Archive-Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 15:39:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 18:39:57 -0400 (EDT) From: SallenNic-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Cecil Sharp House dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, strathspey-request-AT- tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de Message-ID: <4ef925b7.359ababe-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The dance at Cecil Sharp House on July 4th will still take place, despite John Lagden's indisposition. Caller will be Brenda Godrich, who had a sugested programme from John which she will be following substantially. Band is Kelly's Eye, as booked by John. This is a "Friends of Cecil Sharp House" dance, and deserves your support. Please tell anyone you know who might think it had been cancelled because of John's unavailability that it is very much still on the go! Of course, if you are in the north of England or Scotland, then The Assembly Ball in Edinburgh is the event that night!!! "Dance & Danceability" - a programme of dances all published in Jane's lifetime. Nicolas Broadbridge, Lanark, Scotland. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 15:43:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 18:43:30 -0400 (EDT) From: SallenNic-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Cecil Sharp House dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, strathspey-request-AT- tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de Message-ID: <497340ee.359abb93-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The dance at Cecil Sharp House on July 4th will still take place, despite John Lagden's indisposition. Caller will be Brenda Godrich, who had a sugested programme from John which she will be following substantially. Band is Kelly's Eye, as booked by John. This is a "Friends of Cecil Sharp House" dance, and deserves your support. Please tell anyone you know who might think it had been cancelled because of John's unavailability that it is very much still on the go! Of course, if you are in the north of England or Scotland, then The Assembly Ball in Edinburgh is the event that night!!! "Dance & Danceability" - a programme of dances all published in Jane's lifetime. Nicolas Broadbridge, Lanark, Scotland. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 19:23:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 22:19:47 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Fried for FAll To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199807012223_MC2-51E6-B46E-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Calling all English Country Dancers in the Mid-Atlantic States: This is an advertisement in no disguise for the Fried for Fall September 11 - 13, 1998 at a conference center just outside Philadelphia, PA. Fried de Metz Herman will present her English Country Dances, and A JOYFUL NOISE (Barbara Greenberg, Dan Beerbohm and Kathy Talvitie) will play for us. The cost is $ 145 per person. Please send check and business-size SASE to Raymond P. Tackett 434 East Woodlawn Avenue Philadelphia, PA 19144-1333 email 76416.276-AT- compuserve.com phone (215) 844-2474. Directions and schedule will be sent with confirmation. It promises to be a great early fall dance weekend; so far registrations have come from dancers in seven states. Fried welcomes the participation of experienced English Country Dancers... Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 20:16:47 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 23:10:57 -0400 From: solweber-AT- juno.com (sol weber) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: permanent record, the sequel To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980701.231057.3678.108.solweber-AT- juno.com> Back in mid-May, I suggested the desirability of a permanent record (video, film, etc) of the English dance masters still among us -- Fried Herman, Colin Hume, etc etc -- especially those no longer in the "Spring chicken" category. I myself don't have the necessary expertise in video, film, computers, OR, for that matter, the finer points of English dance (and I'm wrapped up in rounds projects), so others must snatch up the gauntlet if such a project is actually to materialize. Many people came forward agreeing that it was an excellent idea and making further suggestions on how to go about it, but like many another topic, discussion has faded. I see that there will be a Fried-for-All weekend in the Philly area, Sept 11-13, and perhaps, with the agreement of Fried and others involved, this would be a fine time to do lots of taping or filming (as unobtrusively as possible), and maybe some interviewing of our dear Fried. There isn't enough time to have an actual polished script, but I don't think that's essential. Lots of interesting footage could be obtained and pieced together later, and hopefully gaps could also be filled in later on. Any takers? I did save the various e-mail correspondence on this subject, and will forward it to any interested parties. I am leaving on Fri morn for Buff Gap, so if there's a daily in my reply, be understanding. Thanks. _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 02 Jul 1998 09:50:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 02 Jul 1998 12:47:53 -0400 From: Arthur Ferguson <71470.3625-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Important Long Pond (Pinewoods) Area Developments To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <199807021251_MC2-51F0-CFBE-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >>---Arthur Ferguson <71470.3625-AT- compuserve.com> wrote: >> Last week at Gerda Conant's request I emailed to the CDS, Boston >>Centre > >members in the Boston area something which she had written describing > >what is being planned for the Clark Road area. With her permission and >> in recognition that many people on this list know and love Pinewoods, > >I have attached what she wrote below. As you can see, the next and >> ?final? Planning Board meeting on the matter is on Tuesday. >>etc. >Arthur, I would like to hear, and I am sure many of the others on this >list, how the meeting went and what has been the outcome. >Barbara Ruth --------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------- I was unable to attend the Planning Board meeting myself and so cannot report first-hand what happened. From what I gather from talking with other knowledgable people, the master plan for the development was approved, though additional approval may be required for individual parts of the project. The area involved is large, stretching along both sides of Route 3 from Clark Road, the exit usually used when going to Pinewoods, to, I believe, the next exit south (in the direction of the Cape). Most of the land and, I believe, most of the development is on the east side of Route 3, that is the opposite side of Route 3 from Pinewoods. What development, if any, is planned for the land between Route 3 and Long Pond Road I don't know. Arthur Ferguson ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 04 Jul 1998 18:20:37 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 04 Jul 1998 21:26:56 -0400 From: Erna-Lynne Bogue Subject: Re: REALLY round dances To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <359ED65E.9B9-AT- ix.netcom.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <19980624.215738.13926.31.solweber-AT- juno.com> The tune for Christchurch Bells is a round, although we rarely hear it played out completley that way - maybe just for a tour of the dance. Pat Shaw took advantage of that fact to write a 3-cpl canon dance, Mr Shaw's Canon (#34 in Book 2 of the Pat Shaw Collection). The dance is started by Cpl 1 in the A music; Cpl 2 will reach the top spot by the end of that phrase and start the same sequence of figures with the B music; Cpl 3 will reach the top at the end of two phrases and dance the starting sequence with the C music. Meanwhile, Cpl 1 has danced the subsequent roles. I've taught the dance a few times in workshop settings. When everyone gets it, there's a nice flow & it's fun. This is enhanced, of course, if there are 3 distinct-sounding melody instruments so each couple can dance to "its" sound. (We had this luxury at Buffalo Gap a few years back.) The downside, of course, is what happens if someone goes astray. Each couple's part is dependent on the other two, and there is no way to "wait for the top of the tune" when it's a round. ELB ------------------------------------- Erna-Lynne Bogue / Ypsilanti MI real email address: ebogue-AT- umich.edu ------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 22:17:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 01:17:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Mary2dance-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Who on this list besides Gene and Alisa and myself will be at Mendocino next week? Mary Luckhardt ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 00:02:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 00:03:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IZ3KRFLDYWA5UDZ4-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Mary -- I am! -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 00:39:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 00:37:09 -0700 From: "Gary D. Shapiro" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Who on this list besides Gene and Alisa and myself will be at Mendocino >next week? > >Mary Luckhardt I'll be there, although on this list I mainly lurk unless I'm asking for help which I usually get. Thanks! -- Gary D. Shapiro Pronounced "Gary Yes! at ..." ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 09:00:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 12:01:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199807071601.MAA05291-AT- mail1.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" David & I and Michael Siemon--see you there! Sharon Green At 01:17 AM 7/7/98 -0400, you wrote: >Who on this list besides Gene and Alisa and myself will be at Mendocino >next week? > >Mary Luckhardt > > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 07:36:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 07:35:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Paul and Vicky Bestock Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Who on this list besides Gene and Alisa and myself will be at Mendocino >next week? > >Mary Luckhardt We'll be there! Paul and Victoria Bestock ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 07:54:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 15:53:28 +0100 From: Michael Barraclough Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <35A387E8.72301CFF-AT- ecid.cig.mot.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: > Who on this list besides Gene and Alisa and myself will be at > Mendocino next week? Clearly some sort of "mecca" judging by the folks going. Please could someone explain what or where Mendocino is please! Michael Barraclough Swindon, UK ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 13:32:40 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 16:30:30 -0400 From: "Susan R. Murrow" <75272.730-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <199807081633_MC2-528A-CE47-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Michael Barraclough of Swindon asked for an explanation of Mendocino... so, here is my "snapshot" (I'd love to see some others!) The town of Mendocino is in northern California, with beautiful sunsets over the Pacific Ocean to its west, and majestic redwood forests to its east... Mendocino is somewhat isolated -- to reach it, the traveller from San Francisco must drive for about 4 hours (no Great Western Railway to take you there!)... Wildflowers along the sides of the road on Route 1 (the Pacific Coast Highway) cheer the weary traveller... until, at last! there is Mendocino -- a fishing village and artists colony, nestled between mighty ocean and mighty trees! (It has been eulogized in song to the point where it is viewed as a "state of mind"... but I'm afraid I don't know anything of the history of Mendocino and I'm remembering all this from the last visit, about 14 years ago! I do hope it hasn't changed too much and the logging industry hasn't carted away too many trees...) Oh! I just remembered something else: the town just south of Mendocino is called Albion (does anyone know why? ... might be something of interest to Brits like me and Michael) The Mendocino referred to by ECDers is the Mendocino Woodlands Camp, a bunch of rustic (no electricty) cabins, a community hall, a dining hall/kitchen wash-house and caretaker's cottage, perched on redwood-covered slopes above a river (or Little North Fork of Big River) a marsh and a meadow... where, next week, there will arise (like Brigadoon!) a gathering of such folk as are minded to dance and sing as they have done since time immemori... all right, let's say, since 1980..or thereabouts... This year the program lists such activities as Northwest Clog Morris, Garland, Longsword, Cotswold Morris, Sacred Harp, Musicians Workshop, The French Connection (perhaps in honour of Bastille Day mid-week?) as well as the eagerly-anticipated English Country Dancing (raison d'etre?)