Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 11:57:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 13:33:58 -0500 (CDT) From: j-sivier-AT- ux1.cso.uiuc.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: places to advertise (nothing to do with gender balance, etc.) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <200107091833.f69IXvC29147-AT- staff2.cso.uiuc.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Our group, Central Illinois English Country Dancers, is planning an English-American Dance and Music weekend for next March. We are trying to think of the best places to advertise to get the word out, on our limited budget. We've submitted the info to the CDSS News for their upcoming events section and are planning to place a display ad, probably in the January-February issue. I would like further suggestions on places to advertise our event and the timing of those ads. What have other people done? What works well and what shouldn't be bothered with? Any other advice on promoting an event like this? Thanks. Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Home page URL: http://www.uiuc.edu/ph/www/j-sivier | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 12:20:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 15:15:43 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Getting past the whoosh To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <200107091519_MC3-D8A4-AEDB-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Tja, what indeed can we do? I find that many MCs, callers and teachers concentrate on things in this order: 1) dancES, 2) dancING and 3) dancERS, leaving the dynamics of events essentially to take care of themselves. Or not. Etiquette? What's that? There seems to be a different set in almost every group, and not all of that is INclusive. So, what CAN we do? If it is tolerated - and oftentimes organizers warn against it beforehand - we can use a mixer or two per evening. I like to start the evening with a mixer and ask beforehand to keep the last partner for the next dance. My reasoning is that the mixer will introduce the dancers to one another, let them recognize who's there and give them a chance to say hello - and the next dance is hopefully danced with someone who is not one of their regular partners, but now becomes a better-known entity on the dance floor. Be warned, mixers are often perceived as exactly what they are: attempts of stirring the pot, and that smacks of manipulation, never mind how much fun some of those dances are! And what is REALLY the difference of whether I dance with my not-chosen partner for one turn as corners or neighbors or whether I come back to the same person each time? Set dances vs. longways. Yes, I like to include more set dances in events! I go a step further and announce that EVERYBODY will have a chance to get into the set because I run the dance twice, and the second time the erstwhile left-out folks have the right to tap themselves into a set (it's not that the erstwhile dancers have to graciously give up their spot, it's the other way round). Time between dances. Particularly in the USA the lines for the next dance form immediately after a dance has stopped. That creates the problems previously discussed in this thread and its relatives: finding no partner, finding oneself almost immediately at the bottom of the set, or being 'forced' to participate in the frenzy. Nasty concept that, but how so true. Again, we can create space and time between dances by being less predictable. Posting the list with the order of dances, as at balls and the evening dances at Pinewoods during ECD weeks, can help somewhat. One can make arrangements in advance for dances - but that takes knowledge, too, and disappointing for those who are not aware of it. Obviously, we don't have sure-fire recipies for 'a good time'. As far as dance events are concerned, it is safe to say however, that folks come with the expectation to participate - not be relegated to the side lines for any amount of time. Depending on the venue they may accept the concept of 'this is a dance we have learned already, so please watch it'. I believe that the organizer should be aware of the general dynamics and communicate them to the MC/teacher/caller. And that person bears the responsibility to facilitate the 'good time' for all who come. It may mean carrying some additional community-building dances or maneuvers in her/his bag of tricks. And yes, it may mean sticking one's neck out and rattling on an established format. It definitely involves more than just being a glorified DJ. _-AT- _ {)/' /\ /\_._,<_/ ' \ /_\ /> /< Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 14:05:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 17:13:45 -0400 From: Graham.Christian-AT- risk.sungard.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Whatever shall we wear? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I apologize to members of the list who perhaps feel that they have heard enough from me for this calendar year already. They are welcome to strike DELETE now. For the readers remaining-- I do ponder the question of apparel from time to time--not least because I am on the stuffy side myself, and apt to err by overdressing rather than otherwise. Cries of dismay often ensue when I turn up at a contra dance, necktie still more or less in place. But in truth, my very *raison d'etre* is to be *suitably* dressed for every occasion. In a hot tub or a swimming hole, attire might be quite, as Loudon Wainwright immortally says in his "Swimming Song," *informal*--and I respect that too. Or if I cannot, I stay away. But herein lies the trouble. What is suitable dress for dance (especially English Country) now? In the not-so-good old days, when classism was in flower, dress sent distinct messages about your birth, your work, and your wealth. If you were somehow so stump-dull, or so uppity, that you didn't grasp this, sumptuary laws were in effect that enforced the differences by law. If you were of such-and-so station, the following fabrics were forbidden. None of the following precious stones. No slashed sleeves, no gimp, no snippet work (As Will Cuppy says, "This resulted in much more gimp and snippet work"). Were these laws *enforced* anywhere? Not, so far as I can tell, very much. But our forebears were acutely aware of the differences, and grumbled about the blurring of the lines, sometimes by legislation. This, by the way, is one of the reasons that it is so shocking and immoral when, as in *Giselle* or *Luisa Miller* or *Barbiere di Siviglia*, the young highborn dolt pretends to be a shepherd boy or some other preposterous thing. We think it's not more than cutely coy--but it is actually wicked for the young man to pretend to be something he is not in this way: the consequences and misunderstandings, in the first two, are tragic. It is my impression that at dances and balls--they being a superior and particular sort of party--one still dressed according to one's birth and station, but rather more so (sometimes *much* more so: one astonished ambassador remarked of Elizabeth I that she had on more pearls than he thought could be assembled in his master's entire kingdom. I am guessing that she *did* have on the Tower of London, but the ambassador was too pearl-blinded to mention it). As for the moisture factor--I'm afraid that sweat follows movement as the cart the horse. My guess is that--while it rarely became quite so hot and humid as it does in my fair country--in the balls of 1600 and 1900, across Europe, dancers simply sweated in their ten or twenty pounds of clothing, and thought it more healthful than harmful (this turns up somewhere in *Tom Jones*, I think, among other places). Throw on more civet, more rose-water, and move on at full speed (tho', in our more squeamish day, extra shirts are never a bad idea). But in our day, dress does not really denote class, and sumptuary laws are not in effect. Yet: *all* apparel is costume, and all apparel sends *some* message. And (following the thread of one of Nilos' remarks) costume certainly changes one's movements and carriage--a phenomenon that any who have acted must have noticed. The rehearsals meander along--but when the costumes arrive, formerly lackluster characterizations suddenly crystallize. So, to me, the question is not about costume--but about what manner of costume is chosen, and what message is sent. Sometimes, I'm afraid, the message is: I didn't care enough about the rest of you to scrub the guano off my Dockers. Or: I don't know where I am. All the gods forbid that I should prescribe for anyone--but among the questions I ask *myself* are: will I look good in this (factoring, naturally, for the material with which I start)? Would my mother concur? my companions and friends? Will it move, and if so, how? [occasionally it's worthwhile to trade a little freedom of movement for the otherwise perfect, but rather limiting, garment]. Will it contribute to the festive atmosphere of the evening? Will everyone *else* be in zoot suits/sarongs/bubbles, or will I stand out as too little or too much? Mileage will of course vary. Some are stunning in tee-shirts--some not. Some men can make a very good impression in batik wraparound skirts--others not. Some women are simply dazzling in well-cut tuxedos--others look lost. The trial of experience--and occasionally a candid friend or two--are possibly even better guides than the mirror. G Graham Christian Technical Writer, Product Management SunGard Trading and Risk Systems 88 Broad Street, Boston, MA 02110 Telephone number: (617)542-2800, extension 248 Email address: graham.christian-AT- risk.sungard.com Group web address: http://www.risk.sungard.com "Speak, that I may see thee." --Ben Jonson ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 15:19:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 23:17:05 +0100 From: Ron Hawkins Subject: starting with a mixer To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hanny said: [snip] I like to start the evening with a mixer and ask beforehand to keep the last partner for the next dance. [big snip] If I heard you announce this I would almost certainly sit out the first dance. The only saving grace about this idea is that you say "the start". Personally I dislike intensely doing a mixer and then being lumbered with someone not of my choosing for the entire next dance. Even more unacceptable (IMHO) is when a caller/MC does this for the last two dances of an evening. I believe this to be the worst crime any caller/MC can commit. If all else has failed me, I at least want to dance the final dance with my own choice of partner. How do dance evenings usually end "over there" (as it is becoming apparent that things are done differently across the pond)? Ron H (in England) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 16:17:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 16:17:16 -0700 From: giovanni de amici Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: starting with a mixer To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B4A3B7C.AA9E601F-AT- yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: Good day all. I have to sympathyze with Ron. Few things are more off-turning than a caller/teacher trying to dictate one's behaviour. If I ever wanted to be told what to do, and have my social choices controlled by someone else, I am sure I can find several organizations willing to help, but an evening of ECD is not one of them. I dance because I enjoy doing it, not because it is a way to redress whatever ills befall our society. And very much intend to keep it that way. Activism, political or social or ..., belongs elsewhere. On the other hand, at least on my side of the pond (mostly San Francisco, Washington DC area and Los Angeles, more or less in that temporal order), such a behaviour as the one Hanny requests is the accepted norm, to the point that the dance teacher does not even feel the need to ask for it (I suspect that if he were to ask, he would meet very little compliance; certainly I would resist the demand). There are exceptions (as in everything, some people never seem to learn), but one knows that at the end of a mixer he is supposed to keep the last partner, even though she is a total three-left-footed stranger. That is, keep her unless she has already booked the next dance with someone else (it happens). Under a worse case scenario you "waste" about 10% of your evening's dances. Considering how many times other people had to put up with you and waste one of their dance slots, while you were learning to dance, it is not too much to be asked and give back to the community. And of course, the teacher knows that he should not choose a mixer as the second-to-last dance of the evening. As for Ron's direct query: contra evenings end with a waltz; ECD evenings end either with a waltz, if we have a more-or-less gender-balanced group, or a dance requested from the floor; balls end always with a waltz. Happy dancing. Giovanni De Amici Ron Hawkins wrote: > > Hanny said: > [snip] I like to start the evening with a mixer and ask beforehand to keep > the last partner for the next dance. [big snip] > > If I heard you announce this I would almost certainly sit out the first > dance. The only saving grace about this idea is that you say "the start". > Personally I dislike intensely doing a mixer and then being lumbered with > someone not of my choosing for the entire next dance. ..... > note: "words used in the masculine gender include the feminine and neuter" and viceversa. California Civil Code, sect 14 -- for information about ECD in the Los Angeles area, please check SBECD's web page at: www.geocities.com/sbecd _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 16:41:38 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 23:41:33 +0000 From: Margherita Davis Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Getting past the whoosh To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU BCC: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT A couple people have mentioned that set dances are good for preventing folks from lining up in a duple minor set, avoiding that whoosh. That is not my experience. However, I have found that many set dances in an evening at a large hall do tend to prevent the mingling of dancers. ("Have you been here all night?!?) The effect is not as profound in a smaller hall. Margherita Davis _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 18:00:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 20:55:50 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: starting with a mixer To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <200107092059_MC3-D8AF-51EE-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT VEEEERRRRY interesting! Both Ron and Giovanni imply that the partner they will get 'stuck with' in a mixer will be the absolutely worst possible, and that the dance will be 'a waste'. We were talking about dance community and inclusion of those potentially and repeatedly left out or relegated to the bottom of sets. I agree that mixers are not fortunate choices toward the end of the evening. Now, why do you folks resent mixers so much? And is it an imposition if a lady asks YOU for a dance, thereby reducing your chance to choose for yourself? And do you consider that dance a waste as well? _-AT- _ {)/' /\ /\_._,<_/ ' \ /_\ /> /< Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 18:20:01 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 18:19:54 -0700 From: giovanni de amici Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: starting with a mixer To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B4A583A.4FB2C06C-AT- yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <200107092059_MC3-D8AF-51EE-AT- compuserve.com> Hallo? anyone home? does anyone ever reads beyond the first line anyone? I hate to quote myself, but this calls for it: "Under a worse case scenario you "waste" about 10% of your evening's dances." Do we understand what it means? that is the WORSE that can happen to you. Nothing more terrible than that; and most likely (implicit in the definition of "worse case") you won't get 'stuck' with a 'bad' partner at all. And for complete understanding: 1) I do not resent mixers. I resent callers who try to impose on me their idea of social engineering and equality and inclusiveness (but make sure to reserve for themselves the last waltz with the best looking lady in the hall). 2) I love it when women ask me for a dance. I just wish they did it more often and did not wait till all the hunks are already taken. Happy dancing. Giovanni "Hanny D. Budnick" wrote: > > VEEEERRRRY interesting! > Both Ron and Giovanni imply that the partner they will get 'stuck with' in > a mixer will be the absolutely worst possible, and that the dance will be > 'a waste'. > > We were talking about dance community and inclusion of those potentially > and repeatedly left out or relegated to the bottom of sets. I agree that > mixers are not fortunate choices toward the end of the evening. > > Now, why do you folks resent mixers so much? And is it an imposition if a > lady asks YOU for a dance, thereby reducing your chance to choose for > yourself? And do you consider that dance a waste as well? > > _-AT- _ {)/' > /\ /\_._,<_/ > ' \ /_\ > /> /< Hanny Budnick -- for information about ECD in the Los Angeles area, please check SBECD's web page at: www.geocities.com/sbecd _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 18:52:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 21:51:54 -0400 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: yo- Mary Jones! To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT what the heck was that that just arrived in my mailbox in six 173K parts????? yikes! Mary Beth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 19:02:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 18:53:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: yo- Mary Jones! To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K5QKIKG97A9QXGQM-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Mary Beth wrote: > what the heck was that that just arrived in my mailbox in six 173K parts????? > yikes! It would appear that Mary's computer has one of those delightful virus/worms that send garbage to everyone in your address book. (This is one of the many reasons why nobody should use Outlook or Outlook Express on a home system; those mail clients make it very easy to get and spread this kind of infection.) I have removed her post from the Digest and haven't put it in the archive. If somebody local to Mary would like to phone her up and warn her about this, it would be a good idea. -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 19:13:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:11:46 -0400 From: "Emily L. Ferguson" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: yo- Mary Jones! To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: >what the heck was that that just arrived in my mailbox in six 173K parts????? > >yikes! A PC virus. -- Emily L. Ferguson elf-AT- cape.com 508-563-6822 New England landscapes, wooden boats and races, press photography Beetle cats on the web at: http://www.beetlecat.com/gft-pics/ef-notes.htm http://www.beetlecat.org/results/99champs.html http://www.beetlecat.org/store.html#yrbook landscape at: http://www.capecodlife.com/CCD/regions/upper_cape.html ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 19:17:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:15:57 -0400 (EDT) From: "Robert A. Brooks" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: yo- Mary Jones! To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > If somebody local to Mary would like to phone her up and warn her about this, > it would be a good idea. Her phone is busy, presumably busy infecting many others . . . --Rob ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 19:26:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:29:12 -0700 From: Robin Hayden Subject: bottom of the set To: ecd list Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3B4A92A8.1893814C-AT- earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT To clarify my point about the two-halves-of-the-room syndrome: I agree with many people's replies to Marian's question, "What's wrong with the bottom of the set?" As Emily points out, the ones' part is often more interesting -- and, consequently, harder to learn, by the way; as Suzanne notes, being closer to the top makes it easier to hear the instructions -- and, by the same token, easier for the caller to spot places where people need help, haven't heard, or haven't understood. There's also the disadvantage of having to change roles before one is quite comfortable with the dance pattern. (That can happen near the top, too, of course.) But what I had specifically meant to point out when I reported on the beginners-at-the-bottom at ESS was that it was the same people again and again dancing with each other -- that (as we all know) when the more experienced dancers in a group consistenty make a point of partnering up and rushing to the top, those who could use some mixing in are left somewhat rudderless. In this particular case, since the Scottish dances weren't longways sets, it *wasn't* a case of "everyone will get to the top of the hall eventually." That was what struck me. I find it's much more difficult to get people to "play nicely," as Yonina put it, at a dance party or dance week than at a regular dance. At our Monday night English dance in Amherst, for example, we have terrific community spirit, and rarely does anyone sit out who doesn't want to. It feels obvious, at a weekly dance, that experienced people helpfully partnering beginners will make for a better evening for everyone. We also often ask beginners to come to the top of the set before taking hands four, expressly because it's easier to learn the dance as a one and dance to the bottom. But at a special dance one may have to dig deeper into reservoirs of generosity to occasionally give up dancing with favorite partners for the good of the community. Robin Hayden ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 20:19:33 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 23:19:26 -0400 (EDT) From: "Robert A. Brooks" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Mary Jones' latest "contribution" to the list To: ecd list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hello everyone, I have spoken to Mary, and she is aware of the problem. She's going to get her computer scrubbed. In case anyone is worried, it appears as though this was a rather poorly-done attempt at sending a virus; the actual application that is the virus was not sent in a form that could cause damage; it was not sent as an executable. In any event, Mary sends her deepest apologies to all for any inconvenience she may have caused. For those with Mac computers, while this virus would not have caused any harm, it is foolhardy to think that you are immune from these problems simply due to using a Mac. If you use, for instance, Microsoft Outlook for the Mac, you can be subject to attack from certain virii. Use of 3rd party (non-Microsoft) email clients greatly reduces the chance of getting whacked by one of these nasties no matter what type of computer and operating system you use. --Rob ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 20:20:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 23:20:06 -0400 (EDT) From: SFORDNYC-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: starting with a mixer To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Personally, I was not aware of the custom that one is obligated to dance the next dance with your final partner in a mixer. I have more often enountered mixers at the end of dances so one might waltz with that person -- or not depending on mutual agreement. I would say that often with a mixer where I haven't really "danced" with the partner I started with, it has happened that we both feel like doing another "for real" dance (not necessarily immediately following but at some point later on) assuming it's not the end of the evening I also thinks it's good when the caller moves couples one apart at the start of a mixer, so you at least get to do one complete round with your "chosen" partner. Suzanne Ford ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 20:29:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 23:27:14 -0400 From: "Emily L. Ferguson" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Mary Jones' latest "contribution" to the list To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: I got an .exe file with Mary's virus. But I don't support Mr. Gates. