Archive-Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 04:28:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 13:30:15 +0100 From: Antony Heywood Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Wa' is me To: ECD Mailing List Message-ID: <199801011227.NAA24295-AT- IAEhv.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There is a dance in the American Purcell Playford book called _Wa' is me, What mun I do!_ which we did during a Christmas Course here in the Netherlands. People asked what the title meant. We *think* it means Woe is me, what must I do but can anyone throw any more light on it please. The source of the dance is given as Playford 1696 and Walsh 1718 and the music is *attributed* to Purcell although as Nicolas Broadbridge does not include it in his very complete collection, I have my doubts about that. The NVS Christmas Course was very successful. The first report can be read on the NVS Website http://www.iae.nl/users/antony/ and the first pictures will appear in about a week - as soon as I can get them scanned. Antony Heywood ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 07:43:19 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 10:43:11 -0500 (EST) From: Will Linden Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Wa' is me To: ECD Mailing List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 1 Jan 1998, Antony Heywood wrote: > There is a dance in the American Purcell Playford book called _Wa' is me, > What mun I do!_ which we did during a Christmas Course here in the > Netherlands. People asked what the title meant. We *think* it means Woe is > me, what must I do but can anyone throw any more light on it please. That is (more or less) Scots for "Woe is me, what must I do?" I suspect that, as often, the "title" refers to an original song text for the tune. Will Linden wlinden-AT- panix.com http://www.panix.com/~wlinden/ Magic Code: MAS/GD S++ W++ N+ PWM++ Ds/r+ A-> a++ C+ G- QO++ 666 Y ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 08:31:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 11:31:36 -0500 From: mls-AT- panix.com (Michael Siemon) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Wa' is me To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:43 AM 1/1/98, Will Linden wrote: >On Thu, 1 Jan 1998, Antony Heywood wrote: > >> There is a dance in the American Purcell Playford book called _Wa' is me, >> What mun I do!_ which we did during a Christmas Course here in the >> Netherlands. People asked what the title meant. We *think* it means Woe is >> me, what must I do but can anyone throw any more light on it please. > That is (more or less) Scots for "Woe is me, what must I do?" > I suspect that, as often, the "title" refers to an original song text > for the tune. Yes; Christine Helwig says that it is a drinking song, and I believe Kittie Keller noted that it (the text) can be found in _Pills to Purge Melancholy_. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 11:52:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 14:50:07 -0500 (EST) From: Capersall Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 97-12-31 15:01:43 EST, JohnBerni-AT- AOL.COM writes: << a Pakistani friend of mine who misquoted Kipling: "Mine not to reason why, Mine but to do and die." >> Or perhaps he was misquoting Tennyson (Charge of the Light Brigade). Art Munisteri ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 18:20:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 21:15:38 -0500 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: manners To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199801012120_MC2-2DC0-CFA3-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Amen to that, Steve! _-AT- _ {)/' /\ /\_._,<_/ ' \ /_\ /> /< Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 18:20:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 21:15:45 -0500 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: definitions To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199801012120_MC2-2DC0-CFA5-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That's why Goethe supposedly said that 'dance is the vertical expression of a horizontal desire'..... _-AT- _ {)/' /\ /\_._,<_/ ' \ /_\ /> /< Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 18:21:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 21:15:41 -0500 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Copyrights and using recordings for To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199801012120_MC2-2DC0-CFA4-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Alan, I disagree with you about the use of recordings vs. 'live music is always better'. Not all bands - or motley consorts - are doing ECD tunes justice. A rotating group of musicians who need to know the tunes four to six weeks in advance and apparently never rehearse together make for a so-so rendition of what has glorious potential, as proven by any number of recordings. Add to that the need (because of the musicians) to cast in stone the program several weeks ahead, and thereby making no allowances for the seven newcomers that may come on a given night, and you have lost any flexibility to address different layers of experience. An additional thought: there are English country dances which are well known in the international folk dance communities, and recorded tunes are the music of their reality. Knowledge of ECD is limited to the repertoire which has been recorded on vinyl or mylar. No record, no dance. Period. If we insist on 'live music only', there is a possibility - only a possibility, mind you - that misinterpretation of dynamics sets in which only recorded music can prevent/cure. I've seen the 'recorded music only' change to live music by recruitment of musicians and facilitation (including lots of rehearsals with them!) of live music. And this was not limited to the ECD group! There are an increasing number of bands who competently play international dance tunes with just the right flavor. Alas, that's happening at special events, not at your regular weekly dance. I'd trade 'just adequate' live music for a professional recording any day! In the early years - up to the early sixties for sure - there were very few groups who could dance without records. Exceptions were Pinewoods, NYC and Boston and perhaps others. New dancers would never have been able to learn ECD (or even found out about its existence) had it been linked inseparably to live music. It is in our best interest to persuade the good music makers and good ensembles to make recordings which can be danced to by all who are not blessed with their own good house band, or who only occasionally insert an English dance into the international mix, or who want to have a few friends over to the house for some informal dancing. _-AT- _ {)/' /\ /\_._,<_/ ' \ /_\ /> /< Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 05:37:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 08:36:05 -0400 From: "Howard A. Markham" Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34ACDF33.1DA9F81E-AT- mitre.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <0005E1BD.1618-AT- bowne.com> I like the definition, but I wonder whether it is too broad. I'm thinking of the use of sea chanteys and other work songs to synchronize group labor, and the use of fife, drums, bagpipes, brass bands for the marching of military units. Perhaps "artistic or recreational movement to music", if work and military marches are to be excluded. But some may prefer to include them. Martin Fager wrote: > > > > I go for a simple, open definition of dance: movement to music. > For me, this covers it. Anything added to this is not definition, but > description or elaboration. The only possible exception I can think of > is the occasional modern dance piece I have seen in which the performers > move to spoken word, or in silence. Modern dancers do of course look to > expand boundaries and definitions. This is much of what makes that > particular form/genre/idiom/style (?!) interesting to me. I have on > occasion broken into spontaneous dancing by myself (usually when alone) > when no music is being played, but when I do this, there is music > playing in my head (who needs a Walkman?) and this fits into my > definition. This definition would also cover unaccompanied tap or > clogging, as the dancer(s) would also be making the music. > > Marty Fager (speaking only for myself, of course) > > -- Howard ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 16:26:19 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 13:53:43 -0500 (EST) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: definitions To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com, ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801021853.NAA26033-AT- staff2.cso.uiuc.edu> Hanny D. Budnick <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> writes: >That's why Goethe supposedly said that 'dance is the vertical expression of >a horizontal desire'..... In my quote list I have that attributed to George Bernard Shaw. Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Home page URL: http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~j-sivier | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 17:57:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 13:21:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Daniel J. Walkowitz" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801021821.NAA22624-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I think, Marty, as you note, your definition creates a related definitional problem of what is music. Your basic dictionary definition of dance avoids this by defining it as a succession of rthymic or patterned movements. This, then, covers the birds, bees and dancing to John Cage's "Silence." And Happy New Year to all. Danny Walkowitz >> I go for a simple, open definition of dance: movement to music. >> For me, this covers it. Anything added to this is not definition, but >> description or elaboration. The only possible exception I can think of >> is the occasional modern dance piece I have seen in which the performers >> move to spoken word, or in silence. Modern dancers do of course look to >> expand boundaries and definitions. This is much of what makes that >> particular form/genre/idiom/style (?!) interesting to me. I have on >> occasion broken into spontaneous dancing by myself (usually when alone) >> when no music is being played, but when I do this, there is music >> playing in my head (who needs a Walkman?) and this fits into my >> definition. This definition would also cover unaccompanied tap or >> clogging, as the dancer(s) would also be making the music. >> >> Marty Fager (speaking only for myself, of course) >> >> > >-- >Howard > > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 17:57:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 10:46:33 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 2 Jan 1998, Howard A. Markham wrote: > I like the definition, but I wonder whether it is too broad. I'm thinking of > the use of sea chanteys and other work songs to synchronize group labor, and > the use of fife, drums, bagpipes, brass bands for the marching of military > units. Perhaps "artistic or recreational movement to music", if work and > military marches are to be excluded. But some may prefer to include them. I'd make that "artistic, recreational or religious". Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 18:02:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 20:01:38 -0600 (CST) From: annel-AT- ix.netcom.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dance or die To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19981221553641-AT- > MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii We know that dancing--however one defines it--can bring such blessings as friendships, self-expression, and joy to life. And, as the NY Times recently reported (12/28/97), it can literally be a life-saver: Stranded Skier Dances Away a Cold Night On the Slopes LAYTON, Utah, Dec. 27 (AP) -- When Karen Hartley found herself stranded in freezing temperatures and mountain snow as night fell on Christmas Eve, she knew it was either dance or die. So by herself, she danced in the dark, remembering tunes to guide her steps, until dawn, when rescuers spotted her from a search helicopter. She was unhurt, and spent Christmas Day in a hot tub. Ms. Hartley, a 33-year-old computer software developer, had wandered out of bounds at the Powder Mountain ski area on Wednesday and spent more than 18 hours cold and alone on the mountain. The temperatures were in the single digits. "The best thing I could think of was to keep my brain occupied by playing music in my head and dancing to it to keep warm," Ms. Hartley said on Friday. "I went through all the old disco songs, show tunes, popular and current stuff, Christmas tunes and even camp songs I'd ever known. I sang and danced all night long, from about 6:30 P.M to dawn. It was the only way I could think of to keep warm." Ms. Hartley became stranded when she skied down the resort's ungroomed powder area. She reached the bottom around 3:30 P.M. and planned to ride back to the top of the mountain in a vehicle called a snowcat, but it was not running. Ms. Hartley said she hollered for help for a couple of hours before finally deciding that she was not going to be heard. She thought about trying to hike back up the mountain but was too tired to make the steep climb through deep snow. "Besides, I figured, the ski patrol would see my car still in the lot and come looking for me," Ms. Hartley said. About 7 P.M. she ate the lone candy bar she had with her, still thinking someone would find her. "Not exactly the Christmas celebration I had in mind," she said. After dancing all night, Ms. Hartley started the steep climb up. Around 9 A.M., she heard a helicopter "and thought, 'That's my ride.'" Anne Lowenthal, who dances mostly in and around NY ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 19:06:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 13:41:59 -0800 From: "Michael J. O'Connor" Subject: Definitions (short) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34AD5F27.538E-AT- erols.