! Yes, I suppose Mendocino is some sort of a "mecca" -- certainly within the ECD community it is spoken of in hushed, reverent tones... and it draws the faithful from afar... Gene and I will be travelling from New York... Et vous? ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 15:04:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 18:04:37 -0400 (EDT) From: SallenNic-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <1c3d4d5d.35a3ecf6-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Two members of the Edinburgh Assembly will also be at Mendocino. They are Peter and Margaret Bainbridge, from Monifieth (just outside Dundee) and are looking forward to it very much. Nicolas Broadbridge, Lanark, Scotland. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 15:40:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 15:41:51 -0700 From: "Gary D. Shapiro" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" References: >Clearly some sort of "mecca" judging by the folks going. Please could >someone explain what or where Mendocino is please! I remember walking for miles along the beach below the cliffs as feathered wildlife scrambles along the shore casually avoiding the waves, the people and the occasional dog while other birds dive for surprised fish. There must be some part of the British Isles like that. -- Gary D. Shapiro Pronounced "Gary Yes! at ..." ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 02:56:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 10:56:23 +0100 From: Michael Barraclough Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <35A493C6.8BD073D4-AT- ecid.cig.mot.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <199807081633_MC2-528A-CE47-AT- compuserve.com> Thanks to everyone who has replied either to the list or directly regarding my query on Mendocino. Sounds like a great place and a great event! Michael Barraclough ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 08:16:42 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 08:10:18 -0700 From: Laurie Buchanan Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Who on this list besides Gene and Alisa and myself will be at Mendocino >next week? > >Mary Luckhardt Hi Mary, I'll be there with bells on (no, wait, I don't do Morris!). Looking forward to seeing old friends and new. Laurie Buchanan Eugene, OR ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 06:27:42 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 09:28:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Mary2dance-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <7a8cfc5.35a616fe-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Robert Reed bounced his own message, so I'm forwarding this: From: Robert Reed Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? In-reply-to: "07 Jul 1998 01:17:51 -0400." <"e8c0d083.35a1af80"-AT- aol.com> To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: Robert Reed Message-ID: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Mary2dance-AT- aol.com wrote: |Who on this list besides Gene and Alisa and myself will be at Mendocino |next week? I am. (Though that should be no surprise to long-time meccaists like some of the respondents to this call.) Once again Charlie and I will inhabit cabin 17, the hospitality cabin. Featured flavors this year--for those who know--are Zesty Orange, Strictly Strawberry, and Very Mint. (For those who have no idea what I'm talking about, these are home-made chocolate truffle flavors.) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 06:29:33 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 15:30:47 +0200 (MESZ) From: Tom Goodale Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Origins of Playford Tunes To: English Country Dance List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hi, I recently bought a CD of fifteenth century dance music, and one tune, 'La Bouree', by Michael Praetorius, dated 1612, starts off just like The Health, moves into Parson's Farewell, and then finishes with The Health again. So my question is, does anyone know if the Playford tunes are derived from this, or if both draw on other music common at the time ? Tom ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 09:56:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 13:02:59 -0400 From: gaff-AT- neu.edu (Terence Gaffney) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Summer dancing in Boston To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" If anybody on the list is passing through Boston this summer, CDS is sponsoring three dances. The dates are July 15, August 5 and August 19. Dances will run from 7:30-10:30 at the Park Avenue Congregational Church in Arlington Mass. Helene Cornelius and Ralph Jones are organizing the dances for us. For a map and more details, see our web site: http://www.math.neu.edu/~gaffney/cds.html Terry ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 14:47:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 17:47:58 -0400 From: Benjamin Stein Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Origins of Playford Tunes To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <199807101748_MC2-52CA-54CD-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Can't really help but I have asked one of our local musicians, who plays = a lot of 17th century pieces, about the phrase in Pretorius that seems so much like Parson's Farewell. She indicated that the line appears to be a common one in much music of the period, from several countries. Ben Stein Burlington, Vt USA Dancers-AT- Compuserve.Com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 19:24:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 22:25:04 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Origins of Playford Tunes To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <199807102225_MC2-52CD-F765-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message text written by Tom Goodale: >Hi, I recently bought a CD of fifteenth century dance music, and one tune, 'L= a Bouree', by Michael Praetorius, dated 1612, starts off just like The Health, moves into Parson's Farewell, and then finishes with The Health again. So my question is, does anyone know if the Playford tunes are derived from this, or if both draw on other music common at the time ? Tom < Yes, and yes. VERY common. Viola da gamba teacher Grace Feldman of New Haven, CT, has compiled a listing of all known composers of "Playford" tunes, with cross references to operas, ballads, and other English and Continental sources. She's listed in the CDSS directory if you wish to write to her. Gene Murrow EC Dancer and Musician, who sometimes dusts off his musicology degree and= puts it to hopefully helpful use... ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 04:29:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: philippe.callens-AT- uia.ua.ac.be Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 13:30:54 +0200 From: Philippe Callens Subject: Christopher Shaw's address To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <35A9EFEE.1605-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can anyone provide me with Christopher Shuldham-Shaw's address? Philippe Callens ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 04:44:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: philippe.callens-AT- uia.ua.ac.be Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 13:46:41 +0200 From: Philippe Callens Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <35A9F3A1.237D-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: The pre-1651 origins of the material in the English Dancing Master (1651) is an interesting subject, one that I feel deserves more research. When John Playford published his EDM, the contents was the result of ongoing evolution that had started about a hundred years earlier. Both native English elements and influences from abroad (especially Italian) can be noticed. Who on this list can add to this? For your information, the tune for Parson's Farewell was also published in the Netherlands: Amsterdam 1621 and Haarlem 1626. Dean-Smith's facsimile is still a valuable source for this sort of information as is "The Playford Ball". There you can find for example that (part of) the tunes for Grimstock, Broom the bonny broom, Dargason and Gathering Peascods have older origins. I'd like to add an example of a Playford tune that has a continental origin, i.e. the tune for the dance Mundesse, also in the first edition. Mundesse is really Mon desir (basse dance), a dance tune written and published by Tielman Susato in Antwerp in his "Danserye" in 1551, that's exactly a hundred years before its use in the EDM. In those hundred years, several rhythmic and melodic changes have occured, but the tune is still very recognizable. This has been pointed out to me by Francois Van Laecke, a Belgian musician, dancer and school teacher. Philippe Callens Antwerp, Belgium ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 06:20:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 09:14:27 -0400 From: solweber-AT- juno.com (sol weber) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: REALLY round dances To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980713.091638.3678.126.solweber-AT- juno.com> References: <19980624.215738.13926.31.solweber-AT- juno.com> <359ED65E.9B9-AT- ix.netcom.com> Thanks for the info \+++++Sol "Roundman" Weber --- "So many rounds, so little time" ++++++25-14 37th St, Astoria, NY 11103; 718-278-4389 (after 11am) +++++Urgent message? If no immediate response, please phone. _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 11:50:33 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 14:46:04 -0400 From: solweber-AT- juno.com (sol weber) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980713.144609.3678.146.solweber-AT- juno.com> References: <199807081633_MC2-528A-CE47-AT- compuserve.com> Yes, Susan has correctly described the lovely scenery in all directions, but more importantly, the town of Mendocino is a good place to pick up some GREAT T-SHIRTS!! (First things first). \+++++Sol "Roundman" Weber --- "So many rounds, so little time" ++++++25-14 37th St, Astoria, NY 11103; 718-278-4389 (after 11am) +++++Urgent message? If no immediate response, please phone. _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 17:04:22 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 20:05:00 -0400 (EDT) From: catdancer-AT- juno.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Who's coming to Mendocino? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980713.200055.6870.12.catdancer-AT- juno.com> References: <01IZ3KRFLDYWA5UDZ4-AT- ssrl.slac.stanford.edu> Dear Alan - I am homesick for Mendocino!! I wish I could be out there with you guys this year! You know I'm there in spirit. Say hi to everyone for me! I'll be thinking about you and the wonderful trees and heavenly music, and.... Hugs - Helen On Tue, 07 Jul 1998 00:03:26 -0700 (PDT) Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing writes: > >Mary -- > >I am! > >-- Alan > > >=============================================================================== > Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU > Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: >650/926-3056 > Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA >94309-0210 >=============================================================================== > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 17:14:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 20:15:23 -0400 (EDT) From: SallenNic-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Christopher Shaw's address To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Philippe, Having tried a number of times to send you e-mails, and always had them returned, I had given up trying to contact you - Belgium doesn't seem to like my messages!!! Anyway, this seemed a good opportunity to resume contact. Christopher B. Shuldham-Shaw's address is:- Holly Cottage, Wiggaton, Ottery St Mary, Devon. EX11 1PY. Tel. 01404 - 814931 Hope that's of use. I much enjoyed your information about Mundesse. Nicolas. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 08:19:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 11:17:08 -0400 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Pinewoods Archives To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199807151119_MC2-5337-414D-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all - I have just returned from Pinewoods - that wonderful haven for ECD folks (and lots of others!) in Plymouth, MA. Over the years Ed Wilfert has gathered information and pictures about the camp's physical make-up, the programs, the staff, crew and of course the dancers/musicians. Currently he is concentrating on the decades of the 40's and 50's. Information gathering is becoming increasingly difficult, because if you were dancing at Pinewoods in the forties, you must be pretty old by now - and you most likely do NOT use computers and email lists etc... Each death in the CDSS community eliminates one potential information source forever. Too many pictures and stories are lost already, because nobody asked for them... Starting with the 70s, the documentation becomes less fragmented. Documentation and 'fleshing out' are most welcome for ANY time period, however. How can you help? If you've been to Pinewoods EVER, you may have photographs, programs, fliers, stories to share. Any documents can be copied at the Archive's expense. If you have really old membership directories of CDSS and mailing lists, perhaps there are names which are local to you and you can check whether the individuals can still be reached and interviewed. If your's is an old established dance community, you may want to ask around for help with this archiving project - lots bits of information are distributed among many individuals... If you are one of the lucky ones who are going to Pinewoods this summer: the Archives are in the right hand corner next to the bookstore-facing door in the camp house. Do have a look! For the time being (until Ed gets his own email) please send email to me. Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 06:23:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 06:33:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980716133301.17930.rocketmail-AT- web2.rocketmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii ---Philippe Callens wrote: > > The pre-1651 origins of the material in the English Dancing Master > (1651) is an interesting subject, one that I feel deserves more > research. When John Playford published his EDM, the contents was the > result of ongoing evolution that had started about a hundred years > earlier. Both native English elements and influences from abroad > (especially Italian) can be noticed. > Who on this list can add to this? This raises a question that I have been wondering about for sometime (at least since last Thursday, when I was interviewed for a local college radio station about our ECD series in Branford, CT and found myself trying to explain the origins of English Country dancing). Where did Playford get his material for the _English Dancing Master_? I don't mean how did the dances themselves originate. I've seen enough of that discussion to have some idea both of the answers and the controversy on the subject. I want to know how Playford himself found the dances for his book. According to the one book I've read on the subject, _A Time to Dance_, prior to Playford the way country dances were done was for the local fiddler to simply string together a series of figures to whatever tune he was playing (remarkably like the "origins of square dancing" according to the same book), and that Playford was the first person to attach particular dances to specific tunes, starting a fad that lasted the next two centuries. I find that scenario suspect (and not only because the book is otherwise obviously out of date - it still maintains that Morris dancing is the remnant of an archetypal, preChristian, sacred ritual of which all later dance forms are derivations). So where did John Playford find the dances he published? Did he go out and collect them in the field, a la C. Sharp? Was he a country boy himself and learned them as he grew up? Or, contrary to the myth, were they already being done in London, at hand, so to speak, and he was simply the first person to have the brillaint idea of writing a guide to what was already in style? (Sort of the 1650's version of being the first one to think of writing a guide to the internet). Anybody got educated answers, or can point me to publications on the subject a little more up-to-date (and available to non-specialists)? Thanks for any info. Barbara Ruth _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 07:30:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 09:29:08 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <980716092908.22b2-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> With all due respect, the book, A Time to Dance, should not be considered a reasonable, scholarly work of any sort. It is more a popular memoir. Use the information there at your own risk, or only after establishing, by your own vigorous efforts, that the ideas are trustworthy. I have fought this book from the first time I read it. I regret that it has become accepted into the mainstream of dance scholarship by researchers who should know better. If this stirs up a controversy, so be it. I am fanatical about few things-- and this is one of them. Forbes/Baker University ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:00:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 11:01:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, Barbara Ruth wrote: > ---Philippe Callens wrote: > > > > The pre-1651 origins of the material in the English Dancing Master > > (1651) is an interesting subject, one that I feel deserves more > > research. When John Playford published his EDM, the contents was the > > result of ongoing evolution that had started about a hundred years > > earlier. Both native English elements and influences from abroad > > (especially Italian) can be noticed. > > Who on this list can add to this? This is a subject that has intrigued me, too. Some of Barbara Ruth's comments: . . . > Where did Playford get his material for the _English Dancing Master_? > I don't mean how did the dances themselves originate. I've seen > enough of that discussion to have some idea both of the answers and > the controversy on the subject. I want to know how Playford himself > found the dances for his book. According to the one book I've read on > the subject, _A Time to Dance_, . . . [details snipped out] I find that > scenario suspect . . . I share Barbara's suspicion here. Playford is clearly describing a well-developed activity -- the dances are sophisticated, they share common elements in very diverse ways, which suggests to me that this is an activity which had been going on for some time, evolving rather slowly into the form that Playford found it in when he published his first book in 1651. We might assume that the changes that had occurred before 1651 were similar to those that occurred just after, say from 1651 to 1670 or so. I don't recall evidence from Playford's first volume that he was describing something drastically new. What is there seems to me to be consistent with the idea that he has a new audience rather than new material -- he has found the opportunity is ripe to sell dance books to the new holders of power, with the Commonwealth having been established just two years before. If these dances evolved primarily at the court, where dancing lessons were part of one's education, there might not have been much demand for such books, and it would not have been worth the effort to publish them -- and Playford's books definitely give the impression that he (and later, others) were in it for the profit). Publishing capabilities were changing rapidly, too -- compare the quality of the type fonts through the various editions -- so it would be getting easier and easier to produce something of this sort as the technology evolved, and hence more profitable. > So where did John Playford find the dances he published? Did he go > out and collect them in the field, a la C. Sharp? Was he a country > boy himself and learned them as he grew up? Or, contrary to the myth, > were they already being done in London, at hand, so to speak, and he > was simply the first person to have the brillaint idea of writing a > guide to what was already in style? I find this last idea most believable, except that I think he took advantage of the changing political situation as well, which perhaps created rather suddenly a real market for such books. There is considerable evidence suggesting that the dance forms reflect the social situation in which they were done, producing the gradual evolution from many set dances, suitable for rather small, intimate groups as might be found in court settings, to the longways set for as many as will, which came to dominate almost(?) exclusively by about 1700. There seems to be much comment on the political and social scene within the dances themselves, so it doesn't seem far-fetched to view them as a mirror, if a coloured one, of social custom of the time. But the period from 1650 to 1700 is a period of very drastic political change and upheval, and I think the dances reflect this quite clearly. It does not take a drastic stretch of the imagination, I feel, to believe that the dances described by Playford in 1651 had gradually evolved at the English court and perhaps elsewhere from Elizabeth's time, and the presence of some names in the Playford 1st edition which had appeared earlier (e.g. Sellinger's Round, Mundesse, etc.) fits in with this view very readily, even if it cannot prove that there was continuity in more than the name. . . . > Anybody got educated answers, or can point me to publications on the > subject a little more up-to-date (and available to non-specialists)? Maybe not an educated answer, but perhaps at least a somewhat educated guess. It's a fascinating subject, and it would be wonderful to discover more about this period. One wonders how many hand-written dance books might have been lost when the Roundheads burnt so many Royalist houses? Perhaps John Playford might even have gotten his hands on one of these... Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:37:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 11:43:10 -0400 From: paul rosenberg Subject: New Joisey Dances To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <199807161539.LAA06251-AT- Delta.capital.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A musician friend of mine will be in New Jersey (Wildwood Crest area along the shore) this coming Monday night till Friday night. She is an avid pennywhistle jam player, and equally avid as a dancer. Are there any jams or contradances or English country dances during that period? Thanks! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 10:26:12 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 13:26:23 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Digest V1 #394 To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From John Ramsay in St Louis In a message dated 7/16/98 8:02:24 AM, Barbara Ruth wrote: <> My understanding is that Playford was a publisher, certainly not a dancing master himself. He published many types of books. I haven't seen an announcement of the Central Iowa Traditional Dance and Music Festival in Ames Sept 18-20 on this network. Enid Cocke, Ted Hodapp and I will be staffing it. I'll be giving one session on Set Running to Contemporary, one on Performance dancing, and one on Danish dances. In addition I'll give a Saturday luncheon demo about how dances reflect societies. Contact by e-mail is either lindasuzan-AT- aol.com or annie-AT- eai.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 00:26:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 03:24:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Dawn Culbertson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, Eric Arnold wrote: > On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, Barbara Ruth wrote: > > > ---Philippe Callens wrote: > > > > > > The pre-1651 origins of the material in the English Dancing Master > > > (1651) is an interesting subject, one that I feel deserves more > > > research. When John Playford published his EDM, the contents was the > > > result of ongoing evolution that had started about a hundred years > > > earlier. Both native English elements and influences from abroad > > > (especially Italian) can be noticed. > > > Who on this list can add to this? > > > Playford is clearly describing a > well-developed activity -- the dances are sophisticated, they share common > elements in very diverse ways, which suggests to me that this is an > activity which had been going on for some time, evolving rather slowly > into the form that Playford found it in when he published his first book > in 1651. If you look at several of the dances from Caroso and Negri's manuals of 1600 and 1601, and at the dances described in Thoinot Arbeau's Orchesography (1588), a number of them contain elements that have come to be associated with English dance - rights and lefts, heys, double and single steps, etc. Also, the Inns of Court books from early 17th century England give instructions for dances that are along the same lines. This is a subject that very little research to date has been done on, unfortunately, and I'm not an expert myself, but Playford's dances certainly seem to have evolved from an established tradition. The question no one has definitely figured out to date is where the tradition started. Dawn Culbertson dcculb-AT- peabody.jhu.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 09:29:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 14:00:42 -0230 (NDT) From: Margaret Connors Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: (long) Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199807171630.OAA15532-AT- cerberus.ucs.mun.