Archive-Date: Sun, 06 Apr 1997 20:10:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 00:10:55 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: calling Colin To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704070423.AAA01855-AT- xis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Does anyone know how to contact Colin Hume now that he is in the U.S.? P.s., I'm back from Costa Rica, so it's okay to talk again. :-) I was glad not to have missed much, but it's been awfully quite on the list lately. ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 03:49:49 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 07:49:45 -0400 (EDT) From: RbnRussell-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: calling Colin To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970407074944_-2038007669-AT- emout09.mail.aol.com> Try Sharon Green at mls-AT- panix.com. I believe Colin will be in town for the NY ball. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 08:42:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 12:39:45 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Roger de Coverly/Virginia R To: ECD discussion list Message-ID: Subject: Time: 1:31 PM OFFICE MEMO Roger de Coverly/Virginia Reel? Date: 4/7/97 This is addressed primarily to Beverly Francis, who mentioned the topic in one of her Jane Austen posts, but anyone who is knowledgable on the subject is welcome to answer. In your post, Beverly, you said something to the effect that "Roger de Coverly" (or "Sir Roger de Coverly") was a good dance to do for Americans not familar with ECD, because they could recognize the similarity of it to the "Virginia Reel." I had always thought, although I couldn't cite where I got this idea, that the "Virginia Reel" *was* "Roger de Coverly" simply renamed. However, after reading your post I started thinking about it, and realized that I am not at all certain of how the "Virginia Reel" goes, because my memory of it from learning it in Junior High School is different from the way I've occasionally danced it in the past few years. I am quite certain that in the school version we did not do the "Strip the Willow" figure. So my question is - is there more than one version of the "Virginia Reel" and how different is it (are they) from "Roger de Coverly?" Also I have read that the "Virginia Reel" was George Washington's favorite dance (this one I could cite, except that the book's at home and I'm at work. That prompted me to speculate on whether the renaming of the dance was in honor of that particular Virginia gentleman. Anyone know? BTW, Jane Austen may not have mentioned that dance in any of her books, but George Elliot did. In _Silas Marner_ in a wonderful passage about a Christmas feast for the gentry, the old fiddler comes in and plays "Sir Roger de Coverly" which is the signal for everyone to get up and start the dance. He also plays "Far and Away." Barbara Ruth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 09:22:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 12:22:37 -0500 From: gaff-AT- neu.edu (Terence Gaffney) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re Contacting Colin To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Here is a reminder of how to get in touch with Colin Hume. His address and phone here in the Boston area are: 5 Edgehill Road Winchester MA 01890 USA Telephone: 617-729-4125 Colin will be leading a weekend here in Boston in the first weekend in May. This will include our first Friday dance and a Saturday dance at the Concord Scout house. Full details should be appearing soon on our web site. Terry Gaffney ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 11:52:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 14:02:00 -0400 (edt) From: "Potter, Donald" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Roger de Coverly/Virginia R To: Barbara Ruth , ECD discussion list Message-ID: <3349308C-AT- SMTPGW01.SCH.GE.COM> Barbara Ruth asked about the REAL Virginia Real .... The Virginia Reel is a "Scotch Reel" a three couple set dance with the following figures. It is also possible to do the dance as a triple minor ... but who would want to. A1 1 st couple hey on the opposite side (1st man with W2 and W3, and 1st W with M2 & M3) A2 1 st couple (w/ cpls 2 & 3) hey on their own side (women w/women, men w/men) B1 Chasse down the center, back and "cast off". The Colonial Assembly in Philadelphia has found that the "cast off" is best done via a chasse to the bottom with the first couple facing their partner as they progress to the bottom. Don ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 12:14:39 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 12:15:29 -0800 (PST) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: Roger de Coverly/Virginia R To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IHF99XZ1IQ90R0RL-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Barbara Ruth remarks: >BTW, Jane Austen may not have mentioned that dance in any of her books, but >George Elliot did. In _Silas Marner_ in a wonderful passage about a Christmas >feast for the gentry, the old fiddler comes in and plays "Sir Roger de Coverly" >which is the signal for everyone to get up and start the dance. He also plays >"Far and Away." And Charles Dickens mentions, in _A Christmas Carol_, that the great effect of the evening [of Mr. Fezziwig's ball] was when the fiddler struck up Sir Roger de Coverly. I have read (but can't cite my source, sorry) that Sir Roger was the nearly invariable ending to balls for many, many years. On tangentially-related topics, I note that there is _a_ Virginia Reel in either Morrison or Keller & Sweet, and the notes there indicate that it is one of many, none of which are the familiar-from-elementary-school version, which certainly resembles Sir Roger very closely. Curiously (considering that it's an _E_FDSS publication), the Community Dance Manuals give the Virginia Reel (to the tune of "Turkey in the Straw"), but don't list Sir Roger anywhere. -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 415/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 09:21:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 12:20:04 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Roger de Coverly/Virgin To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>>Roger de Coverly/Virginia R Alan Winston wrote: -------------------------------------- Barbara Ruth remarks: >BTW, Jane Austen may not have mentioned that dance in any of her books, but >George Elliot did. And Charles Dickens mentions, in _A Christmas Carol_, that the great effect of the evening [of Mr. Fezziwig's ball] was when the fiddler struck up Sir Roger de Coverly. I have read (but can't cite my source, sorry) that Sir Roger was the nearly invariable ending to balls for many, many years. ============================================================================= How wonderful! Thanks for pointing that out - I will have to go back and reread it. There is something delightful about picking up a long ago read book and discovering a reference to country dance that I'd never noticed before. It's like bumping into familiar friends in a foreign country. The Virginia Reel is mentioned by name in _Rose in Bloom_ by Louisa May Alcott, better known for having written _Little Women_. There is a scene where Rose announces that they are going to have "an old-fashioned contra dance" (I think the story is set somewhere around the 1850s) and they start it off with the Virginia Reel. I wonder if Virginia Reel/Sir Roger is the most alluded to country dance in English/A#004#merican literature. I haven't reread _Little Women_ in decades, but all of this prompts me to go back and do that to see if there are any other allusions to specific dances. As to Sir Roger being the nearly invariable ending to English balls, I know that Beverly Francis has mentioned that when she does her Jane Austen workshops (where are you Beverly!) I also recall hearing, but don't know how authentic this is, that Sir Roger actually started life as plain old "Roger de Coverly" and joined the nobility somewhere along the years, much as that good old mariner Patrick Spens also picked up a "Sir." Any experts out there who can verify or refute? Barbara Ruth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 10:02:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 13:03:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Roger de Coverly/Virgin To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704081703.NAA11383-AT- mail1.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:20 PM 4/8/97 -0400, Barbara Ruth wrote: > I also recall hearing, but don't know how authentic >this is, that Sir Roger actually started life as plain old "Roger de Coverly" >and joined the nobility somewhere along the years, much as that good old mariner >Patrick Spens also picked up a "Sir." Any experts out there who can verify or >refute? Neither a verification nor a refutation, but a footnote: COVERLEY, SIR ROGER DE, a character described by Addison in the 'Spectator.' He is a member of the Spectator Club, 'a gentleman of Worcestershire, of ancient descent, a baronet. His great-grandfather was inventor of that famous country dance which is called after him. He is a gentleman that is very singular in his behavior, but his singularities proceed from his good sense, and are contradictions to the manners of the world, only as he thinks the world is in the wrong....It is said, he keeps himself a batchelor, by reason he was crossed in love by a perverse beautiful widow of the next county to him.' He figures in a number of the 'Spectator' papers (both by Addison and Steele), being depicted at home, at church, at the assizes, in town, at the play, at Vauxhall, &c. [Oxford Companion to English Literature, 3rd Ed.] Perhaps the Spectator papers may hold some clues about the noble [or ignoble?] origins of the fictional baronet's purported ancestor. Happy hunting-- Sharon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 10:17:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 13:18:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: ECD in Children's Literature To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704081718.NAA12005-AT- mail1.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Re: Barbara Ruth's reference to country-dancing in Alcott's novels For depictions of country-dancing in children's literature, try the 30-plus Abbey Girls books by Elsie Oxenham. Oxenham, an avid folk-dancer, sets her tales in the early days of Sharp's revival, and references to teaching practices of the period and to the dances themselves abound. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 13:44:49 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 14:00:28 -0700 (PDT) From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Roger de Coverly/Virgin To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Barbara Ruth remarks: > I have read (but can't cite my source, sorry) that Sir Roger was >the nearly invariable ending to balls for many, many years. It seems as though the tradition lasted up to pretty recent times. In one of Dorothy Sayers' novels ( she wrote the Sir Peter Whimsey mysteries ) "Sir Roger" was done at midnight as the last dance of a masquerade ball. Vicky Bestock ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 14:25:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 17:27:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Carol G. Marsh" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Conference announcement To: English Country Dance Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Society of Dance History Scholars Conference, June 19-22, 1997 In 1979 at a conference at Barnard College in New York City, the Society of Dance History Scholars was formed. In 1997, SDHS will return to Barnard in celebration of the breadth and vigor our field has achieved in the intervening years. The open framework of this conference has resulted in an exciting program that represents a wide spectrum of topics and of intellectual approaches. The conference opens Thursday evening, June 19, with a reception in Barnard's Altschul Atrium. On Friday, Saturday, and Sunday the stimulating mixture of papers, roundtables, lecture-demonstrations, and workshops will run in three parallel sessions, each including from two to five presentations. The full program of the conference will appear in the spring SDHS newsletter. *Highlights of the conference include: Modern dance pioneers Writing dance biography Issues in Baroque dance reconstruction Image, film, and iconography Ballet in the 1920s New perspectives on dances of social protest The electronic preservation and retrieval of dance sources New discoveries in early dance Convergence of cultures and identities Gesture and pantomime Social dance training and the performance of cultural assimilation Dance in post-war Germany Dance, politics, and culture in 17th-century England Nineteenth-century ballet Dance institutions in New York City Form in dance and dance music *Workshops: Hanya Holm's circle study Lester Horton technique African dance Baroque gesture *PLUS -A memorial concert for Cynthia Jean Cohen Bull (Cynthia Novack) by the Richard Bull Dance Theatre on Friday, June 20, followed by a roundtable, "Ethnographies of Improvisation: The Work of Cynthia Jean Cohen Bull" -Working groups on Early Dance, on Ethnicity and Dance, and on Dance Reconstruction To receive a conference brochure or to join SDHS, send an email request to: Marge Maddux maddu001-AT- maroon.tc.umn.edu Please put "SDHS conference brochure request" in the subject line. (Please do NOT respond to me or to this list directly.) Carol G. Marsh | Phone: 910 334-5421 School of Music, UNCG | Fax: 910 334-5497 Greensboro, NC 27412 | E-mail: c_marsh-AT- hamlet.uncg.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 15:35:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 18:28:59 -0400 (EDT) From: catdancer-AT- juno.com (Helen Tuzio) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: BACDS Ball To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19970408.171230.6743.0.catdancer-AT- juno.com> Good Day, California! It's been a whole 72 hours and so far not a word has been printed about the BACDS ball. I know it was great; it could not have been otherwise with such wonderful talent involved and a lovely selection of dances. But some of us want details. PLEEEZ! Do tell! Helen Tuzio (an eager New Yorker who really would have preferred to have spent this weekend at the BACDS ball - can you tell?) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 09 Apr 1997 19:00:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 09 Apr 1997 21:53:48 -0400 From: The Dupre Family Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: The Virginia Reel To: 'ECD List' Message-ID: <01BC4530.99AF98E0-AT- ppp25.nerc.com> I almost always end one-nighters by calling the Virginia Reel so I'm delighted to hear there's a historical precedent for it. It's the last thing I do because if there's any traditional dance the average American has run into some way or another, or at least has heard of, it's the Virginia Reel. The crowd always goes wild (more or less!) when it's announced, and it ends the evening at a real high point. Sue Dupre Lawrenceville, NJ dupre-AT- nerc1.nerc.com ph: (609) 844-0459 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 09 Apr 1997 19:09:22 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:17:15 +1000 From: Martin Hungerford Subject: Re: Roger de Coverly/Virginia R To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <334C4DAB.5BF7-AT- netcon.net.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Barbara Ruth wrote: > > Subject: Time: 1:31 PM > OFFICE MEMO Roger de Coverly/Virginia Reel? Date: 4/7/97 > > This is addressed primarily to Beverly Francis, who mentioned the topic in one > of her Jane Austen posts, but anyone who is knowledgable on the subject is > welcome to answer. In your post, Beverly, you said something to the effect that > "Roger de Coverly" (or "Sir Roger de Coverly") was a good dance to do for > Americans not familar with ECD, because they could recognize the similarity of > it to the "Virginia Reel." I had always thought, although I couldn't cite where > I got this idea, that the "Virginia Reel" *was* "Roger de Coverly" simply > renamed. However, after reading your post I started thinking about it, and > realized that I am not at all certain of how the "Virginia Reel" goes, because > my memory of it from learning it in Junior High School is different from the way > I've occasionally danced it in the past few years. I am quite certain that in > the school version we did not do the "Strip the Willow" figure. So my question > is - is there more than one version of the "Virginia Reel" and how different is > it (are they) from "Roger de Coverly?" > Also I have read that the "Virginia Reel" was George Washington's favorite > dance (this one I could cite, except that the book's at home and I'm at work. > That prompted me to speculate on whether the renaming of the dance was in honor > of that particular Virginia gentleman. Anyone know? > > BTW, Jane Austen may not have mentioned that dance in any of her books, but > George Elliot did. In _Silas Marner_ in a wonderful passage about a Christmas > feast for the gentry, the old fiddler comes in and plays "Sir Roger de Coverly" > which is the signal for everyone to get up and start the dance. He also plays > "Far and Away." > > Barbara Ruth To our reading (Australian Bush danceing), Sir Roger is much closer to the Haymakers jig than a Virginia reel. Our virgina reel has a strip the Willow component, which Sir Roger. does not and the Haymaker's has the Sir Roger like corner activity martin ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 09 Apr 1997 21:44:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 00:45:51 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: (Fwd) Re: Roger de Coverly/Virgin To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704100459.AAA22555-AT- xis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT My apologies if you get this post twice. I sent it last night, but it never showed up on the list. Rich ------- Forwarded Message Follows ------- > this is, that Sir Roger actually started life as plain old "Roger de > Coverly" and joined the nobility somewhere along the years, much as > that good old mariner Patrick Spens also picked up a "Sir." Any > experts out there who can verify or refute? This is probably more info than you want. But, with much credit to Kitty Keller's "National Tune Index" as a research tool, here goes-- The dance "Roger of Coverly" (no "sir" and "of" rather than "de") first appeared in the 9th edition (1695) of Playford's Dancing Master and was retained through the last (18th) edition (1728). As usual, Walsh also published the dance (1718 & 1731) in his competing volumes. However, the Playford/Walsh dance is clearly a different dance than the Roger we know: "The 1. man go below the 2. wo. then round her, and so below the 2. man into his own place; then 1. wo go below the 2. man then round him, and so below the 2. wo. into her own place_: The 1. cu. cross over below the 2. cu. and take hands and turn round twice, then lead up through and cast off into the 2. cu. place." [Interestingly, Playford first gives the time signature as 3/9. In later editions and Walsh change to the more modern 9/4.] ----- Playford also published a dance to the same tune, called "Old Roger: The New Way" in The Second Volume of the Dancing Master (1713-1728). In the copy in the Library of Congress, someone, in a 19th century hand, has written in "Sir Roger de Coverly." That dance bears a remote resemblance our Roger: "The first Couple lead down and cast up, then cast off and lead down the 3d Couple and cast up. then the first Man turn the 3rd Wo. and the first Wo. turn the 3rd Man, then turn Partners, then go the half Figure of 8 and cast up, and cross over and turn." ------ Thompson published (in 1765) and I believe a different dance to essentially the same tune. Most of us would recognize Thompson's description, complete with something akin to the "strip the willow" figure: "The 1st Man goes down & foot it to the Bottom Wo. ._. the Wo: does the same with the Bottom Man .._. the Man foot it round the Bottom Wo: ._: the Wo: round the Bottom Man .._.. turn the Bottom Wo: .=. so on till you come up to the top then cross over and turn till you come to the Bottom." ----- Sir Roger de Coverly, was one of the primary characters in Joseph Addison's papers, The Spectator" (1711-1714). I understand the papers were mandatory reading for every school kid in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Quoting from paper #2, Friday, March 2, 1711: "The first of our society is a gentleman of Worchestershire, of ancient descent, a baronet, his name Sir Roger de Coverly. His great grandfather was inventor of that famous country-dance which is called after him. . . ." I have an 1880 republication of the Spectator with annotations by George Washington Greene. He adds the follow note: "The real sponsor to the joyous conclusion of every ball has only been recently revealed after a vigilant search. An autograph account by Ralph Thoresby, of the family of Calverley of Calverley in Yorkshire, dated 1717, and which is now in the possession of Sir W. Calverley Trevelyan, states that the tune of "Roger a Calverley" was named after Sir Roger of Calverley, who lived in the time of Richard the First. This knight, according to the custom of that period, kept minstrels, who took the name, from their office, of "Harper. Their descendants possessed lands in the neighborhood of Calverley , called Harperfroids and Harper's Spring. "The seal of this Sir Roger, appended to one of his charters is large, with a chevalier on horseback." "The earliest printed copy of the tune which has yet been traced is in 'a choice collection to a ground for a treble violin," by J. Playford, 1685. It appears again in 1695 in H. Playfords's "Dancing Master." Mr. Chappell, author of the elaborate work on English Melodies, believes it to have been a hornpipe. That it was popular about the "Spectator's" time is shown from a passage in a satirical history of Powel the puppet man (1715)"--"Upon the preludes being ended each party fell to bawling and calling for particular tunes. The hobnailed fellows, whose breeches and lungs seemed to be of the same leather, cried out for 'Cheshire Round,' 'Roger of Coverly,' 'Joan's Placket,' and 'Northern Nancy.'" "Steele owned that the notion of adapting the name to the good genial old knight, originated with Swift.--*" ----- Chappell pushes the date for the tune back to at least 1648 with a quote from the King's Pamphlets describing a quarrel between a Sir Hugh Caverley and Mr. John Griffiths, in Cheshire: "I made the fiddler play a tune called Roger of Caulveley from one end of the town to the other. This I did to shew that I did not fear to be disarmed by them." ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 09:37:44 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:39:54 -0500 (EST) From: Jim Morgan Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Simple Circle Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I'm looking for a simple circle dance to teach at an outdoor gathering. I know Jumping Joan (maybe too simple), and am thinking a modified Gathering Peascods might work. I've also seen people use Abram's Circle Dance. Does anyone have any other suggestions that would be simple, fun, and at least a little bit traditional? Jim Morgan morganj-AT- iupui.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 10:56:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:55:36 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Simple Circle Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970410115536.2e1e-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> For a simple circle dance, I've had good luck with Circassian Circle (sp?) I think it's listed in the Community Dances Manual. If not, many folks on the list can supply the figures. Forbes/Baker ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:21:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 13:23:25 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Simple Circle Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704101823.NAA01293-AT- ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> Depending on how simple you want it you might consider Selenger's Round, Circassian Circle or La Bastringue. You can also do Jovial Beggars as a circle mixer (triple progression). Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 19:20:40 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 22:21:38 -0400 (EDT) From: BHFrancis-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Sir Roger de Coverley To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: BHFrancis-AT- aol.com Message-ID: <970410222044_1387690594-AT- emout14.mail.aol.com> Many thanks to Rich Galloway for tracing the steps of the gallant Roger. When Thomas Wilson published "Sir Roger de Coverley" in his _Compete System of English Country Dancing_ in 1820, he subtitled it "The Finishing Dance" and included the following: "This dance should be the finishing one, as it is calculated to form the sociality of its construction to promote the good humour of the company, and causing them to separate in evincing a pleasing satisfaction with each other." He has a familiar tune in 9/8 time. The figures include the recognizable corners advancing and retiring, but instead of a strip the willow figure, the active couple weaves to the bottom "shoelace" style. There are clearly a few evolutionary steps between this dance and the mid-twentieth century gym class dance. Perhaps someone can help fill in some of the gaps. Philip Richardson, in his _Social Dances of the 19th Century in England_ says "Before the middle of the century the increasing popularity of the Quadrille and the more intimate Waltz and the invasion of our ballrooms by the Polka swept the Country Dance off the floor. The only one that lingered and remained popular, particularly as a "finishing dance" was "Sir Roger de Coverley" and long before the end of the century even this had been relegated to Christmas and children's parties. In America, however, this particular dance survived a long time as the Virginia Reel, and here to avoid long periods of inaction the full set was divided into "Duple Minor" sets, so that all couples were dancing all the time." Richardson's description of the dance being relegated to an item for jolly parties certainly fits in with Mr. Fezziwig's ball in Dickens' _Christmas Carol_ and the other sightings in relatively "rustic" novels. Beverly Francis ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 22:34:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 15:42:21 +1000 From: Martin Hungerford Subject: Re: Simple Circle Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <334DCF3D.46EB-AT- netcon.net.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Jim Morgan wrote: > > I'm looking for a simple circle dance to teach at an outdoor gathering. I > know Jumping Joan (maybe too simple), and am thinking a modified Gathering > Peascods might work. I've also seen people use Abram's Circle Dance. Does > anyone have any other suggestions that would be simple, fun, and at least > a little bit traditional? > > Jim Morgan > morganj-AT- iupui.edu Sir, why don't you try some of the Bransles from Arbaeu. My favourite's the Burgundian Brawl (Bransle de Bourgougne). Simple, quite trad and rather fun. We use it at weddings for people with no background in trad dance to good effect Martin Hungerford of Rackham's Merrie Players ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 08:44:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 11:45:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "David R. Woolf" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Ashford Anniversary To: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Can anyone give me the instructions to "Ashford Anniversary". If possible, I need them by tomorrow (Sat) morning. Sorry for the rush. Thanks very much, in advance! -David ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ David Woolf Emory Eye Center W - 404/778-4121 Emory University H - 404/355-2827 Atlanta, GA 30322 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 11:44:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 14:45:23 -0500 (EST) From: MEAD-AT- BINAH.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Pinewoods Early Music Week To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01IHKZS04OQEHVDWZ1-AT- BINAH.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Early Music Week 1997 at Pinewoods Camp Country Dance and Song Society (CDSS) June 26 - July 3 (Thursday - Thursday) Sarah Mead, Program Director STAFF: English Country Dance: Brad Foster, Gene Murrow Musicianship Training for Dance Leaders: Gene Murrow Historical Dance & Violin: Julie Andrijeski Recorder and flute: Ken Andresen,Eric Haas,Judith Linsenberg, Gene Murrow ,Chris Rua,Jennifer Barron Southcott Viol: Martha Bishop,Janet Haas,Larry Lipkis, Sarah Mead,Alice Robbins Early Brass: Mack Ramsey Keyboard & Chorus: Frances Fitch Plucked Strings & Voice: Joel Frederiksen Special Events: Kit Campbell, Julian Cole THEME: Upon a Summers Day - music of the seasons, months and days This summer our dates fall at an unusual time. instead of our usual week in July, we start on the last Thursday in June. In honor of our new month, day, and season, we will focus on music written to celebrate the seasons,months of the year, and special days, drawn from the rich repertoires of the 15th, 16th & 17th centuries. PROGRAM: Nig English Country and Historical Dance classes Beginning viol, recorder, and harp Chorus and small vocal ensembles Morning technique and repertory classes Afternoon mixed ensembles and specialty classes Staff and student concerts Lecture/demonstrations Open readings PINEWOODS CAMP: A lovely rustic setting between two cyrstal-clear ponds Swimming, canoeing, birdwatching Marvellous food, homebaked breads, vegetarian options Evening entertainments A friendly and welcoming community INFORMATION and REGISTRATION: CDSS, 17 New South St., Northampton, MA 01060 (413) 584-9913 - email: camp-AT- cdss.org ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 22:23:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 01:24:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Mary2dance-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Ashford Anniversary To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970412012451_571635753-AT- emout17.mail.aol.com> David: This is from memory, since we did it Wednesday night. Up a double and back. Fall back and come forward. chorus: 1st woman and 3rd man skip around the set to the other's place while other dancers set diagonally to their right and cross, all turn single. Set to new partner and turn two hands to place. Pat Shaw siding, chorus. Arming, chorus. Mary Luckhardt ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 09:15:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 12:16:54 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Ashford Anniversary To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII This is in response to Mary2dance-AT- aol.com: One of the great things about internet and all that goes with it is the opportunity to reach a specific audience directly. I hope this reaches everyone involved in any way with English Country Dance: "Pat Shaw siding" is a bad misnomer because he didn't invent it. He, along with many others, discovered it in the 18th-c. dance books whose notation he was studying. So it should be '18th-c.,' or 'old siding,' to distinguish it from Sharp's invention. What Shaw did was to teach it everywhere he went, with the result that anyone who did dances his way learned an old figure without knowing it, and therefore without prejudice! Now if we could just get the terminology straightened out everything would be fine! The reason Sharp invented his siding was that he apparently hadn't seen the original notations; he admitted he didn't know the original figure and so invented something that would fill the time and pass sides. But since it isn't symmetrical we should all have been suspicious of it! Anyway, we know now. So I plead that we should use 'old siding' for all dances from before the 20th century. Julia Sutton On Sat, 12 Apr 1997 Mary2dance-AT- aol.com wrote: > David: > > This is from memory, since we did it Wednesday night. > > Up a double and back. Fall back and come forward. > > chorus: > 1st woman and 3rd man skip around the set to the other's place while other > dancers set diagonally to their right and cross, all turn single. Set to new > partner and turn two hands to place. > > Pat Shaw siding, chorus. Arming, chorus. > > Mary Luckhardt > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 09:15:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 12:16:54 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Ashford Anniversary To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII This is in response to Mary2dance-AT- aol.com: One of the great things about internet and all that goes with it is the opportunity to reach a specific audience directly. I hope this reaches everyone involved in any way with English Country Dance: "Pat Shaw siding" is a bad misnomer because he didn't invent it. He, along with many others, discovered it in the 18th-c. dance books whose notation he was studying. So it should be '18th-c.,' or 'old siding,' to distinguish it from Sharp's invention. What Shaw did was to teach it everywhere he went, with the result that anyone who did dances his way learned an old figure without knowing it, and therefore without prejudice! Now if we could just get the terminology straightened out everything would be fine! The reason Sharp invented his siding was that he apparently hadn't seen the original notations; he admitted he didn't know the original figure and so invented something that would fill the time and pass sides. But since it isn't symmetrical we should all have been suspicious of it! Anyway, we know now. So I plead that we should use 'old siding' for all dances from before the 20th century. Julia Sutton On Sat, 12 Apr 1997 Mary2dance-AT- aol.com wrote: > David: > > This is from memory, since we did it Wednesday night. > > Up a double and back. Fall back and come forward. > > chorus: > 1st woman and 3rd man skip around the set to the other's place while other > dancers set diagonally to their right and cross, all turn single. Set to new > partner and turn two hands to place. > > Pat Shaw siding, chorus. Arming, chorus. > > Mary Luckhardt > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 17:50:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 20:51:47 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: "Old Siding" To: ECD list Message-ID: <199704132051_MC2-1433-A1C1-AT- compuserve.com> For Julia Sutton and others on the list regarding the recent post of instructions for Ashford Anniversary... Many ECD callers have been using the term "side by side" for the "old siding" re-introduced into ECD circles by Pat Shaw. Side by side is a very good term-- the sibiliants carry well as a prompt over a crowded hall, it describes the movement succinctly, and it avoids (yet another!) confusion caused when we used to say "old siding," since Pat's introduction of the figure was "new" to many of us who were raised on Sharp's original interpretation (which was "old"). See what I mean? I hope we can standardize on "side by side right" and "side by side left" to describe the symmetric movements. For consistency's sake, we've been looking for a substitute for "Sharp siding." Some candidate are "crescent siding" or "swirl siding." Any others out there? An aside from Gene Murrow, ECD leader and fan of Sharp, Shaw, and Sutton ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 18:20:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:21:50 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Gene: The problem with your term for the old siding is that it only looks at the movement of the bodies, and says nothing about the movement's significance. But of course the significance is vital here--partners are SUPPOSED TO BE LOOKING AT EACH OTHER! ! ! What your 20th c. desription does hints nothing of this, for it simply places the bodies side by side, thus encouraging the 20th century vogue of no-contact dancing. If you can find a way to say all this in two words let me know! My point is that the flirtatious aspect of this movement must be recognized when it's taught, and reinforced whenever we can do it. As for the objection that people can't relearn chronology when it contradicts their assumptions, my argument is that they can (I did, so . . .), and that talking down to them (essentially your suggestion?) shows perhaps some disrespect for the reasoning abilities of all those intelligent people who can and do learn the complexities of ECD perfectly well! Julia On Sun, 13 Apr 1997, Gene Murrow wrote: > For Julia Sutton and others on the list regarding the recent post of > instructions for Ashford Anniversary... > > Many ECD callers have been using the term "side by side" for the "old > siding" re-introduced into ECD circles by Pat Shaw. Side by side is a very > good term-- the sibiliants carry well as a prompt over a crowded hall, it > describes the movement succinctly, and it avoids (yet another!) confusion > caused when we used to say "old siding," since Pat's introduction of the > figure was "new" to many of us who were raised on Sharp's original > interpretation (which was "old"). See what I mean? I hope we can > standardize on "side by side right" and "side by side left" to describe the > symmetric movements. > > For consistency's sake, we've been looking for a substitute for "Sharp > siding." Some candidate are "crescent siding" or "swirl siding." Any > others out there? > > An aside from Gene Murrow, ECD leader and fan of Sharp, Shaw, and Sutton > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 18:20:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:21:50 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Gene: The problem with your term for the old siding is that it only looks at the movement of the bodies, and says nothing about the movement's significance. But of course the significance is vital here--partners are SUPPOSED TO BE LOOKING AT EACH OTHER! ! ! What your 20th c. desription does hints nothing of this, for it simply places the bodies side by side, thus encouraging the 20th century vogue of no-contact dancing. If you can find a way to say all this in two words let me know! My point is that the flirtatious aspect of this movement must be recognized when it's taught, and reinforced whenever we can do it. As for the objection that people can't relearn chronology when it contradicts their assumptions, my argument is that they can (I did, so . . .), and that talking down to them (essentially your suggestion?) shows perhaps some disrespect for the reasoning abilities of all those intelligent people who can and do learn the complexities of ECD perfectly well! Julia On Sun, 13 Apr 1997, Gene Murrow wrote: > For Julia Sutton and others on the list regarding the recent post of > instructions for Ashford Anniversary... > > Many ECD callers have been using the term "side by side" for the "old > siding" re-introduced into ECD circles by Pat Shaw. Side by side is a very > good term-- the sibiliants carry well as a prompt over a crowded hall, it > describes the movement succinctly, and it avoids (yet another!) confusion > caused when we used to say "old siding," since Pat's introduction of the > figure was "new" to many of us who were raised on Sharp's original > interpretation (which was "old"). See what I mean? I hope we can > standardize on "side by side right" and "side by side left" to describe the > symmetric movements. > > For consistency's sake, we've been looking for a substitute for "Sharp > siding." Some candidate are "crescent siding" or "swirl siding." Any > others out there? > > An aside from Gene Murrow, ECD leader and fan of Sharp, Shaw, and Sutton > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 18:28:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:29:38 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Gene: Further on siding--I'm serious about the need to teach people to flirt! There are some, as you know, who pick this up quite naturally, but my findings with people of today is that they want to think of old dances as devoid of all sexual suggestion! Think of Don Giovanni's seduction duet with Zerlina--without his having to touch her, Mozart's musical gestures convince us that he has! We're talking of a silent but potent body language here that it's up to us, as teachers, to impart. Ahem. Ahem. Julia ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 18:28:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:29:38 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Gene: Further on siding--I'm serious about the need to teach people to flirt! There are some, as you know, who pick this up quite naturally, but my findings with people of today is that they want to think of old dances as devoid of all sexual suggestion! Think of Don Giovanni's seduction duet with Zerlina--without his having to touch her, Mozart's musical gestures convince us that he has! We're talking of a silent but potent body language here that it's up to us, as teachers, to impart. Ahem. Ahem. Julia ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 18:59:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 22:00:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sun, 13 Apr 1997, Gene Murrow wrote: [snip] > For consistency's sake, we've been looking for a substitute for "Sharp > siding." Some candidate are "crescent siding" or "swirl siding." Any > others out there? How about "mooning"? ;) ... just a lunatic suggestion from Eric Arnold, ECD hanger-in-there and fan of Gene Murrow. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 19:12:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 22:14:26 -0400 From: mls-AT- panix.com (Michael Siemon) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:00 PM 4/13/97, Eric Arnold wrote: > >> For consistency's sake, we've been looking for a substitute for "Sharp >> siding." Some candidate are "crescent siding" or "swirl siding." Any >> others out there? > >How about "mooning"? ;) Are you deriving that from "crescent siding?" I'm sorry, but I am forcibly presented with the image of callers shouting out, betimes: "Sharp mooning" or "Shaw mooning" -- the mind, as they say, boggles. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 00:03:44 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 02:43:31 -0400 (EDT) From: webatcheler-AT- juno.com (Wayne Batcheler) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: "Old siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19970414.024042.6967.0.webatcheler-AT- juno.com> Gene's suggestion to standardize on "side by side left" and "side by side right" seems very good to me, because descriptive. "Sharp siding" is also perfectly OK as a prompt, and while not descriptive has the advantage of providing an occasion for the caller to pass on some historical lore while explaining the difference between the two. "Swirl siding" doesn't really describe the motion, but rather emphasizes an undesirable tendency to exaggerate the "swoop" beyond the ability of some to control it and return to place in time. And, for me, the word "swirl" is out of character with the other standard prompts and "moon" is just too awful to contemplate. As for Julia's thinking that flirtation is being neglected these days, I would invite her to come to our New York dances. Wayne Batcheler New York ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:02:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:23:53 -0400 (EDT) From: CF1125-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970414142350_-1066807847-AT- emout16.mail.aol.com> I like Colin Hume's term "banana siding" for the Sharp version of siding. What you call Pat Shaw's interpretation hardly matters as long as you flirt while you do it. -Carl Friedman ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:02:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 15:24:12 -0500 From: Erna-Lynne Bogue Subject: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <33529267.50BC-AT- ix.netcom.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Julia says that we need to teach people to flirt. I take some exception. We do need to encourage people to interact. Living in a time period in which sex is used to sell everything from garage door openers to toothpaste, I don't think we need to do anything extra to introduce the notion of sexuality into connectedness: once people connect, they will figure out the possibilities on their own. In fact, I think there is sometimes an over-emphasis on the sexual end of flirtation. No, I'm not a prude. But I have encountered several women who find the over-bearing leering of the people they encounter in gypsies to be just TOO MUCH to bear -- especially if the height differences are great. I've also begun to be somewhat apalled at the facial expressions I've seen on otherwise intelligent people when they come to the more flirtatious parts of a dance. There are many ways to enjoy the presence and company of another person. Some of them are sexual and lustful. Others are friendly, companionable, playful, mysterious, polite, joking, inquiring, sedate, pretty, strong. I would much rather help people find the moments to connect, and then let them express themselves in a wide variety of moods - NOT prescribe one style alone. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:02:19 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 08:56:02 -0400 (EDT) From: MartinezPC-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970414085601_-1369305152-AT- emout07.mail.aol.com> In a message dated 97-04-13 21:23:00 EDT, Julia Sutton writes: "Gene: The problem with your term for the old siding is that it only looks at the movement of the bodies, and says nothing about the movement's significance. But of course the significance is vital here--partners are SUPPOSED TO BE LOOKING AT EACH OTHER! ! ! What your 20th c. desription does hints nothing of this, for it simply places the bodies side by side, thus encouraging the 20th century vogue of no-contact dancing. If you can find a way to say all this in two words let me know! My point is that the flirtatious aspect of this movement must be recognized when it's taught, and reinforced whenever we can do it." Hmmmm, would hearing a teacher say "old siding" put more of a twinkle in my eye than hearing "side by side"? I think I'm missing something here... Julia's point that flirtation was part of historical dance is well taken, but it doesn't seem to be lacking in any of the 20th century ECD communities where I've danced either. I feel the important thing is for teachers to convey the message Julia has in "caps" above, the importance of that old familiar "eye contact" with their partners and fellow dancers. This can at times turn out to be flirtatious or it can simply be friendly. Both are fine, but as a dancer, I want to make that choice myself and not be directed to flirt at a given moment by the teacher. As a prompt, I cast my vote for "side by side". In addition to being descriptive and efficient, there's a pleasing rhythmic quality to it that "old siding" would lack. Carol Martinez ECD'er always ready to smile and sometimes ready to flirt no matter what you decide to call the figure ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:02:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:23:51 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>"Old siding" I believe I have also heard it called as "shoulder to shoulder" left or right, which is equally clear and descriptive. I also agree with Wayne that "Sharp siding" is a perfectly reasonable term, since in this case it was invented by the person getting the credit (and a very fine invention in my opinion). If the objection to "side to side" or "shoulder to shoulder" is that it doesn't explicitly convey directions to dancers to look at each other and flirt during the movement, it's hard to see how "old siding" is an improvement. For that matter, none of the other standard dance terms directly express that - "turn by the hand," "arming," "up a double," "cast" etc. With the possible exception of "gypsy" which is defined as making eye contact (and then you still have to _know_ that is the meaning), all the terms refer to movements. Looking a partner in the eye and flirting are things that are picked up by watching others or are explained in the teaching/walk-through, not explicitly described in the calls. And again I'll echo Wayne and say that if anyone thinks there isn't enough flirting going on at modern English dances, try coming to our New Haven dance. (I throw down the gauntlet - how do we objectively measure flirting per capita, so we can see which can actually test which dance has a higher flirt intensity?) Incidentally, since Julia's last post on the subject, where she pointed out that the point of this kind of siding is to _touch_ shoulders, I have been trying to incorporate that when I can (not always easy when the partners are a foot taller) and it is indeed a flirtatious move. That seems to me to be something for callers and leaders to make a point of explaining during a walk-through. Barbara Ruth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:09:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 09:45:20 -0400 (EDT) From: darby.1-AT- osu.edu (Michael V. Darby) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: virginia reel To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704141345.JAA24277-AT- mail4.uts.ohio-state.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >To our reading (Australian Bush danceing), Sir Roger is much closer to >the Haymakers jig than a Virginia reel. Our virgina reel has a strip the >Willow component, which Sir Roger. does not and the Haymaker's has the >Sir Roger like corner activity In Elizabeth Burchenal's 1918 book American country-Dances Volume I, she gives the Virginia Reel using as one of the three offered tunes "Sir Roger de Coverly". This is a 9/8 jig, and presumably the proper tune for the dance "Sir Roger...". I've seen another but similar variation of this tune with the same title in other tune books. The dance begins with figures executed by the head and foot corners (forward & back, swing right hand, swing left hand, swing both hands, dos-a-dos). This is followed by "right hand to partner and reel" -- the strip-the -willow figure, finishing with the head couple galoping up to place. The next figure is "March" and consists of the whole set casting around to place. The sequence concludes with the top couple slipping to the bottom under arched arms to effect the progression. With some variations, usually in the first figures or in the march and progression with arches, I believe this is the way the dance continues to done in most parts of the US. I've seen no instructions for the modern "Sir Roger...". John Fitzhugh Millar notes that the Virginia Reel/Sir Roger may derive from the old dance Trenchmore. This dance (name) is first mentioned in 1564 in a Wm. Bulleyn's play. It does not appear in Playford til 1721. The dance begins with couples leading up (or forward) a double and back. This is followed by a cast off to the bottom and lead back up to the top (the"March"). The next figure is arches of the dip and dive variety, the head couple returning to the top. The last figure is arm right w/ partner and left with the next, i.e. the "reel" figure again with the top couple returning to the top. Playford suggests that this last figure be repeated with hand turns and finally with setting. The dance as described is not progressive. I've seen it suggested that the name Trenchmore derives from Rinnce Mor, an Irish term meaning the "big (great?) dance", though today the term is usually used for circle dances. The dip and dive arches figure does occur in the Irish ceildhi dance "Waves of Tory". If the dance mentioned by Bulleyn had the same figures as the one mentioned by Playford, then Trenchmore/Sir Roger/Virginia Reel is probably not only the most popular dance but one of the longest lived dances ever devised. Not to mention all it's relatives like Strip the Willow, Waves of Tory, Cumberland Reel, Willow Tree etc. Michael Darby Columbus, Ohio ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 15:14:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:39:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII It is particularly useful to have very short (two-word maximum, if possible) phrases for use in the actual calling of a dance, both to help to keep the timing clear and to avoid cluttering up the music with more words than are necessary. For the teaching of the figures, there is room for a few more words without it becoming too much, and the phrases "side-by-side right" and "side-by-side left" seems quite concise and appropriate in the latter context. The other type, for which I haven't yet found the ultimately acceptable term, but which for the moment might be called "half-circle siding" or "parentheses siding", requires a similarly long phrase, and both of these seem lime more than I want to say during the dance itself. Once the figure has been explained, it is a simple matter to tell the dancers what your call will be, and I can imagine saying "side right" or "side left" as a call for "old" siding, and "side over" and "side back" for the other type. The distinction is admittedly small, but at this point the dancers should know what they are supposed to do, and all that they need is a prompt which they can associate with a pre-programmed move. I can imagine saying "side over and back" as a call, even though it's four words, because the "side over" part can be delivered in a timely way to prompt the beginning of the move, and the "and back", even if delivered on the beat that the figure should start on, still doesn't prevent the dancers from being able to start their response with the music. Just as long as nobody writes a good dance using both figures! Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 15:18:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:19:37 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: siding terminology To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704142219.RAA20745-AT- ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> I prefer to refer to "siding-to-a-line" and "curvy siding" during the walkthrough. Once the dance is going you aren't going to switch which type is being done (I don't think). If the dance is called, then side-right and side-left refer to siding to a line. Just "side" would then be the other type. My personal preference is the linear siding, but we do both in our local group. We try to emphasise eye-contact. Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 15:43:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:39:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704142139.RAA13534-AT- panix4.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 08:56 AM 4/14/97 -0400, Carol wrote: >Hmmmm, would hearing a teacher say "old siding" put more of a twinkle in my >eye than hearing "side by side"? I think I'm missing something here... > >Julia's point that flirtation was part of historical dance is well taken, but >it doesn't seem to be lacking in any of the 20th century ECD communities >where I've danced either. I feel the important thing is for teachers to >convey the message Julia has in "caps" above, the importance of that old >familiar "eye contact" with their partners and fellow dancers. This can at >times turn out to be flirtatious or it can simply be friendly. Both are >fine, but as a dancer, I want to make that choice myself and not be directed >to flirt at a given moment by the teacher. > >As a prompt, I cast my vote for "side by side". In addition to being >descriptive and efficient, there's a pleasing rhythmic quality to it that >"old siding" would lack. I also cast my vote for "side by side," though I've heard Colin advocate the term "into line," as in "All move forward into line right shoulder to right." On the other hand, Colin likes the term "banana siding".... (-: Sharon Green (Flirt? Moi?) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 16:51:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:43:48 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old Siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970414174348.34ac-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> The discussion of siding seems to be missing one curious element. Don't we walk-through or at least talk-through (for the "Those Who Know It" dances) the dance? That's the ideal place to discuss (In ten words or less, please, "For those who know") to let folks know what siding the leader prefers and to drop the two word phrase used to prompt. I don't think siding has reach the 'star wars' phase. That's when four different peopl try to do their right and left hand stars in a variety of ways. There are a couple of area groups that I don't dance with because of the type of the multiple choice hand grips that seem to appear every time. Forbes/Baker U ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:11:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:37:14 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970414173714.34ac-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> As author of the "RE: Siding & Sexual Suggestion" would you please identify yourself. This will give your comments credibility. Without knowing who you are, I cannot take your comments seriously. Forbes/Baker University Thanks ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:02:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 09:27:48 -0400 From: rjackso1-AT- mcfly.sanders.lockheed.com (Richard Jackson) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704151327.JAA04736-AT- thole.sanders.lockheed.com> >> Julia says that we need to teach people to flirt. I take some >> exception. We do need to encourage people to interact. I agree with Erna-Lynne, encourage interaction in general. I think that teaching people when and where to flirt with someone is like saying "At this point, you need to be spontaneous" Teach people to dance with other people. That is what we are there for, dancing with other people. The nature of the dance and the nature of people will lead to flirtation where it is natural to do so. I have seen lots of people over the years coming at me with these bug-eyes sticking out because someone told them they needed to make eye contact. Rich Jackson ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:03:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 00:35:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Christine Robb Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: virginia reel To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 14 Apr 1997, Michael V. Darby wrote: > John Fitzhugh Millar notes that the Virginia Reel/Sir Roger may derive from > the old dance Trenchmore. This dance (name) is first mentioned in 1564 in a > Wm. Bulleyn's play. [snip] > If the dance mentioned by Bulleyn had the same figures as the one > mentioned by Playford, then Trenchmore/Sir Roger/Virginia Reel is > probably not only the most popular dance but one of the longest > lived dances ever devised. Julia Sutton would be able to give you more precise dates, but I wouldn't count on the Bulleyn reference to be anything like the Trenchmore you described. There are early references to Trenchmore which indicate a three-person dance. Even so, I expect the point is still valid for Western European dance. Christine ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:03:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 22:18:48 -0400 (EDT) From: "m.a.j. mckenna" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: roger de coverley, literary reference, late as always To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19970414203315.4fc727a8-AT- pop.mindspring.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" hi all; sorry to come in so far behind cue, but a major mail crash kept me off line for 2 weeks (and oh the horror of my mailbox when i finally got in...) if anyone's still looking (or ever was) for references to Sir Roger, it plays a key role in the Dorothy Sayers' short story, "The Queen's Square." fairly well described, also. maryn mck. atlanta =-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-= M.A.J. McKenna staff writer, the Atlanta Journal-Constitution 404.526.5987 vox 404.526.5509 fax Standard disclaimers apply. =-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-= ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:03:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 20:28:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704150028.UAA27760-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 05:37 PM 4/14/97 -0500, you wrote: >As author of the "RE: Siding & Sexual Suggestion" would you please >identify yourself. This will give your comments credibility. Without >knowing who you are, I cannot take your comments seriously. > >Forbes/Baker University Dear John [NOT George, as others have supposed]: Doesn't your E-mail setup provide you with some sort of heading that states such info? Mine does: it indicated quite plainly that the sender of that posting was Erna-Lynne Bogue, a fine dancer, teacher, & CDSS Board member, someone whose comments I'm always interested to hear. Faithfully yours, Sharon Green *Friends on the List: I'm puzzled by this occurrence. Do we get our info packaged differently, depending on our server, the phase of the moon (crescent?), the whims of the gods? I am new enough at E-mail that this is a Mystery to me. Gene and other computer-literate folk, please explain what's going on, okay? Much love, Sharon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:12:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:11:00 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: virginia reel To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970415121100.2d51-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> Use the research of John Fitzhugh Millar with great care. He may be an acknowledged expert in maritime history, but his self-published works do not make him an historical expert in matters of dance. John M. Forbes/Baker University. I.E.: In good dance research, always do the work yourself. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:16:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:10:56 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggest To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>>Siding & Sexual Suggestion >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As author of the "RE: Siding & Sexual Suggestion" would you please identify yourself. This will give your comments credibility. Without knowing who you are, I cannot take your comments seriously. Forbes/Baker University Thanks >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Funny, I take the opposite approach. I evaluate a person's credibility based on whether their comments strike me as cogent and making sense, not the other way around. Barbara Ruth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:33:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:34:57 -0700 From: Bruce Hamilton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: BACDS Playford Ball To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: hamilton-AT- hplbh.hpl.hp.com Message-ID: <199704151834.AA216729296-AT- hplbh.hpl.hp.com> After our Playford Ball last April 5, Helen Tuzio asked for reports. I didn't think it appropriate for me, as MC, to write one, so I held back to let others speak for us. As far as I can tell, no one has said anything. Now I and some of the other committee members are curious. Those who were at the ball: is there anything you wanted to say but were too polite to post? We'd like to hear it. Write to me or Alisa Dodson . If you write to her soon, she can include your comments in the minutes from the wrap-up meeting. Thanks. Bruce Hamilton Hewlett-Packard Laboratories MS-4AD Phone 415-857-2818 PO Box 10150 Fax 415-852-8092 Palo Alto, CA 94303-0889 bruce_hamilton-AT- hpl.hp.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:37:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:38:54 -0400 From: walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704151838.AA20696-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" People don't have to flirt (not that I don't), but people do like to be acknowledged and it would help if folkswere reminded that dancing is done with partners (and a set) and with the whole body. Those who aren't bug-eyed are often looking down at their feet or off in a world of their own. On the terminology front: for folks who know the alternatives, they simply need to know which is operative. I cast my vote with the simplist and least cute -- side by side siding or across siding. Danny Walkowitz > Daniel J. Walkowitz Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University New York, New York 10003-6607 tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 11:59:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:01:32 -0500 From: gaff-AT- neu.edu (Terence Gaffney) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: 4th of July weekend To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Details on the Fourth of July weekend at pinewoods which the Boston Centre sponsors are now available on our web site. Our URL is: http://www.math.neu.edu/~gaffney/CDS.html best, Terry ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:09:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:05:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: NPR Visits CD*NY ECD To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704151905.PAA20664-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" In the wake of the New York Times article on Jane Austen & English country dancing, CD*NY has been getting lots of lovely newcomers & also much media interest. (We are the flavor of the month.) Tonight a crew from NPR's "All Things Considered" led by Linda Wertheimer and Lisa Harmon is coming to Duane to cover the final stages of our preparation for the ball (and to view the effects of the influx of beginners on our program). The NPR tentative game plan is to broadcast whatever bits & pieces they come up with some time on Friday, the day before our ball, when the segment will have some topicality. Brad Foster will be with us, and we hope to do some good for all the English groups here in the States by making folks aware that English country happens all over the place. Check your local NPR station for "All Things Considered" and wish us luck. We're bracing ourselves for a possible second influx of beginners, and a new, post-ball English schedule will soon go up on our web site. If you wind up getting hordes of new folks, let us know; if there's anything we can do to help you bring them into the community, we'd be glad to try. Much love, Sharon Green ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:45:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:44:35 -0800 (pst) From: afeldman-AT- oacis.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Email systems and author info To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9703158611.AA861129925-AT- ccsmtp.bellahs.com> As Sharon suggested, different email systems show the header info differently. Mine, for instance, does not show me the author unless I click to open another window, at which point the window with the message disappears (how annoying). And with the number of messages that are posted to the ECD list, I'm very glad I don't have to do this on every one, since most messages have a name at the bottom. Thanks to all of you who regularly DO put your name at the bottom of your posts, and to those that don't--some of us would certainly appreciate it! Anise Feldman Novato, CA ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:51:47 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:52:58 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Once again this darned 20th century is getting in the way! Most of the responses to this discussion seem to assume that by sexual suggestion I mean something broad and rather lewd. Heaven forfend! Of course I mean gentle interaction--anything resembling ogling, breast-baring, or hip-swishing would have been forbidden in polite company (and of course we can speak only of polite company when we speak of Playford, who dealt with the upper crust). So I say again, teach people to flirt, or charm, or whatever you may call it, but put flirting in dance into a polite, genteel context; certainly don't take Hollywood as your model! Julia Sutton On Tue, 15 Apr 1997, Richard Jackson wrote: > > >> Julia says that we need to teach people to flirt. I take some > >> exception. We do need to encourage people to interact. > > I agree with Erna-Lynne, encourage interaction in general. > I think that teaching people when and where to flirt with someone > is like saying "At this point, you need to be spontaneous" > > Teach people to dance with other people. That is what we are there > for, dancing with other people. The nature of the dance and the > nature of people will lead to flirtation where it is natural to do > so. > > I have seen lots of people over the years coming at me with these > bug-eyes sticking out because someone told them they needed to > make eye contact. > > > Rich Jackson > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:51:49 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:52:58 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Once again this darned 20th century is getting in the way! Most of the responses to this discussion seem to assume that by sexual suggestion I mean something broad and rather lewd. Heaven forfend! Of course I mean gentle interaction--anything resembling ogling, breast-baring, or hip-swishing would have been forbidden in polite company (and of course we can speak only of polite company when we speak of Playford, who dealt with the upper crust). So I say again, teach people to flirt, or charm, or whatever you may call it, but put flirting in dance into a polite, genteel context; certainly don't take Hollywood as your model! Julia Sutton On Tue, 15 Apr 1997, Richard Jackson wrote: > > >> Julia says that we need to teach people to flirt. I take some > >> exception. We do need to encourage people to interact. > > I agree with Erna-Lynne, encourage interaction in general. > I think that teaching people when and where to flirt with someone > is like saying "At this point, you need to be spontaneous" > > Teach people to dance with other people. That is what we are there > for, dancing with other people. The nature of the dance and the > nature of people will lead to flirtation where it is natural to do > so. > > I have seen lots of people over the years coming at me with these > bug-eyes sticking out because someone told them they needed to > make eye contact. > > > Rich Jackson > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:53:44 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:55:11 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: virginia reel To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hear, hear! Julia Sutton On Tue, 15 Apr 1997 FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU wrote: > Use the research of John Fitzhugh Millar with great care. He may be an > acknowledged expert in maritime history, but his self-published works do > not make him an historical expert in matters of dance. > > John M. Forbes/Baker University. > > I.E.: In good dance research, always do the work yourself. > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:53:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:55:11 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: virginia reel To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hear, hear! Julia Sutton On Tue, 15 Apr 1997 FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU wrote: > Use the research of John Fitzhugh Millar with great care. He may be an > acknowledged expert in maritime history, but his self-published works do > not make him an historical expert in matters of dance. > > John M. Forbes/Baker University. > > I.E.: In good dance research, always do the work yourself. > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:40:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:41:21 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Virginia Reel and Henry Ford and Lloyd Shaw To: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970415163908_1411942875-AT- emout06.mail.aol.com> This is my first submission to the ECD electronic conversation. There was a question about more recent publications of the Virginia Reel. The following is done from the cuff and with what books I have in hand. Harris, Pittman and Waller in the 7th edition of DANCE A WHILE recite the connection between Sir Roger de Coverley and Virginia Reel. The book is generally pretty good about scholarship but also phrases things for a college text and gives few references. The authors give the more currently popular version in which partners do the figures. They do list 7 "records" for appropriate music (see page 69). They state that Sir Roger de Coverley "was first published about 1685." I haven't researched the dance to find that source. Henry Ford published Virginia Reel in his editions of American traditional dances, GOOD MORNING, starting in 1926. His instructions have a tune sequence of jig, reel, and march for one round of the dance, a six couple longways with corner figures and the "strip the willow" or "reel." (page 82 in the 1943 edition) He also published a recording of the dance with calls. Lloyd Shaw in COWBOY DANCES (pp. 124-126) uses the Ford version but makes some interesting negative comments about the dance. I don't have a copy of Burchenal to check out Shaw's note about her description of the dance. Grace Ryan in DANCES OF OUR PIONEERS, 1939 copyright (pp. 160-163), gives the corner, six couple longways version but gives a reel, McDonald's Reel, for the only tune. I published an article in Country Dance & Song News, 1982 about my meeting up with the dance in Denmark in 1982 danced to Blaydon Races! For what its worth, Yours truly, John Ramsay e-mail johnberni-AT- aol.