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <6fe621ec.34aaa060-AT- aol.com> Oops! I forgot that I wanted to add that the other approach, to refer once again back to something Barbara mentioned a few months ago, is the one Potter Stewart offered in a separate opinion when the Supreme Court was struggling to decide on a definition of pornography, "I know it when I see it." Perhaps this is just a variant of "The music will tell you."? Mike ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 19:08:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 13:33:02 -0800 From: "Michael J. O'Connor" Subject: Definitions (longish) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34AD5D0D.6122-AT- erols.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <6fe621ec.34aaa060-AT- aol.com> > John Ramsay in St Louis responded to Mike who asked did anyone ever ask "Why?"? John: I apologize. From a desire to be brief I was unclear. What I intended by my question was more on the order of Why, what is the purpose for which we should prepare such a group of definitions (you asked for five), and how do you intend for them to be used? At least with nouns, a definition will include many members of a class and lead to discussion, at the least, about which items should be excluded from the class. A related article from yesterday's paper is pertinent here: the NY Times bridge column asks: "Is bridge a sport? That is not a trivial academic question, for on it hinges a matter of great importance to bridge players: the eventual inclusion of bridge in the Olympic Games. "The International Olympic Committee has for many years [yes, Y E A R S] been trying to define 'sport,' and its first vice president ... is pressing for a definition that includes the word intellectual." I recall reading some months ago an article indicating surprise that the IOC could be considering including dancing (dancing, mind you!) as an olympic sport. I think there was an overtone of disapproval there, similar to that which bruited about when ice dancing was included. At least the IOC has a particular reason for its definitional efforts, using its definition to determine what activities to include/exclude in or from future Olympics. Some time ago, I took advantage of a telemarketing offer for free dance lessons from the neighborhood Arthur Murray Studio to clear up a question I had about waltzing. The instructor gave me the answer, but in the course of discussion expressed her opinion that I would do fine "for s*o*c*i*a*l dancing." Clearly social dancing was a far, far different definitional category from what she taught (competition ballroom dancing), and equally clearly it was just one small step above total disregard, even utter disdain. If I may make an inference, perhaps the reason why you wanted your classes to engage in this exercise was to engage them in these boundary issues so they could see the choices that need to be made for exclusion or inclusion and the different possible approaches that can be taken. A platonist can imagine that there is one perfect definition out there somewhere, but I think it's all about choices, and if you have a reason why you are struggling for a definition, that will influence the choices you make. If you don't have a reason why, there is no touchstone to guide you and the effort devolves into an endless (at least unil people get tired of it) series of debates. Marty proposes a broad definition, and Howard promptly notes, whoops, that's too broad for me, citing specifics. As I recall, Gene started this with a different broad definition, and Julia chimed in with a parameter or two to narrow it. All are right, if the purpose is to think more broadly about what dance is. And if the purpose is to give a basis for analyzing dance genres, then somebody has to make some definitional decisions that are grounded in what it is they want to analyze, and what they don't want to. Snoopy used, on occasion, to burst into spontaneous dances of what seemed to be pure joy (I do wish I could find my old sweatshirt of him doing so to the caption "To Dance Is To Live!" Does anyone know Charles Schultz?). I'm not sure whether Snoopy, like Marty, had an internal voice that provided him musical accompaniment. Nor whether football players who exhibit dance-like movement in the end zone after a touchdown have similar internal voices, but maybe that's dance, too. Or maybe it's just a separate category, dances for joy, like revival meeting dances of religious ecstasy, football dances of celebration. Or maybe all are outside the boundaries and are only dance-like movement. To return to one of Barbara's topics of discussion with (I'm sorry, I've quite forgotten who, but you're an erstwhile and occasionally present baker), James Beard once said: "One of the phrases I loathe most is 'gourmet cooking.' What gourmet cooking is I will never know. There is fabulous cooking, good cooking, mediocre cooking, and bad cooking, and I'm convinced that some people can never rise above bad, probably because they really don't like to cook. [Ahhh, remember perpetual beginner dancers??] It is the urge to get into the kitchen and the delight of making something work out that makes for good cooking." In a sense, Beard comes out about where John's classes do. Let's not continue analyzing it, let's just go have some fun doing it. I didn't realize when I started this that I would wind up here. I don't mean to suggest the list should abandon its discussion -- far from it. Several have noted that they find the discussion interesting and stimulating, and I agree fully. But the limits of such discussion are, I think, that without a clear purpose, a why, to the exercise, there is never any basis for saying that my desire to include dances for joy is any better than your desire (not you, John) to exclude them because they're not structured, say, or for some other reason. Are there any linguists out there? If, like Gene and Marty, we essay a broad definition, someone can always think of a specific that it includes that they think would be better excluded. The other route is an absolutely exhaustive listing of everything that anyone thinks should qualify as dance, which then gets debated item-by-item. No, the real point to your exercise, John, and to the discussion on this list, seems to be the process, which is intellectually stimulating and exciting in and of itself. Mike ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 21:44:39 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 00:44:30 -0500 (EST) From: Dawn Culbertson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 2 Jan 1998, Daniel J. Walkowitz wrote: > I think, Marty, as you note, your definition creates a related definitional > problem of what is music. Your basic dictionary definition of dance avoids > this by defining it as a succession of rthymic or patterned movements. > This, then, covers the birds, bees and dancing to John Cage's "Silence." Not to be nit-picky, but "Silence" is the name of a book by Cage, not a musical composition. Dawn Culbertson dcculb-AT- peabody.jhu.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 1998 21:48:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 00:48:15 -0500 From: mls-AT- panix.com (Michael Siemon) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:44 AM 1/3/98, Dawn Culbertson wrote: >On Fri, 2 Jan 1998, Daniel J. Walkowitz wrote: >Not to be nit-picky, but "Silence" is the name of a book by Cage, not a >musical composition. Danny may be thinking of that ever-recurrent whipping-boy, 4'33" -- it *would* be interesting to try to choreograph this, I think. :-) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 02:55:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 02:55:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IRXAPUZRO29GVVG9-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII MLS wrote: Danny may be thinking of that ever-recurrent whipping-boy, 4'33" -- it *would* be interesting to try to choreograph this, I think. :-) The one time I went to the Marlboro Morris Ale, the 'skit' theme was dances to unexpected music. Our own team did a Common Market Morris, involving a tarantella and a polka; the Marlboro Men did the Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy, in tutus, but what I will not soon forget was one of the awesome Mr. Jorrock's men performing a beautiful jig to 4'33", accompanied by a fiddler who remained ready throughout, but never touched bow to strings. This does perhaps suggest the subjectivity of 'the music will tell you what to do.' -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 06:21:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 08:21:01 -0600 (CST) From: annel-AT- ix.netcom.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19981392547741-AT- > MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Michael Siemon writes that it would be interesting to choreograph Cage's 4'33". Jose Limon went way beyond that in "The Winged," originally choreographed to 50 minutes of silence. A couple of weeks before the premiere, in 1966, Limon had a change of heart, deciding that nobody would have the stamina to sit through such a piece, so he put together a tape of sounds, including some music, to accompany the dance. Still, it did not find a secure place in the company's repertory and was performed only in part after Limon's death, in 1972. Recently, Jon Magnussen was commissioned by Juilliard to set the entire ballet to a new score. I saw the production two years ago. In the program notes, Magnussen writes of how the process of composing to an already existing dance pushed him to think about the meaning of "movement-to-sound-in-time." The fact that "The Winged" was originally simply movement-in-time of course goes only part way toward defining it as dance. BTW, maybe that dawn-dancing skier was wearing one of those Snoopy sweatshirts, captioned "To Dance is to Live!" Anne Lowenthal ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 06:39:33 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 08:39:18 -0600 (CST) From: annel-AT- ix.netcom.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dancing to silence, II To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19981394337719169-AT- > MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: annel To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Date: 01/03/98 09:25:52 This is a re-post, since my signature seems not to have made it through the ether the first time: Michael Siemon writes that it would be interesting to choreograph Cage's 4'33". Jose Limon went way beyond that in "The Winged," originally choreographed to 50 minutes of silence. A couple of weeks before the premiere, in 1966, Limon had a change of heart, deciding that nobody would have the stamina to sit through such a piece, so he put together a tape of sounds, including some music, to accompany the dance. Still, it did not find a secure place in the company's repertory and was performed only in part after Limon's death, in 1972. Recently, Jon Magnussen was commissioned by Juilliard to set the entire ballet to a new score. I saw the production two years ago. In the program notes, Magnussen writes of how the process of composing to an already existing dance pushed him to think about the meaning of "movement-to-sound-in-time." The fact that "The Winged" was originally simply movement-in-time of course goes only part way toward defining it as dance. BTW, maybe that dawn-dancing skier was wearing one of those Snoopy sweatshirts, captioned "To Dance is to Live!" Anne Lowenthal ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 07:41:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 16:43:56 +0100 From: Antony Heywood Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dancing and painting To: ECD Mailing List Message-ID: <199801031541.QAA05660-AT- IAEhv.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The next summer dance camp of the Dutch Folk Dance Society (NVS) has as its theme PAINTING. Can anyone suggest suitable dances or music or songs to use to reflect that theme? The dance sorts that will be on offer are English Country (incl. NE Contra), Morris and Western Square. There will also be sessions for musicians and singers. Not to mention painting sessions and other extra mural activities. The dates? 