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Greetings to All! What was intended as a shorter post got out of hand! ;-) A clue to Playford's sources lies in his explanation of why he published "The English Dancing Master" when he did. In November 1650 he sought a license to publish this book "knowing the Times and the Nature do not agree". (Charles II had signed Scotland's Covenants the previous June and would shortly be crowned at Scone. Cromwell's army had won a major battle at Dunbar in August and was now occupying Edinburgh. The battle at Worchester would be fought the following August.) Playford's reason for publication at this time was that "there was a false and surreptitious copy at the Public Presse, which if it had been published would have been a disparagement to the Professors thereof and a hinderance to the hearer." Playford would not have had very far to go to find his Professors. Prior to the Commonwealth, Playford was a bookseller with a shop "in the Inner Temple near the Church door". The Inns of Court (Middle Temple, Inner Temple, Gray's Inn and Lincoln's Inn), schools for the law and civil service, included music and dancing in the curriculum. The emphasis on dance was well known, "No law studied in the Inns of Court, now all turned to dancing schools." The Inns of Court were still famous for dancing during the Protectorate. Roger North (a Royalist) reported that his brother Francis (later keeper of the Great Seal to Charles II and James II) when attending the Middle Temple in 1655/56 avoided dancing and dancing schools for fear that bad company would lead to ruin. Publishing prior to the Commonwealth was controlled by Royal monopoly. This did not appear to affect the publication of books, but it did affect that of music. With the exception of the early years of the reign of James I, little music was published during the time of the Stuarts. Manuscript was the prefered format. This changed during the Commonwealth. A license to publish was still required, but the monopoly was abolished. The market targetted by Playford was that of the amateur musician. About the same time he was busy with "The English Dancing Master" he was preparing "A Musicall Banquet" (first published in 1651, later expanded to two volumes) with sections on theory, lyra-viol music, two part consort music etc. He published easy music that amateurs could play, in notation that was easy to read. He also published books on theory, the writing of music and tutors for various instruments. Playford was an amateur musician himself and composed many tunes for Psalms, a glee "Comly Swain, why sitt'st thou so" that attained pop status and a handbook, intended for amateurs, on the theory of music. Always the businessman, his publications contained ads for various music teachers, including in "Select Ayres and Dialogues" one for his wife's school in Islington where "young gentlewomen might be instructed in ... dancing". With respect to sources for the music: Thomas Mace, a contemporary musician, noted that the "common tunes" of "The Dancing Master" could be traced back to Elizabethan and Jacobean composers or to famous Italian grounds (Musick's Monument 1676). The "Fitzwilliam Virginal Book" (the manuscript collection of Francis Tregian) contains music for court dances, almains, sarabands, corontos etc. Sellenger's Round (William Byrd) is in this collection as well as many pieces that would be suitable for English country dancing. Very likely there are dances for this music. A substantial number of the highly placed musicians and dancing masters in the households of James I, Charles I and those of their wives and children were French. The tune for "Parson's Farewell" might have come to England by this route. "Terpsichore musarum" published by Michael Praetorius and Pierre-Francisque Caroubel in 1612 was an anthology of music for some 300 dances, many French. Margaret Connors, St. John's, Newfoundland Canada ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 11:26:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 11:24:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: (long) Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980717182451.25966.rocketmail-AT- web4.rocketmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thank you Margaret. That was fascinating and answered my question as to where Playford would have found his material. Could I get the source for that wonderful quote about "no law studied at the Inns of the Court?" Since I now work at a law school, perhaps I can suggest that, following historical precedent, dancing be added to the curriculum here. It would be handy to have the proper documentation to support that. Also, thank you Eric for earlier pointing out the connection between the political situation in England and Playford's publishing activities. Alas for the gaps in my liberal arts education - it had never occured to me to associate what little I recalled of Cromwell - mostly from high school English classes with the particular history of my current favorite past-time (although I did know that he was guilty of causing the destruction of most of the existing Irish harps, a crime against posterity for which alone he deserves eternal infamy!) Now my other question - are there books or publications that anyone can recommend on this subject reasonably accessible to the nonspecialist. I find the cultural context surrounding the dancing fascinating - and anything more on the life of Playford(s). === Barbara Ruth New Haven, CT ---Margaret Connors wrote: > > Greetings to All! > > What was intended as a shorter post got out of hand! ;-) > > A clue to Playford's sources lies in his explanation of why he published > "The English Dancing Master" when he did. > > In November 1650 he sought a license to publish this book "knowing the Times > and the Nature do not agree". (Charles II had signed Scotland's Covenants > the previous June and would shortly be crowned at Scone. Cromwell's army > had won a major battle at Dunbar in August and was now occupying Edinburgh. > The battle at Worchester would be fought the following August.) > > Playford's reason for publication at this time was that "there was a false > and surreptitious copy at the Public Presse, which if it had been published > would have been a disparagement to the Professors thereof and a hinderance > to the hearer." > > Playford would not have had very far to go to find his Professors. Prior to > the Commonwealth, Playford was a bookseller with a shop "in the Inner Temple > near the Church door". The Inns of Court (Middle Temple, Inner Temple, > Gray's Inn and Lincoln's Inn), schools for the law and civil service, > included music and dancing in the curriculum. The emphasis on dance was > well known, "No law studied in the Inns of Court, now all turned to dancing > schools." > > The Inns of Court were still famous for dancing during the Protectorate. > Roger North (a Royalist) reported that his brother Francis (later keeper of > the Great Seal to Charles II and James II) when attending the Middle Temple > in 1655/56 avoided dancing and dancing schools for fear that bad company > would lead to ruin. > > Publishing prior to the Commonwealth was controlled by Royal monopoly. This > did not appear to affect the publication of books, but it did affect that of > music. With the exception of the early years of the reign of James I, > little music was published during the time of the Stuarts. Manuscript was > the prefered format. This changed during the Commonwealth. A license to > publish was still required, but the monopoly was abolished. > The market targetted by Playford was that of the amateur musician. About > the same time he was busy with "The English Dancing Master" he was preparing > "A Musicall Banquet" (first published in 1651, later expanded to two > volumes) with sections on theory, lyra-viol music, two part consort music > etc. He published easy music that amateurs could play, in notation that was > easy to read. He also published books on theory, the writing of music and > tutors for various instruments. > > Playford was an amateur musician himself and composed many tunes for Psalms, > a glee "Comly Swain, why sitt'st thou so" that attained pop status and a > handbook, intended for amateurs, on the theory of music. Always the > businessman, his publications contained ads for various music teachers, > including in "Select Ayres and Dialogues" one for his wife's school in > Islington where "young gentlewomen might be instructed in ... dancing". > > With respect to sources for the music: > > Thomas Mace, a contemporary musician, noted that the "common tunes" of "The > Dancing Master" could be traced back to Elizabethan and Jacobean composers > or to famous Italian grounds (Musick's Monument 1676). > > The "Fitzwilliam Virginal Book" (the manuscript collection of Francis > Tregian) contains music for court dances, almains, sarabands, corontos etc. > Sellenger's Round (William Byrd) is in this collection as well as many > pieces that would be suitable for English country dancing. Very likely > there are dances for this music. > > A substantial number of the highly placed musicians and dancing masters in > the households of James I, Charles I and those of their wives and children > were French. The tune for "Parson's Farewell" might have come to England by > this route. "Terpsichore musarum" published by Michael Praetorius and > Pierre-Francisque Caroubel in 1612 was an anthology of music for some 300 > dances, many French. > > > Margaret Connors, > St. John's, Newfoundland > Canada > > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 11:29:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 14:29:23 +0000 (BRITAIN) From: HUGH-AT- SDL.UG.EDS.COM Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: "National Training Programme" (long, sorry about that) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01IZL6H4V4JM003TR8-AT- SDL.UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT The EFDSS have a thing called the National Training Programme which has long made me a bit uncomfortable, but I find it hard to say why, and harder still to say what they should do instead. Maybe someone out there can come up with better answers that I can. First the background; there are a variety of influences pushing this cause: A desire for people to dance "better" A demand for "certificates"; from people who want a feeling of achievement from bean-counters who give grants for worthy causes who want to feel that their grant delivered something (10 people now qualified to referee youth football matches or whatever) from teachers who collect subsidiary qualifications (life-saving so they can take swimming classes) from bean counters who organise evening classes who want proof that someone can do the job -- in this case run a dance Anyway a group (of mostly ex-teachers, of which some read this mailing list) have got together and organised this here National Training Programme. This is basically a series of "Modules" and various "Levels". The theory is that a Module is 12 hours training, variously as a term's worth of 2 hours once a week, over a dance-weekend, or three Sunday afternoon sessions. Level 1 is intended to be introductory, ungraded, with a "certificate of attendance". Level 2 is graded at pass/fail (I think) and intended to be such that anyone keen will pass. Level 3 is aimed at club leaders, and levels 4 and 5 are mentioned, but I have no idea what they are intended to be, and I am not sure that anyone has really thought them through yet. (The whole scheme was only invented a few years ago, and the presumption is that you do levels successively so if you do one a year you would probably not have got to level 4 yet.) (There are various government schemes that say if you go to respectable evening classes for 50 years then you qualify for half a degree or a tax rebate or something; the hope is that if we can make this scheme look serious enough then it can be graded "respectable". As you can tell I am a bit hazy about the details.) Modules are in a variety of topics - Playford, American, Clog and Running Set that I remember, and possibly others too. The official EFDSS position on all this is cautious approval, the National Council is clearly ambivalent, correctly reflecting my position. At the last AGM those people who had run training sessions were formally awarded certificates of "ability to teach XXX"; apart from that the central EFDSS organisation mostly keeps the whole scheme at arms length. Why am I ambivalent? Well, for the scheme we have:- I want people I dance with to be better dancers. (Why not be purely selfish here?) People who "go on a course" will probably pay more attention and be more open to being corrected that those who simply turn up to a dance club. Some people like the incentive of a gold star to push them into things. Someone labelled as "an EFDSS trainer" will get more respect (= attention) than mere John Smith "renowned expert". Against there are three categories, the general principal, the structure and the implementation. Many people like the open, inclusive, non-competitive ethos of the folk dance scene. They feel threatened by the prospect of some people being certified "good dancers" and (by implication) others being "bad dancers". (We can see a range here from Western Club, RSCDS, English to Contra.) (At the last AGM Barbara Kinsman was certified as being able to teach Playford dance; Nic Broadbridge was not, despite having taught Playford at Pinewoods last summer. Hmmm.) A specific issue that the organisers are well aware of, and take care