple.  Each couple returns to their own place; this
> is not a progressive figure.  The direction of motion is
> clearly marked on his diagrams as CCW.
> 
> His "whole" is a progressive figure; the couples circle 1.5
> times to change places.  Again, they move CCW.  

Possibly evolving in later years into the practice of dancing
(usually waltz or polka) 1.5 times around to progress?

Andy

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From: susan-AT-
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Andrew Peterson <lyrlsbro-AT-
yahoo.com> writes:

>> His "whole" is a progressive figure; the couples circle 1.5
>> times to change places.  Again, they move CCW.
>
>Possibly evolving in later years into the practice of dancing
>(usually waltz or polka) 1.5 times around to progress?

Wilson's gigantic manual of country dances includes several
waltz country dances which uses the precise phrase "waltz
poussette."  So I'd say yes.

Susan
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--- Chris Sackett & Brooke Friendly <friendsack-AT-
opendoor.com>
wrote:
> I've seen some dances where clockwise is specified and others
> where counterclockwise is. Setting aside historic research for
> a moment (and certainly for modern dances), my vote for ECD
> pousettes is for variety rather than a hard and fast rule
about
> either direction or who 'pushes'/'pulls'...

Whatever might be written historically, I would venture that
over the years the pousette in many dances has evolved to move
in the direction which flows best with the other figures.

Andy

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From: susan-AT-
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Reply-To: ECD-AT-
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Subject: Draws & Poussettes
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Okay, despite not having time, I got really curious.  I took a very
fast run through the Keller database and found all sorts of neat
stuff.  None of it provides any definitive answers, but perhaps some
folks will find it of interest.  There does seem to be some slight
bias towards clockwise poussetting.  And it also is clear that "draw"
can be used to mean other than a poussette.

I'm not going to list all the editions, but for a rough timeline,
edition 1-1 was in 1651; 2-1 in 1710 (roughly contemporary with 1-14;
first and second volumes ran parallel for a few editions).  If you
want more, here's Keller's database page:

http://www.izaak.unh.edu/nhltmd/indexes/dancingmaster/

Note: Keller's database is a great aid for this sort of survey, but it
also has a number of errors, and he tends to lump together very
different figures into one classification - in this case, for example,
he has the men setting the woman into the middle in Jenny Pluck Pears
listed as a poussette.  Since I depended on his coding, this is not
necessarily complete.  And since his facsimiles are more than slightly
blurry, it may have transcription errors on my part along with
assorted typos since I did this very quickly.  I've expanded the
abbreviations as best I can read them, tried to keep the punctuation
correct, and tried to include everything relevant to either "draw" or
"poussette".  My notes marked as "S:" Dances are roughly in order of
appearance by edition.

(And of course, this is only Dancing Master editions, it doesn't
include the multitude of other country dance manuals published over
the 100 years or so after DM ended.)

Enjoy....

Susan



Dancing Master draw/poussette references:


Cuckolds all a Row 1-1-1-18
"men put the contrary women back by both hands, fall even on the
contrary side [...] put them back again, fall on your owne side"

S: two poussette place changes going back and forth on the
same track, first clockwise then counterclockwise.  note the
dance works well for couples facing couples in the original;
when it later turns into a longways set this move becomes a
collision problem, not just in this part but in several others
(siding and arming with your contrary also become a real
challenge when your contrary is diagonally opposite you and
the others are trying to do the same thing simultaneously...)


Jog On My Honey 1-1-1-10
"put her backe on the outside the second woman into the
second place [...]then into the third place on the outside
the third man"

S: This doesn't sound like a poussette in the sense of 
two couples moving - it seems like one couple is weaving
in and out of the others in an "s" shape, first clockwise
then counter-clockwise.  neat figure.


The Country Coll 1-1-1-8
"first man put his woman back, the other going contrary, all
into each other's places"

S: aha, a clockwise poussette, changing places rather than a
full circle.


Argeers 1-1-1-8
"put each others woman backe by both hands, slip to the
right hand, fall down on the contrary side" [...] "slip
betweene each other to your places, put them backward, and
forward by both hands"

S: this is a two-couples-facing dance, so both men can
put their opposites back without colliding.  they're going
clockwise, but unlike in Cuckolds, they don't "unwind"
with another poussette, they do some sort of "slip between".


The Devil's Dream 1-3-1-18
"the first man pull up the second man and the second woman put
back the first woman, then the first woman fall back against the
second man's back [strain] then the first man put back the second
man on the contrary side, and the second woman put back the first
woman on the contrary side and fall back"

S: this is problematic; the men appear to be going CW while he
woman go CCW.  I suspect this is a typo - see "Lady Banbury"
for the same partial figure with the first woman putting back the
second instead of vice versa, which makes the partial figure work.
interesting "pause" in the middle when they end up in a straight
line before continuing on to change places.


Lady Banbury 1-3-1-8
"the first man take the second man by both hands and the first
woman take the second woman by both hands, the first man pull up
the second man, and the first woman put back the second woman, the
first man [clap?] the second man and first woman back to back,
while the first and second woman change places on the outside
of the first woman and second man"

S: clockwise partial poussette?  they get to a straight line
then the first [man] and second woman swap places!


Ginnie Pug 1-3-1-7
"the first man put back his woman and lead down, the second man
pull his woman to him and lead up the [Co? Cu?] lead up and down,
and the second couple lead down and up the first couple"
and
"the first man pull his woman to him into the 
second couple's place, and slip through them into their own places"

S: The first example sounds like the couples move to outside the
set and then lead up and down on the outside.  The facsimile is
terrible, so the full figure is a little unclear.  In the second
example, it really sounds like only the first couple is
moving, i.e., not a poussette.


Simple Simon 1-3-1-10
"the first man put back the second woman and change places with her,
the second man doing as much with the first"

S: this doesn't sound like a poussette, just a very aggressive
two hand turn.


Buff-Coat 1-4-1-18
"the first puts his woman back into the second place, and back again"

S: this sounds like only the first couple moves, and it isn't
clear they move around the second couple - they could go
between them.


Pegasus 1-4-1-7
"first and third men put your women back by both hands, while
the other go contrary back again to your own places [...] all
that again the contrary way" 

S: there's a problem in the dance here; it claims to be a dance
for four couples but the diagram only shows three.  if it's
for four, then the 1's and 2's could poussette while the
3's and 4's poussette.  But it's not clear this is a poussette
rather than just falling back and then moving forward again.
And if the dance is only for three couples as might be implied
by the use of "other" rather than "others" then it can't be a
poussette because the 3's have no one to poussette with.  There
are no other clues in the dance to decide which is wrong, the
diagram or the "for eight".  Unfortunately Keller gives only
one facsimile, so there's no way to know if it's corrected
in other editions (Keller lists it as for eight.)