18th to 25th July 1998 and the teachers include Nicolas Broadbridge. Why not come and join us? Details will be published on our website http://www.iae.nl/users/antony/ probably around Easter but you can always e-mail me privately with questions if you are thinking of coming and want more details. Antony Heywood antony-AT- iae.nl ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 07:51:47 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 10:48:18 -0500 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: definitions To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199801031051_MC2-2DE8-36A8-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Could it be possible that two great minds came up with the same bon mots? Or, that each nation/language wants to credit one of 'their own' with them? Doesn't really matter to me WHO said it, and I think that - at gut - it is a profound observation. Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 09:01:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 12:01:03 -0500 (EST) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: horizontal desire To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII It seems that the authorship in question might be resolved by a touch of scholarship. How about some references? Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 09:58:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 12:58:22 -0500 (EST) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801031758.MAA13599-AT- staff1.cso.uiuc.edu> mls-AT- panix.com (Michael Siemon) wrote: >On Fri, 2 Jan 1998, Daniel J. Walkowitz wrote: >>Not to be nit-picky, but "Silence" is the name of a book by Cage, not a >>musical composition. >Danny may be thinking of that ever-recurrent whipping-boy, 4'33" -- >it *would* be interesting to try to choreograph this, I think. :-) If the music and dance are to be reflections of one another then I think having the dancers sit perfectly still for 4 minutes and 33 seconds would be the appropriate choreography. ;-) Back on the topic of definitions. Perhaps it might be a good idea to begin to put together a FAQ for the mailing list. It could be made available on the archive site and a pointer to it could be posted to the list occasionally. This way we won't have recurring discussions on the same topics. This could include Julia's definitions of words like form and genre as well as brief descriptions of the basic ECD figures. These descriptions could include all the variations of the figures (as well as the names of figures). So for siding the list could have curvy siding (Sharp) and siding- to-a-line (Shaw) as well as any other variations that are thought to have been done back in the Good Old Days (TM). If one variation is thought to be closer to the original then that can be highlighted in the description. There are some figures where different words refer to the same figure, such as hands-across, star and mill. I think a glossary such as this might be very useful, both for the discussions on this list and as a reference for new dancers and list subscribers. Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Home page URL: http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~j-sivier | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 10:07:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 13:07:01 -0500 (EST) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: horizontal desire To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801031807.NAA14618-AT- staff1.cso.uiuc.edu> The reference I have is "New Statesman", 23 March, 1962. Jonathan ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 10:24:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 13:24:18 -0500 (EST) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: horizontal desire To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sat, 3 Jan 1998, Jonathan Sivier wrote: > The reference I have is "New Statesman", 23 March, 1962. > > Jonathan That is what I found, too; but with G.B. Shaw's death in 1950, it cannot have been a direct quote. It would be interesting to know what the "New Statesman" says by way of attribution. Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 13:46:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 00:56:52 -0600 From: Charlene Charette Subject: comparing Playford editions To: English Country Dance List Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34ADE134.57E1-AT- flash.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anyone know if there exists a comparison of the changes to the dances between Playford editions? I believe this was done for the music, but has it been done for the text? If not, does anyone think there's a need for such a thing? I've been considering the project for myself (for giggles and grins), but I'd rather not undertake something that's already been done. OTOH, if it hasn't been done, is this something anyone else would be interested in? Thanks, --Charlene ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 17:55:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 20:54:33 -0500 (EST) From: JohnBerni Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Definitions To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <21c6f092.34aeebdb-AT- aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John Ramsay in St Louis responds to: In a message dated 1/2/98 9:10:52 PM, Mike Connor wrote: <> Yes, intellectually stimulating and exciting, but also valuable (necessary) for successful communication. Mike is quite right to observe that definitions depend on <> and that the why <>. I did not want my students to fall into the trap of failing to communicate because of preconceptions nor of ignorance. Preconceptions and ignorance are usually the basis of prejudice. By realizing that there are many definitions of dance and no one universal definition, it is easier to see how carefully we must listen to others to understand what they are saying and how honestly we must monitor our own preconceptions. One of my desires is to help people communicate and this requires listening with an open mind. Too often academic education leaves minds closed. And that is my stereotype for the day! Fortunately, we can communicate in other ways-- such as DANCE, defined with words or not! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 18:42:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 21:41:11 -0500 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE:Dancing to silence To: ECD ECD Message-ID: <199801042142_MC2-2E0A-DCF9-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Here's a thought-provoking story at the intersection of two recent active= threads on this list. It was told to Susan and me by Buffy Miller, principal dancer with the Eliot Feld Ballet. A few years ago, Mr. Feld choreographed a ballet for his Company to Richa= rd Strauss' "Four Last Songs" (a beautiful setting of 4 songs for solo soprano and orchestra, contemplating the end of life. Strauss' last work= ). After weeks of rehearsal, and just a few days before the premiere performance, representatives of the estate of Richard Strauss (which continued to hold the copyright) refused permission for use of the music!= = According to Buffty, Mr. Feld and the Company were committed to the piece= , and decided to go forward. At the performance, the audience was told th= at permission to use the music was denied, so they should *imagine* the musi= c. The entire work was then danced in silence. Now try to imagine this piece of art-- as an audience member, or as a dancer. Got me to wondering... how would a longways set of experienced country dancers do with, say, Jack's Maggot, or Miss deJersey's Memorial,= without music. Would it hang together? Which in turn raises the issue of how dancers learn and execute dance. = Ballet dancers, and other theatrical dancers, learn their routines by counting (1,2,3,turn, 4,5, hold, and... ). But eventually they internali= ze the movement in "movement memory," and, in such cases as the 4 Last Songs= , can execute an entire work with this kinetic memory minus music. We teachers of ECD discourage counting (a "received wisdom" that I am not entirely sure is wise in all cases), encouraging the dancers to respond t= o the music. Quite a different view of the art. Of course the purpose of ballet and theater dance is peformance-- presentation and enjoyment by others (the audience), while the purpose of ECD is social-- responding to= music and each other, for our own enjoyment. Would it be worthwhile or f= un to focus more on "learning the movement" itself? I would think that's closer to the 17th and 18th C. conception (where an element of showing one's stuff was an important part of the whole enterprise). = Just wondering... Gene Murrow P.S. IMHO, the best performance on CD of the 4 Last Songs is by Felicity Lott and the Scottish National Orchestra under N. Jarve. = ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 20:07:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 23:07:14 -0500 From: swartell-AT- cas.org (Sue Wartell ext. 3387) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "First footing" To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: swartell-AT- cas.org Message-ID: <9801042307.AA10607-AT- cas.org> Regarding "first-footing", Eric asked: >I'm wondering how widespread this custom is, so I'm asking how many others >have experienced some form of this custom. > >As Fried describes it in "Potters Porch": "A dark-haired man, bearing a >green sprig,should be the first in the New Year to cross the threshold." I was very surprised when I first heard of this as a Scottish custom. When I was a small child in southeastern Pennsylvania in the 1950's, we had an older Pennsylvania Dutch family living next door, and the man of that family would visit each apartment on our floor EARLY on New Year's day, bearing a bottle of some spirit (whiskey I think, but I was much too young to be sure I remember that correctly). Although he was no longer dark-haired (he was in his late 60's), he felt he qualified because he once had been. I always thought this was one of the many German/Pennsylvania Dutch customs/superstitions which were still a major feature of daily life for that family, and to a lesser extent, for many of the people I knew. I don't know if this was a tradition that got adopted from the English/Scots immigrants in the American melting pot, or if it was one that came from Germany with the early settlers. I do know that the older "Dutch" folk I knew loved their "traditions" (or superstitions, if you will) and I can actually believe that they might have picked up a new one that sounded good to them! Sue Wartell Columbus, OH P.S. The Pennsylvania Dutch were not from Holland, but from Germany, and arrived in Pennsylvania early in the history of the colony. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 21:12:01 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 22:22:14 -0600 From: Charlene Charette Subject: Whirligig To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B05FF6.B71-AT- flash.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <349FFF2B.D4389F21-AT- mitre.org> Howard A. Markham wrote: > (An aside on the running step: I found it to be the perfect way to keep up in > the furiously fast Whirley Gig called by Colin Hume last summer at Pinewoods. > It also seemed the natural step when we demonstrated Step Stately at Early > Music Week a couple of years ago--our 4-couple set used about 1/4 of the C# > floor area.) The recording we use for Whirligig is quite fast and I often am teaching it in my living room (which is large for a living room, but small for a dance hall). I find forcing the dancers to keep the set tight actually helps in teaching this dance; it's easier for me to teach when the dancers can't spread out too much. As for the step, I often find myself using a skip change -- works for me, even in such a tight space. --Charlene ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 21:12:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 22:41:02 -0600 From: Charlene Charette Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B0645E.2A38-AT- flash.