to avoid is that of dance style. They are demanding that people dance well, but are determinedly not prescribing any standard style. Maybe it is inevitable that a bunch of teachers will try to force-fit things into some structured examinable framework, but I don't think that a village social dance (Running Set) and a semi-professional display dance (Clog) can fit in the same scheme -- after 12 hours you should be pretty competent at Running Set, but a beginner at Clog. I don't think a level 3 Running Set would be practicable. The main problem with the current implementation is that the people organising it are trying to maintain too much control. I think anyone who tries to organise a "National" scheme has to accept that it will be out of their control very quickly, but when I looked in to trying to organise a course locally the message was "if you can line up enough punters then we will come and run the course" and not "here is a syllabus, call us if you have any problems". OK, enough of trying to describe where we are. What do I want instead? I think that three levels might make sense, but we should label them by what people want. My Level 1 would be (as the current one) enthusiasm; it would not be very serious, and basically would only amount to someone (typically a club leader) certifying that someone was up to attending some other course. My level 2 would be for particular markets: a teacher wanting to run dance sessions for PE classes someone in a band who had been volunteered to call for said band at PTA / wedding / whatever barn dances a dancer who wanted drilling in their dance style I am not sure whether I would have a level 3 as such, but I think there should be some kind of "how to run a club" course covering things like teaching, organising AGMs and not really much to do with dance at all. This leads on to my questions to the Net oracle:- Should EFDSS (or CDSS) be in the business of organising a formal training scheme? How serious should it be? (Certificates at every level? no level?) How widespread should it be? (All levels? Just club leader level?) How should it be managed/audited? Hugh Stewart Cambridge, UK ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 11:30:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 18 Jul 1998 09:03:54 -0500 (EST) From: Mary Railing Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: Ian Engle Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I know there was an edition of Playford's _The English Dancing Master_ that had extensive notes about the music, with references to related tunes going back to the 1500's. I don't have the reference, but maybe one of the librarians on the list could find it. Ian Engle showed it to me some years ago. --Mary Railing mrailing-AT- kiva.net ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 15:13:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 15:13:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: "National Training Programme" (long, sorry about that) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IZMIG1BMV28WWC3D-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Hugh wrote, after what seemed to me (who hadn't heard anything about this scheme before) like a reasonably balanced exegesis of the situation: ===================== This leads on to my questions to the Net oracle:- Should EFDSS (or CDSS) be in the business of organising a formal training scheme? How serious should it be? (Certificates at every level? no level?) How widespread should it be? (All levels? Just club leader level?) How should it be managed/audited? ===================== My first answer: Lord, No! More considered, and unfortunately much longer: It really depends what you want out of your dance genre and organization. If what you want is for things to be done the same everywhere, so you can go anywhere and fit in, then you need standardization and this means certification. This has worked well for the Modern Western Squares people; my girlfriend's parents have done that for a long time, and they have stories about going to conventions and dancing successfully with (for example) groups of Japanese people who speak no English other than the Mainstream, Plus, and Advanced level calls. I've heard similar success stories of RSCDS interchangeability. To get the interchangeability you have to have classes, not dances or dance parties, and you certify both dancers and leaders. This requires people to commit to attending the classes, and separates the classes from the dance parties. If you want to start RSCDS-style dancing or MWSD dancing in a new place, you must find a certificated teacher and enough people who are willing to commit to the classes to make it worth holding them. People can't start doing the non-class fun part until a critical mass of trained dancers has been reached; this makes it very hard to jumpstart unless you have enough people who were already qualified when they moved to the place. Standardized transferable skills are useful in an age of social and physical mobility, which (I think) is part of why MWSD got so very big in the US soon after WWII, when the GI Bill sent many first-men-in-their-family-ever-to-go- to-college off to schools away from their home communities, national and multinational corporations transferred their employees willy-nilly every few years, and neighborhood-based community started to disintegrate. In those circumstances, it's good to know that if you have your Plus certificate, you can find a Plus-level dance wherever you go, meet the people who do it and have at least that much in common with them, and you wouldn't have to learn anything more or risk failure or embarassment by going. So you get a cohort of people who are motivated to put in the time and get the certificates and they tend to stick around and grow old together. If the motivations to put in the time disappear for whatever reason -- people stop moving around as much, other kinds of interest groups appear with smaller time investments, swing dancing gets big and young people who are willing to take classes and dress up for dancing go and do that instead -- your whole cohort can grow old and die, taking the dance genre with it. (This can also happen for other reasons than classes and certifications, of course.) [Just as a side note, it appears that the way typical ECD and contra dances are managed in the US differs considerably from the dance-club model in the UK, which more closely resembles how MWSD groups run in the US. Here, some local person or groups sponsors a dance series every Wednesday or alternate Wednesdays or some such, and anyone who's interested may turn up at the time, pay at the door, and get in. Caller/leaders can't tell in advance what the level of experience is going to be, and are expected to get a sense of the crowd and tailor their programs and amount/level of teaching so that the evening works for whoever actually turns up. I gather the UK dance-club model is more that a bunch of interested people buy memberships and then they're more-or-less expected to turn up every time; don't know whether drop-ins are at all welcome without some prior arrangement. There are clearly some benefits and drawbacks to both arrangements.] Without certification, anybody with a cassette player and an instruction book can start an ECD or contra dance series. If they're no good and don't improve, the series will eventually fail. I think this model is better for the long term survival of these dance genres or their direct successors. There's no bureaucratic bar to starting from scratch, dance organizers and leaders can respond nimbly to local conditions, and dancers can be recruited to just drop in and try it once, which has to be easier than finding them in groups of even multiples of 8 for ten weeks at a time. People who move around find that there's some regional variation in how dances are done. I think that's a benefit, since it adds flavor, and from an evolutionary standpoint makes survival likelier -- the fittest mutation can't survive if there's no mutation allowed. I think all these genres have evolved the way they have for various reasons, and that trying to pick up a form and plop it into a different ecological niche, especially one already occupied by a group that's having problems (MWSD; I'm under the impression RSCDS is thriving, but don't actually know), is a Bad Idea. Some other points: I'm not sure I'm in favor of teaching ECD and contra in schools, especially not as part of PE. The movement toward teaching square dancing in US schools turned a lot of people off of traditional dance; how will a certification that one has met the minimum technical requirements to teach a dance prove that one can effectively inspire children to approach that dance with enthusiasm and a sense of fun, which is at least as important as a technical qualification? Let's get sex education out of the schools and back in the gutters where it belongs. (Oops, wrong argument.) If teacher certification is taken at all seriously by employers / dance bookers, then anyone who wishes not to restrict his or her employment opportunities will have to get certified, giving the certifying body more power and authority than the scheme deserves on its merits. The argument that clueless or unconnected bookers could be sure not to hire total duds if they stuck to the certified people has only a teeny bit of merit. Certification won't -- can't -- tell you if these people are going to be any fun, how flexible they are with the crowd that actually turns up, and so on. It _will_ tend to stifle innovation. Around here, a series or camp/festival organizer is expected to develop enough of a network of spies that he or she can get field reports on how good out-of-town callers are and whether they're worth booking. Finally, a parallel I just thought of and think is interesting. If my facts are wrong please correct me, and I don't mean to slam anybody. The Roman Catholic Church qualifies and ordains priests, and has the right to assign them wherever it thinks appropriate, and to defrock or even excommunicate them if they deviate very far from Church doctrine or policy. The individual congregation has little to say about who gets assigned to them or how well he meets their needs. Judaism has a decentralized model, where religious training is accomplished at a few schools (like Yeshiva University), and congregations hire their own rabbis, based on how good a match that person is for their needs, and renew the arrangements based on how happy they are. ECD as it's handled now is rather more like the Jewish model, and I personally prefer it that way. Whew! -- Alan, just back from Mendocino =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 15:40:19 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 15:40:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Tempo for "Dorset Triumph", among other things To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IZMMDBIUW48WWC3D-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Folks -- I'm just back from the Mendocino dance camp, where I took Gene Murrow's brilliant class on musicianship for English Country Dance Leaders. (I'm pleased to report that in Barbara Greenberg & Liz Dreisbach's dance band workshop, what they told musicians to expect from callers was the same as what Gene was telling callers we should provide to musicians, so there's independent confirmation of the validity of the material. Do I need put a smiley in there?) Anyway, one of the most vexing questions is setting the tempo for dances, especially ones you haven't already danced yourself. One piece of Gene's advice was to look at the figures for bits that require a specific speed: setting steps, slipping circles, etc. (In another part of the class, we mapped out how long certain figures take in certain meters; in duple time, a set right and left is two measures, for example.) Last night I was thinking about the Dorset Triumph, which is in CDM. I've called this dance several times, generally with pleasing results. What I found the first time I did it was that if it's played so that the As (2nd corners set and turn single to place, 1st corners the same) are at normal speed, the rest of the dance is much too fast for comfort. Now I set the tempo based on the B and C parts, and the As seem very slow. Looking at CDM, I see a note that says care must be taken in selecting a tempo so that it's neither too slow for comfort nor too fast for dignity. With Gene's class in mind, I think the problem derives from a bad fit of figure to music in the A part. There's four measures to set and four for a relaxed turn single to place; you could actually do all that in half the music (as in the B part of Guid Man of Ballangigh). Here are some options for dealing with this. o Don't play the repeat on the A music. o Play the As fast and the rest slow (if you could find a band anywhere that would be willing to do this). o Fiddle with the figure. Make that set a step and honor right and left (which actually fits the storyline of the dance reasonably well), make it a slow set that takes two measures to go each direction, steal slip-jig setting and make it two to the right and two to the left. o Point out the problem to the dancers and make it an opportunity for improvisation. The last choice is my favorite. I'm curious about what other people on the list who have danced the dance have done, and whether there are other solutions I'm missing, or if someone can point out a mistake in my interpretation of the dance. Thanks! -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 22:25:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 22:21:27 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "National Training Programme" (long, sorry about that) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 20 Jul 1998, Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote: > Finally, a parallel I just thought of and think is interesting. If my facts > are wrong please correct me, and I don't mean to slam anybody. The Roman > Catholic Church qualifies and ordains priests, and has the right to assign them > wherever it thinks appropriate, and to defrock or even excommunicate them if > they deviate very far from Church doctrine or policy. The individual > congregation has little to say about who gets assigned to them or how well he > meets their needs. Judaism has a decentralized model, where religious training > is accomplished at a few schools (like Yeshiva University), and congregations > hire their own rabbis, based on how good a match that person is for their > needs, and renew the arrangements based on how happy they are. ECD as it's > handled now is rather more like the Jewish model, and I personally prefer it > that way. Wow -- that's some analogy, Alan, and I think you're right on the money. Never thought I'd see Judaism and ECD in the same sentence, but the world is filled with surprises! I agree with virtually everything Alan's said in his posting. And I'd add that if one wanted to see the ECD movement disappear within a generation, a "certification" scheme like this would be a jolly good way to do it. Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 07:32:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 10:30:11 -0400 From: Daniel Walkowitz Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "National Training Programme" (long, sorry about that) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980721103011.006a18d8-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ah, to reinvent the wheel. Good olde Cecil fought long, hard (and a bit ungentlemanly), especially against Mary Neal, to sustain such a certificate system with him as the high priest. They did, though, have somewhat different notions of what constituted a 'proper' dance style. Cecil won, though it is worth noting that Duncan Kennedy in his history of EFDSS claims he and his 'mates' (a majority of whom were undoubtedly female) came by the mid-thirties to 'recognize' that Neal was 'right'. Sharp's styling had left, so it was felt, the spirit and energy of the dance behind in overemphasis on 'style.' The transformative event is reported to be the 1935[?] International Dance Festival organized and held by EFDSS at Cecil Sharp House where the English marvelled at the energy, enthusiasm and joy exhibited by the European folk dance groups. Kennedy says EFDSS then set out to inject some of that spirit into their dancing, a characteristic he notes had been encouraged by Neal. None of this is to diminish Sharp's many achievements. It does suggest having a rabbi does not settle rabbinical wars! Two notes. 1. It would be interesting to hear if Peter Kennedy recalls any of this and what his take is on it. 2. For those interested: Sharp's dispute with Neal was couched in terms of style but surely was complicated by several other concerns -- he was desperate for money (especially as he would only travel first class on liners and identified with the very rich) and wanted the gigs which would go to the high priest (i.e., he replaced Neal as head of the Stratford-on-Avon summer school); he also seemed to have a very hard time with outspoken, assertive women -- Neal was a suffragist [As was Sharp's own sister, who was imprisoned and force fed; he was not sympathetic. In America, Sharp does not have kind words either for the suffragists he is told by Helen Storrow dominate Wellseley College where he was to help with the inaugural folk festival in 1915/6.] I am writing this without away from my notes so I may have a few details a bit off, but I think the gist is right. Are we amused? Danny Walkowitz At 03:13 PM 7/20/1998 -0700, you wrote: >Hugh wrote, after what seemed to me (who hadn't heard anything about this >scheme before) like a reasonably balanced exegesis of the situation: > >===================== > This leads on to my questions to the Net oracle:- > > Should EFDSS (or CDSS) be in the business of organising a formal training > scheme? > > How serious should it be? (Certificates at every level? no level?) > > How widespread should it be? (All levels? Just club leader level?) > > How should it be managed/audited? >===================== > >My first answer: Lord, No! > >More considered, and unfortunately much longer: > >It really depends what you want out of your dance genre and organization. If >what you want is for things to be done the same everywhere, so you can go >anywhere and fit in, then you need standardization and this means >certification. This has worked well for the Modern Western Squares people; my >girlfriend's parents have done that for a long time, and they have stories >about going to conventions and dancing successfully with (for example) groups >of Japanese people who speak no English other than the Mainstream, Plus, and >Advanced level calls. I've heard similar success stories of RSCDS >interchangeability. > >To get the interchangeability you have to have classes, not dances or dance >parties, and you certify both dancers and leaders. > >This requires people to commit to attending the classes, and separates the >classes from the dance parties. If you want to start RSCDS-style dancing or >MWSD dancing in a new place, you must find a certificated teacher and enough >people who are willing to commit to the classes to make it worth holding them. >People can't start doing the non-class fun part until a critical mass of >trained dancers has been reached; this makes it very hard to jumpstart unless >you have enough people who were already qualified when they moved to the place. > >Standardized transferable skills are useful in an age of social and physical >mobility, which (I think) is part of why MWSD got so very big in the US soon >after WWII, when the GI Bill sent many first-men-in-their-family-ever-to-go- >to-college off to schools away from their home communities, national and >multinational corporations transferred their employees willy-nilly every few >years, and neighborhood-based community started to disintegrate. In those >circumstances, it's good to know that if you have your Plus certificate, you >can find a Plus-level dance wherever you go, meet the people who do it and have >at least that much in common with them, and you wouldn't have to learn anything >more or risk failure or embarassment by going. > >So you get a cohort of people who are motivated to put in the time and get the >certificates and they tend to stick around and grow old together. If the >motivations to put in the time disappear for whatever reason -- people stop >moving around as much, other kinds of interest groups appear with smaller time >investments, swing dancing gets big and young people who are willing to take >classes and dress up for dancing go and do that instead -- your whole cohort >can grow old and die, taking the dance genre with it. (This can also happen for >other reasons than classes and certifications, of course.) > >[Just as a side note, it appears that the way typical ECD and contra dances are >managed in the US differs considerably from the dance-club model in the UK, >which more closely resembles how MWSD groups run in the US. Here, some local >person or groups sponsors a dance series every Wednesday or alternate >Wednesdays or some such, and anyone who's interested may turn up at the time, >pay at the door, and get in. Caller/leaders can't tell in advance what the >level of experience is going to be, and are expected to get a sense of the >crowd and tailor their programs and amount/level of teaching so that the >evening works for whoever actually turns up. I gather the UK dance-club model >is more that a bunch of interested people buy memberships and then they're >more-or-less expected to turn up every time; don't know whether drop-ins are at >all welcome without some prior arrangement. There are clearly some benefits >and drawbacks to both arrangements.] > >Without certification, anybody with a cassette player and an instruction book >can start an ECD or contra dance series. If they're no good and don't improve, >the series will eventually fail. I think this model is better for the long >term survival of these dance genres or their direct successors. There's no >bureaucratic bar to starting from scratch, dance organizers and leaders can >respond nimbly to local conditions, and dancers can be recruited to just drop >in and try it once, which has to be easier than finding them in groups of >even multiples of 8 for ten weeks at a time. > >People who move around find that there's some regional variation in how dances >are done. I think that's a benefit, since it adds flavor, and from an >evolutionary standpoint makes survival likelier -- the fittest mutation can't >survive if there's no mutation allowed. > >I think all these genres have evolved the way they have for various reasons, >and that trying to pick up a form and plop it into a different ecological >niche, especially one already occupied by a group that's having problems (MWSD; >I'm under the impression RSCDS is thriving, but don't actually know), is a Bad >Idea. > >Some other points: I'm not sure I'm in favor of teaching ECD and contra in >schools, especially not as part of PE. The movement toward teaching square >dancing in US schools turned a lot of people off of traditional dance; how will >a certification that one has met the minimum technical requirements to teach a >dance prove that one can effectively inspire children to approach that dance >with enthusiasm and a sense of fun, which is at least as important as a >technical qualification? Let's get sex education out of the schools and back >in the gutters where it belongs. (Oops, wrong argument.) > >If teacher certification is taken at all seriously by employers / dance >bookers, then anyone who wishes not to restrict his or her employment >opportunities will have to get certified, giving the certifying body more power >and authority than the scheme deserves on its merits. > >The argument that clueless or unconnected bookers could be sure not to hire >total duds if they stuck to the certified people has only a teeny bit of merit. >Certification won't -- can't -- tell you if these people are going to be any >fun, how flexible they are with the crowd that actually turns up, and so on. >It _will_ tend to stifle innovation. Around here, a series or camp/festival >organizer is expected to develop enough of a network of spies that he or she >can get field reports on how good out-of-town callers are and whether they're >worth booking. > >Finally, a parallel I just thought of and think is interesting. If my facts >are wrong please correct me, and I don't mean to slam anybody. The Roman >Catholic Church qualifies and ordains priests, and has the right to assign them >wherever it thinks appropriate, and to defrock or even excommunicate them if >they deviate very far from Church doctrine or policy. The individual >congregation has little to say about who gets assigned to them or how well he >meets their needs. Judaism has a decentralized model, where religious training >is accomplished at a few schools (like Yeshiva University), and congregations >hire their own rabbis, based on how good a match that person is for their >needs, and renew the arrangements based on how happy they are. ECD as it's >handled now is rather more like the Jewish model, and I personally prefer it >that way. > > >Whew! > >-- Alan, just back from Mendocino > > > >=========================================================================== ==== > Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU > Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 > Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 >=========================================================================== ==== > > > Daniel J. Walkowitz Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University New York, New York 10003-6607 tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 12:26:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 12:26:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: (Fwd from Michael Barraclough) C# vs. EFDS To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IZNURMN6WO8WWAI5-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII From: Michael Barraclough Subject: C# v EFDS Daniel Walkowitz wrote: > > Ah, to reinvent the wheel. Good olde Cecil fought long, hard (and a > bit ungentlemanly), especially against Mary Neal, to sustain such a > certificate system with him as the high priest. They did, though, > have somewhat