Mad Moll 1-9, 1-11-1-18
"the first couple take hands and draw into the second couple's
place, the second couple at the same time hands to the first
couple's place, [snip] the second couple does the same, which
brings the first and second couples as they began"

S: this definitely specifies a place change, not a full circle,
but no hint of direction.


Soldier & the Sailor  1-9, 1-11-1-18
"take hands with your partners and draw [slide? aside?] back
to back until you come into your own places again"

S: this sounds like a poussette.  still no clue on direction.


Love for Love 1-9, 1-11-1-18
"the first man put his woman from him and the second man pull his
woman to him and [sett?  unreadable]" 

S: this doesn't actually sound like a poussette; they're working
their way around into a diamond shape later in the dance.  But
if it was a poussette it would be clockwise.


Ormond House 1-11-1-18 
"the first couple takes hands and puts back into the second couple's
place the second couple does the same at the same time" 

S: they can't do the same exactly; if both the men put back the
women, what we have is a collision.  But it doesn't say which
man pulls and which pushes.


Crosbey Square 1-11-1-18
"then they draw the first couple into the second, and the
second into the first's place" 

S: here's what looks like a poussette.  no clue on direction.


Trip to St. John's Court 1-14-1-18
"then the couples being contrary, the first and second couple
draw and change sides into their proper places"

S: here both couples draw and also add in a turn into proper
places; no directional hints.


Brisk & Airy 2-1-2-4
"then they draw the first couple into the second, and the
second into the first couple's places"

S: this is the same dance as Crosbey Square, under a different name.


Barr a Barr 2-1, 2-2
"the first man draw off his partner at the repeat" (after ending
the dance back in first place)

S: again, this is a usage of draw which does not seem to be a
poussette; it sounds like after the first couple does the dance
they stand out - since they don't progress, the other couples
would never get to move up if they didn't.


A Trip to Marrow-Bone 2-1, 2-2, 2-3
"then the first couple being in the second couple's place, take
hands and draw round into their own places"

S: it's not clear from this if the first and second couple are
both doing a poussette; it could also be interpreted as the
first couple is "drawing" while the second just moves down


Goddesses (second version) 1-17, 1-18
"the first and second couple take hands and draw quite thro'
one another, lead thro' at top and turn your partner"

S: drawing through one another does not sound like a poussette at all.


Miller's Jigg 1-17-1-18
"First couple take hands and second couple take hands, then the first
couple change into the second couple's place, and the second couple
into the first place, then back to back with your own and come to your
places"

S: sounds like a poussette, changing places, but no direction
given.


De'il Take the Wars (second version) 1-17, 1-18
"the first man draw his partner into his place with his right hand,
and the second man in the first woman's place with his left hand,
the other two do the same, then the three men being on the women's
side and the women on the men's side [snip] the first woman draw
the men over into their places again."

S: hoo boy!  This doesn't sound like a poussette, it sounds like a
train wreck.  But it does show draw being used as just moving people
around with one hand.


Salley's Fancy 2-3-2-4
"then the first man takes his partner by both hands and draw her
quite round the third couple and round the second couple" (end)

S: this sounds like the first couple is the only one which is
moving.  Note the "quite" round - it's not a place change, it's a
full circle.






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Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 00:44:18 -0400
From: Rich Galloway <rich-AT-
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Subject: Re: Draws & Poussettes
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Well done Susan!

Re: Pegasus.  No corrections in later editions.  In the figure in 
question, it appears to me that the 1s and 3s dance toward the women's 
wall with the woman backing up while the 2s dance toward the men's wall 
with the man backing up.  Then, they simply return back to places with 
1st & 3rd men backing up.  Although the Dancing Master calls it a 
longways for eight, I agree that the dance appears to be for 3 couples. 
 E.g., it's a USA dance with a progression at the end of each of the 3 
rounds.  

In most cases, instructions in the Dancing Master are directed 
preferentially to the first couple over other couples and to the man 
over the woman.  If you make that (not necessarily always valid) 
assumption, you can sort out the direction of many of the pousettes you 
list.

Rich Galloway

Susan wrote:

>Okay, despite not having time,
>
I know the feeling.

>Pegasus 1-4-1-7
>"first and third men put your women back by both hands, while
>the other go contrary back again to your own places [...] all
>that again the contrary way" 
>
>S: there's a problem in the dance here; it claims to be a dance
>for four couples but the diagram only shows three.  if it's
>for four, then the 1's and 2's could poussette while the
>3's and 4's poussette.  But it's not clear this is a poussette
>rather than just falling back and then moving forward again.
>And if the dance is only for three couples as might be implied
>by the use of "other" rather than "others" then it can't be a
>poussette because the 3's have no one to poussette with.  There
>are no other clues in the dance to decide which is wrong, the
>diagram or the "for eight".  Unfortunately Keller gives only
>one facsimile, so there's no way to know if it's corrected
>in other editions (Keller lists it as for eight.)
>
>
>Mad Moll 1-9, 1-11-1-18
>"the first couple take hands and draw into the second couple's
>place, the second couple at the same time hands to the first
>couple's place, [snip] the second couple does the same, which
>brings the first and second couples as they began"
>
>S: this definitely specifies a place change, not a full circle,
>but no hint of direction.
>
>
>Soldier & the Sailor  1-9, 1-11-1-18
>"take hands with your partners and draw [slide? aside?] back
>to back until you come into your own places again"
>
>S: this sounds like a poussette.  still no clue on direction.
>
>
>Love for Love 1-9, 1-11-1-18
>"the first man put his woman from him and the second man pull his
>woman to him and [sett?  unreadable]" 
>
>S: this doesn't actually sound like a poussette; they're working
>their way around into a diamond shape later in the dance.  But
>if it was a poussette it would be clockwise.
>
>
>Ormond House 1-11-1-18 
>"the first couple takes hands and puts back into the second couple's
>place the second couple does the same at the same time" 
>
>S: they can't do the same exactly; if both the men put back the
>women, what we have is a collision.  But it doesn't say which
>man pulls and which pushes.
>
>
>Crosbey Square 1-11-1-18
>"then they draw the first couple into the second, and the
>second into the first's place" 
>
>S: here's what looks like a poussette.  no clue on direction.
>
>
>Trip to St. John's Court 1-14-1-18
>"then the couples being contrary, the first and second couple
>draw and change sides into their proper places"
>
>S: here both couples draw and also add in a turn into proper
>places; no directional hints.
>
>
>Brisk & Airy 2-1-2-4
>"then they draw the first couple into the second, and the
>second into the first couple's places"
>
>S: this is the same dance as Crosbey Square, under a different name.
>
>
>Barr a Barr 2-1, 2-2
>"the first man draw off his partner at the repeat" (after ending
>the dance back in first place)
>
>S: again, this is a usage of draw which does not seem to be a
>poussette; it sounds like after the first couple does the dance
>they stand out - since they don't progress, the other couples
>would never get to move up if they didn't.
>
>
>A Trip to Marrow-Bone 2-1, 2-2, 2-3
>"then the first couple being in the second couple's place, take
>hands and draw round into their own places"
>
>S: it's not clear from this if the first and second couple are
>both doing a poussette; it could also be interpreted as the
>first couple is "drawing" while the second just moves down
>
>
>Goddesses (second version) 1-17, 1-18
>"the first and second couple take hands and draw quite thro'
>one another, lead thro' at top and turn your partner"
>
>S: drawing through one another does not sound like a poussette at all.
>
>
>Miller's Jigg 1-17-1-18
>"First couple take hands and second couple take hands, then the first
>couple change into the second couple's place, and the second couple
>into the first place, then back to back with your own and come to your
>places"
>
>S: sounds like a poussette, changing places, but no direction
>given.
>
>
>De'il Take the Wars (second version) 1-17, 1-18
>"the first man draw his partner into his place with his right hand,
>and the second man in the first woman's place with his left hand,
>the other two do the same, then the three men being on the women's
>side and the women on the men's side [snip] the first woman draw
>the men over into their places again."
>
>S: hoo boy!  This doesn't sound like a poussette, it sounds like a
>train wreck.  But it does show draw being used as just moving people
>around with one hand.
>
>
>Salley's Fancy 2-3-2-4
>"then the first man takes his partner by both hands and draw her
>quite round the third couple and round the second couple" (end)
>
>S: this sounds like the first couple is the only one which is
>moving.  Note the "quite" round - it's not a place change, it's a
>full circle.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 04:35:38 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 21:37:23 +1000
From: Sue Drain <routier-AT-
tig.com.au>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: On/off topic (was Re: Pousettes)
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B9DF773.72361D30-AT-
tig.com.au>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Thank you for the clarification Alan.