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 21:27:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 00:26:57 -0400 (EDT) From: SFORDNYC-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Mary Jones' latest "contribution" to the list To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT This is a good reason not to let attachments download automatically. While AOL is far from perfect, at least it gives users the option to decide whether to open an attachment -- and avoid the unwanted altogether. I just deleted it. Whew! Suzanne // who even with precautions has still been bitten by the virus bug ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:21:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:24:31 -0700 From: Mary Devlin Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Mary Kay To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT on 3/25/01 10:53 PM, srotenbe-AT- impop.bellatlantic.net at srotenbe-AT- impop.bellatlantic.net wrote: > Dear ECD list, > > I feel a terrible loss, both personally and for the dance community. Mary > Kay was so present at so many dance events, on so many committees and > boards, that her absence will be felt greatly. My personal recollections > of her are posted on our local Germantown Country Dancers web site at: > http://www.culture-at-work.com/mkfreflections.html There's another nice > photo if you click back to the main page. The dance community, as usual, > has been like a family in supporting each other through this sad event. > Our dances, pot lucks, and rehearsals have been intersperced with hugs and > tears and many fond memories. I have received many heartfelt responses to > my own shared memories. It is certainly a tribute to our community that > we can support each other in the hardest of times. > > Several people have shared on the ECD list their thoughts about Mary Kay. > Maybe others have sent cards or messages directly to her family. Her > whole family: mother, brothers, sisters-in-law, neices and nephews are > expected to be at the service in Washington DC on April 5th. Our family > plans to be there and there will be an opportunity to share our memories > and stories. If there are stories or memories you would like to share, but > you can't be present at the service, please send them on and we will > either incorporate them in our remarks or pass them on directly to the > family. > > I also plan to put together a photo collage. If you have a special > photograph of Mary Kay which you are willing to part with or can make a > good xerox copy or photo copy of and get to me by March 31st, I can add it > to the collage. > > Thanks, > > Sandy Rotenberg > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:38:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 00:37:02 -0500 From: Larry Stout Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: starting with a mixer To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B4A947E.B7C5BA90-AT- sun.iwu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <200107092059_MC3-D8AF-51EE-AT- compuserve.com> "Hanny D. Budnick" wrote: > > Now, why do you folks resent mixers so much? And is it an imposition if a > lady asks YOU for a dance, thereby reducing your chance to choose for > yourself? And do you consider that dance a waste as well? Why do "us folks" resent mixers so much? Most (not all--for example Jovial Beggars is an exception) are really dorky dances (to use the slang of my younger son's girl friend). Early in an evening in a group where people do not know each other mixers have a place. I like to get to know the others at a dance and see who I might enjoy dancing with later in the evening--the smooth dancers with excellent timing, the dancers who give a smile and pleasant eye contact, the beginners who are game but not skilled. I also see who I don't want as partners--those who dance only for themselves with too many frills messing up the timing, those who clamp down hard on my right arm on a swing or force my arms into painful positions so they can twirl, those who dance without regard to the music. Late in an evening a mixer is an imposition: it does not serve the same function of providing introductions that a mixer early in the evening does. I do not see it as an imposition if a lady asks me for a dance. Under some circumstances I don't see it as an imposition if a man does, though I usually prefer a partner of the other gender. I do often want to dance with my wife. We lived about 300 miles apart for five years because of the availability of academic jobs (fortunately we are now happily employed in the same city). Dance camps were often the only chance we got to dance together. We probably danced together more than a "communitarian" ethic would call for. I make no apology: one of the things that attracted me to my wife was the joy I experience dancing with her. The glow I've seen in other couples' eyes tells me we are not unique. Larry -- Lawrence Neff Stout "Fiddling is a viol habit." Anon? "Dancing is necessary in a well ordered society." Thoinot Arbeau ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 06:55:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 09:22:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Sam Weiler Subject: Re: Ideal camp To: Mary Devlin CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > I'm curious to know what you particularly like in a dance week. What > are the things you look for when deciding to attend? What are the > elements that, once you're there, make it a great week for you? The answers to those two questions are noticably different. I've tried to list the factors in order, but if you can provide some context for your query, I can give a more detailed answer. When deciding to attend, in order: 1) extensive ECD program 2) manageable cost, including travel (this may change in the future) 3) good teaching staff 4) ability to register (or cancel) late (this may be an unusual requirement, but I expect it to continue to be included) 5) interesting daytime activities, (ie. scuba diving in St. Croix) or 6) having some appealing class during almost every period 7) a perception that there'll be interesting people there ?) Positive comments from people who've been there And once I get there: 1) friendships and off-the-floor interactions and play. May include the late-night parties. Maybe playing cribbage in the camphouse. Maybe sitting and talking for hours. Maybe kayaking or snorkeling. Maybe flirting. 2) enthusiastic, flirtatious dancers 2.5) easily partnering with those people 3) great dancing -- long hours of ECD 4) a surreal experience or two 5) nothing that mars the experience: I've seen leaders who couldn't adapt their language for the audience and stood at the microphone repeating the exact words they used before and getting frustrated with the dancers. I've also had the magic of camp shattered when some folks' anger and frustration leaked out. Summary: I base my decision to attend mostly on published information (program, staff). Unusual factors high on my list are cost and flexibility to register late. That said, my enjoyment of the week depends the most on who's there, a factor which a program committee can't really control for and which I give low precedence on my "deciding" list. Whether I return to a week for a second year is based on the same factors in the first list, though I'm noticably more informed. -- Sam ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 06:55:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 08:39:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Sam Weiler Subject: Re: Admission fees To: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > 2) Do individuals who don't have the money to pay for the fun stay > away or does your group have a discreet way of accommodating them? > If so, what is it? And how do you let those folks know that they > are welcome? For regular events, Pittsburgh leaves a money jar and sign-up list on a table. An announcement is made during the break to encourage visiting the money jar. We don't individually harass those who ignore the jar. While our bylaws say we won't turn anyone away, the label on our jar merely says "members $3, non-members $4". It should probably say "suggested donation". Those words are on our website. http://www.cdssp.org > 1) How does your ECD group handle first-timers at your regular events? > Are they allowed to 'just watch'? Do you charge them admission? I don't think we're consistent on this one. My impression has long been that the first time is free, but I've heard announcements that invited all, including first-timers, to visit the money jar. The context here, though, is that we're a small group and are always able to talk with our newcomers one-on-one. We've also been trying to reach out to the SCA community, which isn't accustomed to paying for their weekly dance practices. So while our fees aren't oppressive, they may be a symbolic hurdle for someone from that community. -- Sam ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 06:56:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 08:30:24 -0400 From: Maryn McKenna Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Mary Jones' latest "contribution" to the list To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.0.20010710082952.00af58a0-AT- mindspring.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT i don't see it in my system. i *do* have virus software, but just in case: what was the bug's full name? At 12:26 AM 7/10/01 -0400, you wrote: >This is a good reason not to let attachments download automatically. While >AOL is far from perfect, at least it gives users the option to decide whether >to open an attachment -- and avoid the unwanted altogether. I just deleted >it. Whew! > >Suzanne // who even with precautions has still been bitten by the virus bug -=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=- M.A.J. McKenna mmckenna-AT- mindspring.com Staff writer, science and medicine mmckenna-AT- ajc.com The Atlanta Journal-Constitution 404.526.5987 vox 72 Marietta St., NW, 8th floor 404.526.5977 fax Atlanta, GA 30303 USA 1.800.756.3328x5987 -=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 07:39:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 10:39:32 -0400 From: DorothyOlsson-AT- netscape.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Summer Dancing Plans! To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <18C40BD8.570484E2.732DE083-AT- netscape.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Hello everyone, If you didn't get into Pinewoods, please consider joining us this summer at the Amherst Early Music Festival!! Cheers, Dorothy Olsson HISTORICAL DANCE PROGRAM Renaissance, Baroque and English Country Dances; Historical Dance for Teachers Workshop; Theatre Project; Special Dance/Dance Music Lecture; Concerts and more… AT THE AMHERST EARLY MUSIC FESTIVAL University of Connecticut at Storrs, USA July 29-August 5, 2001 and August 5-12, 2001 FACULTY: Carol G. Marsh, internationally recognized authority on 17th- and 18th-century dance Kaspar D. Mainz, performer and teacher of historical dance in Europe Dorothy Olsson, director of the New York Historical Dance Company For more information, please visit our website at http://www.AmherstEarlyMusic.org/ (Follow link from Program Information for the 2001 Summer workshop) Amherst Early Music www.amherstearlymusic.org Marilyn Boenau, director P.O. Box 1322 Shirley, MA 01464 Phone: 978.425.4400 Fax: 978.425.6644 info-AT- amherstearlymusic.org For more information about the dance program, contact Dr. Dorothy Olsson: do6-AT- nyu.edu Für Informationen auf Deutsch, bitte kontaktieren Sie Kaspar D. Mainz: KasparMnz-AT- aol.com __________________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 10:10:42 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 12:33:36 -0400 (EDT) From: JBGrun-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: bottom of the set To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <11b.172890e.287c8860-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT In a message dated 7/9/01 10:34:58 PM, robinhayden-AT- earthlink.net writes: << But at a special dance one may have to dig deeper into reservoirs of generosity to occasionally give up dancing with favorite partners for the good of the community. >> True, true. This returns to the idea of *expectation*, esp. when extra time & effort has gone into one's appearance/costume. There's the need to look good, not only as a single, but as a couple. Judy G ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 20:15:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 14:34:48 -0400 (EDT) From: JBGrun-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Terror At The Bottom Of The Set To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <112.170f172.287ca4c8-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT In a message dated 7/9/01 12:31:57 PM, lyrlsbro-AT- yahoo.com writes: << --- "Emily L. Ferguson" wrote: > It would be interesting to study the basic repertoire to > determine just how many dances actually favor those in the > 1 position. Coming immediately to mind are Orleans, Aily, > Beveridge, The Bish, Belamira, Siege of Limerick, From > Aberdeen, The First Lady, Isaac, Kilburn, Red House, Mad > Robin. Kilburn is definitely, for me, on the alltime favorite list for ones. As in Orleans, they never stop moving; they just keep flowing along --well down & up -- the line, sharing their energy with the 2's & 3's as they pass by & through. Judy G. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 05:47:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 08:43:37 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: bottom of the set To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <200107110847_MC3-D8DD-175D-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT About looking good as a couple... You cannot imagine my gut-level reaction when once, at one of the early Playford Balls in Germantown, there appeared a young man who had just moved into our area and who had been a tailor in a historical village up north. He appeared in apparel which he had handmade - and it was the perfect complement, color scheme and all, to my own self-made gown.... Totally unintended and unpremeditated, but - well, you just have to experience it yourself to appreciate it. If you COME as a couple to a special event, most likely your outfits will complement each other. I dress for my own feeling of comfort, wellbeing and appropriateness for the occasion, and my man and I consult with each other. I don't know to what degree the choice of DANCING partners is influenced by their garb, unless it is smelly, dirty or otherwise antisocial. I don't think that the reasoning of "here I've really put a lot of effort into my appearance" influences whether one finds oneself at the bottom of the set. I DO think that sharing the dance experience with 'the floor' and those on the sidelines has more to do with the group's (AND the M.C.'s AND the organizer's) interest in a good community experience. And I'm observing that that spirit develops more easily in regular groups than at special events - even week-long ones. _-AT- _ {)/' /\ /\_._,<_/ ' \ /_\ /> /< Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:03:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 17:00:39 +0100 From: Ron Hawkins Subject: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hanny said: is it an imposition if a lady asks YOU for a dance, ... ? Not at all. this is a free society (I hope) and I have the choice whether to accept the invitation or decline gracefully. In the "keep-your-partner-at-the-end-of-a-mixer" scenario I can hardly be so crass as to refuse my expectant partner, which would in my opinion be extreme bad manners. ... And do you consider that dance a waste as well? I never mentioned "wasting" a dance. All dancing is fun, it is a matter of degree. This is not the point, it is being backed into a corner that I dislike. However I am pleased that no-one seems to disagree (so far) with my intense dislike of the mixer/keeper set being done last. This DOES happen from time to time over here and I am now careful to avoid events where I know the caller/MC has done this to me in the past. [head above parapet] On another subject entirely: I may be old-fashioned and British (and disgracefully non-pc) but I can never imagine in a million years dancing with another man. It's not an intolerant, prudish or preference thing, it is cultural and built into my very being, and I can't help it (even if I wanted to). With the exception of Morris dance which is different and no "touching" is involved, men don't dance with men where I come from. I have no objection or discomfort about other men dancing together, I just couldn't do it myself. Until this recent thread started about gender imbalance I have never ever considered it - I have no idea if it is just me or it is a common but unvoiced feeling, nor whether it is a culture difference or simply my own standpoint. Wow! how about THAT for opening myself up to abuse, accusations, or criticism! [ducks back below the parapet] Ron H ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 14:39:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 17:39:35 -0400 (EDT) From: JBGrun-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dancing on a Maine Island, Aug 18th To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: lucyjy-AT- valley.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I'm posting this for Lucy: The dance is in the High School Gym in Islesboro, Maine, from 8-12 on Saturday, August 18th. Caller is Bruce Hamilton. Musicians are Mary Lea, Jacqueline Schwab, and Chris Rua. Soft-soled shoes, please. The cost is $10. Ferry returns to the mainland after the dance, at cost. Lobster & clam-bake starting 5 PM, by prepaid ($20) reservations to Lucy J. Young, P.O.Box 160, Islesboro, Me. 04848. Questions to Jamie MacMillan at 207-734-8140. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 18:28:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 18:12:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K5TBX2NPGO9QXGQM-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Ron wrote: > However I am pleased that no-one seems to disagree (so far) with my intense > dislike of the mixer/keeper set being done last. This DOES happen from time > to time over here and I am now careful to avoid events where I know the > caller/MC has done this to me in the past. Well, I'll sometimes call a waltz mixer as my last country dance of the evening, but I don't make people keep who they ended up with; instead, I follow with a free waltz where people can choose their own partners (who often turn out to be the ones they asked for the mixer). If I don't intend to run the mixer long enough for everyone to get their partner back, I have the women back up a place so they get to do a whole round with their chosen partner. > [head above parapet] > On another subject entirely: I may be old-fashioned and British (and > disgracefully non-pc) but I can never imagine in a million years dancing > with another man. It's not an intolerant, prudish or preference thing, it > is cultural and built into my very being, and I can't help it (even if I > wanted to). Well, if that's how you feel, that's how you feel. > With the exception of Morris dance which is different and no > "touching" is involved, Picky correction: Some Cotswold morris (Adderbury comes to mind) has about as much physical contact as Playford dancing does (taking hands with partner, basically), and some border morris has more. ("Four Lane End" has what's basically a partner swing in it, and there's another figure I've seen where partners stand shoulder to shoulder and put their arms around each other to make a two-person unit; three of those units can do a hey for three rather than a hey for six.) > men don't dance with men where I come from. >I have > no objection or discomfort about other men dancing together, I just couldn't > do it myself. This could present a certain degree of discomfort if sets had formed for say, Fandango or Newcastle, and one set needed one couple, and there were only two available people left in the room, both men, and one of them was you. Would you be more uncomfortable declining to fill the set (and thus making four or six people sit down) or dancing with the other man? If you move in a milieu where men dancing together is just Not Done, this won't come up, of course, since nobody will expect you to fill the set, but it could very likely make an uncomfortable moment if you were ever to dance in the US. (It's not that those four or six people would press you very hard to dance, once you said "I'd prefer not to", but the big puppy eyes would be hard to resist.) -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 21:25:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 23:19:37 -0500 From: Paul Stamler Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <006601c10a89$dd5de4c0$792c4b0c-AT- paulstam> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: ----- Original Message ----- From: Ron Hawkins <> Whereas, for example, many orthodox Jews have precisely the opposite shudder -- they dance *only* with the same gender. Different strokes for different folks. It's called multiculturalism -- hey, now it's PC! Peace, Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 03:20:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 11:15:46 +0100 From: Trevor Monson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <005501c10abc$8b5de340$ca8701d4-AT- trevormo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <01K5TBX2NPGO9QXGQM-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> Ron wrote: > > > men don't dance with men where I come from. > > >I have > > no objection or discomfort about other men dancing together, I just couldn't > > do it myself. > And Alan said: > This could present a certain degree of discomfort if sets had formed for say, > Fandango or Newcastle, and one set needed one couple, and there were only two > available people left in the room, both men, and one of them was you. Would > you be more uncomfortable declining to fill the set (and thus making four or > six people sit down) or dancing with the other man? > > If you move in a milieu where men dancing together is just Not Done, this won't > come up, of course, since nobody will expect you to fill the set, but it could > very likely make an uncomfortable moment if you were ever to dance in the US. > (It's not that those four or six people would press you very hard to dance, > once you said "I'd prefer not to", but the big puppy eyes would be hard to > resist.) > And I am adding: In most ECD style dances in England, it has still not been accepted that men can/should dance with men. In the above Fandango example, if there were 2 ladies dancing together any where else in the hall, they would split up and partner these 2 men - without causing any fuss (like it sounds happens in US by ladies who insist on dancing with ladies and will not be separated). If by any remote and unlikely chance that there are exactly an equal number of male/female couples dancing in the hall, then it would be up to the self consciousness of the 2 men left whether they would/could dance together, and also up to the other 4 people trying to make up the set. Don't forget they may sit down quickly as they also don't want to dance with 2 men as a couple in their set! The normal thing, here, would be that 2 ladies dancing together would split - normally the ladies would also decide who dances in which set. I think in England with ECD, we have still got some old fashioned notion that this type of dancing is still for mixed sex couples (and this still takes priority over single sex couples) as that was what this type of dancing is made for. And long may this last! (But, if required if there is no alternative, I have been known to dance with a man. And not just ECD, but also SCD and quite often at Irish Sets, where there are often more men then women. And there are also longer/closer times together in Irish Sets as most of it is in ballroom hold!) Trevor Monson _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 06:59:01 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 09:54:12 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <200107120956_MC3-D907-4D71-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Rather than asking to complete a set - either with unprepared beginners or with same-sex couples - wouldn't an easier solution be to announce beforehand that the set will be done TWICE, and that those left out the first time had A RIGHT to claim a place for the second time round? That's what I'm doing, and it works well. Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 08:30:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 17:33:38 +0200 From: Philippe Callens Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: starting with a mixer To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B4DC352.BB6EBCA8-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <200107092059_MC3-D8AF-51EE-AT- compuserve.com> <3B4A947E.B7C5BA90-AT- sun.iwu.edu> Larry Stout wrote: > "Hanny D. Budnick" wrote: > > > > Now, why do you folks resent mixers so much? And is it an imposition if a > > lady asks YOU for a dance, thereby reducing your chance to choose for > > yourself? And do you consider that dance a waste as well? > > Why do "us folks" resent mixers so much? Most (not all--for example > Jovial Beggars is an exception) are really dorky dances (to use the > slang of my younger son's girl friend). As a dancer, I don't resent mixers at all -- I can't see any reason for it. Anyway, de gustibus et coloribus ... but for example, "Indian Princess", " Farewell Marian", "Dear Papa and Dear Mama" are, in my opinion, not dorky. As a caller, for a typical evening dance, I almost invariably programme a mixer, usually as the third dance of the evening (I learnt that from Tony Parkes). Unfortunately, the number of ECD mixers is small, too small for me. Philippe Callens Antwerp, Belgium ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 19:37:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 21:38:47 -0500 From: "Phyllis G. Richmond" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: ECD of Jane Austen's time To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010713023747.JEIO14600.femail17.sdc1.sfba.home.com-AT- [24.182.37.170]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_oBjFuKyZCHpsYFezf5rMGg)" > THIS MESSAGE IS IN MIME FORMAT. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --Boundary_(ID_oBjFuKyZCHpsYFezf5rMGg) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I've been asked to teach ECD for a meeting of the local branch of the Jane Austen Society. What would be appropriate dances to teach beginners with more initial interest in Jane Austen than in ECD? Are there particular books or websites or individuals to consult? I would like to teach the members of the society dances that are appropriately period as well as fun and simple. If anyone out there has had experience with this kind of group, what has worked? Any suggestions? Thanks. Phyllis G. Richmond email: pgrichmond-AT- anet-dfw.com --Boundary_(ID_oBjFuKyZCHpsYFezf5rMGg) Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT ECD of Jane Austen's time
 I've been asked to teach ECD for a meeting of the local branch of
the Jane Austen Society.  What would be appropriate  dances to teach
beginners with more initial interest in Jane Austen than in ECD?  Are there
particular books or websites or individuals to consult?   I
would like to teach the members of the society  dances that are
appropriately period as well as fun and simple. If anyone out there has had
experience with this kind of group, what has worked? Any suggestions?