different notions of what constituted a 'proper' dance > style. Cecil won, though it is worth noting that Duncan Kennedy in > his history of EFDSS claims he and his 'mates' (a majority of whom > were undoubtedly female) came by the mid-thirties to 'recognize' that > Neal was 'right'. Very interesting. This puts more "meat" on some "bones" that I was vaguely aware of. I think it is important to distinguish between C# the person and EFDS (as it was then) the organisation. In a lecture to a group of school teachers in 1923 C# was bemoaning the fact that he had decided that his original views on siding were almost certainly wrong but that the EFDS was unprepared to change. (In fact there is clear evidence from his lecture notes that he believed that what is now often called Shaw siding or siding into line was the correct way to interpreet the figure.) This is a clear example of organisational imperatives creating stagnation. By then all the classes, syllabi (buses if you prefer) and trained teachers were in place and to change what was to be taught was more trouble than it was worth. A change could also be seen to question the validity of what was being taught. He may have been the high priest but in the end I suspect more of a president as opposed to a chief executive. Michael Barraclough /NOSIG =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 14:13:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 14:22:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: high priests, rabbis, and a modest proposal (was National Training etc) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980721212210.28773.rocketmail-AT- web2.rocketmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii ---Daniel Walkowitz wrote: > > Ah, to reinvent the wheel. Good olde Cecil fought long, hard (and a bit > ungentlemanly), especially against Mary Neal, to sustain such a certificate > system with him as the high priest. .....cut......... None of this is to diminish Sharp's > many achievements. It does suggest having a rabbi does not settle > rabbinical wars! Keep in mind there are major differences between a high priest and a rabbi. The major changes that Judiasm went through around the beginning of the Common Era marked the transition from a priestly tradition (i.e. focus on ritual) to a rabbincal one (focus on the interpretation of text) - not effected without its own internecine struggles. >2. For those interested: Sharp's dispute with Neal was couched in >terms > of style but surely was complicated by several other concerns etc. ; >he also seemed to have a very hard time > with outspoken, assertive women -- etc. The battle between Cecil Sharpe and Mary Neal and the neglect of her importance and contributions that resulted, was detailed in one of CDSS' monographs (I'm sure Steve or Caroline can point out the relevent issue for interested parties) the first one I received after joining, still new to the Dance Scene and naively unaware that there could be anything controversial to "folkdancing". HA! It's also discussed at length in _The Imagined Village_ along with the very reasonable surmise that Cecil had the advantage in the battle because he was a man going against a woman. Bringing the story back up reminds me of an idea that struck me when reading the book, as a way of redressing somewhat the score. If Pinewoods goes ahead and builds the new pavilion they were talking about last summer, it seems to me that it ought to be named for Mary Neal. It would be only just. Barbara Ruth _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free -AT- yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1998 13:58:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1998 16:58:29 -0400 (EDT) From: "David R. Woolf" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dummer's Reel To: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Does anyone have the directions for Dummer's Reel? Private e-mail responses would be fine. Thank you. -D ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ David Woolf Emory Eye Center W - 404/778-4121 Emory University H - 404/634-0607 Atlanta, GA 30322 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1998 18:15:38 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1998 21:14:58 -0400 (EDT) From: BHFrancis-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Tempo for "Dorset Triumph", among other things To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: BHFrancis-AT- aol.com Message-ID: <9918f484.35b68e93-AT- aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Alan inquires about the tempo and timing for Dorset Triumph, one of my favorite dances -- If you take another look at the music, you'll see that the corners have two bars to set and two bars to turn single, which is the usual amount of music. There is no need to fiddle with the choreography, which is pretty swell just the way it is. The tempo should be fairly slow and feel like a traditional hornpipe so that when you are doing a walking step there is some bounce and swagger to it. I'm going out on a limb here, not being a musician myself, but I suspect that Paul Friedman, my favorite player of traditional tunes for morris, sword and country dance in NYC plays this tune with a more syncopated feel than the notes actually would appear to have as written on the page -- which lends to the swaggering effect. If the tune starts to feel like a morris tune, it's headed in the right direction. Lots of dancers have a feeling of uneasiness in doing setting to a hornpipe kind of tune, but if you are relaxed and bouncy, setting does fit the tune nicely. Beverly Francis ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 08:34:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 11:31:47 -0400 From: Colin Hume <100116.165-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: National Training Programme To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199807231134_MC2-53EA-5D04-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hugh Stewart has done a good job of summarising the EFDSS training programme, but as one of the people helping to run it (and _not_ a school-teacher) I would like to make a few points! In particular, for such a scheme to have any credibility we need some way of establishing that different groups of people will run courses to the same standard, so each time a course is run (except the first, of course) we are insisting that one of the leaders has already run the course before. For instance, I haven't yet run a Playford module, but I will be helping to run one soon with two other people who have already run one, and I can then run the module myself and bring in additional leaders who will then be qualified. We're certainly not objecting to Hugh running courses, provided he first undertakes one in conjunction with an existing leader. We are all in favour of spreading the training scheme wide. Other people commenting on Hugh's post seem to have taken more extreme views against the training programme. We certainly never intended the standardisation that you find in MWSD or RSCDC - our motto is "Standards without standardisation", and one of the reasons we always have at least two tutors is to show that different people can do things different ways. I doubt that people who have danced to my calling would see me as a bastion of standardisation. We accept that many people (probably the majority) just want to enjoy their dancing, calling or playing music and aren't interested in certificates, and we have no intention of forcing anyone to go on a course. But we recognise that the standard of these activities in England could be improved, and we know there are people who are keen to learn what more experienced people can teach them. Who would object to (for instance) Bruce Hamilton or Kathy Anderson running a callers course at a dance camp? It seems to be the word "certificate" which gets everyone's backs up. I also don't agree that a Folk Dance Club in England is more akin to a MWSD Club than a US dance series. MWSD has a syllabus, and people sign up for the duration. Folk Dance Clubs have no syllabus, and people come and go as they choose. And, as with a dance series in the States, there are people who turn up week after week because they enjoy it. I've only been to one Club in England where they said it was about time I became a member; usually membership entitles you to cheaper admission and a chance to vote at the AGM, but people are certainly not expected to turn up every time, and a good Club will welcome new members even if this means the standard is likely to fall for a time; they know that without new blood the Club will eventually die off. Again, we don't object to anyone who wants to start their own Dance Club - we would wish them every success - but if they came on a course and learned from some of our mistakes they might have more chance of making a go of it. I really don't believe that good callers will find they're not being booked for Clubs or Festivals because they don't have the necessary bit of paper. And I agree that having the certificate is still no guarantee that the caller is right for the job, any more than a university degree. The Training Programme is in a state of transition at the moment, being transferred from EFDSS to a new organisation called GUSTO - Grand Union Structured Training Organisation. We feel this will give us more leeway to concentrate on producing and running the courses without having to clear everything with the EFDSS administration which takes up time we could be employing more usefully. We'll have a newsletter out by the end of August; email me if you'd like a copy. We're having a fund-raising dance on Saturday August 1st at Saint George's Hall, Blockley, Gloucestershire (preceded by a walk and a cream tea), and our National Gathering (a chance to discuss the Training Programme as well as enjoy a good evening's dancing) on Saturday December 19th - more details later. Colin Hume ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 09:23:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 12:22:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: National Training Programme To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Colin has done a good job explaining what this National Training Programme is about. From across the puddle, and perhaps to some extent in Britain as well, the view seems to be "who needs it?", but Colin gives the impression that perhaps there is some need for something of this sort in Britain; and it would be reassuring to know that the appreciation and level of English Country Dancing in its various forms was as high in its mother country as it is elsewhere. On this side of the puddle we seem to have a situation which at least for the moment seems to be working satisfactorily -- there are a number of recognized leaders of ECD, they are asked to teach at various dance camps and workshops, and courses in dance leadership are available (not always as readily available as some would like, as it turns out) for up-and-coming leaders to learn from, and there are a fair number of those who want to learn to lead ECD, so it is a fairly healthy situation from that standpoint. But those leaders are very individual, and while there aren't too many direct conflicts, there are many differences in the ways that they approach things. A student does well to sample as many of these teaching and dancing styles as he or she can, and will then form his or her own approach to teaching this material, for better or worse. It is hard to imagine that, even if all of our dance leaders went to a training workshop, that what they would teach subsequently would be particularly uniform from one leader to another, without feeling that much of what each had to offer individually might be at least partally stifled. And at the second level -- if a teacher could be certified by attending a course from any one of these leaders, and could subsequently teach courses to certify others, it seems that either much of the individual's creativity and individuality would be stifled, or the individual courses would soon be very different from each other, and that would soon cause one to question what the certification meant. This isn't to say that there might not _be_ a core of principles on which essentially all of the current leaders could agree, and that this core might not contain some pretty good, perhaps even profound, stuff. But arriving at that doesn't look like an easy job, particularly when you want it to be durable but leave enough flexibility so that those who come in later who weren't included in the original hashing-it-out don't feel excluded from contributing their own points of view and ideas to the process. Doesn't sound like something you want to do with a small committee of self-appointed arbiters of dance style, however good their intents & abilities. Sounds like something which needs to generate broad support among the dance community before it is taken on seriously. But if that could happen, and an essential, solid core of good, basic principles could be worked out and agreed upon, that could potentially be very useful in leadership training. Eric Arnold Ann Arbor sampler of many styles of ECD leadership... ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 09:31:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 12:29:28 -0700 From: "Michael J. O'Connor" Subject: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <35B78F18.15EF-AT- erols.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <19980717182451.25966.rocketmail-AT- web4.rocketmail.com> A few footnotes to this thread, which I excerpt from an essay, "Dance," by Dorothy Olsson, appearing in "A Performer's Guide to Seventeenth- Century Music," S. Carter, ed. (1997), which, for those interested, contains a list of source manuals from 1560 to 1735 from France, Italy, England and Spain: "The boure'e may have originated as a folk dance and may have had connections with the branle; apparently it was danced at French court festivals in the sixteenth century. An early musical setting is found in Praetorius' 'Terpsichore' (1612); interestingly, part of this piece, 'La Boure'e,' is concordant with an English country dance in Playford, 'Parson's Farewell.' [fn] ... There are no extant choreographies before the end of the seventeenth century ...." The footnote adds: "There are other versions of this tune throughout the seventeenth century: a six-part version called the "Bouree d'Avignonne" in the Philidor Collection; a five-part version labeled "Paduana soldat" in Georg Engelmann's "Fasciculus secundus" (1617); a texted setting in Valerius, "Neder-Landsche Gedenck-Clanck" (1626); settings for recorder in Jacob van Eyck, "Der Fluten Lust-Hof" 1648; a version for violins and continuo in Johann Schmeltzer, "Polish Bagpipes" [a truly intriguing title, if ever there was one - doesn't it pique your curiosity?] (end of seventeenth century). See Bernard Thomas, ed., "Playford Dances, vol. 1: 68 Dances" (LPM 102) (Brighton: London Pro Musica Edition, 1994). Also see Dean-Smith--"Playford." " Seems to have been popular. Regarding Barbara Ruth's inquiry, the source listing for the Inns of Court Manuscripts, as they are evidently called, says: "So named because they were written by students from the various law schools. As they served only as aids to memory, they are deficient in technical information and only one includes music, yet they illuminate aspects of ballroom procedures. Descriptions of steps are lacking, but there are choreographies (some quite abbreviated) for such couple dances as pavan, galliard, alman, and measure. The English dances have specific titles, as well as specific choreographies that differ from Arbeau's. [fn]" The footnote refers to two works for modern editions of these dances: Cunningham, "Inns of Court" and Pugliese/Casazza, "Practise." A bit further on, there is an opinion: "Dances such as Arbeau's branles and the English country dances may have been modelled after genuine peasant dances, but it is nearly impossible to trace their origins." And, while it has no direct relevance to subject already adverted to in this thread, I can't resist adding, from a listing of dance types: "Matachin, morris, moresca." Popular throughout Europe between the sixteenth and eighteenth centuries, the matachin was a mock battle dance for a group of men. Arbeau's "Les Bouffons" remains the only known choreography for this skilled sword dance, yet another type was also current. Negri and others allude to grotesque elements in a matachin for fools; this type may have been related to the morris dance or moresca. The moresca, probably from Moorish sources, has an exotic quality. Arbeau recalls seeing moresca dancers with blackened faces, wearing bells attached to leggings; his choreography has heel-beating movements. Some elements are suggestive of the morris dances of England. Arbeau's music for the moresca is in duple meter; Mersenne's moresque in triple meter, but he provides no description." -Mike O'Connor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 09:44:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 09:45:11 -0700 From: dodson-AT- socrates.berkeley.edu (Allen Dodson) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Tempo for "Dorset Triumph", among other things To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I do not normally post to this list, since Alisa is the ECD honcho in our family, but could not resist pointing out that on the recent "Barn Dance" CD by the English Country Dance Band (which features Rod Stradling and other Old Swan Band alumni--buy it, any of you who like English ceilidh stuff!!) the (Dorset) "Triumph" tune is played by two fiddlers with exactly the sort of morris feel Beverly describes--bouncy but not rushed. The liner notes include the instructions for the dance; although I haven't tried dancing the dance to the recording, I'm sure it would be terrific. Knowing Paul Friedman's skill at playing for morris, I'll bet dancing to his playing is terrific as well! best regards Allen Dodson Mayfield Morris and Sword ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 14:31:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 17:31:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Dawn Culbertson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 23 Jul 1998, Michael J. O'Connor wrote: > "Matachin, morris, moresca." Popular throughout Europe between the > sixteenth and eighteenth centuries, the matachin was a mock battle dance > for a group of men. Arbeau's "Les Bouffons" is the only known > choreography for this skilled sword dance Actually, Arbeau says the matachin (also spelled mattachins) could either be done by a group of men or a group of women dressed as Amazons. "Les Bouffons" is the name of the tune Arbeau gives for the dance, not the choreography, and it was apparently a very popular tune because it exists in a number of sources. (Phalese wrote a 4-part setting of it in one of his books of dances, and there's a setting of it for lute in the Scottish Straloch MS, which dates from the early 17th century.) In fact, Arbeau doesn't really give specific choreography for the mattachins; instead, like he does for the galliard in an earlier part of the book, he gives a series of steps and combinations which, presumably, the user of the book could put together as s/he wished. Dawn Culbertson dcculb-AT- peabody.jhu.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 04:31:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: philippe.callens-AT- uia.ua.ac.be Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 13:32:04 +0200 From: Philippe Callens Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <35B870B4.1EB5-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <19980717182451.25966.rocketmail-AT- web4.rocketmail.com> <35B78F18.15EF-AT- erols.com> Michael O'Connor refers to: See Bernard Thomas, ed., "Playford Dances, vol. 1: 68 Dances" (LPM 102) (Brighton: London Pro Musica Edition, 1994). What sort of publication is this? Could you give us some more information? Philippe Callens ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 05:57:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 08:57:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Origins of Playford Tunes (and Dances) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 24 Jul 1998, Philippe Callens wrote: > Michael O'Connor refers to: > > See Bernard Thomas, ed., > "Playford Dances, vol. 1: 68 Dances" (LPM 102) (Brighton: London Pro > Musica Edition, 1994). > > What sort of publication is this? Could you give us some more > information? It's music for certain dances, in four-part settings. Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 07:57:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 15:52:59 +0000 (BRITAIN) From: HUGH-AT- SDL.UG.EDS.COM Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: National Training Programme To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01IZS8VUJ7V6003538-AT- SDL.UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >> The Training Programme is in a state of transition at the moment, being >> transferred from EFDSS to a new organisation called GUSTO - Grand Union >> Structured Training Organisation. We feel this will give us more leeway to >> concentrate on producing and running the courses without having to clear >> everything with the EFDSS administration which takes up time we could be >> employing more usefully. This was news to me -- I knew they were getting frustrated by the abmivalent EFDSS attitude. In some ways this answers my worries -- if Colin wants to award "Playford Diplomas" then I have no rights to complain, whereas as an EFDSS member I am entitled to worry about what is being done in my name. On the other hand there is the question of whether EFDSS (and CDSS) should be trying to encourage "better" dancing; and if so how. Hugh Stewart P.S. Mike Barraclough said (of Cecil Sharp):- >> (In fact there is clear >> evidence from his lecture notes that he believed that what is now often >> called Shaw siding or siding into line was the correct way to interpret >> the figure.) If you read the introduction to the Country Dance Book VI Cecil Sharp says exactly that, with a softening proviso that maybe the way he had suggested was so ingrained that it was too much bother to change it. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1998 07:27:22 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1998 14:58 +0100 From: graham-AT- gcknight.demon.co.uk Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: National Training Programme To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: ----Original Message----- >From: HUGH-AT- SDL.UG.EDS.COM >To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU >Subject: Re: National Training Programme >Reply-To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU >Date: 24 July 1998 16:52 > >>> The Training Programme is in a state of transition at the moment, being >>> transferred from EFDSS to a new organisation called GUSTO - Grand Union >>> Structured Training Organisation. We feel this will give us more leeway to >>> concentrate on producing and running the courses without having to clear >>> everything with the EFDSS administration which takes up time we could be >>> employing more usefully. > >This was news to me -- I knew they were getting frustrated by the abmivalent >EFDSS attitude. In some ways this answers my worries -- if Colin wants to >award "Playford Diplomas" then I have no rights to complain, whereas as an >EFDSS member I am entitled to worry about what is being done in my name. > >On the other hand there is the question of whether EFDSS (and CDSS) should >be trying to encourage "better" dancing; and if so how. > >Hugh Stewart > > >P.S. Mike Barraclough said (of Cecil Sharp):- > >>> (In fact there is clear >>> evidence from his lecture notes that he believed that what is now often >>> called Shaw siding or siding into line was the correct way to interpret >>> the figure.) > >If you read the introduction to the Country Dance Book VI Cecil Sharp says >exactly that, with a softening proviso that maybe the way he had suggested >was so ingrained that it was too much bother to change it. > Replying to Hugh"s comments on the EFDSS training programme: I feel it is fairly symptomatic of the course the EFDSS has been following in recent years. Recently we have had the publication of the EFDSS Strategic Plan which looks as though it has taken some considerable time to put together. However, I think that every EFDSS member should be questioning the relevance of the Plan. It seems to me that the Plan contains nothing new and most of the material has been raked over many times, particularly at the time of re-organisation a few years ago. I seem to remember at the AGM, held to approve the re-organisation, that one of the reasons given for the re-organisation was to make the EFDSS more attractive to sponsors and to grant organisations. But what has happened since then? Not a lot as far as I can see. My understanding has been that we have missed out on funding from the Millenium Fund because of not enough thought being put into making the applications. As far as my own position is concerned, I have long been thinking of resigning my EFDSS membership and giving that money to the CDSS. I find that CDSS is an organisation that is doing more to promote and encourage folk dancing than the EFDSS has been doing in recent years. Graham Knight ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 11:43:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 14:41:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Praetzel Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: renaissance'ish dance music To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199807271841.OAA00254-AT- sca.uwaterloo.ca> Content-Type: text I figured that there are a few ECD (and earlier?) dance people here. In the SCA they dance early period Playford, and earlier, dances and I'm distributing 8 dance CDs as well as booklets. The one book is excellent for 15th C Italian dance and the other covers Dances from the Inns of Court (1570 - 1675). The music for all 8 CDs is on-line in Real Audio format. Plenty of sheet music (in Postscript) is available for 15th to 17th C arrangements. Just follow the pointers from http://sca.uwaterloo.ca or more exactly http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/~praetzel/sca-music.html - Eric