I've been lurking on this list for about 3 years. Like Susan, my
interests involve mostly pre 1700 Playford and similar. Here (Sydney
Australia), English Country Dance is a much diminished adjunct to the
folk/colonial/bush dance scene so this list has, from time to time,
proved to be a great source of hard information about historical dance
practice (having said that, I have to praise the 'Earthly Delights'
workshop held in Canberra last weekend, which was wonderful).

However, the last time I sent a post with a question (funnily enough,
it was about 'Cuckolds'), I got more replies off list than from the
list. That in itself wasn't an issue, I didn't expect to take up a lot
of bandwidth with what was essentially a small historical
interpretative problem from someone lacking the access to the dance
networks and relevant scholarly information possessed by others on the
list. The problem was that I got the impression that my question was
somehow "improper". And then there were the posts about copyright on
dance interpretations which further confused me about what was OK to
discuss and what was not. Frankly, I have been wondering about whether
I should stay subscribed.

So Susan's posts and your replies were a breath of fresh air. I just
thought I'd tell you that. To everyone else, sorry to get on my
soapbox like this, I'll stop now. But I will stay subscribed.

Best wishes

Sue Drain


Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:
> 
> Susan wrote:
> 
> > I'm happy on list or off.  I've only been on the list a week
> > or so - are we on-topic?
> 
> You very definitely _are_.  ( As far as I know, there's no other forum where
> this would be on-topic - certainly not rendance.)
> 
> -- Alan (list owner)
> 
> ===============================================================================
>  Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT-
SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
>  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056
>  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025
> ===============================================================================

--
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 05:40:23 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 20:49:33 -0400
From: Allison M Thompson <allisonthompson-AT-
juno.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re:  Historical fruit basket
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010911.083939.-1884281.0.AllisonThompson-AT-
juno.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
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New-Arrival- to--the-List Susan wrote ....


> I'd also be careful about lumping together the early stuff; there
> are distinct differences between the Really Early Stuff, the
> Baroque stuff, the later 18thc/early 19thc stuff, and the
> later 19thc stuff.  Cuckolds is in the early bit, Orleans I'd
> say well into Baroque, and Wilson into the next group.  We
> may have not merely apples and oranges but a whole basket
> of fruit here.


Pray elucidate!  I'm sure many of us would like to hear your thoughts! 
Some people on the list are experts in different parts of the fruit
basket that you outline, so you will assuredly create vibrant response,
but that debate is part of what makes this an interesting discussion
list.


Allison Thompson in Pittsburgh

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Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 08:43:19 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 10:43:13 -0500 (CDT)
From: j-sivier-AT-
ux1.cso.uiuc.edu
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: dance named St. Charles Reel?
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <200109111543.f8BFhDr04342-AT-
staff2.cso.uiuc.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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   I've had a request from a dancer for a dance named the St. Charles Reel.
He claims to have done it at some point in the past.  I've checked my usual
sources, including the library of congress site, and haven't been able to
find any dance with a name like this.  I leaning towards the theory that
the dancer has misremembered the name of the dance, but I thought I would
take a chance and see if anyone on this list knows of a dance of this name.

   Thanks for any information.

Jonathan

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jonathan Sivier               |Q: How many angels can dance on the   |
|  j-sivier-AT-
uiuc.edu             |   head of a pin?                     |
|  Flight Simulation Lab         |A: It depends on what dance you call. |
|  Beckman Institute             |                                      |
|  405 N. Mathews                |  SWMDG - Single White Male           |
|  Urbana, IL  61801             |          Dance Gypsy                 |
|  Work: 217/244-1923            |                                      |
|  Home: 217/359-8225            |  Have shoes, will dance.             |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Home page URL: http://www.uiuc.edu/ph/www/j-sivier                   |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 08:51:12 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 11:51:07 -0400
From: Deb Karl <debkarl-AT-
wi.mit.edu>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B9E32E9.DB1110A5-AT-
wi.mit.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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References: <200109111543.f8BFhDr04342-AT-
staff2.cso.uiuc.edu>


I hope everyone on the List, and all of your loved ones, are safe.

sending out hugs and prayers,

Deb Karl
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 10:21:39 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 13:23:28 -0400
From: Stephanie Smith <steph-AT-
boo.net>
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <3B9E4890.365DA88-AT-
boo.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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References: <200109111543.f8BFhDr04342-AT-
staff2.cso.uiuc.edu> <3B9E32E9.DB1110A5-AT-
wi.mit.edu>

The Federal Government closed this morning for security, so along with
all the other Federal workers, I made my way out of DC - slowly.  The
streets were gridlocked with police, ambulances, and people trying to
leave the city.  Rumors were flying, and as we know, they are trying to
fit the jagged pieces of this puzzle together.

Are any New Yorkers able to report?  My thoughts are with you.