Thanks.

Phyllis G. Richmond
email: pgrichmond-AT- anet-dfw.com


--Boundary_(ID_oBjFuKyZCHpsYFezf5rMGg)-- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 20:05:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 23:05:46 -0400 From: "Albert A. Blank" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: history of cdss To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B4E658A.6FA8AD63-AT- sprintmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <200106131258.IAA08752-AT- boo-mda02.boo.net> steph-AT- boo.net wrote: > I am particularly interested in the influence of Pat Shaw and his > repertoire on ECD here in the US, a topic which I'm researching (slowly). > > Stephanie Smith > Bethesda, MD The person you must really interview about Pat Shaw, in both England and the U.S. is Fried Herman. There is no more reliable or knowledgeable source -- Albert Blank Pelham, NY ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 20:38:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 19:59:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: ECD of Jane Austen's time To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K5UUREM68K9R2WMS-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Phyllis wrote: > I've been asked to teach ECD for a meeting of the local branch of > the Jane Austen Society. What would be appropriate dances to teach > beginners with more initial interest in Jane Austen than in ECD? Are there > particular books or websites or individuals to consult? I > would like to teach the members of the society dances that are > appropriately period as well as fun and simple. If anyone out there has had > experience with this kind of group, what has worked? Any suggestions? > Thanks. You could go to the ECD home page and search through the archive using "Austen" as a key; there's been some interesting discussion about this already Here are two Jane Austen dance programs which have been posted to the ECD list; (you'll need to reassemble the URLs so that they have no spaces): Beverly Francis http://www-ssrl.slac.stanford.edu/htbin/hypermailnh/ ..$disk4:[winston.www.ecd]ecd/ECD?thread=Austen/16 Antony Heywood http://www-ssrl.slac.stanford.edu/htbin/hypermailnh/ ..$disk4:[winston.www.ecd]ecd/ECD?thread=Austen/33 Here's one I did for the Bay Area English Regency Society, which put on a successful Pride & Prejudice Ball back in 1998. http://www-ssrl.slac.stanford.edu/~winston/sm981024.htmlx (includes dance instructions) Most of the dances on that last list had also been done at the Jane Austen Society of North America Annual General Meeting in San Francisco, which got about 300 people up and dancing; Cathleen Myers and I were the callers. Some notes: Those JASNA people were not all extremely spry, and they didn't all have great endurance. We had three sets, and we were down to about 75 people by the end of the third one. We published the dance notes in advance, and some JASNA chapters made a practice of learning one dance at each meeting. Things to consider: Do you have live music available? If not, you're limited to what you can get on recordings. How large a group is this? Are you restricted to three-couple dances, or can you get up a longways? Are the dancers physically up to skipping and slipping, or had it better be walking dances? Most of the people who'd be in JASNA (or doing ECD, or doing contradancing now) would have long since given up dancing if they were their current age in Jane Austen's time. My strong impression is that the period dance style was balletic and vigorous, probably more like RSCDS Scottish is now than like ECD is now. It was physically demanding. Feel free to ignore this aspect. Some appropriate easy dances from, approximately, Jane Austen's lifetime: Duke of Kent's Waltz The Dressed Ship The Northdown Waltz (with poussettes instead of closed waltz) Long Odds (somewhat physically challenging; don't start with this) Good luck, and let us know how it goes! -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 02:15:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 10:14:26 +0100 From: Trevor Monson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <005701c10b7c$af26f260$128c01d4-AT- trevormo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <200107120956_MC3-D907-4D71-AT- compuserve.com> > Rather than asking to complete a set - either with unprepared beginners or > with same-sex couples - wouldn't an easier solution be to announce > beforehand that the set will be done TWICE, and that those left out the > first time had A RIGHT to claim a place for the second time round? That's > what I'm doing, and it works well. > > Hanny Not that many people would ant to dance Fandango again over here! In fact, unless it is a really good dance (by whose definition we ask!!) not many people want to do all the dances twice. Trev. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 05:46:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 08:42:15 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <200107130846_MC3-D928-A2F1-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Trevor - I was referring to SET dances with two, three or four couples, definitely not longways 'for as many as will' (or fit into the hall ). Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 06:20:20 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 14:17:48 +0100 From: Ron Hawkins Subject: RE: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Trevor is right. It isn't only a 'man' thing over here. Many of the women would raise an eyebrow at two men dancing together, and would almost certainly split to partner them, as he suggests, or sit down hurriedly to avoid dancing in the same set. Callers too: I admit it was a long time ago, but I can remember an incident in (I think) Chippenham when Fried de Metz Herman point blank refused to start calling a dance in one of her workshops until two men split up. They had only joined in at the last moment to make up a set, but she became almost angry, embarrassed and would NOT call until they split. The whole room just stood there shuffling and not looking. A certain well-known member of this list (who was as I recall wearing a parrot on his head at the time) may well remember the incident. I tried out the two recent points on my wife, to check that I am not being too Chauvinist or sexist or whatever-ist about it. She retorted that she would be hurt and angry if I took her to a dance then was "encouraged" to dance with other women most of the night. On the subject of me dancing with men, she didn't say anything, but gave me a very funny look which was far more meaningful than words. Nuff said. Maybe Trevor is right: perhaps we ARE a tad old-fashioned about these things over here. In response to whoever it was who said "if you ever dance in the US, you will find.." etc.. I think that having seen the comments of the last couple of weeks about the way the dance scene operates over there I seriously doubt that I will ever do so. However ... "Happy Dancing", whichever way you care to do it, and with whom. Ron H ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:35:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:03:15 -0700 (PDT) From: MEIER-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ecd-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: MEIER-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01K5VHP2Y5UY9R9FR4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Ron & Trevor (& perhaps anyone else who can knowledgeably comment) - I've been reading with interest your descriptions of the English Playford dance community. The picture you paint seems clear, but I still have a couple of questions. What I genuinely don't understand is, how do single people learn the dances under the circumstances you describe (bring your own partner or don't dance much, if at all)? Does it work the same way as many modern western square dancing here, where only couples are accepted into dance classes? After all, you can only learn so much by sitting on the sidelines -- some aspects of good dancing require muscle memory. This is tinged with a tiny bit of irony, but I really do want to know how a new person breaks into the English Playford community if they can't convince their spouse or sweetheart to come along. It doesn't sound like an easy task. Honestly curious, Vanessa ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:38:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:36:43 -0700 (PDT) From: MEIER-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Re: free choice To: ecd-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: MEIER-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01K5VHSDSY9U9R9FR4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT My fatigue-addled brain caused me to leave the following sentence in my previous post incomplete: "Does it work the same way as many modern western square dancing classes do here, where only couples are accepted into dance classes?" Blearily yours, Vanessa ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:56:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 15:55:53 +0100 From: Hugh Stewart Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B4F0BF8.E66AA5CD-AT- ugsolutions.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <01K5VHP2Y5UY9R9FR4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MEIER-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote: > Ron & Trevor (& perhaps anyone else who can knowledgeably comment) - > > I've been reading with interest your descriptions of the English Playford dance > community. The picture you paint seems clear, but I still have a couple of > questions. > > What I genuinely don't understand is, how do single people learn the dances > under the circumstances you describe (bring your own partner or don't dance > much, if at all)? In Britain we distinguish between "dance clubs" and "dances". Dance clubs tend to be run as a series of weekly meetings, usually to recorded music. We then have "dances", often organised by dance clubs, usually on Saturday evenings, usually to live music, usually with an imported "name" caller. Typically people will mix within a dance club evening, but go to "dances" as couples, or as a group from some dance club. In any case these are not absolute rules, while Bob Archer ranted on about taking a visitor to some UK dance and having them sit out the entire evening I have taken several US visitors to dances and I think they have danced all they wanted (Terry, you might be able to comment better than I on this). ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:57:20 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 10:43:37 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: free choice To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <200107131046_MC3-D92C-4C85-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Aw, c'mon now Ron, don't spill the baby with the bathwater now! There is some absolutely WONderful dancing to be found in the USA! I submit that you would even enjoy dancing with most of the ECD groups over here! The major difference in attitude is perhaps based on the meaning of ECD in our general recreational - or dance - pursuits. In England it is only natural that ECD occupies the premier spot among folk dancing. AFter all, that's the native dance on native soil. In the USA our recreational dancing can happen in many different 'folk' environments, not at all based on our personal ancestry or heritage. You should see how folks flock to the Balkan and Israeli dances! And whom you can find in Scottish dance groups, mostly RSCDS type dancing. So ECD is one of a number of choices. I didn't find that to be so on my trips to England and dancing there. I don't know what draws the single ladies to ECD in England, where it is soooooo couple-oriented that folks seldom change away from their own partner and don't particularly feel responsible for that 'community' spirit, but I guess that those ladies know ECD as the ONLY kind of folk dancing, and their love is the participation in that. If you come - and I hope you do some day - you will feel warmly welcomed and both, your wife and you, invited to participate. Meanwhile it helps of course to be aware that there ARE slightly different attitudes... Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 09:17:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 10:17:16 -0600 From: Emma Rushton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <01K5VHP2Y5UY9R9FR4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> Vanessa said: >What I genuinely don't understand is, how do single people learn the dances >under the circumstances you describe (bring your own partner or don't dance >much, if at all)? Does it work the same way as many modern western square >dancing here, where only couples are accepted into dance classes? After all, >you can only learn so much by sitting on the sidelines -- some aspects of good >dancing require muscle memory. And Hugh said: >Typically people will mix within a dance club evening, but go to "dances" >as couples, or as a group from some dance club. In any case these are not >absolute rules, while Bob Archer ranted on about taking a visitor to >some UK dance and having them sit out the entire evening I have taken >several US visitors to dances and I think they have danced all they >wanted (Terry, you might be able to comment better than I on this). Different clubs have different attitudes and customs, even within the same country. For instance, I learned ECD at The Round in Cambridge (UK), where free mixing of partners is the norm. I walked in on my own as a complete beginner, and was warmly welcomed and steered through dances by some of the best dancers in the room. Within a year I was being encouraged to try calling - and so were all the other newcomers who showed any aptitude. Inclusiveness like this is what allows a club to thrive. Men did dance together at the Round, if necessary. I last danced there 6 years ago, but I don't suppose those things have changed. On the other hand, the impression that Ron has been getting of typical dancing customs in the US may not hold true everywhere. In Salt Lake we do have free mixing of partners, but there is one couple who always dances together. No comment is made on this - they are free to dance as they like. Men dance together, but it is (usually) by necessity rather than choice, and I'm sure some of our regular men would refuse to dance with another man if pushed. They are never pushed. Women often dance together by choice, and no-one comments on that either. My point is that we have been hearing about extremes of inclusivity and exclusivity. Inclusivity has been attributed to US groups and exclusivity to UK clubs. Clearly that is not the whole picture. It's what you do in your own group that counts. >Typically people will mix within a dance club evening, but go to "dances" >as couples, or as a group from some dance club. In any case these are not >absolute rules, while Bob Archer ranted on about taking a visitor to >some UK dance and having them sit out the entire evening I have taken >several US visitors to dances and I think they have danced all they >wanted I've been to dances in England where most people danced either with their own partner the whole evening, or chose partners from a small subset of people in the hall. I've always gone to those dances with my own partner - by luck at first, and then because I knew there'd be little point in going on my own. I remember the first time I realised that I'd be doing EVERY dance with the person I came with! It was a shock after learning the customs at The Round. On the other hand, I went to Sidmouth without a partner and had a wonderful time. You can't really generalise. Emma -- - Emma Rushton, Department of Biology, University of Utah, 257 South, 1400 East Salt Lake City, UT 84112-0840 (801) 585-1926 (office) (801) 585-9425 (lab) (801) 581-4668 (fax) rushton-AT- biology.utah.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 09:39:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 12:48:04 -0400 From: Graham.Christian-AT- risk.sungard.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: But some are more free than others To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I am aware that the ostensible subject here is whether or not, in desperation, men would dance with each other, and not the presence of gays or lesbians in ECD--but while I respect the good will and good intentions of all, quizzical looks and big scenes are *precisely* what say to gays and lesbians: you're not welcome here. Imagine an occasion where a caller stops everything and will not go on until all the Pakistani dancers sit down. Imagine the outrage, embarrassment, and perhaps legal action that would ensue. After all, isn't ECD, by inheritance, a white and English activity? I think--I hope--that most of us would agree that this would be outrageous, and should not be tolerated. And perhaps some will object that this is not at all the same thing, hrrumph! No, it is *not* the same thing; nor yet is it *so* different. To me, prejudice is prejudice. Hanny and several others have reminded us that the form of ECD is rooted in male-female lines or sets, and that male-female couples are likely to predominate. Of course, historically viewed, that is so. It is true, too, that it was an English form, and one that the English were proud to regard as unique to themselves. This did not stop the French, the Germans, the Dutch, the Americans, and the Mexicans from using and adapting the English dances, and making more of their own. Not being English does not cancel your right to dance ECD--nor should your color or faith or gender. When gays and lesbians and bisexuals are willing to participate in ECD, taught with gender, they generally play by those rules--this is why, very often, the other dancers don't know we're here, as such. But I cannot justify the use of the evil eye or the psychological crowbar to shame and separate same-gender couples, whatever their sexuality. Graham Christian Technical Writer, Product Management SunGard Trading and Risk Systems 88 Broad Street, Boston, MA 02110 Telephone number: (617)542-2800, extension 648 Email address: graham.christian-AT- risk.sungard.com Group web address: http://www.risk.sungard.com "Speak, that I may see thee." --Ben Jonson SunGard World 2001 September 4-7 at The Venetian, Las Vegas "The financial services client conference of the year." Hosted by NPR's David Brancaccio. Speakers include Arthur Levitt, Philips Evans, Scott McNealy, Steven Crosby, Roger Burkhardt. Visit http://www.sungardworld.com for conference registration, updates and highlights. ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. ********************************************************************** ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 16:04:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 19:04:00 -0400 From: "Michael L. Siemon" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: > >Callers too: I admit it was a long time ago, but I can remember an incident >in (I think) Chippenham when Fried de Metz Herman point blank refused to >start calling a dance in one of her workshops until two men split up. I've excerpted this one bit, as I don't wish to comment on the main thread, but know from dancing with Fried for many years that the above might convey a wrong impression. Fried can be (as you note, sometimes embarrassingly) insistent on various points about her dances. I have also seen her insist on same sex couples breaking up (if possible) - but not from any general objection to the practice. Rather, she knows that some of her dances rely heavily on immediate gender perceptions to signal position and movement. Such dances will tend to fall apart in a group that doesn't know them, if the "signals" are not obvious. One of the challenges of dancing as (or in sets with) same-biological-sex couples is that there is generally a bit of a "lag" in mental processing if the dancers are expecting (and not getting) these signals. The problem is not always "solved" by gender-neutral teaching/calling: one of Fried's favorite figures, the "Choice Morsels Hey", requires either total mental control of the geometry (some people have this, many don't) or the "clue" of always passing the same gender. If a dance is slow ("The Introduction") people have enough time to "process" the (ever-changing) layout of the lines and allow for who is dancing what. If it's fast ("The Human Race"), it tends to fall apart without all clues operating subliminally at high speed. The annual "Fried-for-All" dance workshops in the Berkshires often have sets with same-sex couples. Every once in a while, despite this being a common practice that Fried has never objected to so far as I know, Fried _will_ insist on, ummm, "traditional partnering." Sometimes we even obey her! :-) At a festival, where one often has little time to generate a maximum dance exposure, I think that there may be more pressure to "see to" things working without problems. And sometimes (as in your Chippenham instance) that attempt may itself cause problems. Oh, well. Michael Siemon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 17:11:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 20:11:18 -0400 (EDT) From: SallenNic-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Digest V1 #980 To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <93.d29243e.2880e826-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >The person you must really interview about Pat Shaw, in both England and >the >U.S. is Fried Herman. There is no more reliable or knowledgeable source > > >-- >Albert Blank >Pelham, NY > I would also suggest Marjorie Fennessy, to whom Pat turned in all times of weel or woe over a period of many years, who worked for him and with him on his dance compositions and researches (putting her demonstration team The Whirligigs at his disposal any Thursday night practice if he needed their help), typed out those fearfully cryptic New Wine in Old Bottles instructions (in their original form) not once, not twice but three times(!!!) and who acted as his dance executrix after his death. Nicolas B., Lanark, Scotland. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 17:51:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 17:43:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: List owner away from email for a week To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K5W37ZIKVQ9R9T7K-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT ECDers -- I'm off to Mendocino English Week tomorrow. No email, no internet access. Please try to play nicely while I'm gone. Note that updating the searchable ECD list archives is a manual process - I read the messages and file them in the archive. Since I won't be doing that, the searchable archives will lag until I get back and update them. The downloadable monthly archives should continue to grow normally, although if the system they're on falls off the network, nobody will reboot it until I get back. (Since that's the same system that runs the mailing list itself, the list would in that case be down too.) A couple of reminders: The address for unsubscribing, setting your subscription NOMAIL, or setting it to DIGEST is ECD-REQUEST-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu The ECD list home page can be found at http://www-ssrl.slac.stanford.edu/~winston/ecd.htmlx and there you can find a copy of the message that gets sent out to new subscribers, which you were supposed to save when you got it. This explains how to change your subscription options. PLEASE: _Don't_ send stuff to ECD unless you want all the other subscribers to see it. _Don't_ send binaries (Word files, jpegs, anything you have to attach) _Don't_ send HTML if you can possibly help it. _Don't_ send the same message to ECD over and over because it didn't go through the first time, unless you get an explicit bounce message from the list software. (SLAC has been having mail gateway problems which results in occasional long delays; the effect of retrying several times is that when the logjam breaks, everybody will get to see your message as many times as you sent it.) I hope you all have as much fun as I expect to next week. -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 18:52:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 18:42:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Prehistoric EFDS in California? To: ecd-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K5W5BHB6B89R2WMS-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT ECDers -- Well, I could scarcely go away and leave you with nothing to talk about. I'm looking through "Dances of Early California" by Lucile K. Czarnowski, Palo Alto, Pacific Books, 1950. (And who were Pacific Books? They published Lee Owens' square dance books around this time, too.) My particular copy made its way to the Josephine County Library in Grant's Pass Oregon before falling into the hands of a rare book dealer and eventually getting back to me, adjacent to Palo Alto in Menlo Park. Anyway, Czarnowski reviews the history of the folk dance revival in California in an epilogue. I quote a provocative paragraph: "This revival in Europe had its impact on the United States. One evidence was the founding in 1916 of the American Folk Dance Society under the direction and leadership of Elizabeth Burchenal. It had much the same purpose as the other national societies [to preserve the traditions of each nation]. In California this revived interest in the folk arts and dance was shown in several ways. * Branches of the English Folk Dance Society were established in Palo Alto and Ojai and visiting leaders from the headquarters of the society in London gave a number of institutes in different parts of the state.* [Emphasis mine.] Elizabeth Burchenal also led folk dance institutes in some of the large cities, introducing her new collections and findings in the folk dance." EFDS had a branch in Palo Alto? As early as 1916? Well, before 1950, anyway. Visiting EFDS instructors held institutes in California? Does anybody know anything about this, or where I could find out more (like when the groups were founded, how long they lasted, who came over from England, where they taught, etc.) We just had a big party celebrating 30 years of ECD in the Bay Area last year, and our CDS affiliate, BACDS, has reached its majority, but there appear to be prehistoric events we didn't know about. All agape, -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 20:41:33 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 20:39:59 -0700 From: Chris Sackett & Brooke Friendly Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B4FBF0E.175D7F2C-AT- opendoor.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <01K5VHP2Y5UY9R9FR4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> While I respect Ron's preference and right to dance only with women, I find the title of his comments and some of the ensuing mail just a wee bit ironic. What about the free choice of two men or two women who want to dance with each other (gay/lesbian or not)? What if one came with one's same-sex life partner to a dance where couples who came together danced together for the evening only to be told you and your chosen partner couldn't dance together? I also wonder about dances which specify men as partners (Confess comes to mind - the ones and threes are specified as women and the twos as men). Are those dances therefore not done? Or if they are done as written, why is it ok to have to men as partners if Playford 1651 says so in a specific dance, but not otherwise? Brooke in Ashland, Oregon (on her way to Mendocino to dance with old friends and new partners of both genders) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 21:00:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 00:00:46 -0400 From: "Michael L. Siemon" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: >one of Fried's >favorite figures, the "Choice Morsels Hey", requires either total mental >control of the geometry (some people have this, many don't) or the "clue" >of always passing the same gender. I should have added that Fried, in fact, teaches the figure in gender- neutral terms (specifying movement on the diagonals.) The "problem" arises in the dynamic appearance and disappearance of these diagonals, especially when some in the set are lagging behind the pace because of trouble processing where they are and where they have to go. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 23:49:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 23:49:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: But some are more free than others To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010714064902.87273.qmail-AT- web20003.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT --- Graham.Christian-AT- risk.sungard.com wrote: > ...It is true, too, that it was an English form, and one that > the English were proud to regard as unique to themselves. This > did not stop the French, the Germans, the Dutch, the Americans, > and the Mexicans from using and adapting the English dances, > and making more of their own. Not being English does not cancel > your right to dance ECD--nor should your color or faith or > gender. Not to mention the Danes. If it weren't for the dances they have that are related to ECD, we wouldn't have much Danish folk dancing at all. There seems to be little or no trace of Danish folkdance before the 19th Century and many of the dances that we do in Nordlys' repertoire and at the Monday night Scandi dances have a distinct 19th C. flavor to the music. Some of them are more like Vintage dance than Scandinavian folkdances of the other Nordic countries. Andy ...who figures that dancing anything must be okay, since my ancestry is Finnish (way back), Swedish, English, Irish, Scottish, Palatine Dutch, German, Pomeranian and French Huguenot ...that I know of. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 17:54:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 20:55:06 -0400 From: "Albert A. Blank" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: General comments To: ECD list Message-ID: <3B50E9EA.1875C7C2-AT- sprintmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Marian Phillips wrote (in part): > And I'd also still like to know if May Gadd was gay. And I replied, "Why should you care? Anyhow, for the books, I knew Gay before the word, "gay", changed its meaning. Her attitudes toward men, women and same-sex dance partners were certainly not consistent with Gay being gay." I also had more information from John and Carolee Owen which I felt needed their permission before passing it on. Here it is, from a recent communication: "...About a year before she died she came to Florida (when we lived here before...in Maitland) to visit us. We had many talks and I tried to tape some but most of the interesting information had been said before I got the brilliant idea to tape. She did talk about her youth in England before WW I and about a suitor she was in love with...I believe during the time she was teaching gymnastics (late teens early twenties). It seems he was killed in the war...apparently she never got over him and/or found no other gentleman who could measure up. Apparently, after this, she got involved in Cecil Sharps dance and devoted her life to it. She mentioned no other liasons or interest in any relationship with any other...either male or female. She did not strike me as being lesbian and I truly don't believe John feels differently." This is interesting, not so much because it sheds light on Gay's sexual orientation, as that it helps us to understand her passionate single-minded devotion to English country dance. It is May Gadd's work in the ECD community that has current value. Again, why should anyone care about Gay's sexual orientation? In Gay's generation and before, spinsterhood and bachelorhood were common, often for purely economic reasons, and no one would raise an eyebrow over it. Also, after WW I, men were in short supply in England. (Remember that it was the women who kept the morris tradition alive in those times.) In my own time, Gay was often harsh with women and virtually simpered over men, a contrast noted by many of the women of my acquaintance. Ciao, Albert Blank ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 18:03:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 21:03:11 -0400 From: "Albert A. Blank" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Digest V1 #980 To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B50EBCF.60280507-AT- sprintmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <93.d29243e.2880e826-AT- aol.com> Absolutely right, sir. How could I have committed such an egregious omission? Albert SallenNic-AT- aol.com wrote: > >The person you must really interview about Pat Shaw, in both England and > >the > >U.S. is Fried Herman. There is no more reliable or knowledgeable source > > > > > >-- > >Albert Blank > >Pelham, NY > > > I would also suggest Marjorie Fennessy, to whom Pat turned in all times of > weel or woe over a period of many years, who worked for him and with him on > his dance compositions and researches (putting her demonstration team The > Whirligigs at his disposal any Thursday night practice if he needed their > help), typed out those fearfully cryptic New Wine in Old Bottles instructions > (in their original form) not once, not twice but three times(!!!) and who > acted as his dance executrix after his death. > Nicolas B., Lanark, > Scotland. -- Albert Blank & Nancy DeVore 102 Loring Avenue Pelham, NY 10803-2014 Tel. 914 738-7678 e-mail: fandango-AT- sprintmail.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 19:55:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 22:55:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Tideswell-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: But some are more free than others To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <106.294c948.2882600e-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Graham said >I am aware that the ostensible subject here is whether or not, in >desperation, men would dance with each other, and not the presence of gays >or lesbians in ECD--but while I respect the good will and good intentions >of all, quizzical looks and big scenes are *precisely* what say to gays >and >lesbians: you're not welcome here. >Imagine an occasion where a caller stops everything and will not go on >until all the Pakistani dancers sit down. Imagine the outrage, >embarrassment, and perhaps legal action that would ensue. After all, isn't >ECD, by inheritance, a white and English activity? I think--I hope--that >most of us would agree that this would be outrageous, and should not be >tolerated. > >And perhaps some will object that this is not at all the same thing, >hrrumph! No, it is *not* the same thing; nor yet is it *so* different. >To >me, prejudice is prejudice. > >Hanny and several others have reminded us that the form of ECD is rooted >in >male-female lines or sets, and that male-female couples are likely to >predominate. Of course, historically viewed, that is so. It is true, too, >that it was an English form, and one that the English were proud to regard >as unique to themselves. This did not stop the French, the Germans, the >Dutch, the Americans, and the Mexicans from using and adapting the English >dances, and making more of their own. Not being English does not cancel >your right to dance ECD--nor should your color or faith or gender. > >When gays and lesbians and bisexuals are willing to participate in ECD, >taught with gender, they generally play by those rules--this is why, very >often, the other dancers don't know we're here, as such. But I cannot >justify the use of the evil eye or the psychological crowbar to shame and >separate same-gender couples, whatever their sexuality. Hear, hear! If one specifically wanted to exclude queers from participating, one could scarcely do better and stay within the bounds of nominal civility. Nilos, writing from Pinewoods, where it's damp but delightful ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 23:17:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 02:01:09 -0400 From: "Dawn C. Culbertson" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Mary Jones' latest "contribution" to the list--HELP! To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010715.021640.-124599.3.dcculb-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT -- On Tue, 10 Jul 2001 08:30:24 -0400 Maryn McKenna writes: > i don't see it in my system. i *do* have virus software, but just in > case: > what was the bug's full name? I don't know what the bug's name, but I can't delete the message which contained it! Every time I try to call it up so I can delete it, my e-mail system freezes. I'm afraid I'm doomed to carry this thing around in my inbox forever. Anyone have any idea on how to get rid of it? Dawn Culbertson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 05:55:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 08:50:46 -0400 From: Ruth Feldberg Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Mary Jones' latest "contribution" to the list--HELP! To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B5191A6.3E6F94D2-AT- javanet.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <20010715.021640.