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:51:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:51:09 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, webatcheler-AT- juno.com Message-ID: <970415163856_775602138-AT- emout18.mail.aol.com> John Ramsay here! There are some virtues to standardization altho I also agree with MacNeil that . Perhaps the quote makes more sense appearing in a cookbook than in a dance discussion. Tastebuds like nuances of flavor. With standardization of calling or figures in the dance, one can focus more on cultivating personal relationships than on unlearning and relearning often frivolous idiosyncrasies, or sometimes downright mistakes which crop up between callers and communities. The virtue of standardization for dancers is that it allows them to more readily enjoy dancing in a variety of places. A degree of standardization is required for there to be a community of dancers. I am led to endorse Gene Murrow's side-by-side and Sharp siding as seconded by Wayne Batcheler. I was confronted with the problem of two sidings when Pat Shaw brought his interpretation of siding to the United States in 1974. Shortly thereafter I started using Side by Side and Siding for the two interpretation. Was I the first to do this? (not that it matters) But be assured that I would strenuously object to anyone legislating against other terms. I prefer the cigarette approach--convince others with good arguments rather than by making rules. Our society is already too litigious. Three cheers for the freedom brought to us by e-mail!!! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:00:01 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:58:51 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, webatcheler-AT- juno.com Message-ID: <970415163856_775602138-AT- emout18.mail.aol.com> John Ramsay here! There are some virtues to standardization altho I also agree with MacNeil that . Perhaps the quote makes more sense appearing in a cookbook than in a dance discussion. Tastebuds like nuances of flavor. With standardization of calling or figures in the dance, one can focus more on cultivating personal relationships than on unlearning and relearning often frivolous idiosyncrasies, or sometimes downright mistakes which crop up between callers and communities. The virtue of standardization for dancers is that it allows them to more readily enjoy dancing in a variety of places. A degree of standardization is required for there to be a community of dancers. I am led to endorse Gene Murrow's side-by-side and Sharp siding as seconded by Wayne Batcheler. I was confronted with the problem of two sidings when Pat Shaw brought his interpretation of siding to the United States in 1974. Shortly thereafter I started using Side by Side and Siding for the two interpretation. Was I the first to do this? (not that it matters) But be assured that I would strenuously object to anyone legislating against other terms. I prefer the cigarette approach--convince others with good arguments rather than by making rules. Our society is already too litigious. Three cheers for the freedom brought to us by e-mail!!! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:32:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:35:03 -0500 From: gaff-AT- neu.edu (Terence Gaffney) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Colin Hume weekend To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" CDS Boston Centre is sponsoring a weekend led by Colin Hume during the first weekend of May. Colin will be leading our regular first Friday dance on May 2, then leading a workshop on Saturday afternoon and a dance that evening at the Scout House in Concord. There will also be a pot-luck supper before the evening dance. Full details are now available at our web site http://www.math.neu.edu/~gaffney/CDS.html ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:50:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 17:52:01 -0400 From: walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Virginia Reel and Henry Ford and Lloyd Shaw To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704152152.AA17295-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Can someone tell me a little about Henry Ford (surely not the auto mogul and Americanizer), Lloyd Shaw and Grace Ryan? Thanks, Danny Walkowitz >Henry Ford published Virginia Reel in his editions of American traditional ... >Lloyd Shaw in COWBOY DANCES (pp. 124-126) uses the Ford version but makes ... >Grace Ryan in DANCES OF OUR PIONEERS, 1939 copyright (pp. 160-163), gives ... Daniel J. Walkowitz Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University New York, New York 10003-6607 tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 20:38:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 23:40:11 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Is there life after taxes? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704160356.XAA08909-AT- xis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT My apologies to all whose kind messages I have ignored over the past week or so. One of these years I'll get taxes done early. :-( Catching up: 1. Thank you everyone who sent info on how to contact Colin. Mary Kay and I will talk to him at the NY Ball. Hope to see many of you there. 2. Flirting. I side (pun intended) with Julia. When we say we want to encourage flirting, we mean we want the dancers to exhibit friendly, gentle interaction. I'm sure that's not the dictionary definition. But we've used the word as a convenient shorthand for as long as I've been dancing ECD. By that definition, we encourage dancers to flirt at every opportunity--with partner, corner, neighbor, folks from the other set, etc. I hardly think that kind of flirting requires sexual overtones, especially since not all of those folks will be of the opposite gender. To be honest, I can't recall any of the callers in our area telling dancers to flirt, at least not using the word "flirt." There are other ways to induce a desired behavior. E.g., in Jack's Maggot, by asking the dancers to count how many people they can make eye-contact with in the hey. I'm sorry to hear that ogling, leering and other overbearing behavior is so widespread. It's sad that the art of subtlety has been lost. ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 20:51:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 23:52:44 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Washington Ball Program To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704160408.AAA08947-AT- xis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I finished the final version of the Ball program for the Washington Spring Ball. (Yes, BEFORE doing my taxes.) I'll send a copy, without the graphics, in WordPerfect format to anyone that wishes. I also would be happy to share a WordPerfect template for ball programs that I created. I'll send it to anyone that asks as soon as I finish making some improvements in it. Just a reminder, the Washington Spring Ball is May 17. If you think you mind be interested, I can send a registration form via e-mail. Speaking of ball programs, the NY ball program is very attractive. Well done! ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 21:04:42 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 00:06:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Will Linden Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggest To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 15 Apr 1997, Barbara Ruth wrote: > Reply to: RE>>Siding & Sexual Suggestion > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > As author of the "RE: Siding & Sexual Suggestion" would you please > identify yourself. This will give your comments credibility. Without > knowing who you are, I cannot take your comments seriously. > > Forbes/Baker University > > Thanks > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > Funny, I take the opposite approach. I evaluate a person's credibility based on > whether their comments strike me as cogent and making sense, not the other way > around. > > Barbara Ruth > Quite. How does just saying that this comes from "Aleister Busheimer" makes a matter of _opinions_ more or less "credible". We are all amateurs in this together! Will Linden wlinden-AT- panix.com http://www.panix.com/~wlinden/ Magic Code: MAS/GD S++ W++ N+ PWM++ Ds/r+ A-> a++ C+ G- QO++ 666 Y ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 21:08:44 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 00:04:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Virginia Reel and Henry Ford and Lloyd Shaw To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704160404.AAA00746-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 05:52 PM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote: >Can someone tell me a little about Henry Ford (surely not the auto mogul and >Americanizer), Lloyd Shaw and Grace Ryan? > Thanks, > Danny Walkowitz > Hi, Danny! Yes, it is The Henry Ford, auto mogul and avid country dancer. You need to talk to the Michiganders who dance at Lovett Hall and other sites in Ford country. I actually own a copy of _Pioneer Collection/Old Time Dances_ which features Ford's Schottische and a number of other dances with the parenthetic comment: (As used by Henry Ford). There's lots of fascinating stuff about *why* Ford found country dancing so appealing--sure to appeal to your historian's mind! Cheers, Sharon [When you referred to this Ford reference at the dance tonight, I didn't know what you meant, because I'd been off hooking up with the NPR folks & didn't get home till now.] ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 02:55:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 02:50:44 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 15 Apr 1997, julia s sutton wrote: > Once again this darned 20th century is getting in the way! Most of the > responses to this discussion seem to assume that by sexual suggestion I > mean something broad and rather lewd. Heaven forfend! Of course I mean > gentle interaction--anything resembling ogling, breast-baring, or > hip-swishing would have been forbidden in polite company (and of course we > can speak only of polite company when we speak of Playford, who dealt > with the upper crust). So I say again, teach people to flirt, or charm, or > whatever you may call it, but put flirting in dance into a polite, genteel > context; certainly don't take Hollywood as your model! I'm sorry to disagree, but reading accounts of ECD over the centuries gives me the impression that, far from being uniformly polite and genteel, dances in earlier times could get remarkably rowdy. I suspect the proportion of louts, leering and lewd, was about the same then as today, and in many eras they gave far more vent to their crudities. Upper crust or no, these folks often behaved in ways that would shame most C&W line-dancing bars. And speaking of bars, there is no question that our current ECD custom of "clean and sober" is peculiar to this century, and to a great extent is peculiar to this century in the USA. At dances in the past, they drank. Often, they drank a lot. The gentlemen occasionally put on ladies' clothing and danced a burleske of the woman's role. There were fights. Brawls. (Named, of course, for the French traditional dance. Evidently the joke, "Did you go to the dance? Did you stay for the fight?" has been around a long time.) People leered. Other people got offended. Sometimes the offenders were slapped. People patted parts of other people's anatomy without invitation. Or with invitation. In short, people acted like people--some behaved well, some badly. The Victorian era seems to have created a filter, that gives us the idea that everyone in the past, especially rich people, behaved like true ladies and gentlemen. It was not so, even in Victorian times. (And it is not so today. If you want examples of the modern nobility, I offer you [in a non-partisan fashion] Sen. Ted Kennedy, or the unfortunate demise of Nelson Rockefeller. But I digress.) No, I don't think instructions like "Now flirt" make sense; it makes most of us feel awkward, and a few behave offensively. I once watched someone who happened to be feeling miserable and mad at the world attempt to follow these instructions; I never thought until that moment that one could ever compose a sentence reading "She flirted grimly" and have it make sense. Looking at partners, smiling at them; we can remind people of the importance of these things. Those who feel like flirting, will. Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 03:25:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 03:23:00 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Virginia Reel and Henry Ford and Lloyd Shaw To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 15 Apr 1997, Daniel J. Walkowitz wrote: > Can someone tell me a little about Henry Ford (surely not the auto mogul and > Americanizer), Lloyd Shaw and Grace Ryan? Yes, the very same Henry Ford. He was a passionate advocate of country dancing, part and parcel of his xenophobia. The idea was that good American country dances like the Virginia Reel, and good American fiddle music, was a fitting antidote to all the furrin culture pouring in with the new European immigrants. Accordingly, he promoted country dancing and old-time music, sponsoring fiddle contests and publishing dance instructions along with anti-immigrant (especially anti-Jewish) diatribes. (Since a lot of immigrants built his cars, and even more of them made the steel that went into his cars, IMHO this showed a certain lack of gratitude.) Lloyd Show wrote "Cowboy Dances", but I'm afraid I know little about him. And of Grace Ryan I know nothing. Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 06:21:33 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 07:20:10 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Virginia Reel and Henry Ford and Lloyd Shaw To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970416072010.30d5-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> It's been awhile since I looked at anything dealing with Lloyd Shaw vs. (that's the term!) Henry Ford. I don't think the conflict was with Ford, but with the man he brought to Dearborn/Detroit, Michigan to help revive the old time dances. Benjamin Lovett (sp?) came from the east and was a dance master of the old school, at least as represented in his work, "Good Morning" which contains so many of the 19th century set dances. In terms of the general population, Lovett was "precision and social courtesies first, pleasure second." I would characterize Shaw, again for general dancing, as "boisterous, decorous pleasure first, exactitude second." In saying this, I am mindful of Shaw's exhibition team and the wondrous fallout that has generated. Probably the best expert in the field, and a fine caller himself, is Glen Morningstar. Contact him through the CDSS membership list. He has called Lovett's work for years and is preparing, as I write, for the 60th anniversary of Lovett Hall at Dearborn's Greenfield Village, to held (I think) the first Sunday in November, 1997. John Forbes/Baker University ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 07:02:49 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 10:03:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Benjamin Stein <102510.477-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Henry Ford-Lloyd Shaw To: English Message-ID: <970416140326_102510.477_HHM62-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Yes it was Henry Ford the automaker, as mentioned by earlier writers. His Xenophobia, in addition to foreigners (particularly Jews) also extended to Blacks and "jazz". Despite all this his actions helped preserve traditional dance by maintining a demonstration team, publishing books on the subject and recording music for traditional dances. Lovett Hall was named for his personal dance master Benjamin B. Lovett and I would refer you to the book "Good Morning" (I have a copy of the fourth edition, 1943 as well as several 78 RPM Ford records). The cover reads "Good Morning" Music, Calls and Directions for Old-Time Dancing as revived by Mr. and Mrs. Henry Ford. The title page indicates that the manual was compiled and the descriptions written by Benjamin Lovett. The dances included are primarily Contra Dances but there are also 18 "Singing Calls" for square dances, several formal Quadrilles, a number of waltzes, polkas, schottisches and gavottes as well as the steps for the minuet. There is also a dictionary of dance terms and some charming illustrations with the people in 1930's "afternoon" dress. Lloyd Shaw was another matter. In some ways he was the Miss Milligan of Western Style or Cowboy Square Dancing. He directed dance for the University of Colorado and the Recreation Department (not sure if it was local or state) in the late 1930's and early '40s. He had a demonstration team and, evidently deciding that the current approach of "first couple out to the right etc" was rather boring to watch, took all the two and four couple figures he could find and combined them so that everyone was dancing at the same time. He then renamed the figures, the figures having become increasingly complex, so that a new name often covered a combination of figures Thus the original dos-a-dos (or dosey do) became do-pas-o and the new dos-a-dos was applied to a figure that came out of the Kentucky Running Set. Additionally he renamed them with terms that had a Spanish rather than a French intonation. Though he claimed to "collect" cowboy dances, he effectively invented Cowboy, Club level or Western Square Dancing which really took hold in the '50s when someone discovered how well it went to the then current "pop" music. When I called squares in the northern Central States and the Rockies in the early '40s the "cowboys" were dancing to the same traditional "singing squares" that we did in the northeast, even though I had learned some "western" squares from the Lloyd Shaw directions, in the American square Dance Group in New York City several years earlier. Interstingly enough he also introduced contra dancing to the west with the Lloyd Shaw foundation and Don Armstrongs contra dance records that they have published are great for teaching traditional Contras (though they are, by modern standards, VERY conservative, as are the Henry Ford recordings). Benjamin Stein 102510.477-AT- Compuserve.Com. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 07:36:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 10:38:21 -0400 From: O_Krasner-AT- ACAD.FANDM.EDU (Orly Krasner) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Henry Ford To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hi, everyone! I'm fascinated by this discussion of Ford!! I never stopped to think much about him beyond the usual association with cars. Can someone recommend a good biography or something in his own words that covers all these other aspects of his life? I'll add it to my summer reading list! See y'all at the New York ball (and Washington, too)! Orly Krasner O_Krasner-AT- acad.fandm.edu ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 10:57:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:58:43 -0400 From: walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Henry Ford To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704161758.AA18908-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Two suggestions. From one of my doctoral students, Stephan Meyer, THE FIVE DOLLAR DAY. Now about a fifteen years old, I believe it is still in print (SUNY, Albany Press). Focusing on the teens, Meyer details the Ford Sociological Department which directed his Americanization program. For a delightful and tellin five-page sketch, see Dos Passos, THE BIG MONEY (the third book in the USA trilogy). Best, Danny Walkowitz >Hi, everyone! > I'm fascinated by this discussion of Ford!! I never stopped to think >much about him beyond the usual association with cars. Can someone >recommend a good biography or something in his own words that covers all >these other aspects of his life? I'll add it to my summer reading list! > See y'all at the New York ball (and Washington, too)! >Orly Krasner >O_Krasner-AT- acad.fandm.edu > > > > Daniel J. Walkowitz Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University New York, New York 10003-6607 tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 11:41:40 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 11:41:35 -0800 (PST) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: Henry Ford To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IHRSP6KX029KM1HQ-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Ford bios: Danny Walkowitz suggested Stephan Meyer's THE FIVE DOLLAR DAY and a sketch in John Dos Passos's THE BIG MONEY. I can also recommend FORD: THE MEN, THE MACHINES, which came out within the last ten years, and which is a combined bio of the family, the company, and the men who ran it. I think about the first third of the book is on Henry, and it does talk a fair amount about his historical interests, Greenfield Village, and so on. The scope of the book is pretty wide, but I found the whole thing fascinating reading. (It might possibly be considered off topic in the English Country Dance list that I'm recommending a book which describes how Lee Iacocca invented the Mustang by putting a sporty body on a Fairlane chassis, but what the heck.) -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 415/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 11:55:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:56:23 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Siding & Sexual Suggestion To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Paul: You are speaking realistically, and of course I agree with you. Essentially, however, what we put on stage in a reconstruction is an ideal dance--we normally pay no attention to issues such as toothlessness, fleas, smells, drunkenness, etc. (see Hogarth's drawings of dancing in polite society for a good catalogue of them). Playford's audience was conceived ideally, and so are we! If we try to be realistic on stage, then many assumptions must be made of the audience. One thing we can be sure of, however, is that Playford and other dancing masters never gave instructions for lewd behavior. Julia On Wed, 16 Apr 1997, Paul J. Stamler wrote: > > > On Tue, 15 Apr 1997, julia s sutton wrote: > > > Once again this darned 20th century is getting in the way! Most of the > > responses to this discussion seem to assume that by sexual suggestion I > > mean something broad and rather lewd. Heaven forfend! Of course I mean > > gentle interaction--anything resembling ogling, breast-baring, or > > hip-swishing would have been forbidden in polite company (and of course we > > can speak only of polite company when we speak of Playford, who dealt > > with the upper crust). So I say again, teach people to flirt, or charm, or > > whatever you may call it, but put flirting in dance into a polite, genteel > > context; certainly don't take Hollywood as your model! > > I'm sorry to disagree, but reading accounts of ECD over the centuries > gives me the impression that, far from being uniformly polite and > genteel, dances in earlier times could get remarkably rowdy. I suspect > the proportion of louts, leering and lewd, was about the same then as > today, and in many eras they gave far more vent to their crudities. Upper > crust or no, these folks often behaved in ways that would shame most C&W > line-dancing bars. > > And speaking of bars, there is no question that our current ECD custom of > "clean and sober" is peculiar to this century, and to a great extent is > peculiar to this century in the USA. At dances in the past, they drank. > Often, they drank a lot. The gentlemen occasionally put on ladies' > clothing and danced a burleske of the woman's role. There were fights. > Brawls. (Named, of course, for the French traditional dance. Evidently > the joke, "Did you go to the dance? Did you stay for the fight?" has been > around a long time.) > > People leered. Other people got offended. Sometimes the offenders were > slapped. People patted parts of other people's anatomy without > invitation. Or with invitation. > > In short, people acted like people--some behaved well, some badly. The > Victorian era seems to have created a filter, that gives us the idea that > everyone in the past, especially rich people, behaved like true ladies > and gentlemen. It was not so, even in Victorian times. (And it is not so > today. If you want examples of the modern nobility, I offer you [in a > non-partisan fashion] Sen. Ted Kennedy, or the unfortunate demise of > Nelson Rockefeller. But I digress.) > > No, I don't think instructions like "Now flirt" make sense; it makes most > of us feel awkward, and a few behave offensively. I once watched someone > who happened to be feeling miserable and mad at the world attempt to > follow these instructions; I never thought until that moment that one > could ever compose a sentence reading "She flirted grimly" and have it > make sense. Looking at partners, smiling at them; we can remind people of > the importance of these things. Those who feel like flirting, will. > > Peace. > Paul > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:51:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 23:45:28 -0400 From: The Dupre Family Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: English Dancing at Summer Camp To: 'ECD List' Message-ID: <01BC4AC0.5907F040-AT- ppp7.nerc.com> A late good evening to you all! It's time for my annual extolling of the virtues and wonders of summer dance camp, especially English-American Dance Week at Buffalo Gap Camp outside of Capon Bridge, WV (which is something like 15 miles west of Winchester, VA), July 5-12. This year's program features basic country dancing, advanced ECD, ECD for all, contras and squares, couple dance madness, a dance leadership class (led by Scott Higgs), Cotswold morris, Northwest morris, rapper sword, an early chamber music ensemble, beginning fiddle, advanced music classes, singing, and the mysterious Whaddya Know class. I'd love to tell you more - if you'd like to hear more, please contact me one of the following ways: Work e-mail: dupre-AT- princeton.edu Phone: (609) 258-6252 Home e-mail: dupre-AT- nerc1.nerc.com Phone: (609) 844-0459 (And, by the way, they tell me the gender balance at this point is almost even too) Sue Dupre Program Director, English-American Week at Buffalo Gap Camp ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:58:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 23:58:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Colin Hume <100116.165-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Siding To: ECD Mailing List Message-ID: <970417035847_100116.165_EHU39-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> I didn't invent the term "banana siding", though I may have introduced in to the States. In my case it's a reaction to dancers in England who regard Cecil Sharp siding as the only real form and dismiss "Pat Shaw" siding (as they would call it) as a modern invention. John Lagden is the best-known Playford-style caller in England, and if he said "Siding" during the walkthrough of a Playford dance and you asked which kind of siding he meant, he would say "Oh, ordinary Playford siding". But he doesn't mean that; he means Sharp siding. However, when I started dancing no-one would have dreamed of asking him which kind of siding, so things have obviously moved on somewhat. I remember being greeted with cries of "Rubbish" in my early days of calling when I suggested that into-line siding was what Playford actually meant. So I tended to say "Into line right shoulder to right" rather than use the word "siding" at all - this prevented people from saying "THAT's not siding!" I expect Mike Barraclough used the phrase "Side-by-side right" for the same reason. Colin Hume ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 05:07:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 08:08:30 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Virginia Reel and Henry Ford and Lloyd Shaw To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970417080827_-468673053-AT- emout08.mail.aol.com> Ramsay here! Yes, Henry Ford, the mass production automobile guy gave considerable time and attention to America's traditional dance. He built a dance hall in Dearborn MI and hired Benjamin B. Lovett as his dancing master. The hall is still in use. Glen and Judy Morningstar hold regular dances there. Grace L. Ryan taught dance at Central State Teachers College in Mt. Pleasant MI. She was (quoting from the preface to her book) "indefatigable in tracing the pioneer dances that are still found in rural sections of our country." Lloyd Shaw is known as the father of the western square dance movement. He was superintendent (?) of the Cheyenne Mountain High School and led a dance troupe there. Many of the troupe members went on to become square dance callers and organized the "club" dance movement. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 08:44:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 11:40:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: ECD on NPR *Next Week* To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704171540.LAA13858-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" A quick note to let you all know that when NPR's "All Things Considered" crew returned to DC, they found that Linda Wertheimer wasn't scheduled to be on the air till next week [Monday at the earliest]. So: The segment on CD*NY's English program will NOT be aired Friday, 4/18/97. It will most likely be aired in the early part of next week, but we don't know exactly when. Lisa Harmon, the show's producer, has promised to call us when she knows for sure. [This may well be on the day of the broadcast itself.] I feel somewhat self-conscious about posting this sort of local-interest stuff to the whole list, especially when things change on us like this. [The girl who cried "Wolf!" syndrome...]. So, if you'd like to be e-mailed individually when I next get the word from NPR, let me know off-list. Or, if you'd like a copy of the broadcast tape when it eventually arrives, e-mail me privately also. Now: Back to Henry Ford, Elizabeth Burchnall, and the Interesting Stuff! Cheers, Sharon Green ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 08:57:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 12:00:12 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: NPR PUBLICITY To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: re: NPR: to the ECD list and especially sharon green sharon green, hon. it ISN'T just local self-serving anything to want us all to know about the impending NPR feature on the NY Ball. we ALL have a stake in this. remember, we're gonna all be swarmed by the people this free publicity attracts. and even if not, it's enheartening to hear all about it. PLEASE send the info to the whole list. it'll be so much easier. the rest can delete if they REALLY don't want to know sharon "i'm on pins and needles waiting" mckinley, and not an official commentator for any government agency ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 09:33:19 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 12:32:59 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD on NPR *Next Week* To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>ECD on NPR *Next Week* Sharon, I hardly think that a _national_ radio broadcast on the subject of English Country Dancing qualifies as "local interest stuff." Even if you do insist on being modest about the fact that it is your local dance that is being featured. I put my vote for continuing to inform all of us about this. Besides our own interest in the program, this is an opportunity for great English dance publicity for all of us. I certainly hope that the broadcast will mention that this goes on all over the U.S. and give information for those interested in finding out more or where to dance in their communities - presumably the number for CDSS as a reference source. If nothing else, NPR should have that number to give out if they get calls for information. But I would suggest that all English dance groups contact their local radio affiliate that airs "All Things Considered" and provide a contact number in case anyone phones up the station to get more information. Now, if you can just get them to postpone the broadcast one more week, we could announce it at our regular New Haven dance, and at NEFFA. Barbara Ruth New Haven, CT -------------------------------------- A quick note to let you all know that when NPR's "All Things Considered" crew returned to DC, they found that Linda Wertheimer wasn't scheduled to be on the air till next week [Monday at the earliest]. So: The segment on CD*NY's English program will NOT be aired Friday, 4/18/97. It will most likely be aired in the early part of next week, but we don't know exactly when. Lisa Harmon, the show's producer, has promised to call us when she knows for sure. [This may well be on the day of the broadcast itself.] I feel somewhat self-conscious about posting this sort of local-interest stuff to the whole list, especially when things change on us like this. [The girl who cried "Wolf!" syndrome...]. So, if you'd like to be e-mailed individually when I next get the word from NPR, let me know off-list. Or, if you'd like a copy of the broadcast tape when it eventually arrives, e-mail me privately also. Now: Back to Henry Ford, Elizabeth Burchnall, and the Interesting Stuff! Cheers, Sharon Green ------------------ RFC822 Header Follows ------------------ Received: by QuickMail.Yale.edu with SMTP;17 Apr 1997 11:54:21 -0400 Received: from ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu (SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU [134.79.33.14]) by mail-relay2.its.yale.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA24697 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 11:53:16 -0400 (EDT) X-ListName: Discussion of modern and historical English Country Dance Warnings-To: <> Errors-To: owner-ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Sender: owner-ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 11:40:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Subject: ECD on NPR *Next Week* To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Message-ID: <199704171540.LAA13858-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 09:33:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 12:28:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NPR PUBLICITY To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII To Sharon and Sharon, just keep on sharin' ! Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 09:56:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 12:52:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD on NPR *Next Week* To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hi Sharon, Thanks for keeping us posted on the NPR activities. The very fact that NPR picked up on this identifies it clearly as of more than local interest, and while it probably won't be of much interest outside of the area where NPR is heard, I believe that there are enough subscribers to the ECD mailing list who are within that area to justify the propogation of this information through this list. Barbara Ruth's idea of informing the local stations that broadcast "All Things Considered" is excellent and timely -- Thanks, Barbara! Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 10:32:19 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 10:33:45 -0700 From: Suzanne Wright Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Baroque Dance Summer Workshop at Stanford To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Baroque Dance at Stanford University 24th Annual Workshop July 28 - August 8, 1997 =46or Dancers, Dance Scholars, Choreographers, Musicians, Musicologists, and Theater Movement Specialists =46ACULTY: Wendy Hilton, Director Linda Tomko, Co-Director Paige Whitley-Bauguess Thomas Baird Bronwen Pugh, Baroque violin The Baroque Dance Summer Workshop at Stanford University offers intensive study in the style, technique and notation of French court and theater dance at beginning, intermediate, and advanced levels. Daily activities include two technique classes, a dance notation class, a music class or lecture-demonstration, and time to use the music library with its extensive dance collection and the Lully Archives. Beginning and intermediate couples are allocated a one hour daily practice slot. Advanced students are allocated practice space and have four private, or semi-private, notation sessions with Wendy Hilton. The Workshop concludes on August 8th with a demonstration followed by a farewell party at 5:00 pm for faculty, students, and guests. This year's focus will be on French dances in France and other European countries, particularly Germany. The couple dance, La Bavaroise, to be reconstructed by intermediate level students, and the contredances for all which conclude each day, will be from a little-explored collection, La Hessoise Darmstat [Munich, 1718], by Jean Pierre Dubreil, a French master employed in Germany. Beginning students will reconstruct Louis P=E9cour's L= a (Die) Bourgogne (1700) (courante, bour=E9e, sarabande, passepied), one of th= e first French danses =E0 deux to appear in print in Germany (I.H. P. 1705). Advanced students may reconstruct a dance of their choice after a consultation with Wendy Hilton. Evening practice space is also available. Choreographed baroque dances will be related to music in dance forms such as the loure, courante, menuet, and gavotte by Bach, Telemann, and Handel. The Stanford Music Library has a large collection of dance source material in addition to its music resources, which include the Lully Archive. Wendy Hilton's book, Dance of Court and Theater: The French Noble Style 1690-1725, is the text used for the workshop. Baroque Dance & Music Faculty Wendy Hilton, Director, is the author of Dance of Court and Theater: The =46rench Noble Style 1690-1725 and co-author with Donald Waxman of Dance Pageant. Her choregraphic credits include La Dafne by Marco de Gagliano, Dardanus by Rameau, and the American premiere of Mary, Queen of Scots by Thea Musgrave. She is on the faculty of The Juilliard School and general editor of the Pendragon Press series Dance and Music: the alliance of the two arts. She has been consulted by such modern choreographers as Jerome Robbins and Trisha Brown. Linda Tomko, Co-Director, leads "Les Menus Plaisirs," a Baroque dance troupe, and she has appeared in reconstructions of Baroque dance throughout the United States, in Canada, and Japan. She holds a Ph.D. in History from UCLA and is Associate Professor of Dance in UC Riverside's Ph.D. program in Dance History and Theory. Paige Whitley-Bauguess holds an M.A. in Dance History from UC Riverside where her specialization in Baroque dance began. She directs the Craven Historical Dancers and owns a dance school. She has lectured and performed 18th-century dance internationally, including engagements in Hong Kong and Japan. Her publications include Dance Music of the French Baroque, a series of scores in modern notation for the music accompanying 18th-century notated dances, and articles in the Dance Notation Journal, and the International Dictionary of Ballet. Thomas Baird, founder and director of the Early Dance Alliance, also directs the dance and music ensemble, "Apollo's Banquet." With his partner, Paige Whitley-Bauguess, he appears frequently as a guest artist with other music ensembles. Mr. Baird has taught ballet at Sarah Lawrence College and been a guest teacher in Baroque dance at The Juilliard School, the Manhattan School of Music, and Princeton University. Bronwen Pugh, a specialist in Baroque violin, studied at the Royal Conservatory in The Hague with Sigiswald Kuijken. She has played in several chamber ensembles and Baroque orchestras throughout Europe. She is a founding member of Restoration and Sonnerie based in Wellington, New Zealand, and she plays regularly in performances of Baroque music and dance. TUITION (non credit): Two weeks (July 28 - August 8) $475. One week (July 28- August 1) $345. Registration: Sunday, July 27 (2 - 6 pm). CONTACT: Baroque Dance Summer Workshop Department of Music Stanford University Stanford, CA 94305-3076 (415) 723-0038 E-mail: melmcgee-AT- leland.stanford.edu Registration: Sunday, July 27 (2 - 6 pm). I am primarily a: ___ musician; ___ dancer; ___ historian/researcher. Explain on a separate sheet if necessary. My level of skill in dance is: ___ BEGINNING ___ INTERMEDIATE ___ ADVANCED ___ PROFESSIONAL Have you ever studied Baroque dance? _________________________ ___ I would like to reserve a copy of Hilton's Dance of Court & Theater (2nd edition 1997) at the special student workshop price of $69. I learned of this workshop from: _______________________________ NAME ______________________________________________________ ADDRESS ___________________________________________________ CITY _____________________________ STATE _____ ZIP _________ COUNTRY __________________________________________________ TELEPHONE ( _____ ) _______________________________________ EMAIL ______________________________________________________ Application Fee is $15 prior to May 31; $30 after May 31. Application Fee is due with this form; course fees must be paid by registration day. Application Fee is non-refundable. ___ Enclosed is my application fee in the amount $_________ Please make check payable to Stanford University. Please send this form with your application fee to: Baroque Dance Summer Workshop Department of Music Stanford University Stanford, CA 94305-3076 If you have any questions regarding the summer program, please contact the Department of Music at (415) 723-0038 or e-mail: melmcgee-AT- leland.stanford.edu. All workshop and housing applications should be sent directly to the Music Deparment. Advance registration is encouraged. Late applications will be accepted only if space permits. Housing Conference Office housing is available at $37 for single or $26.75 for double accommodations per night per person. ___ Yes, please send housing information. ___ No, I will stay off-campus. Housing information will be sent to you upon receipt of this application. Please enclose a note with this form if you have any special housing needs (handicapped access, accompanying family members, etc.). ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 11:34:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 13:36:03 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD on NPR *Next Week* To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704171836.NAA26871-AT- ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> Yes, let us know when the broadcast will be on. As soon as I read the earlier message suggesting calling the local station to give them a number for people to call for further information, I did so. The said they might be interested in having one of us come in and be interviewed after the broadcast, so I think this may be a good way for groups all over the country to benefit. Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:00:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 13:59:25 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old siding" To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Wayne Batchelder, I agree with you about 'swirl' and 'half-moon,' both of which terms are interpretations of the figures--I've seen them done without 'swirl' and definitely without a half-moon. As for ECD in New York--I haven't come recently , but when I did, it was pretty unflirting! If you've changed, then congratulations! Julia ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 10:04:37 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 10:34:10 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: NEW YORK BALL? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: re: new york ball: WELLLLLLL? let's have it. how was the ball, and when's the spiel gonna be on ATC? we're waitin' with baited breath out here... sharon "let's have it" mckinley and not an official haranguer for any government agency ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 13:26:39 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 16:27:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: ECD on NPR To: ECD list Message-ID: <970421202710_74031.77_BHT172-5-AT- CompuServe.COM> Hi all - my local PBS station suggests that anyone interested in the 'All Things Considered' segment about ECD call Audience Services of that program in Washington at 202-414-3232 to find out when the segment airs and with whom to place local contact information.... Casting off in all sorts of traditions... Hanny D. Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 13:36:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 16:37:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: "Old siding" To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704212037.QAA12489-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Lise Harmon from NPR called. She will be working on our material tonight & tomorrow AM, and, if all goes well, it will air tomorrow [when we'll all be at Duane, wearing our Walkmans, no doubt]. If not tomorrow, it most likely will air Wednesday. Lisa will call me tomorrow at 1 PM to let me know what's up. I'll update you then. Exhausted side note to Sharon McKinley--I thought the New York ball this year looked and sounded *spectacular*, with special kudos to Jacquie Lowry who planned the decorations, and to Bernard Fox (the Broadway sound designer who both designed the sound and worked the board as a favor to Gene Murrow and to Gene's sister Jesica) and to our magnificent musicians. But I am a highly partisan observer. Much love, Sharon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 13:47:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 16:48:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: NPR Update + Oops To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704212048.QAA13251-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" This is a repeat of my previous posting which I managed to send out under the wrong subject heading. I apologize for the ditzyness & the duplication-- Sharon Lise Harmon from NPR called. She will be working on our material tonight & tomorrow AM, and, if all goes well, it will air tomorrow [when we'll all be at Duane, wearing our Walkmans, no doubt]. If not tomorrow, it most likely will air Wednesday. Lisa will call me tomorrow at 1 PM to let me know what's up. I'll update you then. Exhausted side note to Sharon McKinley--I thought the New York ball this year looked and sounded *spectacular*, with special kudos to Jacquie Lowry who planned the decorations, and to Bernard Fox (the Broadway sound designer who both designed the sound and worked the board as a favor to Gene Murrow and to Gene's sister Jesica) and to our magnificent musicians. But I am a highly partisan observer. Much love, Sharon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 22:02:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 01:02:43 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: NY Ball (long) To: ECD list Message-ID: <199704220102_MC2-14B7-16BD-AT- compuserve.com> Dear friends, our beloved sharon mckinley (not an official e.e. cummings stand-in for any government agency) asked for a report on the NY Ball. As one of the M.C.'s / organizers, I disqualified myself from responding, but after some thought (and a couple of glasses of wine, to be sure), I concluded that perhaps it would be of interest to know what the enterprise looked like from the point of view of one (of many) who made it happen. I know many of you out there are in the same position of volunteer organizers for these events (if you don't have any interest, stop reading now... this may go on a bit), so pardon my indulgence of using our forum to organize the many thoughts running around my exhausted brain at the moment.... The distinguishing feature of this year's Ball was the effect of Linda Wolfe's NY Times article. Joining the 60 or so CD*NY regulars who normally show up for the 6 weekly pre-Ball Tuesday night dances were brand new folks off the street, swelling our ranks some evenings to 120 - 140! All in the same room. The program had already been set, and included such challenges as Fried's "December Waltz," Pat Shaw's "Quite Carr-ied Away," "Love's Triumph" as a triple minor, "Newcastle," "Leather Lake House," and more. I concluded right off that keeping the newcomers interested and encouraging them was worth the price of a slightly more ragged Ball, with perhaps more walk-throughs and prompting than normal. Fortunately, the other M.C., Yonina Gordon, and Annie Edden's Ball committee agreed. So I spent a lot of each evening doing introductory dances (including several simple ones I have devised to some of our best loved-tunes), teaching the simpler ball dances in detail (Jack's Health, Winter Memories), and asking the newbies to sit out and watch for the most challenging. These were, by far, the most exhilarating and most exhausting gigs I've ever done (beyond even the notorious "gig from hell"-- the drunken non-dancer wedding reception). A surprising result of this, BTW, was that after 5 weeks or so, EVERYONE was dancing better than the prevailing standard before "the article." Several reasons, I think. One was that the jaded regulars were charged by the electricity generated by the enthusiastic newcomers, many of whom were young, musical, energetic, and graceful. Linda's article really hit the market in the right spot-- we got the ideal initiates. Also, the regulars stepped up to the challenge of integrating all the newbies, and consequently found themselves in "teaching" mode. We all know that the best way to learn anything is to teach it. They were more conscious of their own dancing as example, and became better dancers for it. Many of the newbies actually came to the Ball, and did very well indeed. The Ball program was devised by Yonina and myself. Yonina, a fine dancer and caller of contras as well as English, has a good sense of what makes a dance engaging and fun. I tend to plan around the music. So we had a program of engaging, fun, dances with beautiful tunes... is this a great country, or what? I see a Ball program (indeed any evening of ECD) as a theatrical piece, with a beginning, middle, and end. It requires a firm creative hand, and can't be done by committee, IMHO. I was grateful to the Ball committee for giving us complete control of the program (they made suggestions, but we had the final say). I think that's important. The band was also special; it was the same group I got together for last year's Providence Ball. Not your everyday ECD outift... Bill Peek, our pianist, is one of the most inventive keyboard players on the scene. His harmonic creativity, informed by experience in pop, theater, and jazz, creates music that is unusual and varied, and yet, paradoxically, always appropriate. He's big on major-7th chords (for you theory-nerds out there), unusual chord inversions and voicings, and melismatic ornamentation of the melody line. He uses the standard tricks of syncopation or quotes/parodies VERY sparsely, and he uses a very light touch. He manages to do his unusual thing, while giving other musicians lots of space to do their own thing-- a rare trait. We all love to play with him. Rosamund Morley, on bass viola da gamba, is not generally known to the ECD crowd, but she is an international star in the Early Music World. She is the gambist for the world-traveling Waverly Consort (get some of their tapes or CD's!), and tours with Parthenia (viol consort) and Alhambra (Sephardic music). I've worked with her for 15 years in various settings (in my recorder-playing guise), including Pinewoods Early Music Week, where she caught the ECD music bug. She managed to find just enough time in her touring schedule to do the Providence Ball last year, and NY this year. Like the newbie dancers, she brought a wide-eyed enthusiasm to the band that was infectious. Her status and graciousness didn't hurt either. Bill worked with her some, which was a big help (as the bass player, she needed to know some of his non-standard progressions and bass lines). TAKE NOTE, ECD LEADERS: early musickers are a FIRST RATE source of musicians for your live music needs. Check 'em out. My sister, Jessica Murrow, played oboe. She's a Juilliard grad, and free-lanced for many years in NYC doing chamber orchestras, dance (NY CIty Ballet), some theater, woodwind quintets, generally for starvation wages. She now works as a sound designer/engineer, and "runs the sound" for Smokey Joe's Cafe, and, starting soon, King and I (2 shows currently on Broadway). Oboe is the perfect "color" ECD instrument (I used to play the damned thing myself, and sometimes have relapses), but it cannot be the sole melody instrument (too exhausting). It melts the dancers' hearts-- but be sure you get a pro or a very good amateur. The fourth band member was Earl Gaddis, on violin. Earl needs no introduction to you all. What I like about his playing is the solidity gained from the Scottish repertory he does so well; his impeccable intonation; his keen ear for pleasing counter melodies; his subtlety; and the techniques he's developed to use the violin as a rhythm instrument The viola is an extra benefit. Also important is his loving-kindness, which I know many of you have experienced. Earl was the foundation and glue for this motley group. Music for the afternoon walk-through was by Leah Barkan, our regular pianist at Country Dancers of Westchester. No one does this job better than Leah. She knows the repertory cold; her tempos are right on and steady; she "lines out" the tune as you teach, in perfect synchronization with the pace of the walk-through; she's friendly, enthusiastic, and indefatigable. A great addition to the Ball. I sent the band the tune list, and copies of all music not in Peter Barnes' book about a month in advance. For several tunes, I added some advice about how I like them played, and noted any special features. Included also was my "Notes for the Band..." which explains how I like the mechanics of the caller/band situation to work (how I start, how I signal the final rounds, how I signal a faster or slower tempo, etc., etc.). Good musicians, even pros like these, appreciate knowing what's expected. For the Ball, I asked the band to avoid ritards (slowing of tempo) at the end of the final round of each dance, and instead to play an additional, final chord (as the Scots do). I announced this to the dancers-- the final chord was for a proper honor (bow / curtsey), in aid of preventing the usual rush off to find the next partner. I think it added a touch of graciousness to the evening (ask the dancers...). Suppressing the ritard impulse is hard to do, but the band pulled it off. There are two schools of thought on that (Helene, for one, agrees that the music should not slow at the end of the dance); I'm not sure yet. Maybe I'll know after another 30 years of dancing. The sound system was also unusual. Bernard Fox, the designer, is/was my sister's mentor in the sound biz. He's a very experienced pro in recording and live sound (his theater, recording, concert, and film credits fill an 18-page C.V.). I set him this challenge some time ago: provide a system that enables each dancer, anywhere in the hall, to hear the band (and caller) as if it were just alongside him/her, on the "up" side of the set, playing at unamplified, acoustic levels. When he visited his first ECD 2 years ago, he saw the scope of the problem. He finally designed a system that met my challenge for last year's Providence Ball, and it was written up, in detail, in the CDSS News last Spring (join CDSS if you want a copy). He outdid himself last Saturday in NY. I was able to dance about 7 dances, and the effect was just as I had dreamed. The overall level was about 82-84 db, and the sound was warm and intimate. He used 2 AE-5 direct speakers up front and 8 AE-3's pointed at the walls for dispersed sound around the hall. There were 4 delay circuits, up to 40 msec's; equalization for the speakers; compressor on the caller's signal; recording studio quality mikes (Bernard nearly had apoplexy in Providence when Earl took out his headset mike); and stage monitors for the band that were designed as carefully as the hall sound. It took Bernard nearly all day Saturday to adjust and balance the system (he does it by playing a CD through the system as he walks around and around). For the record, he made a "rough mix" stereo tape recording, and an 8-track DAT (which will have to be mixed down). We may produce a tape or CD, both for dancers' enjoyment and as a benchmark for ECD Ball sound. Stay tuned. [Yes, a system like this is expensive. Bernard reduced his fee as a favor to Jessica and myself, the $100,000+ equipment was rented from Jessica's employer, ProMix, and lots of CD*NY dancer volunteers led by Mike O'Connor schlepped dozens of very heavy cases around. The net cost was still in the healthy 4 figures, with some angels sparing CD*NY's budget any serious damage). The other components of the Ball were first rate, as I'm sure all would agree. Sharon Green's and Gloria Glasser's food committee (all 2,675 of them) produced an INCREDIBLE, varied spread of refreshments. As usual, they each had "pun-ny" names ("Quite Curr-ied Away"); this provides a healthy outlet for Sharon, David Green, and the other punsters and keeps them off the streets and out of jail. The decorations were gorgeous-- tiny white lights outlining the stage, flowers, candles, ... really beautiful. Susan and I didn't get to the after-Ball party (we were offering rides home to 2 Westchester dancers, and we were tired), so you'll have to ask those who did go. And, as usual, things ran very, very smoothly, which is a testament to the skills, caring, and hard work of the CD*NY Board and Ball committee (I am not a member of either, so no conflict of interest here). What a group! It's a pleasure to work with them. My hopes are that they found Yonina, me, the band, and Bernie equally cooperative and competent, and, most of all, that the dancers had a good time. Gene Murrow, EC Dancer who can, unfortunately, get quite carried away. gmurrow-AT- compuserve.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 04:00:20 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 07:02:07 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: NPR To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: re: NPR: thanks to hanny for the NPR audience services info. unfortunately, the office doesn't open til 10. i will call back then, and between that and our new york sources, we should get the info in a timely manner. given that 3 of our stalwart dancers came to us as a result of Emma, this could bring even more... sharon "i love it when it's not a toll call" mckinley and not an official audience server for any government agency ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 09:36:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 11:39:04 -0500 From: gaff-AT- neu.edu (Terence Gaffney) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: History of CDS Boston Centre To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" For those interested in the history of CDS-Boston Centre, we have just added a first version of the history of CDS to our website, written by Jean Krogh. In the future we hope to add personal reminiscences, photos and letters from some of the people mentioned in our history, and more material on Contra dancing; if anyone reading this would like to forward comments or contributions, you can e-mail them to me. Terry Gaffney e-mail: Gaff-AT- neu.edu URL: http://www.math.neu.edu/~gaffney/CDS.html ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 10:54:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 10:54:42 -0800 (PST) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: NY Ball (long) To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01II04Q042PG9KM1HQ-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Gene wrote: >our beloved sharon mckinley (not an official e.e. cummings stand-in for any >government agency) asked for a report on the NY Ball. sharon's notes generally remind me of don marquis, though more of mehitabel (toujours gai) than archy. >I sent the band the tune list, and copies of all music not in Peter Barnes' >book about a month in advance. For several tunes, I added some advice >about how I like them played, and noted any special features. Included >also was my "Notes for the Band..." which explains how I like the mechanics >of the caller/band situation to work (how I start, how I signal the final >rounds, how I signal a faster or slower tempo, etc., etc.). Good >musicians, even pros like these, appreciate knowing what's expected. I don't know if "Notes for the Band..." is a publication or a handout; if it's text available in electronic form and reasonably short, I'd love to see it forwarded to this list. If it's only available to those attending your course at Pinewoods Early Music Week, I'll gnash my teeth and ask Alisa to show me her copy when she gets back. Also, could you please post the set list/program for the ball? Thank you very much for this detailed account of your experience with getting the Ball rolling, as it were; I enjoyed reading it, and it sounds like a wonderful event of which all concerned can be justly proud. -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 415/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 11:16:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 02:16:45 -0400 From: Stella Fogg Subject: Re: History of CDS Boston Centre To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <335DA94D.3CA3-AT- worldnet.att.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Terence Gaffney wrote: > > material > on Contra dancing; if anyone reading this would like to forward comments or > contributions, you can e-mail them to me. > Hi, I am very interested in contra dancing and would love to see more about it on a server. I teach Scottish country dance and do contra dance, do you know of a specific server for contra? Thanks Stella Fogg StellaF-AT- worldnet.att.net ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 12:12:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 15:13:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704221913.PAA20488-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Lisa Harmon tells me the CD*NY English country dance segment will be on tomorrow's All Things Considered show. Also a little snippet of it will air sometime in the morning as a teaser for All Things Considered. Did you ever think you'd live to see the day when a major news broadcast would have as its come-on: "Tune in tonight to learn all about... English Country Dancing"? Doing her best to suspend her disbelief-- Sharon Green ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 01:25:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 04:26:26 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NY Ball (long) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970423042626_-300277824-AT- emout17.mail.aol.com> Dear Gene, Wonderful, useful, inspiring report! Please share anytime you can. I would especially like to see your "Notes for the Band..." John Ramsay ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 06:53:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: Peter.Fricke-AT- noaa.gov Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 10:00:14 -0400 From: Peter Fricke Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: More nice publicity To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Return requested) CC: Peter Fricke (Return requested) Message-ID: <02959335E15EE00C*/c=US/admd=ATTMAIL/prmd=GOV+NOAA/o=CCNMFS/s=Fricke/g=Peter/-AT- MHS> This morning's WASHINGTON POST has a *nice* story on Howard Bass, lutenist and Morris-, English- and contra-dancer and caller. Many of you will also know him as co-curator of the CDSS 75th anniversary exhibit, "The Legacy of Cecil Sharp," at the Smithsonian's Museum of American History in 1990. The story, with photos, is in the Style Section, pp. D1 and D10; sorry, I don't have scanning technology to attach it to this note, but the newspaper's website is www.washingtonpost.com Peter Fricke P.O. Box 2011 Shepherdstown, WV 25443 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 06:57:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 08:59:20 -0500 From: gaff-AT- neu.edu (Terence Gaffney) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: History of CDS Boston Centre To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Terence Gaffney wrote: >> >> material >> on Contra dancing; if anyone reading this would like to forward comments or >> contributions, you can e-mail them to me. >> >Hi, I am very interested in contra dancing and would love to see more >about it on a server. I teach Scottish country dance and do contra >dance, do you know of a specific server for contra? >Thanks >Stella Fogg >StellaF-AT- worldnet.att.net Dear Stella, I haven't seen much to date; I'd put an inquiry on the rec.folkdance list or try looking at the NEFFA web site and sending a message to the organizers. The Neffa web site has a lengthy history of the festival, and some of the pages devoted to particular dance forms have a history section page for links to historical sites. The URL for the NEFFA home page is http://www.ultranet.com/~neffa/ best, terry ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 07:57:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 10:57:09 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NY Ball (long) To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <199704231056_MC2-14CC-15B2-AT- compuserve.com> Hi Alan, Thanks for your note. I'll put "Notes to the Band..." in e-mailable format and fire off a copy to you. Glad to share it. Gene ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 10:35:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 13:31:48 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>The Word on NPR Sharon, I will not be anywhere near a radio during the relevant periods. Will it really be possible to get a cassette? Barbara Ruth -------------------------------------- Date: 4/22/97 3:27 PM To: Barbara Ruth From: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Lisa Harmon tells me the CD*NY English country dance segment will be on tomorrow's All Things Considered show. Also a little snippet of it will air sometime in the morning as a teaser for All Things Considered. Did you ever think you'd live to see the day when a major news broadcast would have as its come-on: "Tune in tonight to learn all about... English Country Dancing"? Doing her best to suspend her disbelief-- Sharon Green ------------------ RFC822 Header Follows ------------------ Received: by QuickMail.Yale.edu with SMTP;22 Apr 1997 15:23:16 -0400 Received: from ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu (SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU [134.79.33.14]) by mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA18094 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 1997 15:20:48 -0400 (EDT) X-ListName: Discussion of modern and historical English Country Dance Warnings-To: <> Errors-To: owner-ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Sender: owner-ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 15:13:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Subject: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Message-ID: <199704221913.PAA20488-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 11:10:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 14:11:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704231811.OAA19949-AT- panix4.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:31 PM 4/23/97 -0400, you wrote: > Reply to: RE>The Word on NPR > >Sharon, >I will not be anywhere near a radio during the relevant periods. Will it really >be possible to get a cassette? >Barbara Ruth Sure--lots of us are recording it. I'll see if I can get the media guy here on campus to give me a rate on bulk copies. Sharon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 11:25:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 14:27:14 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: RE: THE WORD ON NPR To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: X-ListName: Discussion of modern and historical English Country Dance Warnings-To: <> Errors-To: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 13:31:48 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>The Word on NPR Sharon, I will not be anywhere near a radio during the relevant periods. Will it really be possible to get a cassette? Barbara Ruth -------------------------------------- Date: 4/22/97 3:27 PM To: Barbara Ruth From: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Lisa Harmon tells me the CD*NY English country dance segment will be on tomorrow's All Things Considered show. Also a little snippet of it will air sometime in the morning as a teaser for All Things Considered. Did you ever think you'd live to see the day when a major news broadcast would have as its come-on: "Tune in tonight to learn all about... English Country Dancing"? Doing her best to suspend her disbelief-- Sharon Green ------------------ RFC822 Header Follows ------------------ Received: by QuickMail.Yale.edu with SMTP;22 Apr 1997 15:23:16 -0400 Received: from ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu (SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU [134.79.33.14]) by mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA18094 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 1997 15:20:48 -0400 (EDT) X-ListName: Discussion of modern and historical English Country Dance Warnings-To: <> Errors-To: owner-ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Sender: owner-ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 15:13:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Subject: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Message-ID: <199704221913.PAA20488-AT- mail2.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ------------------------------------------ THIS IS A REPLY TO THE ABOVE MESSAGE SUBJECT OF THE REPLY: RE: THE WORD ON NPR-REPLY ------------------------------------------ barbara; actually, i'll be getting home a bit late, but of course we have it on 3 different stations. IF i can get my act, and my seldom-used equipment, together, i will try to tape it off the air. but don't hold your breath. one can generally get tapes from NPR; i will call--well, right now. and i'll post it to the list, coz it's this phone no. if you know your date (today, we assume), you can call 1-888-NPR-NEWS (i hate it when you have to figger it out)...so 1 way or the other we should be able to get it to ya. sharon (i suspect you need a credit card, too) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 12:06:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 15:05:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Regarding the obtaining of copies of All Things Considered from NPR... Check out their website at http://www.npr.org/programs/atc/archives/ It appears that you can get it in Real Audio directly from them. Before you go ordering lots of tapes, Sharon (Green), why don't we see if we can get satisfactory audio copies this way -- then, if not, you could go ahead with this plan. Eric Arnold Ann Arbor On Wed, 23 Apr 1997, Sharon Green wrote: > At 01:31 PM 4/23/97 -0400, you wrote: > > Reply to: RE>The Word on NPR > > > >Sharon, > >I will not be anywhere near a radio during the relevant periods. Will it > really > >be possible to get a cassette? > >Barbara Ruth > > Sure--lots of us are recording it. I'll see if I can get the media guy here > on campus to give me a rate on bulk copies. > > Sharon > > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 12:08:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 14:17:49 -0500 From: sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: THE WORD ON NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" WELL..., the 3 PM newsbreak on Talk of the Nation on my local NPR station just had a plug for the ECD segment of ATC coming up this afternoon... Sheila Beardslee Bosworth sheilab-AT- tiac.net Editor, Boston Early Music News >>next BEMN Deadline 4/20 for May 15 issue! May 15 issue is BEMF Preview issue! Summer workshops & concert listings welcomed! 29 Main Street, Acton MA 01720-3505 voice: 508/263.9926 fax: 508/263.2366 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 12:50:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 15:51:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: THE WORD ON NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704231951.PAA12066-AT- panix4.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:17 PM 4/23/97 -0500, Sheila Beardslee wrote: >WELL..., the 3 PM newsbreak on Talk of the Nation on my local NPR >station just had a plug for the ECD segment of ATC coming up this afternoon... According to Lisa Harmon, the ECD segment is to air in the ten minutes before the hour slot. If ATC runs from 5-7 in your area, you might want to check both the 5:50 & 6:50 slots because there's some question as to how the hourlong blocks get ordered. At last night's English dance, we had the premiere of Colin Hume's dance for Linda Wolfe and an *amazing* round of applause for Linda, who simply glowed. Colin also was greatly applauded, both for his guest appearance and for his splendid new dance. Lead teacher for the evening was our own Paul Ross, with veteran musicians Jim Stevenson and Paul Friedman, and, sitting in on flute, Jean Kershaw, a new English dancer who found us thanks to the article in the New York Times. Sharon Green ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 14:05:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 12:21:02 -0700 From: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: mls-AT- panix.com wrote: |Lisa Harmon tells me the CD*NY English country dance segment will be on |tomorrow's All Things Considered show. Also a little snippet of it will air |sometime in the morning as a teaser for All Things Considered. |Did you ever think you'd live to see the day when a major news broadcast |would have as its come-on: "Tune in tonight to learn all about... English |Country Dancing"? |Doing her best to suspend her disbelief-- |Sharon Green Well, we almost got there. This morning's announcement on Oregon Public Broadcasting following "Morning Edition" referred to something called "British Country Dancing." I for one called the station immediately to supply a correction to the announcer, but of course by then it was too late. ________________________________________________________________________________ Robert Reed Home Animation Limited 503-656-8414 email: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com West Linn, OR 97068 When Dolly Parton goes down to a 32B, then I will give up my eyelashes and my makeup. --Tammy Faye Messner ________________________________________________________________________________ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 14:57:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 17:59:54 -0500 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Yippeee we're famous! To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Well that was LOVELY! Thanks for keeping us informed about it Sharon and THANKS NPR! Mary Beth Goodman <-- did English before English was cool ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 15:07:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 18:09:19 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970423180713_2016238183-AT- emout20.mail.aol.com> John Ramsay Just listened to All Things Considered. Great! Great! Great! Thank you New York and thank you Sharon for letting us know to listen. I did make contact with our local station and will follow up on this excellent promotional opportunity. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 15:26:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 15:27:26 -0700 From: Robin Cohen Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704231527.ZM1718-AT- alewench.engr.sgi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <970423180713_2016238183-AT- emout20.mail.aol.com> On the West Coast, we haven't heard the show yet, so can anyone tell us, please, where in the broadcast is our beloved ECD spot? -- *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Robin Cohen Mailstop - 9U-505 EBU Administrator Phone - 415-933-1368 Silicon Graphics, Inc. Fax - 415-967-8496 *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 15:56:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 06:56:51 -0400 From: Stella Fogg Subject: Re: History of CDS Boston Centre To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <335F3C73.60E1-AT- worldnet.att.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Thanks Terry for your input, I will try your suggestions. Stella ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 16:21:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 09:30:12 +1000 From: Martin Hungerford Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NY Ball (long) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704232323.JAA20447-AT- darth.netcon.net.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" um, could you send me one while your at it. I used to play for ECD balls every so often and would love to know what you felt needed saying etc. Martin (jongleur-AT- netcon.net.au) This is Martin Hungerford, aka Martin Jongleur, aka Martin o' Lyos (called the Juggler) OL. email:jongleur-AT- netcon.net.au ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 17:16:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 20:18:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704240018.UAA03671-AT- panix4.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 03:27 PM 4/23/97 -0700, you wrote: >On the West Coast, we haven't heard the show yet, so can anyone tell us, >please, where in the broadcast is our beloved ECD spot? > The show's hours shift from location to location, BUT the spot definitely came at 50 minutes past the hour. Sharon Green ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 17:17:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 20:16:46 -0400 (EDT) From: "Susan R. Murrow" <75272.730-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <970424001646_75272.730_GHI87-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply : On the East Coast, in New York, we heard the "segment" on ECD at 5:50 pm ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 17:29:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 19:39:24 -0500 From: sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" In Boston in WBUR it aired at 5:50 (the show started at 5 PM) Sheila Beardslee Bosworth sheilab-AT- tiac.net Editor, Boston Early Music News >>next BEMN Deadline 4/20 for May 15 issue! May 15 issue is BEMF Preview issue! Summer workshops & concert listings welcomed! 29 Main Street, Acton MA 01720-3505 voice: 508/263.9926 fax: 508/263.2366 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 17:56:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 17:58:12 -0700 From: Robin Cohen Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704231758.ZM2078-AT- alewench.engr.sgi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <970424001646_75272.730_GHI87-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> I heard the show. It was on at 4:50, as everyone presumed, even though our ATC began on the half hour, at 4:30. It was lovely, sitting here at work, wearing headphones, tuning out the world, and listening to English country dance music, dancing along vicariously. I was disappointed that our local station didn't mention afterwards that ECD can be done locally, and suggest calling the station for more information, or offering our hotline number, which was supplied to them in advance, but I may have missed something mentioned later. Thanks to everyone involved! -- *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Robin Cohen Mailstop - 9U-505 EBU Administrator Phone - 415-933-1368 Silicon Graphics, Inc. Fax - 415-967-8496 *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 19:28:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 22:29:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "m.a.j. mckenna" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19970423204251.4db716e8-AT- pop.mindspring.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" congratters and cyber-hugs to gene and the whole cd*ny community. and thank-yous, as well, for such great p.r. for this dance form we all love so much. maryn mck. atlanta =-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-= M.A.J. McKenna staff writer, the Atlanta Journal-Constitution 404.526.5987 vox 404.526.5509 fax Standard disclaimers apply. =-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-=-+-= ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 19:40:12 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 21:41:57 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970423214157.40d5-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> The plural usually is 'bravos.' ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 19:49:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 22:51:47 -0400 From: mls-AT- panix.com (Michael Siemon) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 9:41 PM 4/23/97, FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU wrote: >The plural usually is 'bravos.' However, brava is entirely appropriate as the feminine singular accolade for outstanding performances, and its plural would be bravas in the same manner as bravos is formed on the usual English pattern. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 20:51:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 22:53:28 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970423225328.5388-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> Only if all the performers were women? (No anti-feminism there, please. My daughter has taught me better than that.) Forbes ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 21:07:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 00:08:51 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: (Fwd) Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704240428.AAA15955-AT- xis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > Check out their website at > > http://www.npr.org/programs/atc/archives/ > > It appears that you can get it in Real Audio directly from them. > Before you go ordering lots of tapes, Sharon (Green), why don't we > see if we can get satisfactory audio copies this way -- then, if > not, you could go ahead with this plan. Thanks for the suggestion, Eric. I just got home from work & so missed the show. But, that site really works! Or at least it will. Unfortunately the site is only current through Tuesday's show. I'm sure it will be updated tomorrow or sooner. Just click on the right link and you can listen to the entire All Things Considered show, fast forward, rewind or whatever. The sound quality is far from ideal, but it beats waiting for a tape! ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 21:46:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 00:45:16 -0400 (EDT) From: webatcheler-AT- juno.com (Wayne Batcheler) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: npr segment: bravo, brava, and their plurals To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19970424.004243.6999.0.webatcheler-AT- juno.com> References: <1.5.4.16.19970423204251.4db716e8-AT- pop.mindspring.com> maryn mckenna, who as staff writer for the Atlanta Journal-Constitution is presumably required to use capital letters now and then, sent her congratters and cyber-hugs to gene and the whole cd*ny community for the great p.r. resulting from the All Things Considered segment. ditto all of that. the radio broadcast (and a tv taping which has yet to emerge on air) flows from the NY Times article by linda wolfe coordinated with the special jane austen evening mc'd by beverly francis. my question for ace reporter maryn is whether she thinks this same stunt could be pulled off in other venues, such as Atlanta. the CD*NY "space committee" or whatever its official name is may have to get busy, because the location of our dances was given in the All Things Considered segment. they'll be bustin' down the doors to get in on tuesday. Wayne Batcheler New York ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 04:03:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 07:05:07 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: NPR DOES IT AGAIN To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: re: you all know what: ok, so do we tie up the list with yet another accolade for CDNY and their minute and a half of fame? well, yes. we DO. it was wonderful. i got a kick out of the austen tie-in, since of course it's not a period most of us associate with hard-core ECD except in the movies. i think my next ball dress should be one of those high-waisted empire things. it'll make me look skinny. don't know how i'll manage the cute curly locks, tho. anyway, it was lovely. gene and beverly et al. are to be congratulated, and if we get a tiny bit of fallout from it (we supplied all of our local Baltimore-DC carriers with our hotline numbers), it'll be great. you guys in ny are gonna be swamped... oh, and i did actually manage to copy it. balto-wash people desiring a copy have only to let me know, and i can supply... thanks again to CDNY and NPR (oh, and if anyone thinks of it, thanking NPR in person might not be such a bad idea, and try to con your local outlet into doing a feature on YOUR dance). sharon "good stuff, but where will we put the 150 newcomers?" mckinley, and not an official dance teacher for any government agency, thank goodness ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 05:52:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 08:52:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: THE WORD ON NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Thanks to Sharon, CD*NY, Linda Wertheimer, & NPR from the Midwest, too... We spread the word among our dancers, & I believe a fair number were able to tune it in. I was able to make my own tape copy (please note, Sharon G.!) since it came after I was off work, at 5:50 pm, as it did in many other areas. We provided contact information to all of our local public radio stations, so at least they have something if they get any calls, and they are connected enough to associate them ... I didn't hear any mention of our activities on the station I was listening to, so I don't know how effective that will be. But I'm hoping. I did approach our local newspaper about the possibility of a feature article after the Times article came out, and generated some interest, but the person responsible thought it would be September before it might be worked into their schedule. So I'm hoping that will take place -- at least it will be timely for the start of a new "season". Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 07:53:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:54:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Will Linden Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Wed, 23 Apr 1997 FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU wrote: > Only if all the performers were women? (No anti-feminism there, please. My daughter has taught me better than that.) > If you are applauding "ALL the performerS", it is _bravi_! Whatever their gender is. Will Linden wlinden-AT- panix.com http://www.panix.com/~wlinden/ Magic Code: MAS/GD S++ W++ N+ PWM++ Ds/r+ A-> a++ C+ G- QO++ 666 Y ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 08:47:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 11:45:34 -0500 From: Marc Edgar Subject: ECD in England? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <335F8E2E.B87EB26-AT- mail.geocities.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Greetings all, My wife to be and I are traveling to England and Scotland for our honeymoon and are looking for some memorable events. We are both English country dancers and folk music enthusiasts and would enjoy doing some dancing and listening to accoustic music while on our trip. We will be traveling in England and Scotland from May 28 to June 10th. Does anyone know of any English Country dances going on during this time? Marc Edgar ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:29:49 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:16:42 -0700 From: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: In Portland it played at 6:50 (ATC runs 5-7). Does that mean we get our hours played in reverse order? ________________________________________________________________________________ Robert Reed Home Animation Limited 503-656-8414 email: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com West Linn, OR 97068 You all look like happy campers. Happy campers you are, happy campers you have been, and, as far as I am concerned, happy campers you will always be. --Dan Quayle, speaking to 2000 children in American Samoa, May 1989 ________________________________________________________________________________ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:45:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:45:17 -0800 (pst) From: afeldman-AT- oacis.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re[2]: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9703248619.AA861903911-AT- ccsmtp.bellahs.com> I listened from 5-6:30 and heard a teaser at 6:00 but never the story. I guessed that they just don't rebroadcast the last 1/2 hour... so I switched to another station to hear the end of the show. Well at 6:50 I thought NOW I would finally get to hear the ECD story--and the station went into a pledge break! Aargh. So I thought the San Francisco area was just not destined to hear about ECD in New York, and then this morning I discovered Robin heard it before 5pm on some station. Yesterday just wasn't my day. Anise ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: The Word on NPR Author: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU at ~SMTP Date: 4/24/97 10:37 AM In Portland it played at 6:50 (ATC runs 5-7). Does that mean we get our hours played in reverse order? ________________________________________________________________________________ Robert Reed Home Animation Limited 503-656-8414 email: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com West Linn, OR 97068 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:48:05 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:49:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Sharon Green Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: The Word on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704241749.NAA11910-AT- panix4.panix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:16 AM 4/24/97 -0700, Robert Reed wrote: >In Portland it played at 6:50 (ATC runs 5-7). Does that mean we get our >hours played in reverse order? Quite possibly: In New York ATC airs from 4-6 on AM, from 5-7 on FM, and the ECD spot played at 5:50 on both! [That's why I specified only that it would play at 10 minutes before the hour and never gave a particular hour.] Cheers, Sharon Green ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:49:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:50:50 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII My best information is that usage of bravo is idiomatic- -"bravo"- -regardless of gender or the singular or plural. Is there an Italian linguist amongst us? Julia Sutton On Thu, 24 Apr 1997, Will Linden wrote: > On Wed, 23 Apr 1997 FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU wrote: > > > Only if all the performers were women? (No anti-feminism there, please. My daughter has taught me better than that.) > > > If you are applauding "ALL the performerS", it is _bravi_! Whatever > their gender is. > > Will Linden wlinden-AT- panix.com > http://www.panix.com/~wlinden/ > Magic Code: MAS/GD S++ W++ N+ PWM++ Ds/r+ A-> a++ C+ G- QO++ 666 Y > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 11:06:47 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 14:07:29 +0000 (GMT) From: Margherita Modica Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, any To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: On 24 Apr 97 at 13:50, julia s sutton wrote: > My best information is that usage of bravo is idiomatic- -"bravo"- > -regardless of gender or the singular or plural. Is there an Italian > linguist amongst us? I grew up saying "bravi"--but then again, my family was from Sicily! Margherita Davis ************************************************************************ Margherita M. Modica mmodica-AT- obgyn.amc.edu Obstetrics & Gynecology (518) 262-6405 Albany Medical College (518) 262-5292, fax ************************************************************************ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 11:27:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 14:27:24 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: More Words on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: More Words on NPR -------------------------------------- I listened from 5-6:30 and heard a teaser at 6:00 but never the story. I guessed that they just don't rebroadcast the last 1/2 hour... so I switched to another station to hear the end of the show. Well at 6:50 I thought NOW I would finally get to hear the ECD story--and the station went into a pledge break! Aargh. Anise ______________________________ Reply Separator ______________________________ I listened from 4:00 to 5:15 in New Haven, when I had to leave work and didn't even hear a teaser. But my room-mates heard it around 6:00. I don't quite understand how that worked out since the show's only an hour and half. But, thanks to the information on realaudio and our in-house computer nerd who plugged it in for me, I just heard the whole thing. Very nicely done. Great job, Gene of making it sound fun and welcoming, and to all the NY dancers who attended, danced and welcomed your newcomers, congratulations. I'm also glad to hear that so many people contacted their local station and gave out contact numbers, since it was my suggestion (although I'm sure a lot of people thought of it independently), especially since my local station wasn't responsive. I'd be interested to hear if any dances found new people (or vice versa) as a result of this. Barbara Ruth New Haven ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 11:55:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 14:55:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Benjamin Stein <102510.477-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD in England? To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <970424185543_102510.477_HHM51-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> To Marc Edgar etc: Suggest that you write to The English Folk Dance and Song Society, 2 Regents park Road, London NW1 7AY, England. They publish an annual directory of local Folk Dance (read English Country Dance) groups. The last I knew it cost $14 plus shipping and handling. They also usually have a listing of special events.We have found their listings very helpful when travelling in England. If you are spending any time in London it would pay to call them at 071-485-2206. Most of the good dancing in London is at local clubs but occassionally there is a fine dance at their headquarters, Cecil Sharp House, which is in Camden Town, only about a block or so from the London Zoo. Good luck. Ben Stein 102510.477-AT- Compuserve.Com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 12:27:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 15:26:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Philip Whaley <101454.633-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD in England? To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <970424192559_101454.633_IHP117-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Marc Edgar wrote: he will be in England/Scotland between 28th May & June 10 - suggest you look at http://www.ftech.co.uk/~webfeet/efolk/dates/danceall.html - that should start you off with what's happening over this side of the "pond" - also Fried de Metz Herman will be in England during those dates - she's calling at Neston in Cheshire on May 31st - afternoon workshop & evening dance - also in Oxford on 3rd June (I can give you details of that one) Happy hunting! Margaret Whaley Oxfordshire ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:01:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 15:59:01 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NY Ball (short) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>NY Ball (short) ------------------------------------------------------------ Gene Murrow wrote: (among much else) For the Ball, I asked the band to avoid ritards (slowing of tempo) at the end of the final round of each dance, and instead to play an additional, final chord (as the Scots do). I announced this to the dancers-- the final chord was for a proper honor (bow / curtsey), in aid of preventing the usual rush off to find the next partner. I think it added a touch of graciousness to the evening (ask the dancers...). ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Gene, Thanks for the wonderful, long description of the New York Ball. It sounds like it was a delightful evening - not much of a surprise there. I really like the idea of sounding a final chord for honors at the end of the dance. Something I've liked a lot in the little Scottish Country dancing I've done is having the chord at the beginning of the dance for partners to acknowledge each other. I noticed that this was done in the movie version of _Sense and Sensibility_ (I don't remember if I saw it in any of the other Austen-films), and wondered if it had been a traditional part of Playford-style dancing, way back when. It does seem to me to be a lovely, gracious way to begin a dance. I personally would like to see it become customary in our modern dance groups. Barbara Ruth New Haven ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:10:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 16:12:14 -0400 From: walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ECD in England? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704242012.AA07549-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The Cecil Sharpe House (at the address Marc provided) has a WEB site that lists dances around the country. Any browser will locate it for you. Danny >To Marc Edgar etc: > >Suggest that you write to The English Folk Dance and Song Society, 2 Regents >park Road, London NW1 7AY, England. They publish an annual directory of local >Folk Dance (read English Country Dance) groups. The last I knew it cost $14 plus >shipping and handling. They also usually have a listing of special events.We >have found their listings very helpful when travelling in England. If you are >spending any time in London it would pay to call them at 071-485-2206. Most of >the good dancing in London is at local clubs but occassionally there is a fine >dance at their headquarters, Cecil Sharp House, which is in Camden Town, only >about a block or so from the London Zoo. Good luck. > >Ben Stein >102510.477-AT- Compuserve.Com > > > Daniel J. Walkowitz Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University New York, New York 10003-6607 tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:12:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 16:12:57 -0400 (EDT) From: webatcheler-AT- juno.com (Wayne Batcheler) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: More Words on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19970424.161032.6999.4.webatcheler-AT- juno.com> References: Barbara Ruth wrote from New Haven (CT), about missing the ECD segment on "All Things Considered" : > I don't quite understand how that worked out since the show's only an hour and half. Well there is part of the answer. In New York on WNEW, the show runs for a full 2 hours. Wayne Batcheler New York (City) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:19:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 15:29:23 -0500 From: sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'm taking a break from the BEMF Book to readd 200 e-mail messages: Julia Sutton wrote: >My best information is that usage of bravo is idiomatic- -"bravo"- >-regardless of gender or the singular or plural. Is there an Italian >linguist amongst us? Well, I went to Italy in January to play for the Pope... does that count? Cheering the guy: BRAVO Cheering lots of guys: BRAVI plural m-ending is I Cheering the gal: BRAVA Cheering lots of gals: BRAVE plural f-ending is E But usually cheering lots of people of at least 2 genders present is normally BRAVI.... or, alternatively: YABBA-DABBA-DOOO!!! Sheila Beardslee Bosworth sheilab-AT- tiac.net Editor, Boston Early Music News >>next BEMN Deadline 4/20 for May 15 issue! May 15 issue is BEMF Preview issue! Summer workshops & concert listings welcomed! 29 Main Street, Acton MA 01720-3505 voice: 508/263.9926 fax: 508/263.2366 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:32:20 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 16:29:31 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: More Words on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>>More Words on NPR -------------------------------------- Date: 4/24/97 4:26 PM To: Barbara Ruth From: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Barbara Ruth wrote from New Haven (CT), about missing the ECD segment on "All Things Considered" : > I don't quite understand how that worked out since the show's only an hour and half. Well there is part of the answer. In New York on WNEW, the show runs for a full 2 hours. Wayne Batcheler New York (City) ------------------------------------------------------ Good Lord! Can anyone stand that much news! (When I was living on an island in the Amazon studying monkeys, listening to All Things Considered on shortwave was my big treat of the day. I only got an hour there!) Barbara Ruth New Haven ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 15:19:57 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 17:30:10 -0500 From: seniort-AT- newtrier.k12.il.us (Thomas J. Senior) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: International Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello all, Congratulations to CDNYC! The publicity can only help ECD. I've been invited to present an ECD workshop to an International Dance Weekend. I've been told there will be a significant gender ballance problem but that the dancers who attend the weekend will all be experienced and capable, though not necessarily in our style of dance. I would appreciate words of wisdom and advice from those of you who have worked with international dancers. Suggest some dances you might teach. There is a very good chance for live music. You may reply by personal note if you'd like. Thanks, Tom Senior Those who can, do. Those who understand, teach. Thomas J. Senior New Trier High School 1232 St. Johns Ave 385 Winnetka Ave Highland Park, IL 60035-3425 Winnetka, IL 60093-4295 847-433-8704 847-446-7000 x2128 seniort-AT- newtrier.k12.il.us ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 15:20:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 18:21:27 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sheila, What's your source for this information, the Pope (not, by the way, a native! Julia ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 17:55:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 20:55:56 -0400 (EDT) From: catdancer-AT- juno.com (Helen Tuzio) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: npr segment: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural, anyway? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19970424.193640.10151.3.catdancer-AT- juno.com> References: On Thu, 24 Apr 1997 15:29:23 -0500 sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) writes: >Cheering the guy: BRAVO >Cheering lots of guys: BRAVI plural m-ending is I > >Cheering the gal: BRAVA >Cheering lots of gals: BRAVE plural f-ending is E > >But usually cheering lots of people of at least 2 genders present >is normally BRAVI.... That's the way I learned it too!! I haven't played for the Pope, but I did see the smoke when he was selected. Does that count? Helen Tuzio New York (just one of the 150 or so now showing up to dance at CDNY on Tuesdays) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 19:00:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 22:02:21 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: More Words on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704250222.WAA22367-AT- xis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > I'd be interested to hear if any dances found new people (or vice > versa) as a result of this. Washington (Glen Echo) English is experiencing an explosion that began about the same time as NY's. Baltimore, only 45 minutes, away is not. I'm at a loss to explain the difference. I find it hard to believe the Times article would bring in very many this far away from NY. From what I can tell, many of the new dancers are folks who first tried contras and then decided to try English. Wonderful, but why so many all at once I wonder? And why now? It will be interesting to see the effect of All Things Considered. Mary Cliff who hosts the folk show on WETA has always been very good about giving us plugs, so I don't know if ATC with add that much for us. Still, All Things Considered has a much bigger audience. With respect to having other newspapers do articles on ECD, the Washington Post did one about a year ago in their Weekender section. We got few if any new dancers the first dance after the article. But, I did get a number of phone calls. Over the next few months new people showed up who had read the article and eventually got around to checking it out. I do think though that it was the tone and quality of Linda's writing that made the difference. She truly captured the spirit of ECD. We may have also caught a wave (well a ripple anyway. There's still dozens of 8 Heads in a Bag for every Emma.) as American tries to reinvent civility. ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 19:18:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 22:20:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christopher G. Levey" Subject: NPR on realaudio To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <199704250220.WAA11767-AT- coos.dartmouth.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The NPR segement from yesterday's all things considered is available by following the last hyperlink ("Linda traveled to New York City") at: http://www.realaudio.com/contentp/npr/nc7a23.html They didn't index the time quite right; you may need to listen to a bit on Clinton and FDR, or move the RealAudio player pointer to about 1/4 for the start of Linda's piece on English Dance. -- --Chris Levey Director, Microengineering Lab Thayer School, Dartmouth College email: chris.levey-AT- Dartmouth.EDU http://hypatia.dartmouth.edu/levey.html ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 02:05:43 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 08:08:59 +0000 From: Mike Watson Subject: Dance Reference in Jane Austen To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <160-AT- dykech.demon.co.uk> I tried bowling the following question to the cognoscenti of the Morris List, with no success, other than a suggestion that I try the ECD. Apologies if this has already been discussed. ============== Can anyone shed light on a question which has intrigued me ever since getting involved in folk dance - the references in Jane Austen to the dancing, which always seemed, at that time, to be in pairs of dances. Some examples: Pride and Prejudice: "...had been obliged, by the scarcity of gentlemen, to sit down for two dances" "So, he enquired who she was, and got introduced, and asked her for the two next. Then, the two third he danced with Miss King, and the two fourth with Maria Lucas, and the two fifth with Jane again...." Mansfield Park: "I wished to engage Miss Crawford for the two first dances" "...by his engaging her for the two first dances" Northanger Abbey: "The two dances were scarcely concluded before..." etc. We can infer that the dances were always done in pairs, but why?, was there any relationship (step, music, timing) between the pairs of dances? Mike Watson Maldon Greenjackets Maldon, U.K. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 08:07:44 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 11:09:12 -0400 From: walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: International Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704251509.AA08972-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Tom, Hole in the Wall is often done in International circles, so you may find it an easy introduction as some will find it familiar. Danny Walkowitz >Hello all, > Congratulations to CDNYC! The publicity can only help ECD. > > I've been invited to present an ECD workshop to an International Dance >Weekend. I've been told there will be a significant gender ballance >problem but that the dancers who attend the weekend will all be experienced >and capable, though not necessarily in our style of dance. I would >appreciate words of wisdom and advice from those of you who have worked >with international dancers. Suggest some dances you might teach. There is >a very good chance for live music. > You may reply by personal note if you'd like. > >Thanks, > Tom Senior > > >Those who can, do. Those who understand, teach. > >Thomas J. Senior >New Trier High School 1232 St. Johns Ave >385 Winnetka Ave Highland Park, IL 60035-3425 >Winnetka, IL 60093-4295 847-433-8704 >847-446-7000 x2128 seniort-AT- newtrier.k12.il.us > > > > Daniel J. Walkowitz Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University New York, New York 10003-6607 tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 09:13:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 11:57:12 -0400 (EDT) From: catdancer-AT- juno.com (Helen Tuzio) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance Reference in Jane Austen To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <19970425.103752.6743.4.catdancer-AT- juno.com> References: <160-AT- dykech.demon.co.uk> On Fri, 25 Apr 1997 08:08:59 +0000 Mike Watson writes: >Can anyone shed light on a question which has intrigued me ever since >getting involved in folk dance - the references in Jane Austen to the >dancing, which always seemed, at that time, to be in pairs of >dances... (clip) >We can infer that the dances were always done in pairs, but why?, >was there any relationship (step, music, timing) between the pairs of >dances? Mike - You reminded me of a conversation I had recently. A dancer (not ECDer) friend of mine commented that in the clubs she frequents, it is customary for people to do pairs of dances. She didn't think there was any written rule about it; it just seemed to evolve. She said the nice thing about doing two dances is that it gives the couple a chance to talk (between dances) and get to know each other. If asked to do but one dance, sometimes there's barely a chance to get to know much more than the name of your partner. I don't know much about how the dances were run during Jane Austen's time, but in her movies it seems the men chatted together as did the women, but there was little intermingling off the dancefloor. If this was truly the case, the only appropriate time for men and women to get to know each other was in the middle of the dance floor between two dances. How's that for an unsubstantiated hypothesis? Helen Tuzio New York ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 09:25:19 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: bolker-AT- phoenix.Princeton.EDU Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:25:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Susie Lorand Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: timing of ATC on NPR in the U.S. To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 24 Apr 1997, Sharon Green wrote: > At 10:16 AM 4/24/97 -0700, Robert Reed wrote: > >In Portland it played at 6:50 (ATC runs 5-7). Does that mean we get our > >hours played in reverse order? > > Quite possibly: In New York ATC airs from 4-6 on AM, from 5-7 on FM, and the > ECD spot played at 5:50 on both! [That's why I specified only that it would > play at 10 minutes before the hour and never gave a particular hour.] > > Cheers, > Sharon Green and Barbara Ruth mentioned that the program is only 1 1/2 hrs. long on her station... sometime in 1996 (i think), all things considered was expanded to 2 hours. for decades it had indeed been a 1 1/2 hour show, typically aired from 5 to 6:30 (at least in the east). starting time was also moved up to 4 p.m. from 5 p.m. perhaps some stations agree with barbara that 2 hours is too much. since ATC and other NPR news programs are produced in washington, d.c., they come from the eastern (u.s.) time zone. stations in other time zones pick up the continuing satellite feed of the original two hours, which i suspect just keep alternating until whenever npr turns off the tape players. (surely linda wertheimer and her co-hosts get to leave after 6 p.m.!) because portland, oregon, is in a time zone an odd number of hours (3) behind from eastern time, the 5-7 slot would indeed give you the two hours of the program in the opposite order from 5-7 p.m. in new york but in the same order as 4-6 p.m. in new york. i heard the ECD segment and enjoyed it - such fun to hear familiar voices on national radio! i do wish that more of the music had been audible (& that npr had taken as much pains with the sound as the n.y. ball organizers) and that more time had been allotted to the segment. congrats to all involved! - susie lorand (public radio fan and former college radio announcer) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 09:27:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:24:32 -0500 From: Marc Edgar Subject: Re: ECD in England? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3360E8CF.BD99A07E-AT- mail.geocities.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 References: <970424185543_102510.477_HHM51-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Thanks for the references, muchly appreciated -- I'll get in touch with them. Hope to see you on the dance floor. Marc Benjamin Stein wrote: > > > Postage paid by: [Image] > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To Marc Edgar etc: > > Suggest that you write to The English Folk Dance and Song Society, 2 Regents > park Road, London NW1 7AY, England. They publish an annual directory of local > Folk Dance (read English Country Dance) groups. The last I knew it cost $14 plus > shipping and handling. They also usually have a listing of special events.We > have found their listings very helpful when travelling in England. If you are > spending any time in London it would pay to call them at 071-485-2206. Most of > the good dancing in London is at local clubs but occassionally there is a fine > dance at their headquarters, Cecil Sharp House, which is in Camden Town, only > about a block or so from the London Zoo. Good luck. > > Ben Stein > 102510.477-AT- Compuserve.Com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 09:28:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:26:42 -0500 From: Marc Edgar Subject: Re: ECD in England? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3360E951.D32ACA32-AT- mail.geocities.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 References: <970424192559_101454.633_IHP117-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Thanks for the reference to the Efolk dance listings. I have been having lots of trouble reaching anything at www.ftech.com. What an informative page. Thanks again. Hope to see you on the dance floor. Marc Philip Whaley wrote: > > > Postage paid by: [Image] > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Marc Edgar wrote: > > he will be in England/Scotland between 28th May & June 10 > > - suggest you look at > > http://www.ftech.co.uk/~webfeet/efolk/dates/danceall.html > > - that should start you off with what's happening over this side of the "pond" > > - also Fried de Metz Herman will be in England during those dates > > - she's calling at Neston in Cheshire on May 31st - afternoon workshop & > evening dance > > - also in Oxford on 3rd June (I can give you details of that one) > > Happy hunting! > > > Margaret Whaley > Oxfordshire > > > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 09:29:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:27:42 -0500 From: Marc Edgar Subject: Re: ECD in England? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3360E98E.5EFB7AE1-AT- mail.geocities.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 References: <9704242012.AA07549-AT- is2.nyu.edu> Thanks for the references. I think we are going to try and go to The Cecil Sharpe House -- sounds like fun. Thanks again. Marc Daniel J. Walkowitz wrote: > > > Postage paid by: [Image] > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > The Cecil Sharpe House (at the address Marc provided) has a WEB site that > lists dances around the country. Any browser will locate it for you. > Danny > > >To Marc Edgar etc: > > > >Suggest that you write to The English Folk Dance and Song Society, 2 Regents > >park Road, London NW1 7AY, England. They publish an annual directory of local > >Folk Dance (read English Country Dance) groups. The last I knew it cost $14 > plus > >shipping and handling. They also usually have a listing of special events.We > >have found their listings very helpful when travelling in England. If you are > >spending any time in London it would pay to call them at 071-485-2206. Most of > >the good dancing in London is at local clubs but occassionally there is a fine > >dance at their headquarters, Cecil Sharp House, which is in Camden Town, only > >about a block or so from the London Zoo. Good luck. > > > >Ben Stein > >102510.477-AT- Compuserve.Com > > > > > > > Daniel J. Walkowitz > > > Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History > 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University > New York, New York 10003-6607 > tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 09:35:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:36:49 -0400 (EDT) From: CF1125-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: More Words on NPR To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970425123642_2049962988-AT- emout12.mail.aol.com> Rich Galloway observed: "Washington (Glen Echo) English is experiencing an explosion that began about the same time as NY's. Baltimore, only 45 minutes, away is not. I'm at a loss to explain the difference." Two possible explanations come to mind: 1) Washington people reading the NY Times in much larger numbers that do we Baltimoronians; 2) the upcoming Washington Playford Ball. -Carl Friedman ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 10:17:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 13:18:33 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: timing of ATC on NPR in To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Reply to: RE>>timing of ATC on NPR in the U.S. -from susie lorand (public radio fan and former college radio announcer) and Barbara Ruth mentioned that the program is only 1 1/2 hrs. long on her station... sometime in 1996 (i think), all things considered was expanded to 2 hours. for decades it had indeed been a 1 1/2 hour show, typically aired from 5 to 6:30 (at least in the east). starting time was also moved up to 4 p.m. from 5 p.m. perhaps some stations agree with barbara that 2 hours is too much. ---------------------------------------- More likely all 2 hours are carried and I just never realized it had gone up. I don't listen all that regularly, although I do think highly of the show. Actually I knew it was on the air for 3 hours (possibly 3 1/2) here, but I assumed that it was 3 half-hour segments rerun, as it used to be in Boston when I lived there. But this explains the mystery of the missing segment! (BTW Susie, I have that recipe for hamantashen for you - I just have to bring it into work someday when I am alert enough not to bury it somewhere.) Barbara Ruth New Haven ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 11:00:33 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 11:01:52 -0700 From: Robin Cohen Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance Reference in Jane Austen To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704251101.ZM5587-AT- alewench.engr.sgi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <160-AT- dykech.demon.co.uk> <19970425.103752.6743.4.catdancer-AT- juno.com> I like Helen's theory about socializing between two dances. There may have also been something about the dance program itself. In the past, I used to do lots of cajun dancing, before it became a fad. A local popular band used to alternate between two-steps and waltzes, very predictably. It quickly evolved into a local custom to do a two-step and waltz with one partner. -- *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Robin Cohen Mailstop - 9U-505 EBU Administrator Phone - 415-933-1368 Silicon Graphics, Inc. Fax - 415-967-8496 *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:08:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 10:45:27 -0700 From: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com Subject: Re: Dance Reference in Jane Austen To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: mike-AT- dykech.demon.co.uk wrote: |I tried bowling the following question to the cognoscenti of the Morris |List, with no success, other than a suggestion that I try the ECD. |Apologies if this has already been discussed. |============== |Can anyone shed light on a question which has intrigued me ever since |getting involved in folk dance - the references in Jane Austen to the |dancing, which always seemed, at that time, to be in pairs of dances. |Some examples: |Pride and Prejudice: |"...had been obliged, by the scarcity of gentlemen, to sit down for |two dances" |"So, he enquired who she was, and got introduced, and |asked her for the two next. Then, the two third he danced with Miss |King, and the two fourth with Maria Lucas, and the two fifth with |Jane again...." |Mansfield Park: |"I wished to engage Miss Crawford for the two first |dances" |"...by his engaging her for the two first dances" |Northanger Abbey: |"The two dances were scarcely concluded before..." |etc. |We can infer that the dances were always done in pairs, but why?, |was| there any relationship (step, music, timing) between the pairs of |dances? I don't have the answer, but I have a further question. Could this somehow have decended to the WSD tradition of dancing two tips in each set? ________________________________________________________________________________ Robert Reed Home Animation Limited 503-656-8414 email: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com West Linn, OR 97068 ...the neural organization of musical skills and performance [gleened by studying aphasics, people who can't talk good] has been more difficult to uncover, mainly because of the rarity of brain-damaged musicians. --Distributed Neural Network Underlying Musical Sight-Reading and Keyboard Performance, July 1992, Science. ________________________________________________________________________________ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:08:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 10:50:30 -0700 From: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com Subject: Re: More Words on NPR To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: webatcheler-AT- juno.com wrote: |Barbara Ruth wrote from New Haven (CT), about missing the ECD segment on |"All Things Considered" : |> I don't quite understand how that worked out since the show's only an |hour and half. |Well there is part of the answer. In New York on WNEW, the show runs for |a full 2 hours. Yes, I was going to say that ATC runs 90 minutes only in some markets. That was its running length until, I believe, last summer when it expanded to a full two hours. And news junkie that I am, I try to catch all of it, and Marketplace that precedes it, and The World, a collaboration between PRI and the BBC, for an hour before that. I really enjoyed my year in the Bay Area listening to KQED, all news, all the time. ________________________________________________________________________________ Robert Reed Home Animation Limited 503-656-8414 email: robert-AT- slipknot.rain.com West Linn, OR 97068 A good politician is quite as unthinkable as an honest burglar. --H.L. Mencken ________________________________________________________________________________ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 19:32:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 19:33:43 -0700 (PDT) From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NY Ball (short) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Reply to: RE>NY Ball (short) > > >------------------------------------------------------------ >Gene Murrow wrote: >(among much else) >For the Ball, I asked the band to avoid ritards (slowing of tempo) at the >end of the final round of each dance, and instead to play an additional, >final chord (as the Scots do). I announced this to the dancers-- the final >chord was for a proper honor (bow / curtsey), in aid of preventing the >usual rush off to find the next partner. I think it added a touch of >graciousness to the evening (ask the dancers...). >------------------------------------------------------------------------- Very accommodating musicians you have, Gene! For Seattle's performing group, Nonesuch, I asked for an extra chord at the end of two dances in the show two years ago, since the dancers were in motion on the last two bars and couldn't catch their balance for a proper bow without the extra chord. One of the musicians grumbled about a Scottish ending to an English dance, but played the chord for the bow -- at rehearsals. It didn't happen during the performance, and the dancers were caught off guard, and off-balance. The next year we solved the problem by instituting a l o n g pause between the penultimate note and the last note (leaving that V7 chord just hanging in the air!) to give us the time to catch our breath and bow without offending our authenticity-minded band member. Vicky Bestock ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 19:43:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 19:45:13 -0700 (PDT) From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance Reference in Jane Austen To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Mike Watson wrote; >I tried bowling the following question to the cognoscenti of the Morris >List, with no success, other than a suggestion that I try the ECD. >Apologies if this has already been discussed. > >============== >Can anyone shed light on a question which has intrigued me ever since >getting involved in folk dance - the references in Jane Austen to the >dancing, which always seemed, at that time, to be in pairs of dances. Whem my husband and I were in England three years ago, we noted some differences in style and social expectations from English dance as danced in the US> Their tradition, and it sounds as though this is continuous from Jane Austin's time, was to dance two dances in the same formation in succession without changing partners or breaking up the set between the two. Then the floor is cleared and people chat before the next two. In this situation, when you ask someone to dance, it is for the next TWO dances, since there won't be a break or partner change between them. We've kept a remnant of this tradition in square dancing, where the sets are held for two squares, then broken up with a round or mixer before new squares are formed. Vicky Bestock ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 22:31:49 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 01:43:59 -0400 From: Faina Riftina Subject: What's It Like to Dance with Linda Wertheimer? To: English Country Dance list Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3361961F.DFA-AT- is3.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Some CD*NY fellow dancers have urged me to break my diffident silence about my dancing with Linda Wertheimer the evening NPR came to Duane Hall. Linda Wertheimer is a mature woman with lots of energy and a terrific good sport, not a natural for English Country Dancing but not bad by any means for a beginner.She wore sensible shoes and a pants suit, so her clothes did not get in the way of her dancing. Linda has a very engaging smile and holds excellent eye contact--perhaps honed by years of one-on-one interviewing. With her solid knowledge of the political landscape, she certainly knows her right from her left, and by the end of a modified version of Scotch Cap and a full rendition of Well Hall, she knew up and down and her diagonal corner as well. But for some reason these terms haven't made it into the political lexicon of NPR's current reporting ("Clinton is meeting on the diagonal with Congress over the budget" just hasn't surface yet). After Gene led us through Scotch Cap and Well Hall in a set that included both Linda and her producer Lisa Harmon and after the NPR crew had "quiet room" interviews with Gene, Beverely, and Brad (from the CDSS office), Linda sat with me and observed the general dancing.I described the dance figures, directed her to watch the sets that were dancing well, and gossiped furiously about who was who, who was dancing well, and other tidbits about the social action on the floor. Sound familiar? During this part of the evening, she and Lisa Harmon invited dancers over to the bench on the side where we were sitting for personal testimonials: The questions asked of each were, "Who are you? What do you do in real life? And why do you enjoy English Country Dancing?" The answers, as you all know, were wonderful to hear. I wanted to ask Linda questions too: how were you chosen for this assignment. How did you prepare for it? What other dancing have you done? Do you enjoy dancing and would you consider coming back for more, now that you've experienced English Country Dancing? But I'm glad I restrained myself. It was more important for her to ask and for us to answer. --Paul Ross, English Country Dance teacher, CD*NY ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 03:12:22 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 03:07:32 -0700 (PDT) From: HUGH-AT- edsug.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance Reference in Jane Austen To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01II59SY40SY00G6XH-AT- UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >> Their tradition, and it sounds as though this is continuous >> from Jane Austin's time, was to dance two dances in the same formation in >> succession without changing partners or breaking up the set between the >> two. Then the floor is cleared and people chat before the next two. I feel I have to chip in here and point out that England is big enough to sustain more than one tradition. My experience is that some callers work to that convention, but most do one dance at a time. (Though many have two-on-the-trot as a useful trick when dancers are slow to form sets (the classic drunken wedding someone mentioned recently), to force mixing ('keep that one and stay in your sets') or to con people into a dance (rant, waltz) they might not want to do.) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 05:24:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 08:25:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "Priscilla M. Burrage" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance Reference in Jane Austen and Learning to Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 25 Apr 1997 bestockp-AT- oz.net wrote: > Mike Watson wrote; > >Can anyone shed light on a question which has intrigued me ever since > >getting involved in folk dance - the references in Jane Austen to the > >dancing, which always seemed, at that time, to be in pairs of dances. > > We've kept a remnant of this tradition in square dancing, where the sets > are held for two squares, then broken up with a round or mixer before new > squares are formed. I grew up in an area where square dancing was part of the social culture: i. e., a square dance followed a basketball games, a church suppers, or a wedding,as a matter of routine. After prohibition, many bars put on square dances on Friday or Saturday night. The squares were always danced in groups of three, and we kept our partner for all three. Sometimes it was great to have those few minutes to talk to my partner; other times it was pure agony. An aside. On Friday night I would go to the local Izark Walton League meeting house to square dance. The hall was long and thin, with no electronic enhancement of the band, who sat in one corner of the hall. The oldest dancers (grandparents) made up the sets closest to the band; the next "ring" of sets were made up of middle-aged dancers; teenagers and recently engaged or married made up the remaining rings of sets. The one lonely set in the opposite corner was where you danced while you, thirteen or younger, were still learning and still learning by doing. Which brings up another aside: I square danced for over twenty yeas before I was taught one in a class. We need to have more of this kind of learning going on today. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Priscilla Burrage Vermont US (pburrage-AT- zoo.uvm.edu) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 10:12:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 16:25:06 +0000 From: bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Number of dances with same partner To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <862073987.1019309.0-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk> HUGH-AT- edsug.com wrote: > I feel I have to chip in here and point out that England is big enough to > sustain more than one tradition. My experience is that > some callers work to that convention, but most do one dance at a time. I would agree with Hugh that some callers do one at a time and others do two, but I would say that most who I have seen do two rather than one. As Hugh says, England's big enough to sustain more than one tradition. One thing that I've noticed is that when I call two dances in a row in England the total time taken including getting people on the floor, doing walk throughs etc. is about 15 minutes. My experience with dancing and calling at contras in the U.S. is that each dance takes about 15 minutes owing to the longer time that the dances are run for. Perhaps 15 minutes is some sort of universal "longest time you can be expected to spend with one partner before being given the opportunity to find someone else". I recall asking before on this group how long a typical Playford dance would be run for in the U.S. Does it fit in with my completely arbitrary "15 minute rule" ? BTW I have seen John Chapman do 5 dances in a row, but then he's John Chapman and he can get away with things like that :-) Bob ---------------------------------------------------------- -- Bob Archer bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 11:41:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 11:39:06 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance Reference in Jane Austen and Learning to Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hi Priscilla (and everyone): Your stories about growing up in a community where square dancing was part of the normal social activities are fascinating. I'm curious: where did you grow up? I see from your post that you live in Vermont now. Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 15:39:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 18:41:44 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Number of dances with same partner To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704262301.TAA03853-AT- xis.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > I recall asking before on this group how long a typical Playford > dance would be run for in the U.S. Does it fit in with my completely > arbitrary "15 minute rule" ? Probably more like 10-12 minutes in DC/Baltimore. We typically do about 10-12 dances in a 2 1/2 hour evening with maybe 30 minutes "wasted" ;-) on a break and socializing. No one has yet mentioned the "always dance with the same partner" tradition. It was widespread in the mid-Atlantic in traditional square dances when first began dancing and still exists in places. When a group of 10 of us went on a dance tour of England, we came across it rather often. Actually, these were more or less permanent partners that you kept week after week. I talked to some women that had been dancing as partners for over 20 years. (The callers usually asked the dancers to adopt the "American" style that evening so that the Americans could get a chance to dance with English partners.) In the early 18th century, one was usually matched with a partner for the evening when you arrived. From a much earlier period, I recall Arbeau mentions that it was considered rude to devote all your attention to one lady. That sounds like the norm was to change partners, but that not everyone did consistently. I'm sure Julia can give us a better perspective on that period. It would be interesting to trace as many partnering traditions as we can through time and dance communities. I you find something, please share it. ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 10:10:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 13:11:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NY Ball (short) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 25 Apr 1997 bestockp-AT- oz.net wrote: [quote from Gene Murrow on playing a final chord] > Very accommodating musicians you have, Gene! For Seattle's performing > group, Nonesuch, I asked for an extra chord at the end of two dances in the > show two years ago, since the dancers were in motion on the last two bars > and couldn't catch their balance for a proper bow without the extra chord. > One of the musicians grumbled about a Scottish ending to an English dance, > but played the chord for the bow -- at rehearsals. It didn't happen during > the performance, and the dancers were caught off guard, and off-balance. > > The next year we solved the problem by instituting a l o n g pause between > the penultimate note and the last note (leaving that V7 chord just hanging > in the air!) to give us the time to catch our breath and bow without > offending our authenticity-minded band member. Vicky Bestock. ...who undoubtedly was playing a period instrument in the proper style without electronic reinforcement... (;-^) Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 16:46:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 18:55:47 -0500 From: sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: NY Ball (short) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >On Fri, 25 Apr 1997 bestockp-AT- oz.net wrote: >[quote from Gene Murrow on playing a final chord] >> The next year we solved the problem by instituting a l o n g pause ... >> to give us the time to catch our breath and bow without >> offending our authenticity-minded band member. Vicky Bestock. > Eric Arnold noted: >...who undoubtedly was playing a period instrument in the proper style >without electronic reinforcement... (;-^) I would like to point out that a historical dance/music specialist might *fully* expect there to be a bow at the end to acknowledge one's partner... Sheila Beardslee Bosworth sheilab-AT- tiac.net Editor, Boston Early Music News >>next BEMN Deadline 4/20 for May 15 issue! May 15 issue is BEMF Preview issue! Summer workshops & concert listings welcomed! 29 Main Street, Acton MA 01720-3505 voice: 508/263.9926 fax: 508/263.2366 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 19:36:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 22:37:00 -0500 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: ET: Back from NEFFA To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Had a great time - thought there was more English than ever - and even in the Main Hall! Colin Hume, Scott Higgs, Brad Foster, Erna-Lynne Bogue - great job! My feet are tired and a bit sore but HAPPY! I have to say, from a slightly biased point of view, that I thought that for the most part the English dancing sessions were pretty adventurous - for example Colin taught his "reconstruction" or rediscovery of the Sharp version of Nonesuch...... no one stomped out! Scott chose some really interesting dances for the no walk thru session including Bar a Bar! there was a lot of very serious looks on people's faces during the talk thru but once the dancing started - Lovely! Loved the session today too - some interesting and little done (outside of camp, anyway) dances. Someone asked me who wrote Easter Morn...... ???? It was great dancing with everyone...... even if we didn't rant. I was really struck by the lovely gentleness and quiet happiness of the roomfuls of people while dancing. Mary Beth Goodman <-- feet up! Ice on! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 01:44:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 04:42:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Margaret Whaley <101454.633-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: No of Dances with Same Formation To: ECD Message-ID: <970428084209_101454.633_IHP94-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> - I agree with Bob Archer, the majority of callers I have come across here in England do 2 dances together. - Although I feel the trend just lately is increasingly only to do pnly 1 dance. - Mt vote is definitely on the side of 2 dances! - Having got up to dance, whether with a regular partner of not, it's very disappointing not to do a second. - and often you hear a disappointed sigh when the caller says "take a break" after only one. - Our club nights are two hours long, and given about 15 minutes for the tea break, with 2 dances together we can dance about 14 dances. - With only single dances it's about 10. - After all - we go folk dancing to dance, not sit. - So please, English callers, 2 dances in a sesssion. - Also, from a callers point of view, surely having got the dancers up, it makes senses to do two, rather than have to get them all up again, - especially trying to make that last set up. - Another point - having done the dance once, what it the view with everybody, - if we are going to do 2 dances, should we do the same one again - or another one? My personal felling is a different one. Margaret Whaley Oxfordshire ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 09:23:37 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 09:14:44 -0800 From: Debbie Bruton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: uunet!SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU!ECD-AT- uunet.uu.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" unsubsribe ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 10:12:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: bolker-AT- phoenix.Princeton.EDU Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 13:13:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Susie Lorand Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: ET: Back from NEFFA To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sun, 27 Apr 1997, Mary Beth Goodman wrote: [positive comments on ECD at NEFFA snipped] > Someone asked me who wrote Easter Morn...... ???? > > Mary Beth Goodman <-- feet up! Ice on! We have Erna-Lynne Bogue to thank for the dance Easter Morn, which uses the tune Miss Gordon of Gight. Dance and tune were published in CDSS News within the last 3-4 years. If I'm remembering correctly, Donna Baird, who along with David West played for Erna-Lynne's hour of ECD at NEFFA, introduced ELB to the tune. A note to anyone who decides to call Easter Morn: the dance is much more fun for the 1s, so I'd recommend keeping the sets short *or* running the dance long enough for everyone to have a chance at being active *more* than one time through (the transition between the end and the beginning being one of the fun parts!) --Susie Lorand ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 11:10:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 14:11:33 -0400 (EDT) From: RLHAYDEN-AT- amherst.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Easter Morn To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01II8PJJP85U91XEP0-AT- amherst.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 You can find Easter Morn in the Nov/Dec 1994 issue of the CDSS News, volume 121. Robin Hayden Amherst, MA ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 12:28:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 14:29:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Playford Ball in IL, June 7 To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704281929.OAA19712-AT- ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> The Central Illinois English Country Dancers Invite You To An E N G L I S H C O U N T R Y D A N C E P L A Y F O R D B A L L The Central Illinois English Country Dancers will be holding their second annual Playford Ball on Saturday, June 7, 1997. The dance will be held at the Channing-Murray Foundation, 1209 W. Oregon, Urbana, IL, on the campus of the University of Illinois. There will be a review of the evening's dances from 7:00 to 8:00, followed by the Ball from 8:00 to 11:00 p.m. Fans and finery are encouraged. There will be a $5.00 suggested donation to help cover the cost of the Ball. All lovers of English Country dance and music are welcome. Dances Lead By: Susan Burt, Jane Hobgood and Jonathan Sivier Music Provided By: The Flatland Consort Dance Review: 7:00 p.m. Playford Ball: 8:00 to 11:00 p.m. Date: Saturday, June 7, 1997 Location: Channing-Murray Foundation, 1209 W. Oregon, Urbana, IL Suggested Donation: $5.00 Here is the list of dances we will be doing: A Grand March The Corporation Dargason Dublin Bay Grimstock Heartsease Hole In The Wall Hunsdon House Juice of Barley Mad Robin Newcastle Picking Up Sticks Waltz Country Dance There will be refreshments at the break and a party following the dance. For further information contact Jonathan Sivier (j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu) at 217/359-8225 or Jane Hobgood at 217/328-1708. Thanks for the support of the Champaign Park District and the Urbana Country Dancers. For those who are interested, the Urbana Country Dancers will be holding a contra dance on Friday, June 6, from 8 to 11 p.m. at the Phillip's Recreation Center, 505 W. Stoughton in Urbana. Deborah Hyland from St. Louis will be calling and The Indian Creek Delta Boys from Charleston will be playing. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier |Q: How many angels can dance on the | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | head of a pin? | | Flight Simulation Lab |A: It depends on what dance you call. | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 20:01:22 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 20:25:35 -0500 From: Mary Beth Goodman Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dance event in Stockport NY? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Someone please help my feeble mind...... SOMEWHERE today, I read of an event happening this summer in Stockport NY - that's in Columbia County..... after searching high and lo and thru all my various CDSS/NEFFA papers..... nothing. I'm either still fried from the weekend or I was imagining it! Thanks! Mary Beth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 21:00:38 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 00:02:08 -0500 From: eferguson-AT- umassd.edu (Emily L. Ferguson) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: No of Dances with Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >- I agree with Bob Archer, the majority of callers I have come across here in >England do 2 dances together. > >- Although I feel the trend just lately is increasingly only to do only 1 >dance. > >- My vote is definitely on the side of 2 dances! > >- Having got up to dance, whether with a regular partner or not, it's very >disappointing not to do a second. Hmmm..... This makes me wonder. Do you all actually sit down between dances? Things are really different here in the states, in that case, as we suffer, even at our English dances, from "center set" syndrome. > >- and often you hear a disappointed sigh when the caller says "take a break" >after only one. And my dance only has one break, which happens after two hours and before the final hour. > >- Another point - having done the dance once, what is the view with everybody, >- if we are going to do 2 dances, should we do the same one again - or another >one? My personal feeling is a different one. We only do set dances more than once. The longways we do 13 to 20 times, depending on whether they are duple or triple. But people like more than one try at a set dance, and new dancers gain confidence from being able to do the same dance a second time and get the hang of it. Ah, vive la difference! Emily L. Ferguson - Cape Cod, Massachusetts eferguson-AT- umassd.edu Photographer, English Country Dance leader, weaver/spinner No matter which side of the fence you're on, the grass will always turn brown if you don't water it. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 01:23:47 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 04:21:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Margaret Whaley <101454.633-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD Message-ID: <970429082126_101454.633_IHP100-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Emily Ferguson writes:- >Do you all actually sit down between dances? - In England - yes we do!! - and when the caller says "take a break" he means just a 2-minute "catch your breath" break while he gets the next tape ready and swots up on the next 2 dance instructions! - of course here we do not have a rush round the floor to get your next partner. - Most of us have the same regular partner, so we all ready to dance again when the caller announces the dance.. - If there are any "odd" ladies in the room, who are without a partner (of either sex) - the norm is that they wait until most "couples" are up to give to "odd" men time to decide their partner for that dance, then pair up amonst themselves. - It's all very civilised. - Also all dances are walked through, so it really doesn't matter if you're never come across them before. And most of us love a challenge! Also it is very unusual to have a "rant" say, as the second of a pair. - Set dance are usually done once, sometimes twice, especially if the caller is a 1-dance man, or there is enthusiastic applause. - Longways are usually done about 7-8 times, but this is because on club night we usually have taped music, and that's the no of times on the tape. Live musicians and at Saturday dances it's perhaps 10 times. As you so rightly say - Vive la difference! Margaret Whaley Oxfordshire ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 03:50:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: philippe.callens-AT- uia.ua.ac.be Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 12:48:43 +0200 From: Philippe Callens Subject: Re: International Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <3365D20B.3A45-AT- uia.ua.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Tom, It depends what the dancers's experience will be, but in general I would do dances that don't take too long to teach (so avoid something as The Red House of Cardiff). Dances that include a polka, rant, schottische step may be enjoyed too (e.g. Double Lead Through). I feel they are used to energetic dances you don't want to do too many real slow/sedate ones. They may find that boring. Avoid triple minor longways, too. Succes, Philippe ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 04:52:40 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 07:54:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Praetzel Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704291154.HAA04394-AT- watt.uwaterloo.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Emily Ferguson writes:- > >Do you all actually sit down between dances? > - when the caller says "take a break" he means just a 2-minute "catch your > breath" break while he gets the next tape ready and swots up on the next 2 Ahhhh! No live music! > - of course here we do not have a rush round the floor to get your next > partner. That is never much of a problem. It is certainly easy to accomplish that in 1 or 2 min. > - Most of us have the same regular partner, so we all ready to dance Yech. Sounds like a dance group I'd never get near. Several of us ran into a group like that a few weeks ago. They were fun, had great music but alas never changed partners, never did walkthrus, formed sets for 3 dances. I saw guys come and leave because they'd never get to dance. Some people refer to a dance like this as one that takes "collections" from single people ie they invite them; but they'll never get to dance. Don't you have problems getting people out to your dances? How can you expect anyone to show up if they have to dig up a dancing partner? Why do you force inexperienced people to only dance with inexperienced people (ie the only ones they could talk into coming dancing)? I'm making a lot of assumptions. We don't have dance classes and I don't know anyone who does. To learn you just come to the dances. You'll get experienced dance partners to boot. Hmm. I just realized that we average about one dancer per 50,000 .. 100,000 people in the community! That is why I make the assumption that nobody is going to ever get a partner to come to a dance with them. I certainly have met a fair number of women who are interested in dancing; but they'll never come out because their partner does not dance. > - If there are any "odd" ladies in the room, who are without a partner (of > either sex) - the norm is that they wait until most "couples" are up to > give to "odd" men time to decide their partner for that dance, then pair > up amonst themselves. This seems to make the assumption of more women than men. About the only time I run into that situation is at dances where people come and dance with their friends; but never with anyone else. I'll see guys looking for someone to dance with; but nothing short of a dynamite will get those ladies to dance with someone they don't know. The "civilized" solution that I've run across is that the group in the minority should be doing the asking as this will prevent a mobbing. In reality both men and women do the asking. At times we have to modify that because people tend to dance with people who dance well; so we have to encourage people to ask beginners or newcomers (who are often too timid to go and ask an experienced dancer). - Eric Praetzel ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 05:08:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 11:50:04 +0000 (UT) From: "S. Ridgway Kennedy" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: bravo, brava, brav- what's the plural? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: I remember this question from high school. It would be one bravo and another bravo and another bravo and another bravo and another bravo . . . Ridge (from New Joisey) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 06:23:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: bolker-AT- phoenix.Princeton.EDU Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 09:24:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Susie Lorand Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: local customs & equality of the sexes (was Dances with the Same Formation) To: ECD Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII the following is not intended as a condemnation of another dance community's customs. however, i was quite surprised by parts of margaret whaley's description of her dance group's habits, and present my reactions here for what they're worth. On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Margaret Whaley wrote: [much snipped about local dance customs] > - of course here we do not have a rush round the floor to get your next > partner. this part i certainly agree is very civilized! i wish i knew a way to eliminate the "whoosh" between dances at our local dance, *without* sacrificing other customs i value. > - Most of us have the same regular partner, so we all ready to dance again > when the caller announces the dance.. i'm so used to changing partners for each dance - and have found so many "favorite" partners in my local dance community over the years - that i don't think i would like this way of doing things. > - If there are any "odd" ladies in the room, who are without a partner (of > either sex) - the norm is that they wait until most "couples" are up to > give to "odd" men time to decide their partner for that dance, then pair > up amongst themselves. i like the custom (apparently more common in the u.s. than in england) of women asking men to dance as well as men asking women (not to mention anyone asking anyone else of the same sex). however, i would agree with eric praetzel that there might be a certain amount of sense in the convention of letting members of the sex in the minority do the asking. (i might not like it if i were always in the majority, though.) i personally value the freedom to ask men, and not to have to wait to be asked, as part of the equality of the sexes (which even in the u.s. is still under construction). how do others on the list feel about this? > Margaret Whaley > Oxfordshire susie lorand (using one of ben bolker's e-mail addresses) princeton, nj, usa ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 08:56:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 11:56:09 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Final chords To: ECD list Message-ID: <199704291156_MC2-15A3-2D30-AT- compuserve.com> Vicky's post about the reluctance (refusal?) of her musicians to play an additional final chord for the "honor partner" at the end of a demo dance raises the thorny issue of "authenticity." Best leave that one alone (for a terrific collection of essays on the problems of authenticity in performance of music, applicable to almost any art, see Richard Taruskin's "Text and Act" available in paperback at most bookstores). Vicky, if your band's claim is based on historical practice, Sheila Beardslee Bosworth's comment is right on: "I would like to point out that a historical dance/music specialist might *fully* expect there to be a bow at the end to acknowledge one's partner... " Indeed, one of the issues in preparing a concert performance of 16th or 17th Century dance music is whether or not to play what is generally known, even among non-dancer musicians, as the "bow note" ["bow" meaning man's gesture of honor] which is WRITTEN OUT, in big huge unmistakable whole notes (or breves) at the end of a dance, in many, many published collections of the period. If the band's claim is along the lines of "...the Scottish tradition is to play a bow note at the end, while the English tradition is not to do so, and we choose not to muddle the two in order to keep the valuable and enjoyable distinctions between the two forms..." I have much more sympathy, and would work to find an acceptable alternative.. But in any event, IMHO, the director/leader/caller of the troupe has the final say. From the rave reviews I've heard of Nonesuch's performances, Vicky knows what she's doing; the band's behavior, especially the change between rehearsal and performance, is inexcusable. At minimum, it should have been discussed. When I'm the caller, I expect the band to do exactly as I say! When I'm in the band, I do exactly as the caller says (including ending a dance in the middle of a round if that's what the caller signals)! Gene Murrow EC Dancer apologizing for a boatload of stern comments on bow notes. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 08:56:21 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 11:56:12 -0400 From: Gene Murrow Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Credit where credit is due To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <199704291155_MC2-15A3-2D31-AT- compuserve.com> Thanks to all of you who, through e-mail or in person, offered compliments on the NPR interview. As many of you know, and indicated in your comments, the credit really goes to Sharon Green, who responded to their initial inquiry and kept their interest high through innumerable phone calls, arrangements, and her unflagging enthusiasm. We all just showed up to "do our thing" and answer Linda Wertheimer's questions! While we were disappointed that NPR chose not to use the many comments we all (including Brad Foster) offered about the national scope of the English country dance community, we were generally pleased with the final product and impressed with NPR's expertise in capturing the essence of what we do. In my late night, rambling report on the New York Ball, I neglected to mention two important components of the success of the Ball-- Margherita M. Davis' "ball book" of instructions and the practice audio tape produced by Wayne Batcheler featuring the playing of all the evening's dances by Paul Friedman and Cynthia Simonoff. Does any other group produce such a wealth of materials to help folks prepare for and enjoy a Ball? Margherita's clear directions helped many dancers, most especially all our newbies, while the book's elegant format made an important contribution to setting the tone of the event. It's also an elegant memento. The music tape enabled people to practice the dances with the actual tunes "in the privacy of their own homes." I can't imagine the Ball being anywhere near as successful as it was without these contributions. Is there a repository of such items for posterity and for use by other Ball organizers in their planning (CDSS??)? Gene Murrow ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 09:09:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 12:10:54 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970429121046_840358976-AT- emout11.mail.aol.com> From John Ramsay in response to Eric Praetzel I appreciate the points which Eric puts forward but strongly object to one of his opening statements, "Yech. Sounds like a dance group I'd never get near." That is a hurtful statement. The remaining statements are helpful and in the interest of useful input about our differences. At least Eric does acknowledge that he may not understand all of Margaret Whaley's circumstances by saying that it "sound like" a group he is not interested in exploring. I'm sure there are things to learn on both sides. Yes, Emily, "vive la difference!" ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 09:36:54 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 12:34:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Margaret Whaley <101454.633-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: "INTERNET:ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU" Message-ID: <970429163435_101454.633_IHP51-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> An English Dancer replies!!! Why does Eric Praetzel assume that all "odd" dancers are inexperienced! - Some of the best dancers at our club haven't got regular partners! - More often that not newcomers will come in pairs although not always. - There is always a friendly welcome for them - and of course we "experienced" dancers will split up and take them in, until they have found their feet. - we don't have dance classes as such either - but everything is walked through, and if we have new or very inexeperienced dancers in the hall then the dance is walked through more thoroughly. And there is a difference between weekly club nights (with tapes), and Saturday dances (with live music and a well known caller). - Surely if there is a rushing to get one's favourite partner for a particular dance - the unexperienced dancers are still going to get left till the end under your system as well!! - Yes generally we do have more women than men at dances - but not always. - our club had a weekend at Halsway Manor last November when men outnumbered ladies. So the men danced together, which is extremely rare in England! The men taking ladies managed very well - although the ladies chain and the swing caught them out!!! Susie Lorand writes about the" whosh" at the end of each dance, presumably to get your favourite dancer before somebody else does!! - Now here we would thank our partners graciously and walk gently back to our seats. Women asking men to dance here is somehow not quite accepted! Perhaps in England the whole thing is more relaxed - more a socialable gathering. Come on you English dancers - back me up! Margaret Whaley Oxfordshire ! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 10:00:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 13:01:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Praetzel Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704291701.NAA05680-AT- watt.uwaterloo.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >From John Ramsay in response to Eric Praetzel > > I appreciate the points which Eric puts forward but strongly object to: > "Yech. Sounds like a dance group I'd never get near." > > That is a hurtful statement. The remaining statements are helpful and I suppose that I'll expand. That statement is based on going to events where there is no mixing. At times I wish that I could be at events where people had some experience. ie at a recent dance weekend I was $#-AT- %#-AT- %$'ed for 2 square dances because the group that I was in had so many beginners that every time we had anything more complex than an alamand left we'd loose everyone (we only lost half of them with the alamand!). I'd love it if the regular contra dances didn't have influxes of beginners which leave me spending the entire night doing stuff with the complexity of singing row row row your boat. However, in my area, very few of the people have partners who dance. I can't even concieve of what it would be like to spend the entire dance with one person; or knowing before the dance who I would dance with! Up here there is a marked distinction between the events with partners (ie everyone is over 65) and those where we mix (people are 15 .. 65). In the past 3 years I've rarely gone to an event with anyone [unless I'm willing to drive 45 min. to pick someone up or unless they were willing to spend 2 hours on a bus getting to me so that we could spend 4 hours driving to the dance!] I hope that my statement was not taken as hurtfull; but these are the realities of dancing within a 4 hour radius of my home. From everything that I've seen, any group that closes themselves by not taking partners, severely limits the number of people who would join. The Scottish Country Dance groups that I know solve this problem by running workshops on 2 levels of expertise. The EC, contra groups don't. Irish groups have workshops but attendance is an insignif. fraction of the dance attendees. I remember one of the Irish set dancers getting upset with me because I was at a workshop, and had asked her to dance with me when I didn't know the dance!! There are vastly different dynamics between those groups. The contra dancers routinely drive > 45 min. to get to a dance. The other groups deal with local dancers. How many of us would drive 1 hour to go to a weekly workshop lasting 2 hours? How many would do it alone week after week? Would you do it if there was nobody in your age range? One of the big components of dances is social. I go to dances because I love the music, the people and because I can actually meet some women and dance with them. The problem is that dancing is such a small community that we have to be pretty accepting in order to boster the ranks and get enough dancers to be able to afford musicians and a hall. It is hard to imagine anything else! - Eric Praetzel ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 10:12:22 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 13:13:08 +0000 (GMT) From: Margherita Modica Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance event in Stockport NY? To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: On 28 Apr 97 at 20:25, Mary Beth Goodman wrote: > Someone please help my feeble mind...... > > SOMEWHERE today, I read of an event happening this summer in Stockport NY - > that's in Columbia County..... > > after searching high and lo and thru all my various CDSS/NEFFA papers..... > nothing. I'm either still fried from the weekend or I was imagining it! Yes, indeed, there is a new CDSS-affiliate summer dance series in Columbia County, NY (near the Berkshires), a country destination of many folks in the broader region. The Inaugural Dance Party is Saturday, May 10 (yes, I know, but the Hartford Ball had not gotten onto the CDSS news listing when we made the schedule), at 7:30pm and will continue on 2nd Saturdays. The callers are Paul Ross and John Huhn. Music is by Hudson Crossing (David Barnert, recorders; George Davis, fiddle; Stewart Dean, concertina; Robin Russell, piano; and Milton Zelermyer, oboe). The series is being held at the community house of St. John the Evangelist, County Route 25. The hall has wonderful accoustics and a sprung wooden floor. There are also lovely grounds around the house, picnic tables and a children's play area; dancers are welcomed to use them. Overnight hospitality is available there; just bring your sleeping bags and you may use the mats that the nursery school kids use for naps. For more information and directions, email me privately or call 518-828-6181. In closing, I want to thank the members of this list who contributed many suggestions in a discussion we had some months ago about building a dance community. I carefully saved them and find them useful in this effort. Margherita Modica Davis ************************************************************************ Margherita M. Modica mmodica-AT- obgyn.amc.edu Obstetrics & Gynecology (518) 262-6405 Albany Medical College (518) 262-5292, fax ************************************************************************ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 10:15:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 13:16:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Praetzel Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704291716.NAA05738-AT- watt.uwaterloo.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Why does Eric Praetzel assume that all "odd" dancers are inexperienced! I'm assuming a steady state condition where all people are partnered. Any new people would come single. > - Some of the best dancers at our club haven't got regular partners! Ahh; but they know that they can get a partner at the dance. Perhaps they even arrange things ahead of time, making sure that they will have a partner there? I've had to run my EC dance workshops that way. I will not consider holding one unless I can get some women to commit. > - More often that not newcomers will come in pairs although not always. That makes me think of the 1960's and 50's where you needed someone to go out. Even now there are many settings where, if I show up alone, I am pretty well excluded. I'm talking about social settings like bars or couple dance shops. > - we don't have dance classes as such either - but everything is walked > through, and if we have new or very inexeperienced dancers in the hall > then the dance is walked through more thoroughly. That sounds good and typical for us up here. > And there is a difference between weekly club nights (with tapes), Neat. We could not afford to do that. The dances depend upon people driving 45 .. 75 min. and so weekly club nights would not draw enough people to pay for a hall and would probably detract from regular attendance. > - Surely if there is a rushing to get one's favourite partner for a > particular dance - the unexperienced dancers are still going to get > left till the end under your system as well!! It depends. In some places where I've danced you better be within a few meters/yards of your next dance partner. At times I orient myself in one line such that I'll be in a good position to ask someone that I want to dance with! There is an entire thread on the practice of booking dance partners for upcoming dances! That is quite exclusionary; but at times a necessary outcome. One dance weekend that I was going to go to (Brattleboro) I was warned that I'd have to dance with guys for a few hours before I could get close enough to a woman to ask her to dance! Many of us aren't that fussy. There are dances where I'll spend as much (if not more) time with my corner/opposite than my partner! And since my partner is only with me for one dance there is no big "penality" for dancing with someone who is not "ideal". > So the men danced together, which is extremely rare in England! I don't suppose that you have men wearing skirts either do you? :) Then again I'm told that I've started some interesting comments for showing up in C 1580's doublet and pantaloons. > - Now here we would thank our partners graciously and walk gently back > to our seats. Sit!!! But you're at a dance :) > Women asking men to dance here is somehow not quite accepted! Interestingly enough the various English women who I've met have been very forward and outspoken. Curiously they often learned how to dance in school! Even in Canada women typically do not ask men to dance. It is not until they've been at several dances that they come to understand that asking a man is normal, expected, and sometimes necessary! > Perhaps in England the whole thing is more relaxed - more a socialable > gathering. Could be. Sometimes after a dance people go out for some food. I'm usually more anxious to get home before 2am. I don't really want to be falling asleep while driving. - Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 10:29:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: Peter.Fricke-AT- noaa.gov Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 13:25:41 -0400 From: Peter Fricke Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Credit where credit is due To: gmurrow-AT- compuserve.com (Return requested), ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Return requested) Message-ID: <04E2333662F15148*/c=US/admd=ATTMAIL/prmd=GOV+NOAA/o=CCNMFS/s=Fricke/g=Peter/-AT- MHS> re: collections of Ball booklets and related materials... about four or five years ago (and for some time before that too) George Fogg put out a formal request for these items... he was tracking popularity of dances and style changes as well as maintaining an archive. Peter Fricke ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 13:06:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 16:07:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: International Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970429200709_74031.77_BHT68-2-AT- CompuServe.COM> Tom, depending on the length of dance experience of the weekend participants, they may well know some ECD chestnuts already. International, after all, is the contribution of MANY ethnic and cultural groups to the collection of 'international' recreational dances. Sellenger's Round, Gathering Peascods, Hole in the Wall, Trip to Paris, The Bishop, Fandango, and - yes, Newcastle! - were known by the international folk dance groups long time ago, and may still be. Even during 78 rpm days, there were English as well as American records for those dances, that's why. Practically unknown are traditional dances (Nottingham Swing, Speed the Plough, Thady U Gander). I have found that the biggest challenge for folks who are quite good dancers but lack ECD, SCD or contra exposure, is the concept of progression, either duple or triple. So, whole set progression (as in Thady, Haste to the Wedding etc.) is easier to understand. If you use 3/2 dances (Hole in the Wall etc.), please tell them about units of SIX rather than four or eight steps, and they will do just fine. There are very few two-couple set dances in the internatinal folk dance repertoire, so Hey Boys, Heartsease may be real hits. For gender imbalance: Walpole Cottage, Three Sea Captains, Mason's Apron. For fun: Levi Jackson Rag. Good luck, and leave out those swings (unknown in Playford type dances anyway) and extra turns, please! Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 13:44:12 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Return-Path: bolker-AT- phoenix.Princeton.EDU Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 16:44:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Susie Lorand Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: what's appropriate in ECD or Playford; was Re: International Dance , [suggestions of ECD dances for international dancers] To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Hanny D. Budnick wrote: > Tom, > depending on the length of dance experience of the weekend > participants, they may well know some ECD chestnuts already. > International, after all, is the contribution of MANY ethnic and > cultural groups to the collection of 'international' recreational > dances. Sellenger's Round, Gathering Peascods, Hole in the Wall, Trip to > Paris, The Bishop, Fandango, and - yes, Newcastle! - were known by the > international folk dance groups long time ago, and may still be. Even > during 78 rpm days, there were English as well as American records for > those dances, that's why. Practically unknown are traditional dances > (Nottingham Swing, Speed the Plough, Thady U Gander). I have found that > the biggest challenge for folks who are quite good dancers but lack ECD, > SCD or contra exposure, is the concept of progression, either duple or > triple. So, whole set progression (as in Thady, Haste to the Wedding > etc.) is easier to understand. If you use 3/2 dances (Hole in the Wall > etc.), please tell them about units of SIX rather than four or eight > steps, and they will do just fine. There are very few two-couple set > dances in the internatinal folk dance repertoire, so Hey Boys, > Heartsease may be real hits. For gender imbalance: Walpole Cottage, > Three Sea Captains, Mason's Apron. For fun: Levi Jackson Rag. Good luck, > and leave out those swings (unknown in Playford type dances anyway) and ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > extra turns, please! > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > Hanny Budnick hanny, i'm curious which swings and extra turns you're referring to. there are some dances on your list of suggestions in which they would certainly (imho) be inappropriate, but in other dances -- e.g. levi jackson rag, nottingham swing -- swings are part of the choreography. i also think that what is appropriate in a playford or playford-style dance may vary according to local custom and the abilities & preferences of the dancers on a given occasion. for instance, in a very lively modern dance (barbarini's tambourine springs to mind), i enjoy sometimes substituting a swing for the two-hand turn. (mind you, i'm not sure whether barbarini's should be classified as playford-style.) and i love arming right an extra time round at the end of the A part in dublin bay (before falling back four in line). for another instance, sometimes it feels appropriate -- when all four people in the minor set are capable of doing it without getting confused -- to turn a figure eight into a double figure of eight. on the other hand, i do get annoyed when contra dancers visiting an english dance do the back-to-backs with lots of extra twirls. and i also wish that more ecd callers would take time to reinforce the difference between the wrist-grasp star that seems to have taken over in modern contra dancing and the hands-across star that (again imho) works best in english dances and some contras. - susie lorand (borrowing an e-mail address from ben bolker) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 14:38:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 17:40:06 -0400 From: walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704292140.AA11040-AT- is2.nyu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Margaret, I occasionally spend semesters in London (and will in the fall again be visiting as UCL) and found the coupling with regular partners at Cecil Sharpe most UNcivilised. Fortunately, it was not so frequent as you suggest. I think it more sociable and welcoming to dance with any and all -- less parochial and more "civilized". Also worth noting, nowhere in the US have I ever encountered tapes at English. But then I do not roam everwhere. I first heard of it in Melbourne; but how common is the practice? Danny Walkowitz >Emily Ferguson writes:- > >>Do you all actually sit down between dances? > >- In England - yes we do!! > >- and when the caller says "take a break" he means just a 2-minute "catch your >breath" break while he gets the next tape ready and swots up on the next 2 >dance instructions! > >- of course here we do not have a rush round the floor to get your next >partner. > >- Most of us have the same regular partner, so we all ready to dance again when >the caller announces the dance.. > >- If there are any "odd" ladies in the room, who are without a partner (of >either sex) - the norm is that they wait until most "couples" are up to give to >"odd" men time to decide their partner for that dance, then pair up amonst >themselves. > >- It's all very civilised. > >- Also all dances are walked through, so it really doesn't matter if you're >never come across them before. And most of us love a challenge! Also it is >very unusual to have a "rant" say, as the second of a pair. > >- Set dance are usually done once, sometimes twice, especially if the caller is >a 1-dance man, or there is enthusiastic applause. > >- Longways are usually done about 7-8 times, but this is because on club night >we usually have taped music, and that's the no of times on the tape. Live >musicians and at Saturday dances it's perhaps 10 times. > >As you so rightly say - Vive la difference! > >Margaret Whaley >Oxfordshire > > > Daniel J. Walkowitz Director, Metropolitan Studies, and Professor of History 285 Mercer Street, rm 703, New York University New York, New York 10003-6607 tel. (212) 998-8091 fax (212) 995-4371 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 14:51:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 21:59:56 +0000 From: bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <862347649.052161.0-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk> Eric Praetzel wrote: > > >Do you all actually sit down between dances? > > - when the caller says "take a break" he means just a 2-minute "catch your > > breath" break while he gets the next tape ready and swots up on the next 2 > Ahhhh! No live music! Some clubs do have live music but a lot don't. Basically it depends on the relationship that the club has with local musicians. I know of one club near me who have gone from having live music three or four times a year about 10 years ago to having live music every week. Basically they've built up gradually and really appreciate their musicians. The musicians go along because they enjoy the evening as well. many (although not all) of the nights are open to anyone who wants to come and play along and occasionally you'll get two or three weeks with pretty much the same band line up but with a different person leading the band each time. Perhaps we should start a separate "how to treat musicians" thread. > > - Most of us have the same regular partner, so we all ready to dance > Yech. Sounds like a dance group I'd never get near. Several of us > ran into a group like that a few weeks ago. They were fun, had great music > but alas never changed partners, never did walkthrus, formed sets for 3 > dances. I saw guys come and leave because they'd never get to dance. > Some people refer to a dance like this as one that takes "collections" from > single people ie they invite them; but they'll never get to dance. > > Don't you have problems getting people out to your dances? > > How can you expect anyone to show up if they have to dig up a dancing > partner? > > Why do you force inexperienced people to only dance with inexperienced > people (ie the only ones they could talk into coming dancing)? > > I'm making a lot of assumptions. We don't have dance classes and I don't > know anyone who does. To learn you just come to the dances. You'll get > experienced dance partners to boot. Hmm. I just realized that we > average about one dancer per 50,000 .. 