Stephanie
Bethesda, MD

Deb Karl wrote:

> I hope everyone on the List, and all of your loved ones, are safe.
>
> sending out hugs and prayers,
>
> Deb Karl

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 10:50:29 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 17:50:24 +0000
From: Orly Krasner <okrasner-AT-
hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
BCC: 
Message-ID: <F30o2YPgXhV6qm39gA400013a68-AT-
hotmail.com>
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I feel as though I'm reporting at second hand, albeit from NY.  It's 
surreal--I live in Queens and if it weren't for the TV it would be a quiet, 
lovely day.  So far, all those who dance with us regularly and who work 
downtown have reliably been reported safe--but I know that they all have 
friends, and my fingers are too shaky to finish typing that thought.  If 
only the world community were as close knit as the dance community. . . .
--Orly.

_________________________________________________________________
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================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 11:09:24 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 11:09:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andrew Peterson <lyrlsbro-AT-
yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010911180918.80649.qmail-AT-
web20004.mail.yahoo.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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--- Orly Krasner <okrasner-AT-
hotmail.com> wrote:
> I feel as though I'm reporting at second hand, albeit from NY.
> It's surreal--I live in Queens and if it weren't for the TV
> it would be a quiet, lovely day.  So far, all those who dance
> with us regularly and who work downtown have reliably been
> reported safe--but I know that they all have friends, and my
> fingers are too shaky to finish typing that thought.  If only
> the world community were as close knit as the dance
> community. . . .
> --Orly.

I know what you mean about it being surreal. My cats sleep as
usual as though nothing has happened, and in their world it
hasn't. My neighbor awakened me about 7:30 this morning to tell
me what had happened and I'm stunned beyond comprehension.

Orly's last words remind me of this:

All the ills of mankind, all the political blunders, all the 
failures of the great leaders have arisen merely from a lack of 
skill in dancing.		-- Molière

...then there's the great idiot in the White House. Who'd have
thought that he would "lead" us to this so quickly?

Andy in Portland

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Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 11:22:09 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:21:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: SallenNic-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Terrorist attacks today
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <15a.d7dda4.28cfb044-AT-
aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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I watched on Television with horror the devastating scenes in the USA today. 
I send my heartfelt condolences to everyone on the other side of the 
Atlantic. Living as I do about 35 miles from Lockerbie, I have some slight 
idea of what you must be going through, and my thoughts go with you,
                                                            Nicolas 
Broadbridge.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 11:33:27 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:33:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: S2LINEN-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <119.46f7973.28cfb2e9-AT-
aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Dear Stephanie,
I'm so happy that you are safe.
At first I thought that it was just a terrible accident. But then learned 
abut the collaspe of the WTC buildings!!!! NYC has been closed off to all 
traffic. People are walking over the brigdges, boats were used to get some 
people off the island and to help.  There is limited phone service0-it works 
better with the old dial fphones not the touch tones. Many cell phones are 
not working.  There are large plumes of black smoke and the acrid aroma has 
reached my parents area at Ralph and Ave K in Brooklyn!!!
    I haven;t heard from others in NYC. Hopefully they didn't reach their 
jobs that early.  Take care   Sandra Linenschmidt
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 11:48:40 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:51:45 -0400
From: Sharon Green <mls-AT-
panix.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <4.1.20010911141110.00c8e300-AT-
popserver.panix.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
References: <200109111543.f8BFhDr04342-AT-
staff2.cso.uiuc.edu> <3B9E32E9.DB1110A5-AT-
wi.mit.edu>

At 01:23 PM 9/11/01 -0400, Stephanie wrote:
>Are any New Yorkers able to report?  My thoughts are with you.

Tonight was going to have been our first English dance of the season at
Metropolitan Duane Church.  We have canceled it, out of respect for the
work going on at St. Vincent's Trauma Center, right across the street from
Duane, where emergency vehicles are bringing victims of the blast.  If you
look down Seventh Avenue, you can still see smoke.

These are the CDNY folks I've heard from, directly or indirectly, all of
whom are fine.  If somebody's name isn't on this list, it probably means
they haven't gotten through the phone system, which is overloaded.

Annie Edden, Marty Fager, Suzanne Ford, Karen Geer, Sally Denmead & Jonah
Winter, Kit Campbell, Rob Weinstein, Margherita & George Davis, Yonina
Gordon, Gloria Glaser & Millie Kern, Rob Weinstein, Sol Weber, Michael
Siemon, David Green, Helen Tuzio, Robin Russell, Beverly Francis, Orly
Krasner, David Simonoff, Irv Kass & Elizabeth Freedman, Art Munisteri &
Nancy Boyd.

Sharon Green

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 13:23:10 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 16:24:37 -0400
From: SUSAN B BOOKER <susantiq-AT-
prodigy.net>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: "Attack on America"
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <001301c13aff$c7c480a0$7d03ffd1-AT-
oemcomputer>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Many thanks for the posts regarding the safety of dancing friends in NYC and
Washington. You are all in my thoughts and prayers.

Dancers everywhere in the US  may want to check with  local blood centers or
Red Cross offices. A nation-wide blood drive is underway, and the Red Cross
is accepting donations specified for this tragedy. I just got back from
delivering cookies and fruit punch to the local blood center (I can't donate
blood due to a medical condition) - the line was out the door and the police
were directing traffic attempting to turn in. Bless all those who can help
in this way...

By the way, the rumor that a plane was missing in Lexington, KY's airspace
this morning was false. It was reported on ABC network TV, but all planes
are accounted for here.

Susan Booker
Lexington, KY

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:14:05 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 17:13:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: S2LINEN-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: "Attack on America"
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <36.1b7d661f.28cfd893-AT-
aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Thank you for the update Susan--Sandra Linenschmidt
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:23:09 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 17:20:15 -0400
From: Rich Galloway <rich-AT-
madrobin.net>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B9E800F.3070005-AT-
madrobin.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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References: <F30o2YPgXhV6qm39gA400013a68-AT-
hotmail.com>

Thank you Orly and Sharon.  Has anyone heard from Laura Basili?  I 
didn't see her name on Sharon's list and I recall from several years ago 
that she worked in or near the World Trade Center.

I think Steph and I were the only ECDlisters that worked in DC, so I 
think that our area is safely accounted for.  I know people that work at 
the Pentagon, but none that are dancers.  

 From my office near the top of the tallest building along the Potomac, 
we have a perfect view of the Pentagon.  None of us saw or heard the 
crash, but we saw the billowing black smoke almost immediately.  The day 
was uncannily clear as we watched in almost surreallistic detail.  We 
could see the fire spread and saw a section of the Pentagon collapse. 
 With all the wild rumors being reported as news and conflicting 
information this morning, we dared not leave.  Eventually, we heard that 
the Metro was running and I convinced my staff that their safety was 
much more important their work.  