-124599.3.dcculb-AT- juno.com> Dawn, I called my server and asked them to delete any msgs from Mary Jones. Ruth Feldberg Amherst, MA "Dawn C. Culbertson" wrote: > > -- > > On Tue, 10 Jul 2001 08:30:24 -0400 Maryn McKenna > writes: > > i don't see it in my system. i *do* have virus software, but just in > > case: > > what was the bug's full name? > > I don't know what the bug's name, but I can't delete the message which > contained it! Every time I try to call it up so I can delete it, my > e-mail system freezes. I'm afraid I'm doomed to carry this thing around > in my inbox forever. Anyone have any idea on how to get rid of it? > > Dawn Culbertson > > ________________________________________________________________ > GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! > Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! > Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 12:04:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 12:04:00 -0700 From: Bob Archer Subject: Re: ECD Digest V1 #981 To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3B5186B0.9611.E2D3A33-AT- localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hugh Stewart wrote: > Typically people will mix within a dance club evening, but go to "dances" > as couples, or as a group from some dance club. In any case these are not > absolute rules, while Bob Archer ranted on about taking a visitor to > some UK dance and having them sit out the entire evening I have taken > several US visitors to dances and I think they have danced all they > wanted (Terry, you might be able to comment better than I on this). Just to make myself clear, in the particular cases I was thinking of, when I took US visitors to dances they danced as much as they wanted to. My rant was about the fact that I felt that I had to warn them that they might not. Emma Rushton wrote: > You can't really generalise. You certainly can't come up with a single rule that will apply to all clubs in a particular country, but I think there are some probabilities that can be stated. In my experience, a single dancer is more likely to get included in a US club than a UK one. I know there are exceptions on both sides of the pond, but the numbers favour the US side. I believe that this is a direct result of the couples based attitude found in UK dance clubs. To address Vanessa's question about where single people learn to dance - they find a club that will accommodate them (and the Round would be one example of such a club, although to give the full picture is should be mentioned that it is a university club which does make a difference), or they end up in the ceilidh scene which is vastly more friendly towards singles. There are other dance clubs in the UK than the Round which accommodate singles, there just aren't enough of them. Bob ---------------------------------------------------------- -- Bob Archer bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 13:53:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 21:51:22 +0100 From: Ron Hawkins Subject: RE: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Chris and Brooke said: While I respect Ron's preference and right to dance only with women, I find the title of his comments and some of the ensuing mail just a wee bit ironic. What about the free choice of two men or two women who want to dance with each other (gay/lesbian or not)? What if one came with one's same-sex life partner to a dance where couples who came together danced together for the evening only to be told you and your chosen partner couldn't dance together? Excuse me, but you are misrepresenting what I said. I *specifically* said that I have NO PROBLEM with others dancing with whomsoever they wish, I was merely commenting on my OWN preference. As far as I am concerned, your two women/men or same-sex partners are perfectly free to dance together, just as I want to be with my life partner. That is my free choice and theirs too. Having said that, I am grateful for the comments of many people on the subject of dancing in the USA v the UK, who have quite rightly pointed out that there is a great deal of grey (gray?) area in between, and it has been said among those who know me that I can be very black and white (read "bigoted", "pig-headed", etc if you wish) in my opinions. Ron H ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 14:33:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 21:13:03 +0100 From: Trevor Monson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <00c801c10d76$01623580$389501d4-AT- trevormo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <200107130846_MC3-D928-A2F1-AT- compuserve.com> > Trevor - > I was referring to SET dances with two, three or four couples, definitely > not longways 'for as many as will' (or fit into the hall ). > > Hanny Hanny, I was answering the example for Fandango as given in an earlier message. I thought Fandango was a 3 couple dance - do you do it as a longways then? Trev. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 14:33:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 22:22:22 +0100 From: Trevor Monson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <00c901c10d76$029f9780$389501d4-AT- trevormo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <01K5VHP2Y5UY9R9FR4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> > Ron & Trevor (& perhaps anyone else who can knowledgeably comment) - > > I've been reading with interest your descriptions of the English Playford dance > community. The picture you paint seems clear, but I still have a couple of > questions. > > What I genuinely don't understand is, how do single people learn the dances > under the circumstances you describe (bring your own partner or don't dance > much, if at all)? Does it work the same way as many modern western square > dancing here, where only couples are accepted into dance classes? After all, > you can only learn so much by sitting on the sidelines -- some aspects of good > dancing require muscle memory. > > This is tinged with a tiny bit of irony, but I really do want to know how a new > person breaks into the English Playford community if they can't convince their > spouse or sweetheart to come along. It doesn't sound like an easy task. > > Honestly curious, > > Vanessa Vanessa, One thing about the English Playford/ECD community, is, that unless a dance is billed as a Playford Ball, that most things from Playford, to modern playford style dances (for want of a better description) squares (English and any sort of American - we don't know the difference) and longways (again English or American contra) are danced, and the majority of dancers would not know where the dance is from, or if it is English, American, Dutch or anything else. We do not tend to segregate or compartmentise dances - but just carry on dancing what the caller/MC calls. To answer your question, single people, just like couples, learn the dances by dancing them! (You may find this hard to believe I know) I cannot speak for all of England, but where ever I have danced (South Yorkshire and many festivals) I have never seen a single person sit out more than one dance by choice. If they are new to the club/area, you will find that everyone in the club will try to dance with them. If they have been coming for years, people know them and make sure they dance with them. This is not forced on anyone, but people are aware of who is sitting out, and they make sure that they are included in the next dance. Whether this is by other single people asking them for a dance, or if all the single people have partners, then spouses even send there partners off in their direction to make sure they get a dance. A single person who misses a dance will often have a queue of partnered people who have noticed this, and gone over to ask them for the next dance. This can/does happen in England. This may not happen in US, as I understand from previous comments (feeding frenzy?) Americans are so keen to get a new partner, they abandon their partner before getting off the dance floor, and are busy asking someone else for a dance - from the same set maybe, and never make it back to the side lines. (I have not been to a dance in America, but this is the feeling the list gives me) As I said, there are no written rules, or club rules of etiquette, but people are aware of what is happening on the side lines, and it is made sure no-one is left out. When I used to go on courses for work, at the other end of the country, for up to 6 weeks at a time, I used to go to dance evenings whenever I could. I was therefore a single person going to a strange club, many times for the first time. Every club I went to, without exception, I was always made welcome, and also danced most dances. Even though I was (well, I still am! - but the courses were in the past) a man, with the male prerogative of being expected to ask a lady for a dance, I always waited for the couples to pair up, to see who was left to ask for a dance. But after a couple of dances I was being asked for dances, I presume to make sure I was not dancing with the same people every time. So, I hope that answers some of your questions. We in England may not make it obviously clear that we will dance with other people, other than our partners/spouses. But we are still aware of what is happening around us and people do not get left out. But we will not accept being told to change partners every dance - we make our own decisions who to dance with in our own way, thank you! (And, as in US, there are a lot of single dancers here who cannot get their partners to come to a dance) Trev (who considers himself lucky to have a wife who loves dancing. But there again, we both enjoyed dance when we met and that brought us closer together many years ago - she may even know how many!) _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 18:56:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 11:39:54 +1000 From: Aylwen Subject: Dance News from Aylwen Garden, ACT, Australia To: aylwen.garden-AT- earthlydelights.com.au Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <00c201c10d99$2448e940$727e09d2-AT- earthly> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_8Gx1vcplhA0IcYZEElpcmA)" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_8Gx1vcplhA0IcYZEElpcmA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Dear friend, Some items of news: 1.. Enrolments open today for John Garden's next Monday evening dance course at the Australian National University. This course promises to be just as enjoyable as the last. We again have use of the large wooden floor of the Sports Union's upstairs multipurpose room and will again have a lot of fun tripping through 500 years of dance styles (all levels of experience catered for) . So for 12 socially, intellectually and physically stimulating evenings starting this coming Monday 23 July, 7:30-9:30pm, and finishing 22 October (no classes on September 24 and October 1), please do phone 6125 8381 this week and speak with Denis Seselja or colleague in the ANU's Sports and Recreation Program. Fees are extremely good value at just $70 for ANU students, $85 for Sports and Rec members and $100 for others (who are equally welcome!). For any more info. on course phone us on (02) 62811098. 2.. John and the band Earthly Delights are planning a big day and evening of English Country Dancing on Saturday 8 September – with workshops in the morning and afternoon and a big ball in the evening. Early bird tickets for the day&evening combination are available from us and friends from interstate are welcome to inquire about being billeted. Please let me know if you'd like a copy of the registration form. 3.. Please diary for later this year two other day/evening combinations on Saturday 13 October (flowing Contra dancing) and 10 November (romantic European couples dancing). 4.. Towards the end of each year Earthly Delights has always put on a big ball at the grand Albert Hall – this year the date is Sunday 16 December and the theme - a Dickensian Christmas Ball!. 5.. We have long dreamt of having a dance/music retreat/studio in our own back garden here in Yarralumla and after many painful months of renovation (punctuated 2 months ago by the birth of our fourth child, Alcuin Albert) that dream is about to become reality -with the near completion of the smallest grand dance hall in the world!. We hope soon to be able to invite all our friends to the ‘house’ warming and to use the studio later this year as the venue for some workshops leading up to the Christmas Ball. Please stay posted. I hope to be able to send some more information on the above events within the month, but for now, please do consider taking a place in the course starting Monday – you will meet some great people and set the ball rolling for a fun-filled second half to this year. Feel free to pass this information to friends. Warmest Regards, Aylwen Garden (02) 62811098, 87 Schlich Street, Yarralumla ACT 2600 garden-AT- earthlydelights.com.au / http://www.earthlydelights.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- P.S. Our apologies if you had not put your name down to receive news such as this from us or you received this message more than once, but due to a computer crash every email address we had on the system got thrown in with the addresses on our dance mail list. If you do not need to receive information on up-coming dance or music events featuring John Garden or the band Earthly Delights please reply with DELETE in the subject box. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --Boundary_(ID_8Gx1vcplhA0IcYZEElpcmA) Content-type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Dear friend, Some items of news:

    1.. Enrolments open today for John Garden's next Monday evening dance
course at the Australian National University. This course promises to be
just as enjoyable as the last. We again have use of the large wooden floor
of the Sports Union's upstairs multipurpose room and will again have a lot
of fun tripping through 500 years of dance styles (all levels of experience
catered for) . So for 12 socially, intellectually and physically stimulating
evenings starting this coming Monday 23 July, 7:30-9:30pm, and finishing 22
October (no classes on September 24 and October 1), please do phone 6125
8381 this  week and speak with Denis Seselja or colleague in the ANU's Sports
and Recreation Program. Fees are extremely good value at just $70 for ANU
students, $85 for Sports and Rec members and $100 for others (who are
equally welcome!). For any more info. on course phone us on (02) 62811098.
    2.. John and the band Earthly Delights are planning a big day and
evening of English Country Dancing on Saturday 8 September – with workshops
in the morning and afternoon and a big ball in the evening. Early bird
tickets for the day&evening combination are available from us and friends
from interstate are welcome to inquire about being billeted. Please let me
know if you'd like a copy of the registration form.
    3.. Please diary for later this year two other day/evening combinations
on Saturday 13 October (flowing Contra dancing) and 10 November (romantic
European couples dancing).
    4.. Towards the end of each year Earthly Delights has always put on a
big ball at the grand Albert Hall – this year the date is Sunday 16 December
and the theme - a Dickensian  Christmas Ball!.
    5.. We have long dreamt of having a dance/music retreat/studio in our
own back garden here in Yarralumla and after many painful months of
renovation (punctuated 2 months ago by the birth of our fourth child, Alcuin
Albert) that dream is about to become reality -with the near completion of
the smallest grand dance hall in the world!. We hope soon to be able to
invite all our friends to the ‘house’ warming and to use the studio later
this year as the venue for some workshops leading up to the Christmas Ball.
Please stay posted.
I hope to be able to send some more information on the above events within
the month, but for now, please do consider taking a place in the course
starting Monday – you will meet some great people and set the ball rolling
for a fun-filled second half to this year. Feel free to pass this
information to friends.

Warmest Regards,  Aylwen Garden
(02) 62811098, 87 Schlich Street, Yarralumla ACT 2600
garden-AT- earthlydelights.com.au / http://www.earthlydelights.com.au
 
P.S. Our apologies if you had not put your name down to receive news such as
this from us or you received this message more than once, but due to a
computer crash every email address we had on the system got thrown in with
the addresses on our dance mail list. If you do not need to receive
information on up-coming dance or music events featuring John Garden or the
band Earthly Delights please reply with DELETE in the subject box.
--Boundary_(ID_8Gx1vcplhA0IcYZEElpcmA)-- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 19:14:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 21:51:52 -0400 From: Allison M Thompson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Getting past the whoosh & Feeding Frenzy To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010715.221202.-1679079.1.AllisonThompson-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Why are there no anthropologists or socio-biologists on the list who have deigned to study this pre-nuptial, post-nuptial behavior as per a recent interesting article on post-nuptial coupling rituals in the Science section of the NY Times! One would think that dancers were at least as interesting as porcupines or baboons! Where is Margaret Mead when we need her? Allison ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 22:20:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 23:55:17 -0400 From: "Dawn C. Culbertson" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: But some are more free than others To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010716.011933.-124599.5.dcculb-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Fri, 13 Jul 2001 12:48:04 -0400 Graham.Christian-AT- risk.sungard.com writes: > > I am aware that the ostensible subject here is whether or not, in > desperation, men would dance with each other, and not the presence > of gays > or lesbians in ECD--but while I respect the good will and good > intentions > of all, quizzical looks and big scenes are *precisely* what say to > gays and > lesbians: you're not welcome here. > Imagine an occasion where a caller stops everything and will not go > on > until all the Pakistani dancers sit down. Imagine the outrage, > embarrassment, and perhaps legal action that would ensue. After all, > isn't > ECD, by inheritance, a white and English activity? I think--I > hope--that > most of us would agree that this would be outrageous, and should not > be > tolerated. > > > When gays and lesbians and bisexuals are willing to participate in > ECD, > taught with gender, they generally play by those rules--this is why, > very > often, the other dancers don't know we're here, as such. But I > cannot > justify the use of the evil eye or the psychological crowbar to > shame and > separate same-gender couples, whatever their sexuality. Amen to that! Dawn Culbertson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 00:14:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 00:14:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: General comments To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010716071448.71834.qmail-AT- web20003.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT --- "Albert A. Blank" wrote: > I also had more information from John and Carolee Owen which I > felt needed their permission before passing it on... > > "...About a year before she died she came to Florida (when we > lived here before...in Maitland) to visit us. ...She did talk > about her youth in England before WW I and about a suitor she > was in love with... It seems he was killed in the war... It was common among women who lost a special man in either World War to have never found or married another man. Andy __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 00:18:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 17:28:27 +1000 From: Aylwen Subject: Apologies - Oops! To: ECD List Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <031001c10dc8$e836a480$727e09d2-AT- earthly> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_aq4GFsAqfcOw4+BT/C8/Sg)" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_aq4GFsAqfcOw4+BT/C8/Sg) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Dear List, Just realiozed that I sent out my dance update letter to this list by mistake. Will be more careful next time. Sorry. Warmest Regards, Aylwen Garden --Boundary_(ID_aq4GFsAqfcOw4+BT/C8/Sg) Content-type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Dear List,
Just realiozed that I sent out my dance update letter to this list by mistake. Will be more careful next time. Sorry.