100,000 people in the community! > That is why I make the assumption that nobody is going to ever get a > partner to come to a dance with them. I certainly have met a fair number of > women who are interested in dancing; but they'll never come out because > their partner does not dance. I can't speak for Margaret but I can make a few comments of my own on the above points. A lot of dance clubs in England are very couples based. there are dance clubs and Saturday night dances that I wouldn't go along to as a single male because I probably wouldn't get to dance. The club I mentioned earlier that has the live music is one of the exceptions. In fact, thinking about it I very rarely go to dance clubs or Saturday night dances - I do most of my dancing at festivals (where there are usually a number of singles or couples who are happy to dance separately), or when I go over to the U.S. I find it very difficult to describe the dance scene in England objectively because it's what I've been brought up with. There are things I like about it and things I don't. One of the things I love about coming to the States is that I can walk into a dance without knowing anyone and dance all night - in fact I did exactly that at the VFW dance just before NEFFA last year. Some of the things about the English dance scene sound very odd when they're described on here (even I think that and I'm used to them!), but the whole scene does fit together as a whole. I guess as with anything you need to experience it to fully appreciate it. Susie Lorand wrote: > > - of course here we do not have a rush round the floor to get your next > > partner. > > this part i certainly agree is very civilized! i wish i knew a way to > eliminate the "whoosh" between dances at our local dance, *without* > sacrificing other customs i value. This is one of the areas in which I prefer the English scene. Surely some sort of compromise is possible :-) > > - Most of us have the same regular partner, so we all ready to dance again > > when the caller announces the dance.. > > i'm so used to changing partners for each dance - and have found so > many "favorite" partners in my local dance community over the years > - that i don't think i would like this way of doing things. I can appreciate that point. As I said before I find it difficult to be objective about the English dance scene, it just _is_ couple based. If it wasn't it would be something different. To go back to your earlier point of eliminating the whoosh without sacrificing the other customs, I'm not sure that this would be possible. I suspect that a number of the customs are closely tied together so that you can't have one without having another. > i like the custom (apparently more common in the u.s. than in england) of > women asking men to dance as well as men asking women (not to mention > anyone asking anyone else of the same sex). > i personally value the freedom to ask men, and not to have to wait to be > asked, as part of the equality of the sexes (which even in the u.s. is > still under construction). how do others on the list feel about this? Certainly there are very few women over here who would ask a strange man to dance and even fewer men who would ask a strange man to dance. Sexual equality has a way to go yet. eferguson-AT- umassd.edu (Emily L. Ferguson) wrote: > Hmmm..... This makes me wonder. Do you all actually sit down between > dances? Things are really different here in the states, in that case, as > we suffer, even at our English dances, from "center set" syndrome. We have no such thing as centre set syndrome. I will quite often see the centre set being shorter than the others. > >- and often you hear a disappointed sigh when the caller says "take a break" > >after only one. > > And my dance only has one break, which happens after two hours and before > the final hour. Having the break between pairs of dances makes for a different style of evening. It's possible to spend more time socialising but you'll lose time dancing - I guess it depends what sort of event you want. > Ah, vive la difference! Hear, hear. I'm waiting to have enough money and time that I can pick the best American events to go to and the best English events and just spend my life flitting between them. Ah well, I've written far too much. As Susie Lorand wrote, none of this is intended as a condemnation of another dance communities customs. There are some surprising differences though. Bob ---------------------------------------------------------- -- Bob Archer bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 18:05:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 29 Mar 1997 21:00:03 -0500 From: Marc Edgar Subject: Re: ECD in England? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <333DC923.7948-AT- geocities.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <970424192559_101454.633_IHP117-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Margaret, Thanks for your reply. There is a some chance that we will be near Oxford on June 3rd. We are starting in Edinburgh on May 29th and and working our way south. What kind of dance will it be? (a workshop, special dance, ball, etc). It is funny, I don't think I have gotten to dance to Fried's calling in the states -- when you travel a long way for something that is next door it becomes all the more valuable. Thanks again. Marc Philip Whaley wrote: > > Postage paid by: [Image] > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > > Marc Edgar wrote: > > he will be in England/Scotland between 28th May & June 10 > > - suggest you look at > > http://www.ftech.co.uk/~webfeet/efolk/dates/danceall.html > > - that should start you off with what's happening over this side of the "pond" > > - also Fried de Metz Herman will be in England during those dates > > - she's calling at Neston in Cheshire on May 31st - afternoon workshop & > evening dance > > - also in Oxford on 3rd June (I can give you details of that one) > > Happy hunting! > > Margaret Whaley > Oxfordshire > > > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 21:21:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 14:30:41 +1000 From: Martin Hungerford Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704300423.OAA11971-AT- darth.netcon.net.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Can I put my two cents in here (australian ECD fan and muso). This thread is facinating and covers a huge amount of ground! snip >different person leading the band each time. Perhaps we should start >a separate "how to treat musicians" thread. This would be great. Certainly both a "how to treat musos" and a "how to treat dancers" could be useful. One caller I know has had trouble getting musos ever since he said, in their hearing, that all local musos were incompetant! > snip >> How can you expect anyone to show up if they have to dig up a dancing >> partner? snip >I can't speak for Margaret but I can make a few comments of my own on >the above points. A lot of dance clubs in England are very couples >based. there are dance clubs and Saturday night dances that I >wouldn't go along to as a single male because I probably wouldn't get >to dance. The club I mentioned earlier that has the live music is one >of the exceptions. In fact, thinking about it I very rarely go to >dance clubs or Saturday night dances - I do most of my dancing at >festivals (where there are usually a number of singles or couples who >are happy to dance separately), or when I go over to the U.S. > >I find it very difficult to describe the dance scene in England >objectively because it's what I've been brought up with. There are >things I like about it and things I don't. One of the things I love >about coming to the States is that I can walk into a dance without >knowing anyone and dance all night - in fact I did exactly that at >the VFW dance just before NEFFA last year. snip This thing of bringing your own partners pops up everywhere! I danced with a Square dance group in Bangladesh for a little while and was forced to stop going when they insisted on only couples attending. The only unattached women I knew were the girls at school, who were all muslim and would *never* have been allowed out to go *dancing* with a boy! Surely, for social dances, people attend partly to meet other people! > >Certainly there are very few women over here who would ask a strange >man to dance and even fewer men who would ask a strange man to dance. >Sexual equality has a way to go yet. > My now-ex-wife used to do just that. We would go to a dance together, I'd be in the band, she'd dance. She used to check out all the men and then ask those who could dance, to dance with her. As for a man asking another man to dance, well, there are stories about that. In the white population, it actually traditional in Australia for men to dance together. This is a result of the shortage of women. Sexual ratios of 100:1 were not uncommon in the outback and costoms altered to suit. At dances, for instance, some men were (somehow - I don't know how) designated as women for the evening. They were envied by the other men because it meant they got to sit with the women when not danceing! Martin This is Martin Hungerford, aka Martin Jongleur, aka Martin o' Lyos OL (Called the Juggler) Piper, Juggler, Stiltwalker, Unicyclist, Singer, Firebug, Idiot ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 23:55:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 23:53:46 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: International Dance To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII And while we're at it, could someone tell me the translation of "Thady U Gander" (or "Thady You Gander", as my sheet music has it)? Thanks in advance! Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 00:40:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 00:25:13 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Wed, 30 Apr 1997, Martin Hungerford wrote: > As for a man asking another man to dance, well, there are stories about > that. In the white population, it actually traditional in Australia for > men to dance together. This is a result of the shortage of women. Sexual > ratios of 100:1 were not uncommon in the outback and costoms altered to > suit. At dances, for instance, some men were (somehow - I don't know how) > designated as women for the evening. They were envied by the other men > because it meant they got to sit with the women when not danceing! This happened a lot in mostly-male societies. On America's frontier, the temporary ladies would designate their status by wearing red bandannas. And of course, remember the line in "Jailhouse Rock"--"If you can't find a partner use a wooden chair"... Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 04:33:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 07:33:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: "BlindCopyReceiver:;"-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <970430113312_74031.77_BHT98-2-AT- CompuServe.COM> Sorry Margaret, I can't back you up. I, single woman dancer came from the US and danced at a Halsway weekend (in 1975, with Kate Coombs). There were 8 men (all with a steady female partner, presumably their wife), and they NEVER changed partners. There was an abundance of women. When I asked one of them for a dance, she refused - she had a 'constant partner' among the other women. Needless to say, it was a drastic change from dancing in the US.... There was never a 'whoosh' before the next dance - everybody already knew in advance who their partner would be (same as for this dance of course). But things may have changed in the intervening years, and dancing IS different at a weekend to which folks from different groups come. Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 04:58:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 08:00:08 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: CHANGE PARTNERS AND... To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: re: dance styles; ooh, another red flag for sharon. as a single woman, i am SOOO glad that american dancers change partners. i have, as someone else said, many favorite partners. many of these are women, of course, but i like that idea that in ECD, we're dancing with everyone. i did dance at the cecil sharp house once, and a few couples actually broke up once or twice to include me and my friend, but we spent half the evening dancing together. which was fine, but makes me wonder what woulda happened had i been alone. sigh. and i'm sure glad that women can do all the asking they want. certainly at the contras i attend, it's the only way i'd ever get a male partner, since they don't seem to ask women they don't already know. the baltimore ECD crowd goes out of their way, i think, to include newcomers of both sexes. which is how i got hooked so quickly, and made so many friends doing it.... sharon "thank you, ECD" mckinley, and not an official rah-rah anything for any government agency (but if you're in DC on may 4, come on down to the Library of Congress; we're having the grand reopening of the Jefferson building, a truly gorgeous place. there'll be kiddie activities, entertainment like Sweet Honey in the Rock and the Seldom Scene, and tours of places you can't usually get into, like the private congressional rooms. good stuff) (oops, shameless advertising) (well, it's FREE, anyway) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 07:47:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 10:47:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: what's appropriate in ECD or Playfor To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970430144739_74031.77_BHT134-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Hi Susie, I'm sure you have encountered dancers who - no matter what and with whom and where - take EVERY opportunity for an extra turn for themselves or their (sometimes unsuspecting!) partner, or an extra swing. It is more prevalent among modern contra dancers than ECD aficionados, but it is part of SCD as well. The key phrase you used is "...swings are part of the choreography". That is true for many traditional English country dances, they are boisterous, fast, easy and fun. And Pat Shaw choreographed several dances 'in the traditional manner', Walpole Cottage among them. Levi Jackson was commissioned by the Berea Adult Dancers if my memory serves me correctly - and I would classify it as a 'dance choreographed by an Englishman for an American dance community'. If pushed for further classification, I'd call it 'a new dance with traditional country dance elements'. That's a vast difference from the dances of the 17th - 19th century which we loosely classify as 'historical' or 'Playford type' dances. Although many dance researchers (Pat Shaw, Thomas Cooke among them) have challenged Cecil Sharp's interpretation of some of the movements contained in the dances published since 1651, certain basic tenets have not changed and - to the best of current knowledge - in recreational ECD we follow Sharp's interpretations, with modifications by the later interpreters. And that's where the camps divide: some groups dance the Sharp renditions, others have adopted some changes. Barbarini's Tambourine? Well, it's an 18th century tune, which to me suggests the 'historical dance' realm: no swings, no spins. But the choreographer is still among us, why not ask for the intended or preferred interpretation? As any teacher/leader will tell you, beginning dancers and those experienced dancers to whom a particular genre may be new just LOVE to adopt those habits which are exhibited by the experienced dancers of that genre. In the international arena that meant Cacak, Reka and Hambo. Once you knew those you were no longer a beginner, and folks did not permit themselves to gather enough dance experience FIRST, so that those dances would have been part of their organic growth as dancers. An occasional spin in an English dance by a teacher may well be interpreted as 'belonging, if you are an advanced dancer'. From then on the spin, however awkwardly executed, becomes part of the dance for the learner, and its omission, sadly enough, signifies 'beginner'. ECD will maintain its uniqueness and appeal as long as we appreciate the difference between an occasional exuberant extra turn - when, as you say, the subset and its general experience warrant it - and the habitual and constant 'enhancements' of dances which have stood the test of time and are thriving without them. Therein lies responsibility for those who carry ECD into other dance communities... Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 10:24:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 10:24:30 -0800 (PST) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: what's appropriate in ECD or Playfor To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <01IIBA0HG4209KM1HQ-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hanny wrote: > I'm sure you have encountered dancers who - no matter what and with whom and >where - take EVERY opportunity for an extra turn for themselves or their >(sometimes unsuspecting!) partner, or an extra swing. It is more prevalent >among modern contra dancers than ECD aficionados, but it is part of SCD as >well. I certainly have. It certainly annoys me. It is difficult to explain to people the difference between *their* excessive embellishment and *my* occasional 'adding extra fun to the dance'. (But there is one, honest, and part of is that they take EVERY opportunity, regardless of whether the dance and the current dacners support or allow it.) >Barbarini's Tambourine? Well, it's an 18th century tune, which to me suggests >the 'historical dance' realm: no swings, no spins. But the choreographer is >still among us, why not ask for the intended or preferred interpretation? Don't have my sources handy -- they're packed, as I'm in the middle of moving house -- but I'm pretty sure the choreographer is long dead. Two different interpreters (Jacqueline Schwab and Ken whatz-his-name of 'From Two Barns') are still around, but I think the dance was an 18th century source as well. I actually can't see where the music supports a swing. > As any teacher/leader will tell you, beginning dancers and those experienced >dancers to whom a particular genre may be new just LOVE to adopt those habits >which are exhibited by the experienced dancers of that genre. In the >international arena that meant Cacak, Reka and Hambo. Once you knew those you >were no longer a beginner, and folks did not permit themselves to gather enough >dance experience FIRST, so that those dances would have been part of their >organic growth as dancers. An occasional spin in an English dance by a teacher >may well be interpreted as 'belonging, if you are an advanced dancer'. From then >on the spin, however awkwardly executed, becomes part of the dance for the >learner, and its omission, sadly enough, signifies 'beginner'. This is the most insightful explanation of this phenomenon that I've seen so far. -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 415/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 10:54:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:54:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: International Dance To: ECD list Message-ID: <970430175410_74031.77_BHT76-2-AT- CompuServe.COM> Oh, I almost forgot: although you may be fortunate and teach to live music during that weekend, international dance events usually happen to canned music. You will be doing the weekend crowd a big favor if you limit your introduction to material which is available on records, tapes or CDs! And tell them where they can find the dance descriptions (unless you have to provide them in a syllabus...). A GREAT opportunity to plug CDSS.... Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 11:42:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 11:40:34 -0800 (pst) From: afeldman-AT- oacis.com (Anise Feldman) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re[2]: International Dance, and Hole in the Wall To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9703308624.AA862425711-AT- ccsmtp.bellahs.com> Yes, it would be good to stick with dances that are easy enough that inexperienced (at English) dancers will enjoy them. However, my feeling is that Hole in the Wall is very difficult to dance beautifully, and people often feel awkward with the (usually) slow tempo when they are not used to it. (We've had this discussion before...) For this reason HITW might give a poor impression of ECD. Since one of the distinctive and enjoyable characteristics of ECD is the social interaction, dances that have an especially lot of interaction (how's that for grammar?) would be nice to do, for example, Geud Man of Ballangigh. Anise Feldman Novato, CA ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 12:35:03 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 20:36:31 +0100 From: Michael Barraclough Subject: Dancing in Phoenix To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <33679F3F.89156F8E-AT- ecid.cig.mot.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------B944AD3A6732BACB5294970C" References: <9703308624.AA862425711-AT- ccsmtp.bellahs.com> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------B944AD3A6732BACB5294970C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It looks like I shall be in Phoenix (which from my perspective includes Mesa, Tempe, Scottsdale etc) arriving Sunday 11 May and departing Sunday 18 May. Are there any classes/dances that will be taking place in this time? If so, please could you let me know, either via the list or direct using barraclm-AT- ecid.cig.mot.com. My tastes are varied: English (Barn Dance/Ceilidh/Playford), Historical Dance (especially 17/18 English Country Dance), American Square, Contra, Cajun ... Regards - Michael Barraclough --------------B944AD3A6732BACB5294970C Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Barraclough, Michael Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin:vcard fn:Barraclough, Michael n:Barraclough;Michael org:Motorola Cellular Infrastructure Grou adr:16 euroway;;Blagrove;Swindon;Wiltshire;SN5 8YQ;UK email;internet:barraclm-AT- ecid.cig.mot.com title:OA Specialist tel;work:+44 1793 565344 tel;fax:+44 1793 512618 x-mozilla-cpt:;0 x-mozilla-html:FALSE end:vcard --------------B944AD3A6732BACB5294970C-- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:29:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:30:19 -0700 From: Robin Cohen Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: what's appropriate in ECD or Playford To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <9704301330.ZM6218-AT- alewench.engr.sgi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <01IIBA0HG4209KM1HQ-AT- SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> > > I'm sure you have encountered dancers who - no matter what and with whom and > >where - take EVERY opportunity for an extra turn for themselves or their > >(sometimes unsuspecting!) partner, or an extra swing. It is more prevalent > >among modern contra dancers than ECD aficionados, but it is part of SCD as > >well. > The key point there is "with whom". I have several male friends who, I'm ashamed to say, take every opportunity to twirl every partner they encounter. When I meet them in line, I watch the other woman, often a new dancer, come out of the spin dizzy and disoriented. After witnessing another incident recently, I asked a friend what he thought he was doing. He jokingly said something about trying to confuse the woman (and probably trying to cover up his embarassment at getting "caught"). I often wonder what my friends think they are trying to prove. I get the impression it's a mating ritual. > I certainly have. It certainly annoys me. It is difficult to explain to > people the difference between *their* excessive embellishment and *my* > occasional 'adding extra fun to the dance'. (But there is one, honest, and > part of is that they take EVERY opportunity, regardless of whether the dance > and the current dacners support or allow it.) I have, on occasion, done a dance with a partner where we do take every opportunity to embellish. It's exhilerating, and the dancers around us get involved in the fun energy too. But we also know when to not confuse our neighbors, since new dancers do try to emulate our actions. I think the difference Alan is trying to convey is a combination of being aware of when others may be confused by the excessive movement, and not being late for the next move. I will sometimes refuse to take a lead if it will make me/us late. I hope my partners get the point. > > As any teacher/leader will tell you, beginning dancers and those experienced > >dancers to whom a particular genre may be new just LOVE to adopt those habits > >which are exhibited by the experienced dancers of that genre. During a circle mixer recently, one partner twirled me on to the next partner, who asked me to show him how that was done. I had never seen this man before, and I got the impression he was new. I barely had enough time to tell him that he should just learn to be a good dancer first, certainly no time to teach him any moves, before we moved on to our next partners. Later I met him again in line, and he was completely disoriented in that dance. I shudder to think what kind of monster dancer could have been created had I been the kind of woman who likes to be twirled no matter what, and gleefully lead myself into twirls. I wish I had the time that evening to talk to him more and explain how fancy moves does not a good dancer make. If he comes back, I will do just that. -- *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Robin Cohen Mailstop - 9U-505 EBU Administrator Phone - 415-933-1368 Silicon Graphics, Inc. Fax - 415-967-8496 *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:39:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 15:49:25 -0500 From: sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Attachments to messages.... To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Michael Barraclough wrote: >It looks like I shall be in Phoenix (which from my perspective includes >Mesa, Tempe, Scottsdale etc) arriving Sunday 11 May and departing Sunday >18 May. and he then told us what he likes to dance.... THEN APPEARED ON MY SCREEN (and later on the hard drive of my computer) >Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Content-Description: Card for Barraclough, Michael >Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" > >Attachment converted: The Big One:vcard.vcf (TEXT/ttxt) (0001DF2B) I would like to very nicely (at least this time) like to ask folks on this list to PLEASE NOT send ATTACHMENTS with their e-mail... It is considered rude to send something to someone that they didn't ask for, and most of the time whatever it is that they sent cannot be opened by the software I have. Once, after much struggle, I finally got one of these awful "attachments" open and found it completely useless... Unlike "junk" e-mail which you can just delete, I have to go clean up after your "visit".... Sheila Beardslee Bosworth sheilab-AT- tiac.net Editor, Boston Early Music News >>next BEMN Deadline 4/20 for May 15 issue! May 15 issue is BEMF Preview issue! Summer workshops & concert listings welcomed! 29 Main Street, Acton MA 01720-3505 voice: 508/263.9926 fax: 508/263.2366 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:56:56 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:58:19 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Re[2]: International Dance, and Hole in the Wall To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Anise: This gives me a good opportunity to say that, as far as I can tell, the tempo for Hole in the Wall, as done today, is much TOO SLOW. There is absolutely no evidence for such a tempo, nor would the standard late-17th-c steps have been comfortable that way. I suspect the slow tempo was conceived by someone who thought old music was slow music for the elderly! Or thought notation in minims (half notes) meant slow (absolutely not). Seriously, the original tune, by Purcell, is called a hornpipe in the collected edition! I suggest MM. 60 to the bar of triple meter. Julia Sutton On Wed, 30 Apr 1997, Anise Feldman wrote: > Yes, it would be good to stick with dances that are easy enough that > inexperienced (at English) dancers will enjoy them. However, my > feeling is that Hole in the Wall is very difficult to dance > beautifully, and people often feel awkward with the (usually) slow > tempo when they are not used to it. (We've had this discussion > before...) For this reason HITW might give a poor impression of ECD. > > Since one of the distinctive and enjoyable characteristics of ECD is > the social interaction, dances that have an especially lot of > interaction (how's that for grammar?) would be nice to do, for > example, Geud Man of Ballangigh. > > Anise Feldman > Novato, CA > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:56:58 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:58:19 -0400 (EDT) From: julia s sutton Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Re[2]: International Dance, and Hole in the Wall To: ECD-AT- PLAYFORD.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Anise: This gives me a good opportunity to say that, as far as I can tell, the tempo for Hole in the Wall, as done today, is much TOO SLOW. There is absolutely no evidence for such a tempo, nor would the standard late-17th-c steps have been comfortable that way. I suspect the slow tempo was conceived by someone who thought old music was slow music for the elderly! Or thought notation in minims (half notes) meant slow (absolutely not). Seriously, the original tune, by Purcell, is called a hornpipe in the collected edition! I suggest MM. 60 to the bar of triple meter. Julia Sutton On Wed, 30 Apr 1997, Anise Feldman wrote: > Yes, it would be good to stick with dances that are easy enough that > inexperienced (at English) dancers will enjoy them. However, my > feeling is that Hole in the Wall is very difficult to dance > beautifully, and people often feel awkward with the (usually) slow > tempo when they are not used to it. (We've had this discussion > before...) For this reason HITW might give a poor impression of ECD. > > Since one of the distinctive and enjoyable characteristics of ECD is > the social interaction, dances that have an especially lot of > interaction (how's that for grammar?) would be nice to do, for > example, Geud Man of Ballangigh. > > Anise Feldman > Novato, CA > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 14:44:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 01 May 1997 07:53:21 +1000 From: Martin Hungerford Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199704302145.HAA09277-AT- darth.netcon.net.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >This happened a lot in mostly-male societies. On America's frontier, the >temporary ladies would designate their status by wearing red bandannas. >And of course, remember the line in "Jailhouse Rock"--"If you can't find >a partner use a wooden chair"... > >Peace. >Paul > Does anyone know the actual mechanism for choosing the lucky men? Did every man bring a red bandanna in hope or what? This is Martin Hungerford, aka Martin Jongleur, aka Martin o' Lyos OL (Called the Juggler) Piper, Juggler, Stiltwalker, Unicyclist, Singer, Firebug, Idiot ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 14:46:49 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 21:56:09 +0000 From: bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dances with the Same Formation To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <862433828.1113887.0-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk> walkowit-AT- is2.nyu.edu (Daniel J. Walkowitz) wrote: > I occasionally spend semesters in London (and will in the fall again > be visiting as UCL) and found the coupling with regular partners at Cecil > Sharpe most UNcivilised. Fortunately, it was not so frequent as you > suggest. I think it more sociable and welcoming to dance with any and all > -- less parochial and more "civilized". Cecil Sharp House is something of an exception to many of the standard English dance club customs so I wouldn't take anything that happened there as being typical. > Also worth noting, nowhere in the > US have I ever encountered tapes at English. But then I do not roam > everwhere. I first heard of it in Melbourne; but how common is the practice? I have encountered it once in the U.S., oddly enough at a club run by an ex-pat Brit who was in the same university Folk Dance Society that I was, just a few years before me. The impression I get is that we use recorded music more over here than happens in the States. I've pretty much stopped calling to records now and usually insist on live music. Since I live in an area with a good selection of willing musicians this isn't too much of a problem, other areas of the country differ. Martin Hungerford wrote: > Can I put my two cents in here (australian ECD fan and muso). This thread > is facinating and covers a huge amount of ground! > snip > >different person leading the band each time. Perhaps we should start > >a separate "how to treat musicians" thread. > This would be great. Certainly both a "how to treat musos" and a "how to > treat dancers" could be useful. One caller I know has had trouble getting > musos ever since he said, in their hearing, that all local musos were > incompetant! I could make the same comment about a number of our local callers. There are callers I work with who know how to treat musicians (probably not coincidentally they tend to be musicians themselves) and other callers who don't know how to treat musicians who I don't work with. I figure I'm doing this for fun (I certainly can't earn a living at it) so I only work with people I'm going to enjoy working with. "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> wrote: > Sorry Margaret, > I can't back you up. I, single woman dancer came from the US and > danced at a > Halsway weekend (in 1975, with Kate Coombs). There were 8 men (all > with a steady female partner, presumably their wife), and they NEVER > changed partners. There was an abundance of women. When I asked one of > them for a dance, she refused - she had a 'constant partner' among the > other women. Needless to say, it was a drastic change from dancing in > the US.... There was never a 'whoosh' before the next dance - > everybody already knew in advance who their partner would be (same as > for this dance of course). But things may have changed in the > intervening years, and dancing IS different at a weekend to which > folks from different groups come. I'm sorry you had a bad experience Hanny. Halsway is another exception to the normal English dance club rules, having said that though I can't promise that you'd have had a better experience at a club. Festivals tend to be much more single person friendly - there are usually more single people and people who are prepared to mix there than at the clubs. I had a friend visit from the States recently and took her to one dance where I was playing and one where I was calling and was nervous that she might not get to dance. As it turned out the particular clubs in question were very friendly and welcoming but I know of other clubs where she wouldn't have got to dance at all. I was slightly embarassed that I had to be worried. This is coming across as a very negative post about the English dance scene. Perhaps I ought to finish by saying that I'm off too Eastbourne festival this weekend where I don't anticipate having any trouble getting partners. Bob ---------------------------------------------------------- -- Bob Archer bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:09:47 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:10:42 -0400 (EDT) From: JohnBerni-AT- aol.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: May 10 Events include ST LOUIS To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <970430191041_-532251528-AT- emout20.mail.aol.com> If you can't get to Stockport or Hartford you can also dance in St Louis on May 10. The seventh annual St Louis English Country Dance Playford Ball will be held at 8 PM at JUST DANCING Studio at Woodsmill and Manchester. A Ball review will be held the same afternoon between 1 and 4 PM at Wydown Middle School. You can call John Ramsay and Berni Meyer at 314-863-2476 for info. It is going to be an interesting event with q uite a mixture of new dancers, experienced dancers, locals, out-of-towners, and even some lovely teenagers! A Ball brunch is offered at our house Sunday morning. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 17:21:46 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 20:21:45 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Ben Fisher died To: "BlindCopyReceiver:;"-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <970501002145_74031.77_BHT81-2-AT- CompuServe.COM> Ben Fisher died yesterday morning. He was in his eighties, and his last years were lost in the fog of Alzheimer's Disease. I met him in the international folk dance scene in Philadelphia 38 years ago. Eventually he lent his enthusiasm and skill to the position of President of the Folk Dance Center of Philadelphia. He became one of the founding members and staunch supporters of the Germantown Country Dancers and was their president for awhile. He often went to the English Weeks at Pinewoods. If you are lucky, you own one of the CDSS T-shirts with the dancing lion, eagle and Scotsman - Ben had designed that. Many years earlier he had designed album covers for RCA's series of square dances. At age 65 he took up Scottish Country Dancing, and was most amused that the tailor in Scotland, who made his kilt, was also a Ben Fisher. His 82nd birthday was celebrated at separate dances with both, the English and the Scottish dance communities in the Philadelphia area. A memorial service will be held at Goldstein's Funeral Home at 6410 North Broad Street in Philadelphia this Friday, April 25th at 2 pm. He is survived by two daughters and several grandchildren. Condolences may be sent to his daughter, Ms. Beryl McCullough, 406 Wadworth Avenue, Philadelphia, PA 19118. If I find out additional information, I will post it here. Hanny Budnick ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 18:41:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 21:40:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hanny D. Budnick" <74031.77-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Ben Fisher died, II To: "BlindCopyReceiver:;"-AT- compuserve.com Message-ID: <970501014046_74031.77_BHT143-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> In my upset I posted an incorrect date: Ben Fisher's funeral service will be at 2 pm this Friday,*** May 2nd ** at Goldstein's, 6410 North Broad Street in Philadelphia. Memorial gifts in his name may be made to the Alzheimer's Disease & Related Disorders Association, 100 North 17th Street, Philadelphia, PA 19103. If you wish, you may send an email message to me which I will give to his family on Friday... His daughters only knew about their father's love for and participation in folk dance, English and Scottish Country Dance, they did not experience him in that setting. So if you have any memories of him, please share them. Hanny Budnick