I've spend the afternoon checking in with friends and coworkers.  So 
far, all in the DC area are safe. The news from NY however is grim. 
 I've received a very distressing report from one of my closest 
gardening friends.  I know what it felt like when I sent my staff home 
today not knowing if their journeys would be safe.  I cannot begin to 
imagine how my friend feels, not yet having heard from any of his staff 
or their coworkers.

With great sadness,
Rich Galloway

Orly Krasner wrote:

> I feel as though I'm reporting at second hand, albeit from NY.  It's 
> surreal--I live in Queens and if it weren't for the TV it would be a 
> quiet, lovely day.  So far, all those who dance with us regularly and 
> who work downtown have reliably been reported safe--but I know that 
> they all have friends, and my fingers are too shaky to finish typing 
> that thought.  If only the world community were as close knit as the 
> dance community. . . .
> --Orly.



================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:38:30 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:38:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andrew Peterson <lyrlsbro-AT-
yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: "Attack on America"
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010911213825.92797.qmail-AT-
web20006.mail.yahoo.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

--- SUSAN B BOOKER <susantiq-AT-
prodigy.net> wrote:
> Many thanks for the posts regarding the safety of dancing
> friends in NYC and Washington. You are all in my thoughts and
> prayers.
> 
> Dancers everywhere in the US  may want to check with  local
> blood centers or Red Cross offices. A nation-wide blood drive
> is underway, and the Red Cross is accepting donations
specified
> for this tragedy. I just got back from delivering cookies and
> fruit punch to the local blood center (I can't donate blood
due
> to a medical condition) - the line was out the door and the
> police were directing traffic attempting to turn in. Bless all
> those who can help in this way...

The Portland Red Cross has long lines of people outside waiting
to give blood and the local TV stations are telling people to
wait a day or two. They have more donors than they can handle
today. The need will be there for some time to come, I'm sure.

Andy

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Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:56:29 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 17:50:58 -0400
From: Beatrice Huppert <bhuppert-AT-
juno.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010911.175101.-3830201.0.bhuppert-AT-
juno.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
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Dear Sharon,  Was at work in Westwood, NJ at that time.  Was at World
Trade Ctr on Saturday for concerts for many hours, and was planning to go
back tonight for another performance.  Incredible and horrid.    Bea
________________________________________________________________
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Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 15:36:20 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 18:32:53 -0400
From: Diane Schmit <dschmit-AT-
ix.netcom.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <200109112236.SAA05493-AT-
johnson.mail.mindspring.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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References: <F30o2YPgXhV6qm39gA400013a68-AT-
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At 05:20 PM 9/11/01 , you wrote:

>I think Steph and I were the only ECDlisters that worked in DC, so I 
>think that our area is safely accounted for.  I know people that work at 
>the Pentagon, but none that are dancers.  

Nope. Me, too --- about 2 blocks from the Capitol, as you remember, Rich.
But, I and my co-workers (including some dancers not on this list) all
got out and home safely (after waiting a while). We couldn't see the Pentagon 
from my office, but the ride we got (we were blessed today - finding an empty
Limo-Bus heading to Bethesda) took us past the Tidal Basin, with a view of
the 
Pentagon and the heavy, billowing black smoke... 
(this was about 12 or 12:30). 

And, thank you, Sharon, and others, for your reports....

My thoughts are with you all.

Diane


Diane Schmit
dschmit-AT-
ix.netcom.com
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 16:13:00 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 19:12:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: TOMAAA-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the list
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <107.5834995.28cff46f-AT-
aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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My apartment has a panoramic view of the New York City skyline.  Every 
morning when I awake I look out the window and see the World Trade Center 
gleaming in the early mornng light or emerging from a shroud of mist.  I 
didn't realize this morning's would be my last view of it.  

I was at work when I heard the WQXR radio announcer say a plane crashed into 
the North tower and it was burning.   I went to the roof and was greeted by 
an incredible sight.  The North tower was spewing smoke like a giant 
smoke-stack on the horizon.  It was about ten or twelve unobstructed miles 
away.  Just then, there was a roar directly overhead.  A very low flying 
commercial jet was headed directly for Manhattan. I watched for thirty 
seconds and to my horror, a fireball came from the south tower followed 
sometime afterward by a tremendous roar.  I could not believe what I had 
seen.  

My surprise, at the time, however, didn't come close to an hour later when I 
was watching TV.  A woman who was being interveiwed began screaming.  Moments 
later the camera showed only one tower.  I knew it had to be a different 
angle.  I asked "Where's the other tower?"  No one answered.

So far, everyone I knew in the area is alright.  I wish I could say the same 
for everyone I didn't know.  

Thanks for listening,
Tom Amesse
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 19:42:20 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 22:43:45 -0400
From: SUSAN B BOOKER <susantiq-AT-
prodigy.net>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Fw: Dance event cancellations?
To: ecd-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <004601c13b34$bf1ef5e0$0846fcd1-AT-
oemcomputer>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
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Sorry - misaddressed this on the first try.

Susan

----- Original Message -----
From: "SUSAN B BOOKER" <susantiq-AT-
prodigy.net>
To: <ECD-AT-
playford.stanford.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2001 10:40 PM
Subject: Dance event cancellations?


> Would members of any groups who are cancelling current or upcoming weekend
> dance events due to the events in NYC and Washington please post this
> information to the list? This would be especially useful for out-of-town
> dancers who are planning on attending these events, especially if they
must
> travel considerable distances.
>
>  Information about events which are _not_ being cancelled would also be
> welcome.
>
> Thank you.
>
> Susan Booker
>
>

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 20:44:49 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 23:45:29 -0400
From: "Albert A. Blank" <fandango-AT-
sprintmail.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B9EDA59.7C2FE85E-AT-
sprintmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
References: <200109111543.f8BFhDr04342-AT-
staff2.cso.uiuc.edu> <3B9E32E9.DB1110A5-AT-
wi.mit.edu> <3B9E4890.365DA88-AT-
boo.net>



Stephanie Smith wrote (in part):

"Are any New Yorkers able to report?  My thoughts are with you."

Hello Stephanie,

    We were too far from the scene to be directly involved. It was eerily
quiet in Pelham as air and train traffic stopped and auto travel into the
city was blocked. I stayed home and tried to work but couldn't.
    Nancy's hospital, Einstein, hasn't received any of the injured yet but
may as other hospitals fill. The hospital next door, where Nancy used to
work, is a major burn trauma center and has received a number of injured
but is far from swamped. My greatest fear is that by far the greater number
of casualties have been killed which means that the hospitals won't receive
too many wounded.
    Many of the docs in Nancy's department, especially the surgeons who
have useful skills in ER, went downtown and volunteered their services. As
you probably know from TV or radio, the rescue work has barely begun.
    By mutual consent, I've canceled an important appointment with my blind
associate at Baruch College. We both felt that staying off the streets of
Manhattan was the wise thing to do.
    I pray that none of our dance community were in the line of fire but I
am very uncomfortable with the remembrance that two of them, dear friends,
went down with that Egypt airlines flight.