Warmest Regards,
Aylwen Garden
 

 
--Boundary_(ID_aq4GFsAqfcOw4+BT/C8/Sg)-- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 08:31:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 11:27:23 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <200107161130_MC3-D96B-C9D1-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT We know that many of the longway sets for three couples started out as triple minors, Fandango being one of them. I like the diversity of formations and never let an ECD evening pass without doing at least two non-longways. Although we don't usually revert to the old triple minor form (and it feels weird because of our very assertive physical memory!), it is fun to occasionally DO the original triple minors! Alas, Trevor, to answer your question: Fandango is done as a three couple longways set. Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 21:57:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 00:57:03 -0400 (EDT) From: DavBarnert-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Experienced and inexperienced dancers To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <37.17f9e5a9.28851f9f-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hello from Pinewoods (Early Music Week). Yes, Nilos is here, too. She says Hi. Vis a vis the recent talk of the phenomenon where the experienced dancers all couple up quickly and take their places at the head of the line while the inexperienced dancers wind up at the bottom, often coupled as pairs of women: Tonight, Pat Petersen called a dance (Faithless Nancy Dawson) here and introduced it thusly: "We're going to try a little challenge here. All the experienced dancers come to the center of the floor. OK. Now all the inexperienced dancers around the edges: Choose your partner!" ______ /\/\/\/\ <______> | | | | | David Barnert <______> | | | | | <______> | | | | | Albany, N.Y. <______> \/\/\/\/ Ventilator Concertina Bellows Bellows (Vocation) (Avocation) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 05:57:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 13:44:42 +0100 From: Paul Sartin Subject: annoucement To: ECD Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3B54333A.4DAFB76D-AT- attglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT 'John Playford's Secret Ball'. Belshazzar's Feast's celebration of the 350th anniversary of the first edition of John Playford's 'The English Dancing Master'. 1. Maiden Lane 2. Parson's Farewell 3. Goddesses 4. The Garter (second supplement 7th Edition 1688) 5. Mundesse 6. Bobbing Joe 7. Jenny Pluck Pears 8. Cuckolds all a Row 9. The Bishop of Chester's Jig (7th Edition 1686) 10. The London Gentlewomen or The Hemp Dresser or The London Maid 11. The Maid Peeped Out at the Window, or The Friar in the Well 12. Parson Upon Dorothy (2nd Edition 1652) 13. Gathering Peascods 14. The Old Mole Paul Hutchinson & Paul Sartin with Robert Harbron - English Concertina, Guitar, Mandolin, Bassoon and William Balkwill - Trumpet Also, we're coming back over the water next spring, if any of our American friends wish to book us early . . . Paul. _________________________ Paul Sartin MA (Oxon) LRSM May Cottage, Wherwell, Hampshire, SP11 7JS Tel/fax: +44 (0) 1264 860791 Mobile: +44 (0) 7711 485798 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 06:39:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 09:38:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Experienced and inexperienced dancers To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Tue, 17 Jul 2001 DavBarnert-AT- aol.com wrote: > Tonight, Pat Petersen called a dance (Faithless Nancy Dawson) here > and introduced it thusly: > > "We're going to try a little challenge here. All the experienced > dancers come to the center of the floor. OK. Now all the > inexperienced dancers around the edges: Choose your partner!" OK, I'll bite! What was the result? Did it "work" (in the sense of provoking each group to seek partners in the other group)? Did it carry over to other dances if/when that division spontaneously recreated itself? On reflection, if the division _did_ spontaneously recur, that would be an indication that the provocation had only short-term effects at best. But if it didn't (i.e. the experienced & inexperienced dancers remained mixed thereafter), then the pattern of looking to the sidelines to find them would be broken, and one would find inexperienced as well as experienced dancers in one's midst, so a different algorithm would be required to maximize pairing of an experienced dancer with an inexperienced one. Thus, ironically, the success of the method destroys itself! Perhaps at a week such as Early Music Week with its relatively large number of inexperienced dancers, maintaining a somewhat deliberate segregation for the purpose of enabling experienced-inexperienced pairing is a useful tool, at least at the beginning. My feeling has been, when I have been there, that the experienced dancers were more attentive to the needs of tbe inexperienced ones than at, say, English Week or English-American Week, but of course it's still a good idea to encourage as much interaction as possible. Eric P.S. Hi, Nilos! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 08:47:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 08:47:15 -0700 From: bruce_hamilton-AT- agilent.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Getting past the whoosh To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Mary Beth Goodman wrote: > If you really don't want to encourage the rapid fire changing of > partners and you want to encourage more social behaviour, mingling, > mixing etc - allow more time between dances. Long ago, in a galaxy far away, I attended a Scottish ball in a big hotel in Vancouver, BC. They had round tables of 10-12, arranged around the outside of the dance floor. We ate dinner, mingled (this was the Saturday night of a workshop) and then started the dance. It struck me that as each dance finished, it made sense to escort my partner to her seat, because she *had* a seat: it's the place where she had dinner, her purse was there and her friends were there. There might be a seat for me, or I could stand as we chatted a bit. Then I might ask someone at her table for a dance, or visit other tables. Of course, the MC left time for all this. As I say, this was a long time ago. Things have changed since then, some for the better. But for the time, place and occasion, it was a graceful setting. (Of course, it helped that Jo was there :-) < [...] > But I won't go so > far as saying "do more rants" so that people sit out more and chat on > the sidelines. LOL. Ah, Mary Beth! Would it were so. -Bruce Hamilton (back from Pinewoods Scottish week, preparing for Pinewoods English week) bruce_hamilton-AT- agilent.com Tel: 650-485-2818 Fax: 650-485-8092 Agilent Technologies MS 24M-A, 3500 Deer Creek Road, Palo Alto CA 94303 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 09:17:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 17:12:46 +0100 From: Paul Sartin Subject: announcement cont. To: ECD Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3B5463FE.2C5C9EF5-AT- attglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Sorry everyone. I should have stated the fact that 'John Playford's Secret Ball' is a recording (WildGoose Records). In the UK and Europe it will be available from me, and also AADS. In the US, Sidestreet/Elderly and CDSS, presently. That being said, we hope to throw a ball or two, as it were, in December. Paul. _________________________ Paul Sartin MA (Oxon) LRSM May Cottage, Wherwell, Hampshire, SP11 7JS Tel/fax: +44 (0) 1264 860791 Mobile: +44 (0) 7711 485798 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 10:39:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 18:36:48 +0100 From: Paul Sartin Subject: knickers in a twist To: ECD Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3B5477B0.34DA07E5-AT- attglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT "Priscilla M. Burrage" wrote: > I thought the origianl lisst of dances was a ball -- and pushed Delete. > Could you put the contents on ECD again for me and others like me. Yes. 1. Maiden Lane 2. Parson's Farewell 3. Goddesses 4. The Garter (second supplement 7th Edition 1688) 5. Mundesse 6. Bobbing Joe 7. Jenny Pluck Pears 8. Cuckolds all a Row 9. The Bishop of Chester's Jig (7th Edition 1686) 10. The London Gentlewomen or The Hemp Dresser or The London Maid 11. The Maid Peeped Out at the Window, or The Friar in the Well 12. Parson Upon Dorothy (2nd Edition 1652) 13. Gathering Peascods 14. The Old Mole _________________________ Paul Sartin MA (Oxon) LRSM May Cottage, Wherwell, Hampshire, SP11 7JS Tel/fax: +44 (0) 1264 860791 Mobile: +44 (0) 7711 485798 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 10:54:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 13:57:57 -0400 (EDT) From: "Roger W. Broseus, CHP, Ph.D." Subject: Re: knickers in a twist To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <58409.148.184.176.32.995392677.squirrel-AT- www.weitzman.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <3B5477B0.34DA07E5-AT- attglobal.net> Staying with the flow of consciousness for a moment: Knickers In a Twist: Is that the name of the ball? A dance? An out-dated rock tune? > "Priscilla M. Burrage" wrote: > >> I thought the origianl lisst of dances was a ball -- and pushed > Delete. >> Could you put the contents on ECD again for me and others like me. > > Yes. > > 1. Maiden Lane > 2. Parson's Farewell > 3. Goddesses > 4. The Garter (second supplement 7th Edition 1688) > 5. Mundesse > 6. Bobbing Joe > 7. Jenny Pluck Pears > 8. Cuckolds all a Row > 9. The Bishop of Chester's Jig (7th Edition 1686) > 10. The London Gentlewomen or The Hemp Dresser or The London Maid > 11. The Maid Peeped Out at the Window, or The Friar in the Well > 12. Parson Upon Dorothy (2nd Edition 1652) > 13. Gathering Peascods > 14. The Old Mole ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 11:29:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 19:26:40 +0100 From: Paul Sartin Subject: Re: knickers in a twist To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3B548360.E07C28A7-AT- attglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <3B5477B0.34DA07E5-AT- attglobal.net> <58409.148.184.176.32.995392677.squirrel-AT- www.weitzman.com> "Roger W. Broseus, CHP, Ph.D." wrote: > Staying with the flow of consciousness for a moment: Knickers In a Twist: Is > that the name of the ball? hmm - many a wise word . . . _________________________ Paul Sartin MA (Oxon) LRSM May Cottage, Wherwell, Hampshire, SP11 7JS Tel/fax: +44 (0) 1264 860791 Mobile: +44 (0) 7711 485798 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 14:37:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 17:33:03 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Small (gender balanced) world! To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010717.173311.-846599.3.gmurrow-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Just returned from the Port Townsend, WA, early music workshop, where I led an English country dance for about 110 people who'd never done or seen it before. A good time was had by all, what with a great band of world-class early music pros and global, gender-neutral terminology welcoming everyone. I directed many of the enthusiastic folks to local groups (San Francisco, Portland, Seattle, New Haven, New York), so look out for 'em in the Fall. One of the most enthusiastic was Priscilla Winslow, a SF Bay-area lawyer who's the volunteer counsel for the American Recorder Society (she represents the California Teachers Association in her day job). In the course of a long conversation about country dancing and the SF dance community (she'd love to come dance with her life-partner Frances Feldon), I mentioned the discussion on this list about gender balance, etc., and the remarkably cogent legal postings of Jon Berger. Priscilla replied that the daughter of her mentor at UC Santa Cruz (and a friend of Priscilla's) had filed a relevant lawsuit that I might be interested in knowing about. "What's her name," says I. "Victoria Isbister," says Priscilla! "Funny thing," I said, "that's exactly the case Jon mentioned-- 'Isbister vs. Boys' Club.'" "Famous case," said Priscilla, who then agreed with Jon's opinion that it is "on point" as far as gender balanced dances in California were concerned. Priscilla also noted that a policy of "doing it anyway and hoping no one files a lawsuit" should be considered carefully. If someone does sue, she, like Jon, believes they would prevail, and notes that in California the prevailing party is entitled to reimbursement of all legal fees! This would include the plaintiff's legal fees plus, of course, the fees the defending group would have to pay to defend the case in court. The purpose of the policy is to ensure that people suffering non-monetary harm are not discouraged by legal fees from filing a lawsuit. So while the "damages" that an offended party might recover would be nominal, the actual costs to a group could be very high. Small world, eh? Gene Murrow ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Permanent address: - for your Address book ISP of the moment: - "Reply" button destination ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 15:02:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 15:02:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Jon Berger Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Small (gender balanced) world! To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Tue, 17 Jul 2001, Gene Murrow wrote: > Priscilla also noted that a policy of "doing it anyway and hoping no one > files a lawsuit" should be considered carefully. If someone does sue, > she, like Jon, believes they would prevail, and notes that in California > the prevailing party is entitled to reimbursement of all legal fees! Maybe. That's an interesting angle that I hadn't even thought of. She's doubtless referring to California's "private attorney general" law, formally known as Code of Civil Procedure section 1021.5, under which a party who wins a public-interest lawsuit can collect attorney's fees from the losing party. This statute is what keeps a lot of plaintiff-side environmental attorneys afloat, for example. However, I don't *think* it's necessarily true that a discrimination lawsuit is automatically "public interest." The standard in the statute is that the fees are available if (a) a significant benefit, whether pecuniary or nonpecuniary, has been conferred on the general public or a large class of persons, (b) the necessity and financial burden of private enforcement, or of enforcement by one public entity against another public entity, are such as to make the award appropriate, and (c) such fees should not in the interest of justice be paid out of the recovery, if any. I think a judge might have a little bit of trouble with the concept that stopping sex discrimination at English country dances benefits either the general public or a large class of persons. It would certainly be worth a try, though; worst that can happen is the judge says no, and then the plaintiff's attorney has run up the defendant's legal fees a little more to defend the fee motion. ------------------------------- Jon Berger Personal: jberger-AT- monitor.net Business: jon-AT- perforce.com http://www.monitor.net/~jberger ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 19:02:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 21:58:18 -0400 From: Allison M Thompson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Pinewoods and Hot Women and Feeding Frenzy To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010717.215818.-1893177.1.AllisonThompson-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT No, this isn't one of the messages you should automatically block. Apropos of the discussion on feeding frenzy, center-set-syndrome etc., some years ago when I and a group of similarly quiet and reserved female friends, all of us *excellent* dancers, attended Pinewoods, we noticed that, night after night, dance after dance, some women were "snapped up" right away and others (like us) continued trolling around searching for a partner or altogether on the sidelines. After careful observation (we had plenty of time for it), we finally determined that all the "hot" women had--independent of other attributes--long, flowing hair. (Ours, collectively, was either short or pinned up.) Not satisfied with mere field observation, but searching for empirical confirmation, one of us went out on to the floor with her hair in a bun and failed to get a partner. Next dance, she went out, pulled out her pins, ran her hands casually through her cascading silky locks and was practically knocked over by besieging male partners. I rest my case, such as it is--since we did not replicate the Vondervogel-Meuniere Brassiere Test, our conclusions are necessarily imperfect. A. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2001 13:02:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2001 13:02:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010718200229.48229.qmail-AT- web20004.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT --- "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> wrote: > We know that many of the longway sets for three couples > started out as triple minors, Fandango being one of them. I > like the diversity of formations and never let an ECD evening > pass without doing at least two non-longways. Although we don't > usually revert to the old triple minor form (and it feels weird > because of our very assertive physical memory!), it is fun to > occasionally DO the original triple minors! The last NEFFA performance that I did with Reel Nutmeg (1989) we started Shrewsbury Lasses as the "standard" three couple set then two couples eventually were added at the top and we made a duple-minor longways set out of it. Everyone *really* had to pay attention as the cast and circle figure could get very confusing as to who was casting and who was circling. We practiced it a long time. Andy in Portland OR __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2001 18:18:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2001 21:18:02 -0400 From: Mary E Jones Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa To: ECD List Message-ID: <3B56354A.99862DB3-AT- earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT To All Who Have Been Perplexed and Pained: That pernicious piece of perfidy, known as the W 32/Magistr-AT- MM worm/virus, is gone...whew! What a royal pain in the patootie that was!! Thanks for your patience - Mary (poorer but wiser) Jones ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 03:52:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 12:55:11 +0200 From: Philippe Callens Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B56BC8F.252E8FF9-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <01K5VHP2Y5UY9R9FR4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> <3B4F0BF8.E66AA5CD-AT- ugsolutions.com> I have experienced a similar thing in Britain between festivals (like Eastbourne) and dance weekends (e.g. Halsway Manor). At festivals, there is virtually no "mingling/change partners" while at dance weekends I have been to, it did happen - smaller number of people (40-60) who seems to know many of the other dancers present. So I don't have to tell you why I don't feel terribly excited to attend festivals. Philippe Callens Antwerp, Belgium Hugh Stewart wrote: > MEIER-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote: > > > Ron & Trevor (& perhaps anyone else who can knowledgeably comment) - > > > > I've been reading with interest your descriptions of the English Playford dance > > community. The picture you paint seems clear, but I still have a couple of > > questions. > > > > What I genuinely don't understand is, how do single people learn the dances > > under the circumstances you describe (bring your own partner or don't dance > > much, if at all)? > > In Britain we distinguish between "dance clubs" and "dances". Dance > clubs tend to be run as a series of weekly meetings, usually to recorded > music. We then have "dances", often organised by dance clubs, usually > on Saturday evenings, usually to live music, usually with an imported > "name" caller. > > Typically people will mix within a dance club evening, but go to "dances" > as couples, or as a group from some dance club. In any case these are not > absolute rules, while Bob Archer ranted on about taking a visitor to > some UK dance and having them sit out the entire evening I have taken > several US visitors to dances and I think they have danced all they > wanted (Terry, you might be able to comment better than I on this). ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 12:24:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 15:24:02 -0400 (EDT) From: DavBarnert-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Experienced and inexperienced dancers To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Eric wrote: >On Tue, 17 Jul 2001 DavBarnert-AT- aol.com wrote: > >> Tonight, Pat Petersen called a dance (Faithless Nancy Dawson) here >> and introduced it thusly: >> >> "We're going to try a little challenge here. All the experienced >> dancers come to the center of the floor. OK. Now all the >> inexperienced dancers around the edges: Choose your partner!" > >OK, I'll bite! What was the result? Did it "work" (in the sense >of provoking each group to seek partners in the other group)? >Did it carry over to other dances if/when that division >spontaneously recreated itself? Sorry for the delay in my response. There are more interesting things to do at Pinewoods than respond to e-mail. Of course, there's no clear cut answer to the question, which seems to assume that there are two distinct "groups" of dancers (as, admittedly, did Pat's suggestion and my "Subject:" line) and that before Pat's suggestion they never mixed. Neither of these is true. There is a full range of experience in the dancers here, and it's not strictly linear, either. That is, different people with similar "experience" might have very different strengths and weaknesses and be very different dancers. Experience isn't black or white or even a continuum of grays but a pastiche of varying colors. Also, much of the kind of activity that Pat's suggestion encouraged was already taking place. So the sample size that would be needed to demonstrate a significant effect would have to be huge. >On reflection, if the division _did_ spontaneously recur, that >would be an indication that the provocation had only short-term >effects at best. But if it didn't (i.e. the experienced & >inexperienced dancers remained mixed thereafter), then the >pattern of looking to the sidelines to find them would be >broken, and one would find inexperienced as well as experienced >dancers in one's midst, so a different algorithm would be >required to maximize pairing of an experienced dancer with an >inexperienced one. Thus, ironically, the success of the method >destroys itself! Actually, I've not had an opportunity to witness any results. That was Monday night. Tuesday night, I was in the band, and I am typing this on Wednesday afternoon, although I don't know when I'll next plug in to post it. I don't think it will have any lasting effect on the way partners are chosen. I hope that it at least reminded some people that this is something to be aware of when choosing a partner. ______ /\/\/\/\ <______> | | | | | David Barnert <______> | | | | | <______> | | | | | Albany, N.Y. <______> \/\/\/\/ Ventilator Concertina Bellows Bellows (Vocation) (Avocation) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 19:20:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 21:25:11 -0400 From: Stu Shapiro Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Pinewoods and Hot Women and Feeding Frenzy To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <003c01c110c2$ea2cf800$3153c0d8-AT- stushapiro> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <009FF2DF.BC6275D5.