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <199801042142_MC2-2E0A-DCF9-AT- compuserve.com> Gene Murrow wrote: > Now try to imagine this piece of art-- as an audience member, or as a > dancer. Got me to wondering... how would a longways set of experienced > country dancers do with, say, Jack's Maggot, or Miss deJersey's Memorial, > without music. Would it hang together? I've taught dances where I've had the dancers run through it without the music. It works fine as long as I tap out a beat to get everyone started at the right speed. --Charlene ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 21:54:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 00:55:16 -0500 From: eferguson-AT- umassd.edu (Emily L. Ferguson) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE:Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >A few years ago, Mr. Feld choreographed a ballet for his Company to Richard >Strauss' "Four Last Songs" > refused permission for use of the music! >According to Buffy, Mr. Feld and the Company were committed to the piece, >and decided to go forward. At the performance, the audience was told that >permission to use the music was denied, so they should *imagine* the music. > The entire work was then danced in silence. Those guys must have been good. That's hard music. > >Now try to imagine this piece of art-- as an audience member, or as a >dancer. Got me to wondering... how would a longways set of experienced >country dancers do with, say, Jack's Maggot, or Miss deJersey's Memorial, >without music. Would it hang together? Well, we end up singing. The core problem is that people have differing tempi in their heads at the start and we need someone to set a tempo for all of us. Even after that, some of us will speed up and some stay in tempo so after a while the thing comes apart. Now I'm only talking a run-through, like for dem at NEFFA or somesuch. Not an actual rehearsed performance which might be done silently. Every once in a while, when we're all lined up in the craft room door and we can't find any Bare Necessities and the act before us is nearly finished, there's this moment of mild panic. What if......? But that large a group is subject to some of the same problems of a band, some people have metronomes in their rib cages and some have uh, metronomes that can be influenced by circumstance. The dances have the same array, I'm quite certain. Like a choir getting excited and going sharp, or being nervous and going flat. > >Which in turn raises the issue of how dancers learn and execute dance. >Ballet dancers, and other theatrical dancers, learn their routines by >counting (1,2,3,turn, 4,5, hold, and... ). But eventually they internalize >the movement in "movement memory," and, in such cases as the 4 Last Songs, >can execute an entire work with this kinetic memory minus music. We >teachers of ECD discourage counting (a "received wisdom" that I am not >entirely sure is wise in all cases), encouraging the dancers to respond to >the music. Quite a different view of the art. Of course the purpose of >ballet and theater dance is peformance-- presentation and enjoyment by >others (the audience), while the purpose of ECD is social-- responding to >music and each other, for our own enjoyment. Would it be worthwhile or fun >to focus more on "learning the movement" itself? I would think that's >closer to the 17th and 18th C. conception (where an element of showing >one's stuff was an important part of the whole enterprise). And so we come to T'ai Ch'i. But is the _movement_ what we're learning, really? Or are we there, and to hearken to another thread, not to master the style, but to achieve sufficient facility to enjoy each other and the conjunction of the music and the choreography? In fact, I see this as what Sharp was after, performance, yes, but not historic reconstruction. As I understand his motivation he was after accessibility and sociability. I experience the dancing I do in Boston as an outgrowth of Sharp's work as conveyed to us through two generations of fine ladies, the first of which sat at the table with the inventor. I don't see what I do there as having much to do with historic accuracy, and I don't want it to, because I don't want to dance that way. I don't want rules, classes, restrictive clothing, fancy footwork at the expense of interaction with others. I want the freedom from that so I only have to split my attention three ways - towards the music, towards the other dancers and towards the sequence of figures. The other and most wonderful part of what is happening in Boston is the slow but inexorable change in the style and repertoire. Yes, we did begin tilted over far enough that we'd fall on our faces if we were shot from behind, back when Lily Conant led the dance. Even Genny recommended that posture, but danced with a modification of it, as does Helene. And we have not degenerated into a trudge or stride yet, and I hope we don't ever get there because neither of those is my idea of the right style for our dancing. A dance walk is what we use, what I understand Sharp to have advocated albeit with somewhat different posture from 1998, and what I hope continues. When it turns into a stride, it will be walking briskly but not dancing. When it becomes a trudge it's time to go take a nap, or for the leader to come and help one get a sense of the style of movement (or maybe to go lose 60 pounds!). Emily L. Ferguson - Cape Cod, Massachusetts eferguson-AT- umassd.edu Photographer, English Country Dance leader, weaver/spinner No matter which side of the fence you're on, the grass will always turn brown if you don't water it. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 04:36:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: philippe.callens-AT- uia.ua.ac.be Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 14:38:48 +0100 From: Philippe Callens Subject: Re: dancing and Politics To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B0E268.6DBF-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Elise van der Ven sure was an important person in the Dutch folk dance revival. But she was not the only one at all. Think of Anna Sanson-Catz and Line Tiggers, amongst others. But she definitely was the most important one in spreading English dancing in the Netherlands. In the 1930s, Flemish leaders and dancers went dancing to the Meihof and brought the English dances back to Belgium. I like Stephen's contributions to "politics and folk dancing" a lot. A very interesting topic, indeed, and much more influential as we may believe. For example, folk dancing in Flanders in some way is still divided in two big groups/ideologies both of which go back to the 1930s. Philippe Callens Antwerp, Belgium ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 07:35:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 10:35:06 -0500 (EST) From: Stephen D Corrsin Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: dark haired men, thresholds etc To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII For anyone interested in English "calendar customs," see Ronald Hutton, "Stations of the Sun: A history of the ritual year in Britain" (1996), or his earlier "Rise and Fall of Merry England... 1400-1700," or "Pagan Religions of the Ancient British Isles." Excellent surveys of what is known, and often more important *not* known about these sorts of topics. (Big chunk of stuff on "first over the threshold" new year's customs, for instance, which is why I bring this up.) Not really involved with country dancing, however. Still, very informative, and I expect many people on this list are interested in such things. Steve Corrsin ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 10:01:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 13:01:02 -0500 (EST) From: walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801051801.NAA25643-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" There are a couple of dances in the international repetoire where the person running the evening will turn off the sound on a recording in the middle of the dance. It is great fun (and a challenge) to hold the dance together to be in place when the music is turned back on. Usually works fine and does help folks learn the pacing. Danny Walkowitz >Gene Murrow wrote: > >> Now try to imagine this piece of art-- as an audience member, or as a >> dancer. Got me to wondering... how would a longways set of experienced >> country dancers do with, say, Jack's Maggot, or Miss deJersey's Memorial, >> without music. Would it hang together? > >I've taught dances where I've had the dancers run through it without the >music. It works fine as long as I tap out a beat to get everyone >started at the right speed. > >--Charlene > > > > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 11:32:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 11:32:47 -0800 (PST) From: rushton-AT- biology.utah.edu (Emma Rushton) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE:Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>Now try to imagine this piece of art-- as an audience member, or as a >>dancer. Got me to wondering... how would a longways set of experienced >>country dancers do with, say, Jack's Maggot, or Miss deJersey's Memorial, >>without music. Would it hang together? > >Well, we end up singing. The core problem is that people have differing >tempi in their heads at the start and we need someone to set a tempo for >all of us. Even after that, some of us will speed up and some stay in >tempo so after a while the thing comes apart. How many of the readers of this list were dancing at the contra dance workshop at Sidmouth this summer, where the rain flooded dance tents and caused several power cuts? The power only went off during one dance; the whole floor spontaneously burst into song (it was Alexander's Rag Time Band if I remember rightly) and kept on dancing. The caller was reduced to conducting. The far end of the hall did get out of synchrony with the front, where some of us could hear Chris Dewhurst on accordion, but it wasn't too far out, because when the power came on again we all shook back down together. A memorable experience in an altogether memorable Sidmouth! Emma Emma Rushton, Department of Biology, University of Utah, 257 South, 1400 East Salt Lake City, UT 84112 phone (801) 585-9425, fax (801) 581-4668 "time is fun when you're having flies" - Kermit the Frog ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 11:37:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 11:37:47 -0800 (PST) From: rushton-AT- biology.utah.edu (Emma Rushton) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: next dance To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hallo everybody, this is to remind you that there will be English Country Dancing this Thursday, the 8th Jan. As usual, we will be at St Paul's Episcopal Church on 261 South, 900 East, at 7.30. For more details, phone me at (801) 359-1590, or email rushton-AT- biology.utah.edu Hope to see you there! Emma Emma Rushton, Department of Biology, University of Utah, 257 South, 1400 East Salt Lake City, UT 84112 phone (801) 585-9425, fax (801) 581-4668 "time is fun when you're having flies" - Kermit the Frog ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 11:48:40 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 14:48:31 -0500 (EST) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801051948.OAA13455-AT- staff1.cso.uiuc.edu> walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) writes: >There are a couple of dances in the international repetoire where the person >running the evening will turn off the sound on a recording in the middle of >the dance. It is great fun (and a challenge) to hold the dance together to >be in place when the music is turned back on. Usually works fine and does >help folks learn the pacing. This is also seen occasionally in contra dancing. The band will stop playing for 8 bars and the dancers will keep dancing with just the sound of their feet keeping time. Then the band will come back in, usually to a big cheer. Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Home page URL: http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~j-sivier | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 12:07:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 15:02:47 -0800 From: Laurie Anderson Subject: FAQ? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B16697.1C5A-AT- mica.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Would someone please guide me to this list's FAQ or instructions for subscribing/unsubscribing? Sorry to post to the entire list. Thank you, Laurie Anderson Baltimore, MD landerso-AT- mica.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 12:29:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 12:29:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: FAQ? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IS0N9W55GG9GWCV2-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII From: Laurie Anderson >Would someone please guide me to this list's FAQ or instructions for >subscribing/unsubscribing? Sorry to post to the entire list. I'm replying to the whole list since people tend to forget this kind of info. To get the instructions for messing with your subscription, send a mail message with the body HELP to ECD-REQUEST-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To subscribe, use the same address and send SUBSCRIBE "my name here" To unsubscribe, use the same address and send UNSUBSCRIBE If an account has already been closed and you want to unsubscribe from a different account, send off-list mail to me, winston-AT- ssrl.slac.stanford.edu. [The instructions you get when you send the HELP message are a trifle ambiguous, because they're trying to be correct for messages sent to the listname-request address and to the MXserver address. Use the ECD-REQUEST address and don't put the name of the list in your commands; thus, if you want to set an account to not get mail but still be able to post, you send SET NOMAIL rather than SET ECD NOMAIL as you might think from reading the documentation.] -- Alan PS: I've thought on and off about a FAQ for this list, but in fact it seems to me that we don't actually have many Frequently Asked Questions. If someone wants to take charge of developing a FAQ, and I agree with the contents, I'll be happy to make it accessible from the archive page. =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 12:57:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 12:56:57 -0800 (PST) From: rushton-AT- biology.utah.edu (Emma Rushton) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: oops To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" oops! I didn't mean to send this to the ECD discussion group (though you are all most welcome, I must say!) I should pay more attention to who messages are going to, clearly. >Hallo everybody, this is to remind you that there will be English Country >Dancing this Thursday, the 8th Jan. > >As usual, we will be at St Paul's Episcopal Church on 261 South, 900 >East, at 7.30. > >For more details, phone me at (801) 359-1590, or email rushton-AT- biology.utah.edu > >Hope to see you there! Emma Rushton, Department of Biology, University of Utah, 257 South, 1400 East Salt Lake City, UT 84112 phone (801) 585-9425, fax (801) 581-4668 "time is fun when you're having flies" - Kermit the Frog ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 20:57:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 20:42:08 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sat, 3 Jan 1998, Jonathan Sivier wrote: > If the music and dance are to be reflections of one another then I think > having the dancers sit perfectly still for 4 minutes and 33 seconds would > be the appropriate choreography. ;-) Not necessarily. The original piece, 4'33", was in fact choreographed; the pianist was instructed to sit in three different positions, with precise instructions in the score on when to shift. These are the three movements of the piece. (All of the preceding is serious; I'm not making it up.) I had the opportunity to witness a performance of 4'33" several years ago, and it was an astonishing experience, in all seriousness; the silence of the performer makes your ears tune in to all the sound in the hall -- papers rustling, air conditioning sounds, eventually even your own breathing. It opens your ears to the sounds in which we're awash. I was taping the concert for radio presentation, and alas, 4'33" didn't come across in the changed medium; the faint sound textures in the almost-silent hall weren't picked up, even by good professional recording equipment. Cage knew what he was doing. And it wasn't a joke. (The choreography may have been, but then again it may have been a deliberate device to keep an audience's attention from completely drifting.) Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 21:25:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 21:22:40 -0800 From: metis-AT- mcs.mcs.csuhayward.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801060522.VAA04741-AT- seki.mcs> > > dancer. Got me to wondering... how would a longways set of experienced > > country dancers do with, say, Jack's Maggot, or Miss deJersey's Memorial, > > without music. Would it hang together? > > I've taught dances where I've had the dancers run through it without the > music. It works fine as long as I tap out a beat to get everyone > started at the right speed. > > --Charlene Assuming I knew the tune, I would find Gene's scenario much easier to handle than I would dancing something I just learned without the music. I would hear the tune in my head and it would direct my dancing, helping me find ends of phrases and letting my feet enjoy the right kind of step. Far beyond it just being more pleasurable to dance to music, the tune is an active part of my learning any dance. When I try to recall a dance, it's basically impossible for me without recalling the tune first (or simultaneously). But I gather that for others this is not the case. I find myself getting annoyed at teachers who underutilize the music (be it live or recorded), and greatly appreciate those who play a bit of the tune (and preferably once through) before even starting to teach a dance. In contradancing it rarely matters: I can hum my favorite 32 bar hornpipe or dorky jig to myself as during the talk through, but in English it's dangerous to try to second guess the meter or phrase length. Knowing that up front is a big help. So here's a plea to English callers: Play the tune early and often! Tom Tom Roby Department of Math & CS troby-AT- mcs.csuhayward.edu California State University [Fax] 510-885-4169 25800 Carlos Bee Blvd. [Off] 510-885-2691 Hayward, CA 94542-3092 http://www.mcs.csuhayward.edu/~troby ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 23:39:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 02:39:22 -0500 (EST) From: Dawn Culbertson Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Cage & Dance?] To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Jan 1998, Paul J. Stamler wrote: > The original piece, 4'33", was in fact choreographed; > the pianist was instructed to sit in three different positions, with > precise instructions in the score on when to shift. These are the three > movements of the piece. (All of the preceding is serious; I'm not making > it up.) > The actual "score" for 4'33" has no instructions; it's basically little more than a vertical line. The choreography as such was devised by pianist David Tudor, to whom the piece is dedicated & who played the premiere. Actually, to be picky, 4'33" is not for a specific instrument or ensemble but for any number of players. > I had the opportunity to witness a performance of 4'33" several years > ago, and it was an astonishing experience, in all seriousness; > Cage knew what he was doing. And it wasn't a joke. Agreed. (It's interesting to read this discussion here, by the way; I'm also on a Cage mailing list, and never imagined the discussion there would tie in to a discussion here!) Dawn Culbertson dcculb-AT- peabody.jhu.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 03:28:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: philippe.callens-AT- uia.ua.ac.be Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 13:32:01 +0100 From: Philippe Callens Subject: Re: comparing Playford editions To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B22441.5BC9-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <34ADE134.57E1-AT- flash.net> You may have heard of "The Assembly", Tom Cook's work. In that work, unpublished though, he compared all English country dances published between 1651 and 1730 (The Dancing Master, Walsh, Bray, ...). Rich Galloway has a copy of that most important work -- and he is on this list. Presumably others, too. Philippe Callens ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 06:13:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: Peter.Fricke-AT- noaa.gov Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 09:09:58 -0500 From: Peter Fricke Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re[2]: "First footing" To: swartell-AT- cas.org (IPM Return requested), ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (IPM Return requested) Message-ID: <05F3A34B23B36009*/c=US/admd=ATTMAIL/prmd=GOV+NOAA/o=CCNMFS/s=Fricke/g=Peter/-AT- MHS> My experiences of first footings in England were in Northumberland and Durham in the 1960's in the rural areas of Kielder, the South Tyne valley, Brancepeth and Hexham. I was not aware of first footings in rural Lincolnshire (Lindsey) when I was a boy in the 1940's and early '50's. In Northumbria the tradition was to first attend the bonfire lighting in the village at midnight (in Allenheads, there was a procession through the town of young men carrying lighted pitch barrels on their heads led by a motley town band before the bonfire lighting) and then to go to each of the outlying farms in turn. Each individual would offer presents of bread, coal and salt to the farm family (and usually beer and/or whiskey) as good-luck tokens for the coming year. New Year "breakfast" buffets would be provided for the visitors, and there was usually singing, music and stepping dances (rants and clog) in the farm kitchens. The revelry usually lasted until dawn or the time of morning milking (whichever came first). Peter Fricke ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 06:22:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 08:20:17 -0600 (CST) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: comparing Playford editions To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <980106082017.558-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> I think Tom Cook's work is also available from the CDSS Archives housed, I believe, at the University of New Hampshire. My copy is missing one of the preliminary pages. Whoever copied it forgot to install the '2-sided' copying function in the early pages. For a comparison of the advertising in John Playford's work you might want to consider Peter Munstedt's Ph.D. dissertation on the works of John (only). A later Bibliographic study has been made of the publications of Henry Playford. I think Harvard has a microfiche copy they will sell you. But check it out quickly. The latter pages are somewhat blurry when you try to copy them out to 8 1/2 x 11. Forbes/Baker University ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 06:33:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 09:32:53 -0500 (EST) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD Style [Definition, "What Is Dance?"] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Jan 1998, Paul J. Stamler wrote: [snip] > Not necessarily. The original piece, 4'33", was in fact choreographed; > the pianist was instructed to sit in three different positions, with > precise instructions in the score on when to shift. These are the three > movements of the piece. Hmmmmm... wouldn't that be _two_ movements? (;-^) Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 08:55:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 12:54:48 -0800 From: "Michael J. O'Connor" Subject: Dancing to Silence To: ECD List Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B29A17.2443-AT- erols.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A dance review by Jack Anderson in today's _New York Times_ of a piece entitled "Unfinished Symphony," by Yoshiko Chuma in collaboration with the School of Hard Knocks (the full review should be available at www.nytimes.com), notes: "No instruments accompanied one long dance. Yet silence did not prevail, for the dancers made a kind of music of their own with the thudding of their feet and their exhalations of breath. Dancing produces sound, the sequence implied. "So, too, other incidents suggested that the motions involved in making music can be viewed as dances. "String players let their arms sweep over their instruments. Pianists' fingers raced up and down the keys. Ms. Chuma occasionally stood in front of the cast and soulfully waved her arms like a flamboyant conductor. Artful disharmony always resulted." For those in the New York area, "Unfinished Symphony" will be repeated at St. Mark's Church (10th Street at 2nd Ave.) in the East Village from Thursday through Sunday this week. The comment about dancers producing sound calls to mind an hilariously dry comment at a dance some while ago; after announcing that the next move was (as I recall) two chassee steps, she instructed, "That's: 'Step, scrape; step, scrape,' or at least that's usually how it's done." Mike ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 09:13:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 11:11:50 -0600 (CST) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Dancing to Silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <980106111150.42e-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> Our Old Castle Dancers perform a version of the "Kentucky Running Set" without any accompanying music. I'll skip the historical stuff readers can find in Sharp's "Country Dance Book" Part 5. But I would note that there are a number of 4-beat and 8-beat movement patterns. A couple of examples "Partner Swing" (3, 4) "Corner Swing" (3, 4) "Promenade your partner round that ring" (5, 6, 7, 8) Readers will remember that the numbers represent silent beats). Without music, the dance can be quite impressive for only the 'slap' of the feet on the performing surface drives the dance along. This presents a number of interesting challengers to our young dancers, not the least being the need to keep the tempo up and steady. Forbes/Muso and occasional caller when needed/Old Castle Morris and Garland Team ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 09:28:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 13:27:13 -0800 From: "Michael J. O'Connor" Subject: Silence To: ECD List Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B2A1B1.35F-AT- erols.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Has anyone seen Twyla Tharp's "The Fugue," a 1970 work performed without music on an amplified stage? Mike ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 09:32:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 13:31:59 -0800 From: "Michael J. O'Connor" Subject: Re: Dancing to Silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B2A2CF.632D-AT- erols.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <34B29A17.2443-AT- erols.com> Michael J. O'Connor wrote: > The comment about dancers producing sound calls to mind an hilariously > dry comment at a dance some while ago; after announcing that the next > move was (as I recall) two chassee steps, she instructed, "That's: > 'Step, scrape; step, scrape,' or at least that's usually how it's done." Regrettably, I forgot to attribute the instruction to Helene Cornelius. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 10:22:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 13:22:39 -0500 From: Martin.Fager-AT- bowne.com (Martin Fager) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Silence To: ECD List , "Michael J. O'Connor" Message-ID: <00061982.1618-AT- bowne.