Warmest regards,
Albert




--
Albert Blank & Nancy DeVore



================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 21:20:10 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 23:34:41 -0400
From: "Dawn C. Culbertson" <dcculb-AT-
juno.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the List
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010911.235629.-76077.15.dcculb-AT-
juno.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Although Baltimore, where I live, was not attacked, we were apparently on
the terrorists' list list as a possible target (our World Trade Center).
So security downtown has been very strict; in fact, one of the
interstates going into the city was blocked off.  But I have a number of
good friends in both Washington and New York, and am extremely upset over
what happened. It's so horrible it seems almost unreal. My thoughts and
prayers are with anyone in those areas, and I hope you're all safe.

Dawn Culbertson
________________________________________________________________
GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
Join Juno today!  For your FREE software, visit:
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================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 03:13:00 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 11:10:32 +0100
From: Trevor Monson <tmonsont-AT-
yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Prayers to the list
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <005901c13b73$5b4dfcc0$4a9501d4-AT-
trevormo>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Having watched the live pictures on TV yesterday - I am sure we couldn't
get the true horror of what was happening - we can still only imagine -
and hope.

As a firefighter for almost 30 years, it was shattering to watch the
emergency services running in when everyone else was running out of the
area.  No amount of training could ever prepare them for what they had
to do, and their death toll must also be enormous.

And dancing? I am sure it is this that kept me sane during my time in
the fire service. An escape valve from work, from what I had seen and
had to do, and a circle of friends to meet and dance with. So, if you do
feel you must cancel any dances in respect of what has happened - don't
forget some people/survivors may still need the dances, especially in
this time of their loss, to know they are not being abandoned by their
dance community and to try and keep some normality in their lives.

Trevor Monson.




_________________________________________________________

Do You Yahoo!?

Get your free -AT-
yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com



================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 06:26:10 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 13:26:04 +0000
From: Orly Krasner <okrasner-AT-
hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: The need to dance
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
BCC: 
Message-ID: <F59zDDvUPIj1bRbKbIs00008a02-AT-
hotmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
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Hi, Trevor--
   Several members of our dance community expressed exactly that sentiment 
while discussing whether or not to cancel the dance--whether we actually 
moved to music or not became almost secondary to our desire to be with other 
people to whom we felt so connected.  Our dance space is directly across the 
street from St Vincent's Hospital, so we continue to pray. . . .
--Orly (still in shock--perhaps even more so as the enormity of the loss to 
humanity starts to sink in)

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 07:57:16 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 10:41:48 -0400
From: Gene Murrow <gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Steve Adams
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010912.105008.-771981.1.gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Dear friends,

I'm sad to report that it appears that my sister Jessica's husband Steve
Adams was killed yesterday at the WTC-- he was a sommelier at the Windows
on the World restaurant and at work when the planes struck.  There's been
no news of him.  Steve was an avid Morris dancer (Marlboro Men), and
Jessica has done sound at Pinewoods and some NY events.

Jessica is coping OK-- I'm staying with her at her apartment for the next
few days.

Gene
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Permanent address: <gmurrow-AT-
post.harvard.edu> - for your Address book
ISP of the moment: <gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>         - "Reply" button
destination
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 08:14:04 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 11:06:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Roger W. Broseus, CHP, Ph.D." <Roger-AT-
just.net>
Subject: To Dance? Yes In DC (Glen Echo)
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <54464.148.184.176.32.1000307190.squirrel-AT-
www.weitzman.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
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The message appearing below was dispatched to many dancers in the 
Washington, DC area this a.m. We will dance at Glen Echo (suburban 
DC) tonight. Out-of-towners who may be in the area may find info at 
www.just.net/~roger/events.html.

-- 
Roger W. Broseus
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
After a brief consultation with others, this is to let you know that we plan 
to dance tonight. I questioned the appropriateness of my being a dancer 
tonight, given yesterday's most tragic events. I then came across a message 
on the English country dance mailing list from a New York City fire fighter:

"Having watched the live pictures on TV yesterday - I am sure we couldn't 
get the true horror of what was happening - we can still only imagine - and 
hope.

"As a firefighter for almost 30 years, it was shattering to watch the 
emergency services running in when everyone else was running out of the   
area.  No amount of training could ever prepare them for what they had to 
do, and their death toll must also be enormous.

"And dancing? I am sure it is this that kept me sane during my time in the 
fire service. An escape valve from work, from what I had seen and had to do, 
and a circle of friends to meet and dance with. So, if you do feel you must 
cancel any dances in respect of what has happened - don't forget some 
people/survivors may still need the dances, especially in this time of their 
loss, to know they are not being abandoned by their dance community and to 
try and keep some normality in their lives.

"Trevor Monson."

And Rich Galloway said earlier today,

"Yes, Roger, let's dance.  It's a time to grieve and a time to heal.  There 
is no better place to do that than in the warm embrace of the dance 
community.  It's especially comforting to know that as we dance together in 
our local community, we are part of a global dance community.  May we 
transcend the hatred."

Let us come together this evening, once again sharing in mutual caring and 
support, nurturing the souls of our dance community.

/Roger

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 
While it may appear that you are the only recipient of this message, is is 
being sent to many in my personal Email address book.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 08:16:50 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 10:16:16 -0500
From: Paul Stamler <pstamler-AT-
pobox.com>
Subject: Re: Steve Adams
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Message-ID: <006801c13b9d$df3b6340$51294b0c-AT-
paulstam>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
References: <20010912.105008.-771981.1.gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>

<<I'm sad to report that it appears that my sister Jessica's husband Steve
Adams was killed yesterday at the WTC-- he was a sommelier at the Windows
on the World restaurant and at work when the planes struck.  There's been
no news of him.  Steve was an avid Morris dancer (Marlboro Men), and
Jessica has done sound at Pinewoods and some NY events.

Jessica is coping OK-- I'm staying with her at her apartment for the next
few days.>>

Gene:

Our deepest sympathies go with you, with your sister, and with Steve's
friends and side-mates.