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> On Tuesday, July 17, Allison Thompson wrote: > No, this isn't one of the messages you should automatically block. > > Apropos of the discussion on feeding frenzy, center-set-syndrome etc., > some years ago when I and a group of similarly quiet and reserved female > friends, all of us *excellent* dancers, attended Pinewoods, we noticed > that, night after night, dance after dance, some women were "snapped up" > right away and others (like us) continued trolling around searching for a > partner or altogether on the sidelines. After careful observation (we > had plenty of time for it), we finally determined that all the "hot" > women had--independent of other attributes--long, flowing hair. (Ours, > collectively, was either short or pinned up.) Not satisfied with mere > field observation, but searching for empirical confirmation, one of us > went out on to the floor with her hair in a bun and failed to get a > partner. Next dance, she went out, pulled out her pins, ran her hands > casually through her cascading silky locks and was practically knocked > over by besieging male partners. > > I rest my case, such as it is--since we did not replicate the > Vondervogel-Meuniere Brassiere Test, our conclusions are necessarily > imperfect. O.K., what is the Vondervogel-Meuniere Brassiere Test? Stu Shapiro, who sometimes asks the questions others are unwilling to ask. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2001 12:42:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2001 15:39:00 -0400 From: sol weber Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Long hair etc To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010720.153912.-198243.0.solweber-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Re the "Long hair theory" that postulates more partners for women who *do* wear it long -- in the "What's the world coming to?" department, at some recent dances there has been an over-abundance of *men*, so what's a *guy* to do to get more partners? My hair is too short, it would take too long to grow, and anyway I'm skeptical of the theory. Civilized men (in self defense?) *have* adopted the maxim that 'size doesn't matter', and I think will generally choose partners (in the long run) on the basis of personality and dancing ability, rather than length and size attributes. (And I guess that would apply to gay *and* non-gay situations, since that topic has suddenly emerged from the closet.) Well, I'm off to camp, where I'll check into the theory. Stay cool. +++++Sol "Roundman" Weber --- "So many rounds, so little time" +++++25-14 37th St, Astoria, NY 11103; 718-278-4389 (after 11am) ++SINGERS and musicians, contact me for info on books, albums, and misc musical fun; solweber-AT- JUNO.com ; members.nbci.com/rounds Urgent message? Please phone. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2001 16:04:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2001 19:04:42 -0400 (EDT) From: SallenNic-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Digest V1 #985 To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >The last NEFFA performance that I did with Reel Nutmeg (1989) we >started Shrewsbury Lasses as the "standard" three couple set >then two couples eventually were added at the top and we made a >duple-minor longways set out of it. Everyone *really* had to pay >attention as the cast and circle figure could get very confusing >as to who was casting and who was circling. We practiced it a >long time. > >Andy in Portland OR Of course, this is originally a triple minor dance, with only one B music. Barney Heffer added the very satisfying and clever B2, which is kind of a mirror image of B1. I can imagine that as a duple minor it would tax the brain somewhat! Nicolas B., Lanark, Scotland. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2001 23:18:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2001 23:15:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K67KYNQON69RP86W-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Andy wrote: > The last NEFFA performance that I did with Reel Nutmeg (1989) we > started Shrewsbury Lasses as the "standard" three couple set > then two couples eventually were added at the top and we made a > duple-minor longways set out of it. Everyone *really* had to pay > attention as the cast and circle figure could get very confusing > as to who was casting and who was circling. We practiced it a > long time. I recollect that Mr. Bentley notes that the the second cast and circle (which make the three-couple version of the dance much more satisfactory than it would otherwise be) was added in for his version, along with a repeat of the appropriate strain of the tune. Did your duple-minor version incorporate the second cast and circle (which would be quite disorienting) or revert to the original choreography? -- Alan (back from Mendocino English Week, which was swell) =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2001 23:25:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2001 23:20:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: ECD Digest V1 #985 To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K67L6XL3H49RP86W-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Nicolas quoted the same post I did and added: > Of course, this is originally a triple minor dance, with only one B music. > Barney Heffer added the very satisfying and clever B2, which is kind of a > mirror image of B1. > I can imagine that as a duple minor it would tax the brain somewhat! > Nicolas B., Lanark, . . . which was the same point I made, except probably with the correct attribution (Apted, not Fallibroome). I would have been spared some minor embarrassment if Nic had changed the subject line of his reply to that of the post of which he was responding, rather than to (re: ECD Digest ...) since I did check ahead for other responses. Please try to remember to do that, although I understand some mail software makes it difficult. Thanks, -- Alan (well, perhaps not altogether mentally back from Mendocino) =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 20:20:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 23:19:54 -0400 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: music software To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Just back from MacWorld Expo in the big Apple (no really!) and picked up some information about SmartScore "the most versatile music software ever" V.2.0. I stood and watched it translating audio music into sheet music for a bit and that was cool. Apparently can do the reverse as well -- has a big list of features but not being a musician, much of it doesn't mean much to me. I don't know anything about the software itself pro or con, only that I saw it and obviously it's for macs. For more info about it if interested: http://www.smartscore.com or http://www.musitek.com They also have a toll free number: 800-676-8055 Cheers! Mary Beth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 03:04:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 11:09:31 +0100 From: Annie Walker Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Sir32cam.exe virus warning To: zander-AT- nyrond.co.uk, Ysclare-AT- aol.com, WolfMoon6663-AT- aol.com, webmaster-AT- SCoFF.zzn.com, WarwickEdwardC-AT- aol.com, "W. Scott Snyder" , Violene MENEZ , Valmai Goodyear , Trevor Monson , Trevor Monson , Tom Jeffers , tisbuts , Tim Walker , Tim Walker , Theresa Buckland , Teddy1-AT- mdx.ac.uk, Ted Anthony , tara mackenney , Talis Kimberley , sue , Stickulari-AT- aol.com, Steve Macdonald , Steve Jones , Steve Bryan , stephen_jones-AT- harcourt.com, "Stephen D. Corrsin" , Standpat1-AT- aol.com, SONYMUSIC , somers.folklife-AT- virgin.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT EFDSS has been infected with an email virus. If you have had an attached file sent to you within the last four days containing the words "I send you this file for your advice", you have potentially been infected. You can download a removal tool from the Symantec site: http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/FixSirc.com This email is not a hoax - please feel free to call me if you are worried about infection - my number is 0207 485 2206 Ext. 19. The virus sends random files from the hard drive, seeds itself into the new system and then emails everyone on the new address book. You have been sent this email as you are on my address book. It seems particularly pernicious. Please ignore any suspicious email attached files that you may have had from the EFDSS in the past four days. My apologies for bothering you with this. Annie Walker Assistant Librarian ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 03:55:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 17:28:36 +0100 From: Barry McNamara Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Sir32cam.exe virus warning To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <000701c0fb38$64536060$e3ba86d9-AT- default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: Thanks for the warning ----- Original Message ----- From: Annie Walker To: ; ; ; ; ; W. Scott Snyder ; Violene MENEZ ; Valmai Goodyear ; Trevor Monson ; Trevor Monson ; Tom Jeffers ; tisbuts ; Tim Walker ; Tim Walker ; Theresa Buckland ; ; Ted Anthony ; tara mackenney ; Talis Kimberley ; sue ; ; Steve Macdonald ; Steve Jones ; Steve Bryan ; ; Stephen D. Corrsin EFDSS has been infected with an email virus. If you have had an > attached file sent to you within the last four days containing the > words "I send you this file for your advice", you have potentially been > infected. You can download a removal tool from the Symantec site: > > http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/FixSirc.com > > This email is not a hoax - please feel free to call me if you are > worried about infection - my number is 0207 485 2206 Ext. 19. The virus > sends random files from the hard drive, seeds itself into the new system > and then emails everyone on the new address book. You have been sent > this email as you are on my address book. It seems particularly > pernicious. > > Please ignore any suspicious email attached files that you may have had > from the EFDSS in the past four days. > > My apologies for bothering you with this. > > Annie Walker > Assistant Librarian > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 14:08:40 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 14:08:28 -0700 From: giovanni de amici Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Philadelphia Ball? To: ecd mailing list Message-ID: <3B5C924C.5D72A98C-AT- yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Good day. does anyone know when the Philadelphia Ball will take place this year? I expect it will be either 1 or 8 december, but on which day? the web site for the Germantown Country Dancers has been down for a couple of days, and I need the info rather quickly. please save everybody's bandwidth and reply off-line to sbecd-AT- yahoo.com. Thank you. Giovanni De Amici -- for information about ECD in the Los Angeles area, please check SBECD's web page at: www.geocities.com/sbecd _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 15:59:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 15:58:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: free choice To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010723225852.47074.qmail-AT- web20009.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > Andy wrote: > > started Shrewsbury Lasses as the "standard" three couple set > > then two couples eventually were added at the top and we > > made a duple-minor longways set out of it. > To which Alan wrote: > I recollect that Mr. Bentley notes that the the second cast > and circle (which make the three-couple version of the dance > much more satisfactory than it would otherwise be) was added > in for his version, along with a repeat of the appropriate > strain of the tune. > > Did your duple-minor version incorporate the second cast and > circle (which would be quite disorienting) or revert to the > original choreography? Having never experienced the original triple-minor dance and not being aware that the second B music was added, we used Mr. Bentley's complete three couple version, which is the reason it took so long to work it out. It was very disorienting to some people. It helps that when dancing in a performing group such as this, we always danced the same position every time and learning the dance became more a matter of repeating it until those who were confused got their own position in the dance committed to memory. If for some reason we had been scrambled out of position before starting this dance, it may not have worked as well in performance. I think that was the suite that Dale choreographed and she had all of the positions for every dance committed to paper before we even started rehearsing it. There weren't many changes once we started working on it. Andy Andy __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 16:05:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 16:05:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Prehistoric EFDS in California? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010723230543.27408.qmail-AT- web20007.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT --- Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote: > ECDers -- > > Well, I could scarcely go away and leave you with nothing to > talk about. << snip >> I think we behaved ourselves quite well in your absence. Of course many others were or still are at camp. Concerning Alan's comments and question about EFDSS in California, I had never heard anything about such a center in the early part of the Century. It never was discussed in the writings that I've seen from May Gadd or Genny Shimer about the early years of CDSS and it's evolution from the EFDSS centers that I mentioned earlier. Maybe EFDSS has some information about it. Andy __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2001 15:53:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2001 18:52:51 -0400 (EDT) From: SallenNic-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re:Slapped wrist! To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <4d.ebe5d08.288f5643-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT In a message dated 23/7/01 3:00:33 pm, system-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU writes: >which was the same point I made, except probably with the correct >attribution (Apted, not Fallibroome). I would have been spared some minor >embarrassment if Nic had changed the subject line of his reply to that >of >the post of which he was responding, rather than to (re: ECD Digest ...) >since I did check ahead for other responses. Please try to remember to >do >that, although I understand some mail software makes it difficult. Sorry Alan; I'll try hard to be a better boy in future :-) Nicolas. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 08:59:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 11:58:48 -0400 (EDT) From: SaundersCr-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: PLAYFORD CONFERENCE To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_3PZ7fhVspr0ZvjTlF1HyMQ)" --Boundary_(ID_3PZ7fhVspr0ZvjTlF1HyMQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT PROCEEDINGS The Dolmetsch Historical Dance Society would like to apologise to all those who ordered copies of the Proceedings of the Playford Conference held in London in March this year. We had expected to send out copies in June, but due to circumstances beyond our control, this has not been possible. The Editor hopes to be able to dispatch ordered copies in September. Once again, our apologies for the delay. Chris Saunders for DHDS; www.dhds.org.uk --Boundary_(ID_3PZ7fhVspr0ZvjTlF1HyMQ) Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT PROCEEDINGS
The Dolmetsch Historical Dance Society would like to apologise to all those
who ordered copies of the Proceedings of the Playford Conference held in
London in March this year. We had expected to send out copies in June, but
due to circumstances beyond our control, this has not been possible. The
Editor hopes to be able to dispatch ordered copies in September.
Once again, our apologies for the delay.

Chris Saunders
for DHDS; www.dhds.org.uk --Boundary_(ID_3PZ7fhVspr0ZvjTlF1HyMQ)-- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 14:41:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 17:40:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Will Linden Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT My pardon for this, but the SirCam worm may be loose on the list. For a change, this one is real... I have been getting dozens of copies of the thing instead of dozens of "alerts". (Funny how the number of "warnings" seems to be in INVERSE proportion to the reality of the threat). Never has there been a better time to be smug about using a Unix mailer. See File that you are currently viewing Linkname: SARC Write-up - W32.Sircam.Worm-AT- mm http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/w32.sircam.worm-AT- mm.html about this and explicit instructions for removing it. Or a program to do it automatically, if Regedit makes you turn pale. * If you get a message with a weird (random) subject line from someone you do not know from Adam saying "I sent you this file to get your advice", and it has an attachment with a strange name, DO NOT OPEN THE ATTACHMENT. * If your e-mail software is configured to open attachements automatically, he said smugly, re-configure it. * Keep your anti-virus programs up to date. * If you are using Windows, and it is set to "hide file extensions for known file types", uncheck it. The sociopaths take advantage of this (default) setting to name a worm something like "Kitty.jpg.com", and Windoze hides the "com" extension to make the worm look like a graphic file. * If you think you have the "virus", take countermeasures BEFORE yelling at the purported sender by return mail. If the "send" address is even genuine, the "sender" may not even know what his corrupted system is doing. * And even if you don't open the thing, the current barrage is taking up lots and lots of mailbox space. Have no compunction about deleting the things. Interestingly, part of the countermeasures for this is to empty the trash. Yes, empty the Trash, oops, I mean the RECYCLING BIN. Part of the hostile agent lurks there. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 15:06:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 18:03:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Will Linden Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT And if you DO send a copy of the message to someone to complain, DO NOT INCLUDE THE ATTACHMENT. That only spreads the thing further. I made that mistake, and was rebuked by the auto-responder for sending a virus. Will Linden wlinden-AT- panix.com http://www.ecben.net/ Magic Code: MAS/GD S++ W++ N+ PWM++ Ds/r+ A-> a++ C+ G- QO++ 666 Y ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 17:48:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 20:46:28 -0400 From: "Linda M. Nelson" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: >seems to be in INVERSE proportion to the reality of the threat). Never has >there been a better time to be smug about using a Unix mailer. Ummm.... a question for us Mac users... does this worm attack Macs? or just Windoze? (The info websites didn't say, though the instructions looked PC specific.) And just a reminder to all: please never send attachments to the list. Thanks - Linda -- __________________________________________________ "Oh, yes. It's vital to remember who you really are. It's very important. It isn't a good idea to rely on other people or things to do it for you, you see. They always get it wrong." (Terry Pratchett - from "Sourcery") __________________________________________________ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 06:49:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 09:49:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Thu, 26 Jul 2001, Linda M. Nelson wrote: > >seems to be in INVERSE proportion to the reality of the threat). Never has > >there been a better time to be smug about using a Unix mailer. > > Ummm.... a question for us Mac users... does this worm attack Macs? > or just Windoze? (The info websites didn't say, though the > instructions looked PC specific.) Not necessarily even all PC's. Though I use PC's, I use the Pine e-mail program running on a Unix-based server. Attachments are a real pain to open, because their files reside on the server, not on my computer; I have to download them before I can open them so I don't do that unless I really know it's something I want. I've received half a dozen of this virus but it hasn't affected my computer (I know; I've got current anti-viral software checking...). > And just a reminder to all: please never send attachments to the list. The thing about the virus: not only do you not know you're sending an attachment, you don't know you're sending the message. Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 07:15:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 10:14:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Will Linden Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Fri, 27 Jul 2001, Eric Arnold wrote: > Not necessarily even all PC's. Though I use PC's, I use the Pine e-mail > program running on a Unix-based server. Attachments are a real pain to Same here.... but they STILL take up my file space until I delete them. I have had to log on several times a day just to clean out megabytes of junk. Will Linden wlinden-AT- panix.com http://www.ecben.net/ Magic Code: MAS/GD S++ W++ N+ PWM++ Ds/r+ A-> a++ C+ G- QO++ 666 Y ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 07:27:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 10:27:08 -0400 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: > >On Fri, 27 Jul 2001, Eric Arnold wrote: >> Not necessarily even all PC's. Though I use PC's, I use the Pine e-mail >> program running on a Unix-based server. Attachments are a real pain to > > Same here.... but they STILL take up my file space until I delete them. I >have had to log on several times a day just to clean out megabytes of >junk. Good points about the virus and the problems even for careful people and even mac people like myself. I got a "warning" notice from my ISP that I was approaching the max of server space usage( not really since it was about 75%). I sent them back a thoughtful reply - ..."nothing has changed but the repeated delivery of the 140K+ virus laden emails So why don't you get on that virus-filtering-thing dearies?" Wish I'd kept a copy for future use actually. Mary Beth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 14:18:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 16:17:30 -0500 From: Charlene Charette Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B61DA6A.2AD8F37D-AT- flash.