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've seen it twice over the years. In addition to the amplified footfalls, the dancers (there are three) slap their thighs a lot, often as a prelude to (launching of?) movement. Marty Fager ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Silence Author: "Michael J. O'Connor" at Internet-Express Date: 1/6/98 1:27 PM Has anyone seen Twyla Tharp's "The Fugue," a 1970 work performed without music on an amplified stage? Mike ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 17:36:38 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 17:36:23 -0800 From: Laurie Buchanan Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Gene Morrow wrote: > dancer. Got me to wondering... how would a longways set of experienced > country dancers do with, say, Jack's Maggot, or Miss deJersey's Memorial, > without music. Would it hang together? This reminds me of a contra experience at Glen Echo Park (Washington, DC) sometime in the early 80s. My memory is very sketchy, but it was something like this: The Capital Quickstep Quadrille Orchestra had made a demo tape and someone from the band (Steve Hickman?) was being interviewed live on a radio show airing shortly before the start of a regular dance. The word was spread that their taped version of Chorus Jig would be played at the end of the interview and so we brought our "Walkmen" and earphones and plugged in. There was a set of about a dozen couples and we appeared to be dancing in silence, yet we were all listening to our own personal music. As people came into the hall, more joined the set without any music and just danced to the silence. This wasn't a good test of "would it hang together?", since we were not all dancing to silence, but when I took off my headphones to experience dancing to the silence, it was rather awesome. Also, some people who were listening to the music were humming or doodling along with it very flatly and probably unconsciously. Thanks for the nudge to that memory. Anyone else on the list remember this? Rich? Mary Kay? Laurie Buchanan Eugene, OR ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 11:54:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 20:53:18 +0100 From: martin.sheffield-AT- wanadoo.fr (M Sheffield) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: new member To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thanks to those of you who sent the info allowing me to sign up here (David M, Laurie A, Bill R, and, of course, Alan W. Looks like it worked ! Martin S, in Grenoble, France. Martin, Grenoble, France. ------------------ http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france This web site has been revised: ...in.france/scd.htm -- Scottish Country Dance items, ...in.france/cycle.htm -- cycling, and urban transport items (mainly links), ...in.france/dances.htm -- a sampler of new dances, ...in.france/books.htm -- list of SCD booklets, ...in.france/CDlist.htm -- a selection of SCD recordings, ...in.france/calendar.htm -- SCD events in France, ...in.france/groups.htm -- SCD clubs in France. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 12:00:40 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 15:03:41 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dancing and painting To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801071944.OAA04505-AT- ns.kreative.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > The next summer dance camp of the Dutch Folk Dance Society (NVS) has > as its theme PAINTING. Can anyone suggest suitable dances or music > or songs to use to reflect that theme? The dance sorts that will be > on offer are English Country (incl. NE Contra), Morris and Western > Square. There will also be sessions for musicians and singers. Not > to mention painting sessions and other extra mural activities. Painted Chamber jumps to mind. A challenging dance, not for beginners, though. An interpretation is published in 2 Barns, vol. 3. However, you might want to do your own reconstruction from the Dancing Master (7th through 18th editions of vol. 1) or Walsh (1718). The original text sure sounds to me like it's saying the dance is improper. Makes the dance less challenging that way, too. You also might use dances with colors, such as Red House or Black Nag et al. ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 12:00:44 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 15:03:41 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801071944.OAA04512-AT- ns.kreative.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT There is a wonderful idiom in Spanish for a dance without music, baile seco [dancing dry]. ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 14:33:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 17:25:55 -0500 From: Mary K Friday Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Welsh Country Dancing -- ?? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9801078842.AA884212325-AT- smtp-gw1.census.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: Quoted-Printable A belated response -- I was unavailable when the thread was active= ,=20 but I have a story that has just amused me so much: =20 About 10 years ago, a dancing friend and I noticed an item in the = FSGW=20 (Folklore Society of Greater Washington) for Welsh country dancing= on=20 a Sunday afternoon at the British Embassy. We went, out of simple= =20 curiosity. It turned out that there is a Welsh Society, which mee= ts=20 (monthly, I believe) at the Embassy. My recollection is that the = dances were fairly simple (perhaps aimed at the type and level of = the=20 group, basically a one-night stand for non-dancers) and similar=20= =0A (figures and progressions) to English country dances. At the=20= =0A conclusion of the afternoon, we overheard one member saying to = another, "That was so much fun! Let's do it again next year!" =20 We, of course, nearly fell about laughing, as we were planning to = go=20 to the FSGW weekly dance to do it again THAT NIGHT. =20 I have the impression that they may, indeed, "do it" annually (the= =20 hotbed of twmpath dancing in the Eastern U.S.?). I'm sorry that I= =20 have no idea who led the dances (or even whether the music was liv= e or=20 recorded). Mary Kay Friday Washington, D.C. ______________________________ Reply Separator ________________________= _________ Subject: Welsh Country Dancing -- ?? Author: at SMTP-GATEWAY Date: 12/16/97 9:03 AM =2E =2E =2E Oh, yes -- anyone know where the hotbed of twmpath dancing is in the = Eastern U.S.? Mike O'Connor =20 = ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 22:21:20 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 22:48:22 -0600 From: Charlene Charette Subject: Re: comparing Playford editions To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B45A96.1C3B-AT- flash.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <34ADE134.57E1-AT- flash.net> <34B22441.5BC9-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> Philippe Callens wrote: > > You may have heard of "The Assembly", Tom Cook's work. In that work, > unpublished though, he compared all English country dances published > between 1651 and 1730 (The Dancing Master, Walsh, Bray, ...). What sort of comparison did he do? There are lots of ways to organize this sort of project. --Charlene ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 22:21:22 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 22:52:51 -0600 From: Charlene Charette Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B45BA2.1487-AT- flash.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <199801060522.VAA04741-AT- seki.mcs> metis-AT- mcs.mcs.csuhayward.edu wrote: > > I've taught dances where I've had the dancers run through it without the > > music. It works fine as long as I tap out a beat to get everyone > > started at the right speed. > > > > --Charlene [snip] > I find myself getting annoyed at teachers who underutilize the music (be > it live or recorded), and greatly appreciate those who play a bit of the > tune (and preferably once through) before even starting to teach a > dance. In contradancing it rarely matters: I can hum my favorite 32 bar Agreed. I do like to play the tune before teaching a dance. But I also like to do several walkthroughs without music while teaching. I usually do this only for the small number of dancers I get to my house on a weekly basis (6-20). When I'm teaching large groups I teach quite differently. --Charlene ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 22:32:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 01:34:19 -0500 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ok - I finally got to throw my two pence in here. The ice dancers Torville and Dean had a routine a couple of years ago that had a prolonged opening sequence of just them, skating, no music. There was a small click at the beginning to cue them to start and then it was just the sounds of their skates on the ice. It was really beautiful to watch. [and what an achievement and marvel - they had to be at a certain point when the music finally kicked in!] I often practice dancing using my walkman and tapes or just the music in my head or no music and just counting and figure it must look pretty darn weird to the casual observer... And finally a tale from my husband. He started out his dancing by belonging to a performing group run by Burt Schwartz in Detroit. Ron always tells me this tale and starts by saying how hard they practiced - that they would really learn the dances and then rip them apart and make them performance pieces with a lot of fine tuning and detailing. Apparently some thought Burt was really a hard task master. But he made them do the dance so many times and would make them do it sometimes without music, because you just never know what might happen. They got a big gig - dancing at the Democratic Convention when it was there. The big day comes and they're up on this big outside stage/platform. Waiting for the music. There's something - but it's just loud noise. Apparently the music got totally distorted going through the sound system and into that large outside space. But they did it anyway - a Kentucky running set, no music, done for - as Ron tells it - a totally oblivious crowd of politicos. Mary Beth <-- ok - it was 3 pence ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 07:26:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 10:26:09 -0500 (EST) From: Stephen D Corrsin Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: dancing without music To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII This reminds me of a couple of stories. First, my wife the professional musician has often said that professional dancers (i.e., ballet, modern dance) are notorious for not listening to the music; rather for counting. (I should add, they are notorious with musicians for doing that.) Second, once I was at the Lincoln Center Dance Division Library. I wanted to photocopy an article, which included several pieces of music. That same day, the neighboring Music Division had refused to let me photocopy another article from a journal in their collection, which had complete pieces of music in it, saying that this might violate copyright laws. (This was several years ago; I don't think I'd have a problem now.) Being a good citizen and a librarian to boot, in asking for permission from the Dance Division librarian, I pointed out the music included. She said, "Go ahead. We're dancers, we don't care about music." QED. Steve Corrsin ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 13:52:20 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 22:51:18 +0100 From: martin.sheffield-AT- wanadoo.fr (M Sheffield) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: (Welsh) Country Dancing -- ?? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > "That was so much fun! Let's do it again next year!" > > We, of course, nearly fell about laughing, as we were planning to go > to the FSGW weekly dance to do it again THAT NIGHT. > It does seem strange to regular dancers that others can join in just once a year and be satisfied. I have been asked to MC a ceili/barn dance evening year after year for two different organizations here, where everyone joins in enthusiastically and always wants more -- but not before the following year. These events have produced precisely ONE new member for my weekly club/classes, otherwise, never the twain shall meet. Martin, Grenoble, France. ------------------ http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 18:50:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 21:52:14 -0500 From: eferguson-AT- umassd.edu (Emily L. Ferguson) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: The Prez on the Beach To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sometimes my lists overlap >Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 18:43:24 -0800 (PST) >Subject: The Prez on the Beach >Sender: NPPA Discussion List >To: NPPA-L-AT- CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU > >Just to add fuel to the fire.... > >Sam Donaldson and Cokie Roberts, co-hosts of "This Week," said on CNN >tonight that they believe the infamous AFP photo was allowed to "happen" >by the White House. > >Sam, stating that "he knows something about the Secret Service," >explained that the agency knows where every photographer is at every >moment, and that a road-block leading to the beach was blocked on >one-day, but was "miracuously" unblocked the next. > >He also said that the Secret Service informed the White House staff of >the presence of the media, and they were fully aware that photos were >being taken, as was the president. > >Cokie said that she has been married a lot longer than the Clintons, and >would never dance on the beach, especially when no music was playing. > >Larry King elaborated that the photo may have been the White House's >answer to the Paula Jones case, showing the Clintons as a >happily-married and loving couple. >-- > >SO, if this was a staged photo-op, why all of the fuss? Did it backfire >when the incident was shown to have paparazzi overtones? >These are rhetorical questions, so feel free to blow them off. > >Granted, I've never covered the Clintons, but I did shoot the 1996 >Republican Convention and from my limited experience with high-level >politics, nobody in the media sneezes without the party cronies knowing >about it. > >Michael R. Brown >Freelance Photojournalist >photog-AT- i-star.com >brnmike-AT- hotmail.com < >"Never let school get in the way of your education." > --Mark Twain > > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > Emily L. Ferguson - Cape Cod, Massachusetts eferguson-AT- umassd.edu Photographer, English Country Dance leader, weaver/spinner No matter which side of the fence you're on, the grass will always turn brown if you don't water it. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 12:38:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 15:36:00 -0500 From: Anne Marie Edden Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: ECD with Gene Murrow Tonight To: ecd-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <2F888B3101FC4600-AT- GRUZENSAMTON.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT This is a reminder to all in the NYC area that tonight (Friday, January 9) CD*NY will sponsor an experienced English Country Dance from 8pm to 10:45. The caller will be Gene Murrow. Musicians will be John Austin, Cara Friedman and Cynthia Simonoff. Location is Duane Metropolitain Church, 201 W 13th St -AT- 7th Ave, NYC. Admission: $7 members, $9 non-members Bring your clean, soft-bottomed, non-street shoes! Bring edible goodies to share! PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS DANCE IS -NOT- LISTED ON OUR CALENDAR. See you all there tonight! Annie Edden ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 18:02:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 21:01:55 -0500 (EST) From: "Priscilla M. Burrage" Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII nOn Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Rich Galloway wrote: > There is a wonderful idiom in Spanish for a dance without music, > > baile seco [dancing dry]. Just had some lessons in Mexican dancing, and the class was taught in Spanish. The teacher had a neat way to avoid the four syllable Spanish word for 'left.' He called it the bad (mal) foot. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Priscilla Burrage Vermont US (pburrage-AT- zoo.uvm.edu) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 09:00:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 11:58:14 -0500 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Kissing dances To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199801101200_MC2-2EBA-AED4-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Occasionally I use 'All in a garden green' with an ECD group. It's in the first Playford edition of 1651. Is anyone aware of other 'kissing dances'? Hanny ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 11:13:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 14:07:54 -0500 From: marthacd-AT- juno.com (MARTHA C DAVEY) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Valentine's Day (a dance) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980110.140913.4798.0.marthaCD-AT- juno.com> Hi- I'm looking for the instructions to a dance called Valentine's Day. I have the music. It's in Barnes. According to the index, the instructions can be found in Country Dance and Song#3 1970 or with the recording PE205 "Next Dance is..." I am leading a dance in North Jersey tomorrow (Sun, Jan 11), and since it is the first dance of the new year, I am preparing a program to "dance around the year" with dances from seasons, holidays, etc. Any ideas? Martha Davey 25-14 37 ST, Astoria, NY 11103 (718)278-4389 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 11:23:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 14:19:54 -0500 From: marthacd-AT- juno.com (MARTHA C DAVEY) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: All Saints Day To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980110.141955.4798.2.marthaCD-AT- juno.com> Hi- I am looking for the instructions to "All Saint's Day", a neat little dance set to "The Chestnut". It is not in the index. Can anyone help? Can anyone think of any other dances for fall holidays or about Martha Davey 25-14 37 ST, Astoria, NY 11103 (718)278-4389 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 12:18:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 15:18:58 +0000 From: Mary E Jones Subject: Re: All Saints Day To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B79161.57C9-AT- javanet.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <19980110.141955.4798.2.marthaCD-AT- juno.com> MARTHA C DAVEY wrote: > > Hi- > I am looking for the instructions to "All Saint's Day", a neat little > dance set to "The Chestnut". Martha, and all - "All Saints' Day" (version taught by George Fogg) David Ashwell, 1975 Music: "Doves Figary" (The Chestnut) A BB ad lib A 1st corners right-hand turn while 2nd corners cross over behind their partners into each other's place; repeat with 2nd corners turning by the left hand and the 1st corners crossing over. [End progressed and Improper.] B1 All fall back a double, forward, cross (passing right), turn right into a no-hands circle, 1st woman leading to a line of four across the room (1W-2W-2M-1M). B2 Line lead forward a double, fall back into longways lines; 1's cross and go below while 2's lead up and cross over. This is published in the CDSS News, #99, March/April 1991. The News also published the orignal text: A1 1st M & 2nd W give R. hands & turn once around...at same time the 1st W & 2nd M across set into Partners place, the 2nd M moves Up, & 1st W moves Down into each others place. A2 1st W & 2nd M give L. hands and turn as 1st M & 2nd W cross set & move Up or Down the set to change places. (All are now progressed & improper.) B1 All fall back and double, & come forward, changing sides with partner (R. Shoulder) over to correct side, & immediately turn into a circle left, Indian file (i.e. no hands), 1st W leading 2nd W, 2nd M & 1st M into a line of 4, facing up. B2 Lines Forward, & back, 2's swinging 1's in to meet above them. 1st couple cast down one place, 2's lead up. All 1/2 turn Partners. Good luck - Mary Jones Amherst, MA ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 12:45:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 15:34:43 -0800 From: Stephanie Smith Subject: News about Glen Echo Park - Spanish Ballroom To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B80593.4D3E-AT- ix.netcom.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <19980110.141955.4798.2.marthaCD-AT- juno.com> <34B79161.57C9-AT- javanet.com> I know more than a few of you on this list have danced at the Spanish Ballroom, and as one of many concerned dancers in the Washington D.C. area, I wanted to share this with you. Thanks. Stephanie ************************************************************ To dance associations/enthusiasts nationwide: Many of you have visited the Spanish Ballroom at Glen Echo Park, MD, near DC. You may have heard that the future of the ballroom is in question. We're hoping that you will help spread the word about what's happening and show your support for this national treasure. We're trying to get as many dancers as possible to attend the first review meeting on February 3rd. I realize that those of you in Charlottesville or Philadelphia or NY will probably not venture to Glen Echo during the week. But anything you can do will help. Following is a message about what's happening and how people can help. Would you please post it on your sites and newsletters, announce it at your dances, and distribute the message through your list serves if you have them? Thanks so much. Janice Saylor, Washington Swing Dance Committee, and Stephanie Smith, Folklore Society of Greater Washington. *********************************************************** Important Notice about Glen Echo Park and the Spanish Ballroom As many of you know, the National Park Service is developing a management plan for Glen Echo Park. The results of this management plan could affect the current use of the Ballroom. The continued use of the Spanish Ballroom for dancing is NOT guaranteed. We need to let the park service know that we value this national treasure. The first milestone in this procedure is February 3. At that time, the park service will have a "cafeteria" style meeting at which the several different options for management of park will be presented. There will be a number of "stations" in the hall with the options displayed and flip charts available for recording public comments and ideas. Each station will be staffed by a park service person who has been involved with the internal process to date. Here's how you can help: 1. Show up at the meeting and make your views known. We're hoping that the dance community will come in droves to give a very visual message to the park service. The meeting will be held on Tuesday, February 3 at 6:00 PM, at the Clara Barton Recreation Center, 7425 MacArthur Boulevard, Cabin John -- just down the road from the Ballroom, towards Great Falls. 2. If you can't make it to the meeting, call that day. Say that you wanted to come to the meeting but were unable to. Tell them that you want to be put on the mailing list to be kept apprised of developments. The phone number is: 703/285-1924 3. Write the park service. Tell them your personal history and experience with the park (you wanted to see where your parents met; you live in some other country or state, but always make sure that you come to the ballroom when you're in town; you've taken lessons at Glen Echo; you rode the carousel when you were a child ....). You get the picture. Make it very personal. You don't want to lose this national living history treasure. Send your letter to Superintendent Audrey Calhoun, George Washington Memorial Parkway, Turkey Run Headquarters, McLean, VA 22101. Send the letter to your congressional representative also. 4. Spread the word. Make sure that anyone you know in the dance community who may have the slightest possibility of visiting the park knows about these developments. Ask them to participate. And a special note to out-of-towners. It's extremely important that you let the park service know that you want to keep this national treasure for its intended purpose -- dancing (not exhibits or company picnics). We know that the Ballroom has been visited by people from all over the world. Please write. If you wish to continue dancing at Glen Echo it's important that you make your views known now. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 13:51:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 16:51:25 -0500 (EST) From: CF1125 Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Kissing dances To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It's not officially a kissing dance, and it's not ECD either, but I love = the=0Apre-AIDS-era tradition of doing Rory O'More with kisses on the bala= nces. =0A=97Carl Friedman=0A ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 15:47:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 18:48:55 -0500 From: eferguson-AT- umassd.edu (Emily L. Ferguson) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Valentine's Day (a dance) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Hi- > I'm looking for the instructions to a dance called Valentine's >Day. I have the music. It's in Barnes. >According to the index, the instructions can be found in Country Dance >and Song#3 1970 or with the recording PE205 "Next Dance is..." It's also in Choice Morsels, one of Fried's books. My instructions go: (spacious duple minor set) A: 1s lead up & bk, while 2s lead down & bk A: Men lead out & bk, while Ladies lead out & bk. B: 1st crnrs x, 2nd crnrs x, fall bk on the the line, advance and pass thru by right B: orig 1 crnrs meet in mid & turn their back on each other, orig 2nd crnrs the same, all clap and cast out to place, all circle all the way around Have fun. Let us know how it comes out. Emily L. Ferguson - Cape Cod, Massachusetts eferguson-AT- umassd.edu Photographer, English Country Dance leader, weaver/spinner No matter which side of the fence you're on, the grass will always turn brown if you don't water it. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 16:05:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 16:04:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: Kissing dances To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IS7UD6TKBS9GYLEW-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Hanny asked about kissing dances. _The Playford Ball_ notes that Sharp's reconstruction removed the kissing from "Epping Forest". I have tried calling it with the kissing for a historical recreationist group. The timing works fine, but people were sure embarrassed about doing it; most were more comfortable with men kissing women's hands than cheeks or lips. (Of course, I didn't warn them it was going to be a kissing dance when they took partners.) So, count Epping Forest as a kissing dance if you go back to the original, but think carefully before introducing kissing dances. And let us know how it goes! -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 20:11:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 23:10:06 -0500 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: POSSIBLY Incomplete Message: Dance, music, and ECD To: ECD ECD Message-ID: <199801102310_MC2-2ED5-5C48-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (This is a late-night, meandering attempt to get some thoughts down in writing... You've been warned). I got a good laugh from Steve Corrsin's post of two examples of performan= ce dancers' indifference to music. Not to worry... when I played in various= professional free-lance orchestras for a few pro and semi-pro ballet companies (in my profligate youth), I was chagrined at the indifference o= f the musicians to the dance. I recall some heated pinochle games among th= e wind players in the orchestra pit during the most poignant moments. QPQ= (quid pro quo). Which only serves to illustrate a wonderful and appreciated feature of ou= r favorite form (oops, I mean genre) of dance-- the intimate connection between movement and music. There are good technical reasons why this is= so (IMHO): ECD choreography is repetitive and is (often) prompted, so there's brain capacity available to listen to and enjoy the music, and to= let the music set the tempo and serve as a reminder of what to do. Balle= t choreography, on the other hand, is so complex, lengthy, and non-repetiti= ve that the movement must be entirely and precisely learned and internalized= =2E = Its execution requires extreme concentration (think of your state of mind= when first learning/doing a very complicated new figure). Thus the learning by counting, and the "indifference" to the melodic and rhythmic cues of the music. (Of course the great talent of the very best dancers allows them to express the content of the music as well). Looking in the= other direction, the best "realization" of the music for ECD occurs when there are dancers moving to the music-- there's a real synergy that improves the performance of the music. Just ask any ECD musician who's tried to record, in a studio, music for dancing. Playing ballet music, OTOH, in an orchestra without dancers is not considered a problem; indeed= , not having those gorgeous duck-walking ballerinas around is an advantage!= (see paragraph 1 above ;-) ) What's remarkable is that, while other social dance genres (e.g. couple dancing) also involve a direct, "real-time," relationship between dancer and musician, "Playford" or "historical-style" ECD goes further and makes= a strong connection between particular choreography and a particular tune. One can waltz, schottische, jitterbug, electric boogie, or polka to any appropriate tune, but there's only one Miss DeJersey's Memorial, or Orlea= ns Baffled, or St. Martin's Lane (to pick a few easy examples). Just like ballet! We even talk about "story lines" in the best dances, and experience the dances differently based on the shape and affect given the= music by the band-- all of which I think is appropriate. Within the EFDSS= in the 50's, revisionist criticisms of Sharp's legacy were leveled at his= postulate that these "little ballets" (as they were called by some) were folk dances. = So we get the best of both... a dynamic interplay of music and movement t= o be fully enjoyed by both musician and dancer as it's happening, and the aethetic appreciat ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 07:29:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 16:16:41 +0100 From: Antony Heywood Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Kissing dances To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199801111529.QAA01038-AT- IAEhv.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Maid in the Moon and Kettledrum are also kissing dances. The Maid in the Moon was published by Sharp with the tune All in a Garden Green and it works quite well with that tune. But try it to its original tune which is the same tune as Valentine Day and if the band can play a pause on each of the appropriate notes in the B-music, the kissers can have a good smacker! Incidentally, with the original tune, you have to leave out the set and turn singles in the introductions. Hasn't any reader ever wondered why in The Maid in the Moon, the first two stars are right hand stars and the last one a left hand star. Think whom the next person is to be kissed and it all becomes obvious! Antony Heywood with memories of Summer Dance Camp 1985 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 10:19:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 10:19:07 -0800 (PST) From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Valentine's Day (a dance) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Hi- > I'm looking for the instructions to a dance called Valentine's >Day. I have the music. It's in Barnes. >According to the index, the instructions can be found in Country Dance >and Song#3 1970 or with the recording PE205 "Next Dance is..." >I am leading a dance in North Jersey tomorrow (Sun, Jan 11), and since it >is the first dance of the new year, I am preparing a program to "dance >around the year" >with dances from seasons, holidays, etc. Any ideas? > >Martha Davey >25-14 37 ST, >Astoria, NY 11103 >(718)278-4389 MARTHA, HOW ABOUT SOME OF THESE? In the Fields of Frost and Snow Female Saylor (Tune is an Xmas Carol, Masters in this Hall) Easter Morn Easter Thursday All Saint's Day Gathering Peascods or Sellenger's Round (dances for the first of May) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 12:56:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 15:51:27 -0500 From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- compuserve.com> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Welsh CD listing To: Blind.Copy.Receiver-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <199801111555_MC2-2EEE-3BF0-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alan, Si=E2n does not know the procedure to get onto the list. Will you please tell her? Thanks, Hanny -- Forwarded Message -- Sb: Re: Welsh CD listing = Fm: Sibn Frick 73642,2074 Welsh Folk Dance Classes taught by Sia^n Frick, certificated WFDS teacher, on Sundays, 2-4.30 p.m. at Rehoboth Chapel, Main Street, Delta, PA (January 11 only), then at Slate Ridge Presbyterian Church, Chestnut Street, Delta, PA, January 18 to March 15, 1998 (weather permitting). Two hours of dancing, followed by a Te Bach (Welsh tea). We will be preparing dances for display at the *Hwyrnos*, an evening of Welsh food and entertainment on March 21, 1998 in Delta, and other Welsh or Celtic events. No need to bring a partner, and no experience is necessary. Further information from Sia^n Frick, sianfrick-AT- compuserve.com or (302) 368-2318. Carpool available from Newark, Delaware. In response to Mary Kay Friday, the St. David's Society of Washington used to meet at the British Embassy but unfortunately is no longer allowed to, and their annual folk dance afternoon has been discontinued. If you went in 1987, that was me calling the dances, with music by Sue Richards' band Peascods Gathering. I also trained a small group to perform a couple of more interesting dances during the afternoon. As you gathered, the members of the Society are not dancers, so it had to be on the Twmpath level, easy dances suitable for audience participation. In spite of announcements and encouragement, the Welsh societies in Washington, Baltimore, Philadelphia, etc. have not been responsive to my offers over the years to teach Welsh folk dance on a regular basis, partly because the members tend to be older and partly because the Welsh tradition handed down by their grandparents who emigrated to America in the last century was that to be Welsh, you went to chapel 3 times on Sunday and sang in choirs, and it was sinful to dance. Some of us are trying very hard to educate them about 20th century Wales and the existence of Welsh folk music and dance, etc., and it is gradually bearing fruit. Fortunately Rehoboth Welsh Choir is a lively group, and some of us plus some new people (not Welsh-connected) are having a terrific time learning the social and display dances to perform. It's great to do the dances on a regular basis again, after my previous team Dawnswyr y Tract Cymreig (The Welsh Tract Dancers) in Newark, DE had to disband owing to health problems. It's a common problem in the U.S., people start teams but the Welsh don't support them and other dancers have so much else to choose from. So all you English dancers, come and join us in Delta! It's easy to get to from I-95, just over an hour from Washington I believe, and a pretty drive near the Susquehanna River. Mary Kay, your name seems familiar, have we met somewhere? Hwyl (All the best), Sia^n Frick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 19:45:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 22:44:17 -0500 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dance, music, and ECD II To: ECD ECD Message-ID: <199801112245_MC2-2EEB-D817-AT- compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From Gene Murrow: Computer glitch truncated my last posting. Here's the= last paragraph in full... = So we get the best of both... a dynamic interplay of music and movement t= o be fully enjoyed by both musician and dancer as it's happening, and the aethetic appreciation of a unique work of art, created by an artist (Mr. Isaac, Henry Purcell, Colin, Fried, Gary, et. al.) that we participate in= re-creating. Well worth the price of admission on a Friday night... Gene Murrow Too tired to dance, too awake to sleep. = ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 21:04:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 00:24:22 -0500 From: Faina Riftina Subject: Re: Dancing to silence To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <34B9A906.22CE-AT- is3.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Emily L. Ferguson wrote: > But is the _movement_ what we're learning, really? Or are we there, and to > hearken to another thread, not to master the style, but to achieve > sufficient facility to enjoy each other and the conjunction of the music > and the choreography? In fact, I see this as what Sharp was after, > performance, yes, but not historic reconstruction. As I understand his > motivation he was after accessibility and sociability. > > I experience the dancing I do in Boston as an outgrowth of Sharp's work as > conveyed to us through two generations of fine ladies, the first of which > sat at the table with the inventor. I don't see what I do there as having > much to do with historic accuracy, and I don't want it to, because I don't > want to dance that way. I don't want rules, classes, restrictive clothing, > fancy footwork at the expense of interaction with others. I want the > freedom from that so I only have to split my attention three ways - towards > the music, towards the other dancers and towards the sequence of figures. > > The other and most wonderful part of what is happening in Boston is the > slow but inexorable change in the style and repertoire. Yes, we did begin > tilted over far enough that we'd fall on our faces if we were shot from > behind, back when Lily Conant led the dance. Even Genny recommended that > posture, but danced with a modification of it, as does Helene. And we have > not degenerated into a trudge or stride yet, and I hope we don't ever get > there because neither of those is my idea of the right style for our > dancing. > > A dance walk is what we use, what I understand Sharp to have advocated > albeit with somewhat different posture from 1998, and what I hope > continues. When it turns into a stride, it will be walking briskly but not > dancing. When it becomes a trudge it's time to go take a nap, or for the > leader to come and help one get a sense of the style of movement... Excellently said! I couldn't agree more. I attended Gene's Amherst Assembly and learned a great deal from it. I am grateful for the many historical insights into English Country dancing that a long line of researchers, beginning with Sharp himself, has given us. But we are moderns, and in my view we'll gain the greatest pleasure and reward from this activity if we dance as such.--Paul Ross ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 22:27:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 01:17:19 -0500 From: marthacd-AT- juno.com (MARTHA C DAVEY) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Valentine's Day (a dance) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19980112.012355.3478.1.marthaCD-AT- juno.com> References: Hi-, Vicky, et al, I did the following program: 1) New Year's Day in the Morning 2) Valentines Day 3) Spring 4) Easter Thursday 5) The Tweenty-ninth of May 6) Upon a Summer's Day 7) Halloween Triad 8) All Saint's Day 9) In the Fields in Frost and Snow 10)Sellinger'