Peace,
Paul


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 08:17:00 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 10:16:53 -0500 (CDT)
From: j-sivier-AT-
ux1.cso.uiuc.edu
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: The need to dance
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <200109121516.f8CFGrU15762-AT-
staff2.cso.uiuc.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Orly Krasner writes:
> 
>    Several members of our dance community expressed exactly that sentiment 
> while discussing whether or not to cancel the dance--whether we actually 
> moved to music or not became almost secondary to our desire to be with other 
> people to whom we felt so connected.  Our dance space is directly across the 
> street from St Vincent's Hospital, so we continue to pray. . . .
> --Orly (still in shock--perhaps even more so as the enormity of the loss to 
> humanity starts to sink in)

   Several years ago Orace Johnson, the leader of our local contra dance,
died during one of our dances here in Urbana, IL.  After the amulance had
taken him away there was a lot of uncertainty as to what to do.  I don't
recall what arguments, pro and con, there were, but in the end the consensus
was to continue with the dance in the time that remained.  The thought was
that Orace had died while doing what he loved and would have wanted us to
continue on, even though he was no longer with us.  I think that in the
end this helped us through that hard time better than being alone and
quiet would have.

   Another possible way to look at this is that this attack was in some
ways directed against the American culture and traditional dance and music
are an important part of any culture.  By continuing to celebrate the
positive aspects of our culture (which includes Anglo-American dance and
music) we show that the attack did not achieve it ultimate goal, the
distruction of our culture and it's values and beliefs.

Jonathan

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 08:17:43 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 11:11:18 -0400
From: Ruth Feldberg <madrobin-AT-
javanet.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Tragedy
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B9F7B11.87CED268-AT-
javanet.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT






Hello everyone,

It is with great sadness that I write to you about the death of Chris
Carstanjen, Mary Jones' son. Chris was on one of the planes that hit the WTC.

So far we have not been able to reach Mary; we think she is on her way
to be with relatives. 

We will keep you posted when we learn more.



Ruth
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 08:41:56 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 11:38:02 -0400
From: "Emily L. Ferguson" <elf-AT-
cape.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Steve Adams
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <a05100301b7c531d7cb40-AT-
[140.186.54.28]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
References: <20010912.105008.-771981.1.gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>

>Dear friends,
>
>I'm sad to report that it appears that my sister Jessica's husband Steve
>Adams was killed yesterday at the WTC-- he was a sommelier at the Windows
>on the World restaurant and at work when the planes struck.  There's been
>no news of him.  Steve was an avid Morris dancer (Marlboro Men), and
>Jessica has done sound at Pinewoods and some NY events.
>
>Jessica is coping OK-- I'm staying with her at her apartment for the next
>few days.
>
>Gene
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>--
>Permanent address: <gmurrow-AT-
post.harvard.edu> - for your Address book
>ISP of the moment: <gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>         - "Reply" button
>destination


-- 
Emily L. Ferguson
elf-AT-
cape.com  508-563-6822
New England landscapes, wooden boats and races, press photography
Beetle cats on the web at:
http://www.beetlecat.com/gft-pics/ef-notes.htm
http://www.beetlecat.org/results/99champs.html
http://www.beetlecat.org/store.html#yrbook
landscape at:
http://www.capecodlife.com/CCD/regions/upper_cape.html
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 08:46:13 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 08:49:52 -0700
From: Mary Devlin <mary-AT-
mdevlin.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Set mail
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <B7C4D22F.17BF%mary-AT-
mdevlin.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Set mail

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 09:21:00 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 12:20:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: SFORDNYC-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: The need to dance
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <143.17a575a.28d0e557-AT-
aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Of course, this being such a close-knit community, we should dance and be 
together.  And we will.  However, yesterday in New York City, there was no 
question that our regular English dance could not take place.  There had just 
been a major terrorist attack that demolished two huge buildings with 
consequences that were developing minute by minute.  Manhattan was sealed 
off.  Most public transportation was suspended or greatly reduced.  No one 
was going anywhere.  And our dance location is one block away from the key 
trauma center for lower Manhattan so obviously there was (and still is) only 
emergency access to the area.  However, concern for our fellow dancers was 
tremendous and many of us remained in contact with each other waiting for 
news.  We are thankful that so many of our community emerged from this horror 
safely and are deeply saddened to learn how this tragedy continues to affect 
us. 

To be perfectly truthful, I don't know when we will be able to resume.  I 
hope we will be able to hold our contra dance on Saturday.  But Manhattan 
below 14th Street is sealed off and the rescue work at the WTC will be going 
on for days.  This is not a decision, just thinking out loud.  However, life 
will resume -- as close to normal as we can make it.

Thanks to everyone on the list for your expressions of love and concern.  It 
is comforting to know that our geographically far-flung community is so close 
in spirit.

With gratitude and love,
 
Suzanne Ford
President CD*NY
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 11:29:49 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:29:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: S2LINEN-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Steve Adams
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <127.4016e01.28d10385-AT-
aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Gene, My heartfelt sympathies go out to you and your families on the loss of your Brother in Law Steve

Sandra Linenschmidt
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 11:43:10 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Return-Path: <dancers-AT-
globalnetisp.net>
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:43:00 -0400
From: Benjamin Stein <dancers-AT-
globalnetisp.net>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Steve Adams
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <3B9FACB4.4769E3E8-AT-
globalnetisp.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
References: <20010912.105008.-771981.1.gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>



Gene Murrow wrote:

> Dear friends,
>
> I'm sad to report that it appears that my sister Jessica's husband Steve
> Adams was killed yesterday at the WTC-- he was a sommelier at the Windows
> on the World restaurant and at work when the planes struck.  There's been
> no news of him.  Steve was an avid Morris dancer (Marlboro Men), and
> Jessica has done sound at Pinewoods and some NY events.
>
> Jessica is coping OK-- I'm staying with her at her apartment for the next
> few days.
>
> Gene
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> Permanent address: <gmurrow-AT-
post.harvard.edu> - for your Address book
> ISP of the moment: <gmurrow-AT-
juno.com>         - "Reply" button
> destination

Gene:

My heart, my love and my tears go out to you!

Ben Stein


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 12:29:03 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 15:28:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tideswell-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Tragedy
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <42.1a31adef.28d11175-AT-
aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT


In a message dated 9/12/01 8:18:51 AM, madrobin-AT-
javanet.com writes:

>Hello everyone,
>
>It is with great sadness that I write to you about the death of Chris
>Carstanjen, Mary Jones' son. Chris was on one of the planes that hit the
>WTC.
>
>So far we have not been able to reach Mary; we think she is on her way
>to be with relatives. 
>
>We will keep you posted when we learn more.
>
>Ruth

What a terrible loss.  Does anyone have Mary's snail mail or email address so 
I can send her a note?

thanks

Nilos
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 12:36:12 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 15:36:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Robert A. Brooks" <rbrooks-AT-
mail.wesleyan.edu>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Tragedy
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.05.10109121534520.26402-100000-AT-
mail.wesleyan.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

> >Hello everyone,
> >
> >It is with great sadness that I write to you about the death of Chris
> >Carstanjen, Mary Jones' son. Chris was on one of the planes that hit the
> >WTC.
> >
> >Ruth
> 
> What a terrible loss.  Does anyone have Mary's snail mail or email address so 
> I can send her a note?