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: OK, I've been studying heraldry too long. I saw the subject line and thought "how can a worm be rampant?" :-) --Charlene -- They got the library at Alexandria -- They're not getting mine. ===== Free Book Searches (out-of-print, hard-to-find, foreign, used, new) - mailto:findbook-AT- flash.net ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 17:42:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 20:26:03 -0400 From: "Linda M. Nelson" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <3B61DA6A.2AD8F37D-AT- flash.net> >OK, I've been studying heraldry too long. I saw the subject line and >thought "how can a worm be rampant?" :-) > >--Charlene Wyrm. Given how nasty this evil little wyrm is, i can imagine it breathing fire and creating havoc of a draconic sort... L. -- __________________________________________________ "Oh, yes. It's vital to remember who you really are. It's very important. It isn't a good idea to rely on other people or things to do it for you, you see. They always get it wrong." (Terry Pratchett - from "Sourcery") __________________________________________________ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 17:47:12 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 17:46:16 -0700 From: Ric Goldman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hmmm, Do internet worms (wurms?, wyrms?) concern themselves with gender balance or discrimination issues? If not, does that mean we should emulate this aspect of their behavior? Unless.... darn, darn, darn, it *does* look like they may have a platform bias Thanx, Ric Goldman timelord01-AT- sprynet.com http://connect.to/ric > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-ecd-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU > [mailto:owner-ecd-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU]On Behalf Of Linda M. > Nelson > Sent: Friday, July 27, 2001 5:26 PM > To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU > Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. > > > >OK, I've been studying heraldry too long. I saw the subject line and > >thought "how can a worm be rampant?" :-) > > > >--Charlene > > Wyrm. Given how nasty this evil little wyrm is, i can imagine it > breathing fire and creating havoc of a draconic sort... L. > -- > > __________________________________________________ > "Oh, yes. It's vital to remember who you really are. > It's very important. It isn't a good idea to rely on other > people or things to do it for you, you see. They always > get it wrong." (Terry Pratchett - from "Sourcery") > __________________________________________________ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 17:53:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 20:52:26 -0400 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: At 5:46 PM -0700 7/27/01, Ric Goldman wrote: >Do internet worms (wurms?, wyrms?) concern themselves with gender >balance or discrimination issues? If not, does that mean we should >emulate this aspect of their behavior? > >Unless.... darn, darn, darn, it *does* look like they may have a platform bias > >Thanx, Ric Goldman brilliant! Mary Beth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 18:10:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 20:41:14 -0400 From: Allison M Thompson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: PLAYFORD CONFERENCE To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010727.210733.-1691939.3.AllisonThompson-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT For those who did not order at that time, could you provide details? Allison On Thu, 26 Jul 2001 11:58:48 -0400 (EDT) SaundersCr-AT- aol.com writes: > PROCEEDINGS > The Dolmetsch Historical Dance Society would like to apologise to > all those > who ordered copies of the Proceedings of the Playford Conference > held in > London in March this year. We had expected to send out copies in > June, but > due to circumstances beyond our control, this has not been possible. > The > Editor hopes to be able to dispatch ordered copies in September. > Once again, our apologies for the delay. > > Chris Saunders > for DHDS; www.dhds.org.uk ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 18:10:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 20:39:17 -0400 From: Allison M Thompson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010727.210733.-1691939.2.AllisonThompson-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Isn't the definition of "rampant" that you stand up on your tail/hind legs/hinder parts and open your jaws as wide as possible and possibly extend your claws if any? One could (provoked) imagine a worm rampant ("even the worm turns")... Turning the other cheek, Allison On Fri, 27 Jul 2001 16:17:30 -0500 Charlene Charette writes: > OK, I've been studying heraldry too long. I saw the subject line and > thought "how can a worm be rampant?" :-) > > --Charlene > > -- > They got the library at Alexandria -- They're not getting mine. > ===== > Free Book Searches (out-of-print, hard-to-find, foreign, used, new) > - > mailto:findbook-AT- flash.net ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 22:16:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 22:14:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01K6FWK71WQW9RU7MP-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT ECders -- I would say that we've gotten pretty thoroughly off-topic. (Also, I'd generally rather not see virus warnings posted to this list, both because it's off-topic and because most virus warnings are bogus. This was a real one, and there's been some useful discussion which may have benefited the less computer-savvy members of this list, so I'm glad I didn't stop it right away, but, please, no general discussion of viruses, worms, or computer problems in general now.) Thanks, -- Alan (ECD listowner) =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 22:17:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 22:17:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: SirCam Worm rampant. To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010728051714.57476.qmail-AT- web20002.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT --- Will Linden wrote: > My pardon for this, but the SirCam worm may be loose on the > list. For a change, this one is real... I have been getting > dozens of copies of the thing instead of dozens of "alerts". Either Yahoo is screening them out before they get to me, my Norton Anti-Virus is working overtime, or itvirus doesn't work in Netscape. I haven't seen any sign of it. Andy __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2001 06:08:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2001 09:08:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Tideswell-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Worm, Rampant To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Alison remarked >Isn't the definition of "rampant" that you stand up on your tail/hind >legs/hinder parts and open your jaws as wide as possible and possibly >extend your claws if any? > >One could (provoked) imagine a worm rampant ("even the worm turns")... Well, upon provocation, I imagine it rearing up in a sort of an angry S-curve, opening its superabundantly fanged jaw in an malignant hiss....azur upon a field of computer chips, vert. With a fess or something which Charlene will have to discribe. And the motto? How about "Et In Arcadia Ego"? Nilos, back to work but still chuckling from Early Music Week ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2001 21:36:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2001 21:36:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Colonial and Civil War era shoes To: =?UNKNOWN?Q?ECD=A0list?= Message-ID: <20010730043624.17480.qmail-AT- web20006.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Somebody posted this site on the Scandinavian music and dance list that I am on. I thought that this list ought to know of them. I can't offer any insight on the quality. Andy __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2001 23:21:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 01:20:52 -0500 From: Charlene Charette Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Worm, Rampant To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B64FCC4.FB642585-AT- flash.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: Tideswell-AT- aol.com wrote: > Well, upon provocation, I imagine it rearing up in a sort of an angry > S-curve, opening its superabundantly fanged jaw in an malignant hiss....azur > upon a field of computer chips, vert. With a fess or something which > Charlene will have to discribe. Ok, Ok, I'm sorry I started it. And I really *am* using lots of restraint to refrain from further heraldic jokes. --Charlene -- They got the library at Alexandria -- They're not getting mine. ===== Free Book Searches (out-of-print, hard-to-find, foreign, used, new) - mailto:findbook-AT- flash.net ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 03:20:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 11:20:09 +0100 From: Steve Hubbard Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Sidmouth tickets for sale To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3B6534D9.879E9B0A-AT- uk.thalesgroup.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Due to my girlfriend being in hospital I have for sale two Sidmouth tickets complete with camping. £150 each, which is £50 less than the current price. If anyone is interested please contact me a.s.a.p. Thanks ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 06:32:01 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 09:25:00 -0400 From: Torbin Zimmerman Subject: Re: Colonial and Civil War era shoes To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3B65602C.7D16F92F-AT- sympatico.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <20010730043624.17480.qmail-AT- web20006.mail.yahoo.com> Thanks to Andrew for his note about Fugawee. I've been searching for late Regency era dancing shoes for some time. A word of caution: I haven't handled Fugawee's shoes, but I've generally found that reenactors' shoes are for walking, not dancing, which is to say that they are, from a dancer's perspective, inflexible and heavy. Also, from my study of period prints, it appears that dancing shoes were more like slippers, having lower heels than walking shoes, or none at all. Can any confirm or correct this? I recommend checking very carefully before ordering or ensuring there's a return policy. Especially when buying over the Internet, caveat emptor. Torbin Zimmerman ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 08:23:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 08:28:50 -0700 From: Kalia Kliban Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: custom shoes To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.20010730082850.00894810-AT- mail.monitor.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I was out of the loop for a couple of weeks and appear to have missed a thread about shoes. I'm in the market for some custom dance shoes (I have big, wiiiiide feet), and would appreciate any recommendations or warnings folks can offer. I'm not looking for period styles necessarily, just shoes that will work for ECD or contra. If this is too tangential to the subject matter at hand, replies off-list would be just fine. I'd hate to interrupt the heraldry discussion... Many thanks Kalia ----o-O-0-O-o---- kalia-AT- monitor.net ----o-O-0-O-o---- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 09:18:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 11:21:42 -0500 From: Dianna Shipman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: custom shoes To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <00c601c11913$dc564980$edf1520c-AT- pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <3.0.1.32.20010730082850.00894810-AT- mail.monitor.net> You might check out James Senior website - they specialize in shoes for Scottish dance but have a variety of styles that might work - I've been pleased with their service - you trace your foot (while standing) and mail it to them and they can figure out the correct British size and make recommendations on type of shoe if you like. My website at http://home.att.net/~diannashipman under "Links" has a category for shoes and foot supplies with some other links as well. Dianna Dianna L. Shipman diannashipman-AT- worldnet.att.net Scottish Country Dancing and More web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman PMB 134, 1302 Waugh Drive Houston, TX 77019-3908 phone: 713-522-1212 DANCE LOCATION: Oddfellows Hall, 115 E. 14th St. (Heights), Houston, Texas ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kalia Kliban" To: Sent: Monday, July 30, 2001 10:28 AM Subject: custom shoes > I was out of the loop for a couple of weeks and appear to have missed a > thread about shoes. I'm in the market for some custom dance shoes (I have > big, wiiiiide feet), and would appreciate any recommendations or warnings > folks can offer. I'm not looking for period styles necessarily, just shoes > that will work for ECD or contra. > > If this is too tangential to the subject matter at hand, replies off-list > would be just fine. I'd hate to interrupt the heraldry discussion... > > Many thanks > > Kalia > > ----o-O-0-O-o---- > kalia-AT- monitor.net > ----o-O-0-O-o---- > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 09:28:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 12:39:37 -0400 (EDT) From: "Roger W. Broseus, CHP, Ph.D." Subject: Re: custom shoes To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <47731.148.184.176.32.996511177.squirrel-AT- www.weitzman.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <3.0.1.32.20010730082850.00894810-AT- mail.monitor.net> Dear Kalia, etECD, I needed support for a hefty load, protection against pronation (rolling-out of the ankle) and dance-able shoes. And, in black so it would not look like I was going to climb a cliff or that I was in the wrong game on the dance floor. So, I went to my shoe reference, a report on walking and running shoes by Consumer Reports. I tried several shoes recommended by them for my feet and found that, for ME, New Balance had just the shoe: in black, quadruple-E (yes, that's 4E!), and with a 'roll bar' in the heel. I believe the shoe is in the 800 series . . . like an 810 (take a look at www.newbalance.com . . . it's NOT the black shoe rated for postal delivery persons). Usually about $70-$80, I've had to look high-and-low to find them locally. I lucked-out last time around and found them on sale at Nordstrom's (of all places) for $39.99999 last week. THEN, we take these shoes to a good shoe repair. I found a place that repairs shoes for a local dance studio the first time but other competent places do this too: they shave-off the tread and glue-on good quality shoe leather. In the local market (a toney zip code kinda place), the price was $40. I've done this several times and have been very satisfied. The weak point in the shoe: the liner at the Achilles tendon: it wore thru. I had soft, glove-like leather sown in as a liner/patch as soon as the wear-thru appeared. Worked like a charm. On one pair of shoes, I went thru TWO re-soles and two leather liners before the shoe blew-out on me: the uppers finally gave up the ghost. Some like to buy bowling shoes but I've found what works best for me. /Roger > I was out of the loop for a couple of weeks and appear to have missed a > thread about shoes. I'm in the market for some custom dance shoes (I > have big, wiiiiide feet), and would appreciate any recommendations or > warnings folks can offer. I'm not looking for period styles > necessarily, just shoes that will work for ECD or contra. > > If this is too tangential to the subject matter at hand, replies > off-list would be just fine. I'd hate to interrupt the heraldry > discussion... > > Many thanks > > Kalia > > ----o-O-0-O-o---- > kalia-AT- monitor.net > ----o-O-0-O-o---- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 09:28:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 12:39:39 -0400 (EDT) From: "Roger W. Broseus, CHP, Ph.D." Subject: Re: custom shoes To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <47752.148.184.176.32.996511179.squirrel-AT- www.weitzman.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <3.0.1.32.20010730082850.00894810-AT- mail.monitor.net> Dear Kalia, etECD, I needed support for a hefty load, protection against pronation (rolling-out of the ankle) and dance-able shoes. And, in black so it would not look like I was going to climb a cliff or that I was in the wrong game on the dance floor. So, I went to my shoe reference, a report on walking and running shoes by Consumer Reports. I tried several shoes recommended by them for my feet and found that, for ME, New Balance had just the shoe: in black, quadruple-E (yes, that's 4E!), and with a 'roll bar' in the heel. I believe the shoe is in the 800 series . . . like an 810 (take a look at www.newbalance.com . . . it's NOT the black shoe rated for postal delivery persons). Usually about $70-$80, I've had to look high-and-low to find them locally. I lucked-out last time around and found them on sale at Nordstrom's (of all places) for $39.99999 last week. THEN, we take these shoes to a good shoe repair. I found a place that repairs shoes for a local dance studio the first time but other competent places do this too: they shave-off the tread and glue-on good quality shoe leather. In the local market (a toney zip code kinda place), the price was $40. I've done this several times and have been very satisfied. The weak point in the shoe: the liner at the Achilles tendon: it wore thru. I had soft, glove-like leather sown in as a liner/patch as soon as the wear-thru appeared. Worked like a charm. On one pair of shoes, I went thru TWO re-soles and two leather liners before the shoe blew-out on me: the uppers finally gave up the ghost. Some like to buy bowling shoes but I've found what works best for me. /Roger > I was out of the loop for a couple of weeks and appear to have missed a > thread about shoes. I'm in the market for some custom dance shoes (I > have big, wiiiiide feet), and would appreciate any recommendations or > warnings folks can offer. I'm not looking for period styles > necessarily, just shoes that will work for ECD or contra. > > If this is too tangential to the subject matter at hand, replies > off-list would be just fine. I'd hate to interrupt the heraldry > discussion... > > Many thanks > > Kalia > > ----o-O-0-O-o---- > kalia-AT- monitor.net > ----o-O-0-O-o---- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 12:51:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 12:24:23 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: PLAYFORD CONFERENCE To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010730.154635.-811467.1.gmurrow-AT- juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_V2Tdl6QlXZ4UdNH2VLXAwA)" This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --Boundary_(ID_V2Tdl6QlXZ4UdNH2VLXAwA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hi Chris! Thanks for the notification. Am I correct in assuming that we as speakers receive at least one complimentary copy?? Thanks, Gene Murrow On Thu, 26 Jul 2001 11:58:48 -0400 (EDT) SaundersCr-AT- aol.com writes: PROCEEDINGS The Dolmetsch Historical Dance Society would like to apologise to all those who ordered copies of the Proceedings of the Playford Conference held in London in March this year. We had expected to send out copies in June, but due to circumstances beyond our control, this has not been possible. The Editor hopes to be able to dispatch ordered copies in September. Once again, our apologies for the delay. Chris Saunders for DHDS; www.dhds.org.uk ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Permanent address: - for your Address book ISP of the moment: - "Reply" button destination --Boundary_(ID_V2Tdl6QlXZ4UdNH2VLXAwA) Content-type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Hi Chris!
 
Thanks for the notification.
 
Am I correct in assuming that we as speakers receive at least one complimentary copy??
 
Thanks,
 
Gene Murrow
 
On Thu, 26 Jul 2001 11:58:48 -0400 (EDT) SaundersCr-AT- aol.com writes:
PROCEEDINGS
The Dolmetsch Historical Dance Society would like to apologise to all those
who ordered copies of the Proceedings of the Playford Conference held in
London in March this year. We had expected to send out copies in June, but
due to circumstances beyond our control, this has not been possible. The
Editor hopes to be able to dispatch ordered copies in September.
Once again, our apologies for the delay.

Chris Saunders
for DHDS; www.dhds.org.uk
 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Permanent address: <gmurrow-AT- post.harvard.edu> - for your Address book
ISP of the moment: <gmurrow-AT- juno.com>         - "Reply" button destination
--Boundary_(ID_V2Tdl6QlXZ4UdNH2VLXAwA)-- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 19:55:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 19:54:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Andrew Peterson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Colonial and Civil War era shoes To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <20010731025447.75990.qmail-AT- web20004.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Someone from upstate New york, whose name slips my mind at present, was trying about 12 years ago to get a colonial style shoe for dancing made by Capezio. He talked to several of the men at the Hartford Ball. He told us that all he needed was an order for 12 pairs for them to design the shoe. I don't know what success he had. (Note to Pat: If you see Ron and Dale, ask Ron about this. He might remember more than I do.) I agree with Torbin that you want to be careful about ordering dance shoes by mail. The company does state someplace on their web site that they will accept returns as long as the shoe is in a sellable condition, i.e. no scuffs on the sole. Andy --- Torbin Zimmerman wrote: > Thanks to Andrew for his note about Fugawee. I've been > searching for late > Regency era dancing shoes for some time. > > A word of caution: I haven't handled Fugawee's shoes, but I've > generally > found that reenactors' shoes are for walking, not dancing, > which is to say > that they are, from a dancer's perspective, inflexible and > heavy. Also, > from my study of period prints, it appears that dancing shoes > were more > like slippers, having lower heels than walking shoes, or none > at all. Can > any confirm or correct this? > > I recommend checking very carefully before ordering or > ensuring there's a > return policy. Especially when buying over the Internet, > caveat emptor. > > Torbin Zimmerman > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/