Mary's address is mjones010-AT-
earthlink.net

						--Rob

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 12:53:04 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 12:52:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andrew Peterson <lyrlsbro-AT-
yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Tragedy
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010912195259.47723.qmail-AT-
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--- Ruth Feldberg <madrobin-AT-
javanet.com> wrote:
> It is with great sadness that I write to you about the death
> of Chris Carstanjen, Mary Jones' son. Chris was on one of the
> planes that hit the WTC.

I think I remember Chris many years ago while still in his teens
coming to the Hartford Ball with his mother. A fine young man
and a tragic loss.

Once again the mindless cowardice of terrorism reaches into our
peaceful community and takes another of our friends.

Andy in Portland

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Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:07:02 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 21:06:57 +0000
From: Orly Krasner <okrasner-AT-
hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Checking  in
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
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I'm writing at the request of Laura and Leonard Wilson, who are not on the 
list, but who ARE safe and wish to thank everybody for their concern.
--Orly

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Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:27:20 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 22:01:27 +0100
From: Trevor Monson <tmonsont-AT-
yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: To Dance? Yes In DC (Glen Echo)
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <008701c13bce$db61b540$6b8c01d4-AT-
trevormo>
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Roger,

Just to clarify one point - I was a firefighter in Wales and then
England until I retired earlier this year.

Although many miles away, watching the atrocity unfold gave me, and I'm
sure millions of others, a feeling of helplessness.

And now we are learning of deaths of relations of
friends/acquaintences - even names on a list who we have become used to
reading but never met. I hope, as I said before, that dance (and the
dance community)  can still be a way to start to bring back some
feeling of
normality to those who need it.

Trevor Monson



> The message appearing below was dispatched to many dancers in the
> Washington, DC area this a.m. We will dance at Glen Echo (suburban
> DC) tonight. Out-of-towners who may be in the area may find info at
> www.just.net/~roger/events.html.
>
> --
> Roger W. Broseus
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
-
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
-
> After a brief consultation with others, this is to let you know that
we plan
> to dance tonight. I questioned the appropriateness of my being a
dancer
> tonight, given yesterday's most tragic events. I then came across a
message
> on the English country dance mailing list from a New York City fire
fighter:
>
> "Having watched the live pictures on TV yesterday - I am sure we
couldn't
> get the true horror of what was happening - we can still only
imagine - and
> hope.
>
> "As a firefighter for almost 30 years, it was shattering to watch the
> emergency services running in when everyone else was running out of
the
> area.  No amount of training could ever prepare them for what they had
to
> do, and their death toll must also be enormous.
>
> "And dancing? I am sure it is this that kept me sane during my time in
the
> fire service. An escape valve from work, from what I had seen and had
to do,
> and a circle of friends to meet and dance with. So, if you do feel you
must
> cancel any dances in respect of what has happened - don't forget some
> people/survivors may still need the dances, especially in this time of
their
> loss, to know they are not being abandoned by their dance community
and to
> try and keep some normality in their lives.
>
> "Trevor Monson."
>
> And Rich Galloway said earlier today,
>
> "Yes, Roger, let's dance.  It's a time to grieve and a time to heal.
There
> is no better place to do that than in the warm embrace of the dance
> community.  It's especially comforting to know that as we dance
together in
> our local community, we are part of a global dance community.  May we
> transcend the hatred."
>
> Let us come together this evening, once again sharing in mutual caring
and
> support, nurturing the souls of our dance community.
>
> /Roger
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> While it may appear that you are the only recipient of this message,
is is
> being sent to many in my personal Email address book.




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Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:39:39 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 17:39:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: JBGrun-AT-
aol.com
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Tragedy (Chris)
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
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In a message dated 9/12/01 8:18:51 AM, madrobin-AT-
javanet.com writes:

>It is with great sadness that I write to you about the death of Chris
>Carstanjen, Mary Jones' son. Chris was on one of the planes that hit the WTC.
>So far we have not been able to reach Mary; we think she is on her way
>to be with relatives.>

How terrible terrible terrible. Chris was close to my son Noah's age, & they 
were at Family Weeks together for several years during the late 70's I think. 
Those were my first encounters with him & his Mom & I know I am not alone in 
immediately responding to their warmth. I was so pleased, over all these 
years, to have observed him blossom into a wonderful dance partner with a 
sense of fun & humor truly worthy of Mary. 

Judy Grunberg
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Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:41:37 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 17:44:55 -0400
From: Sharon Green <mls-AT-
panix.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: To Dance? Yes In DC (Glen Echo)
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
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popserver.panix.com>
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References: <54464.148.184.176.32.1000307190.squirrel-AT-
www.weitzman.com>

At 10:01 PM 9/12/01 +0100, Trevor wrote:
>And now we are learning of deaths of relations of
>friends/acquaintences - even names on a list who we have become used to
>reading but never met. I hope, as I said before, that dance (and the
>dance community)  can still be a way to start to bring back some
>feeling of normality to those who need it.

It can be and shall be, Trevor, even here in New York.  It's still
prohibited for anyone except neighborhood residents or people on official
business to go below 14th Street, but we're working to set up an alternate
site for our Saturday dance, if it's necessary.  And we'll have one.
Godspeed--
Sharon
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Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 15:01:33 PST
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Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 17:52:09 -0400
From: Beatrice Huppert <bhuppert-AT-
juno.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: Steve Adams
To: ECD-AT-
SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Message-ID: <20010912.175615.-3815893.1.bhuppert-AT-
juno.com>
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Dear Gene,  My heartfelt and sincere sympathies to you and Jesssica, and
family.    Bea H.
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Archive-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 15:47:38 PST
Sender: owner-ecd-AT-
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Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 17:47:32 -0500
From: Roger Diggle <diggle-AT-
bigfoot.com>
Reply-To: ECD-AT-
playford.slac.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: The need to dance
To: ECD-AT-
PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
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j-sivier-AT-
ux1.cso.uiuc.edu wrote:  

>Orly Krasner writes:
>> 
>>    Several members of our dance community expressed exactly that sentiment 
>> while discussing whether or not to cancel the dance--whether we actually 
>> moved to music or not became almost secondary to our desire to be with 
other 
>> people to whom we felt so connected.  Our dance space is directly across 
the 
>> street from St Vincent's Hospital, so we continue to pray. . . .
>> --Orly (still in shock--perhaps even more so as the enormity of the loss to 
>> humanity starts to sink in)
>
>   Several years ago Orace Johnson, the leader of our l