Archive-Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 01:39:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 01:39:27 PST From: ajs1-AT- cam.ac.uk Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A92C1.D8B44165.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: No dance announcements please Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 09:39:10 +0100 From: Anthony Stone Subject: No dance announcements please In-reply-to: mls-AT- panix.com "Re: Albany & Woodstock Dances" (Sep 30, 2:07pm) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: <9610010939.ZM11448-AT- fandango.ch.cam.ac.uk> X-Envelope-to: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.2 10apr95 MediaMail) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <009A9261.30514F28.22-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> In your message at 2:07pm on 30 Sep, mls-AT- panix.com (Sharon Green) wrote: > I know a bandwagon when I see one.... > > [etc] > Can I make a plea for others to resist the temptation to jump on this particular bandwagon? I agree with Jonathan Sivier's first comment on this, and I'm sorry that he seems to have changed his mind. It seems to me that the ECD list is much better kept for discussion of matters of _general_ interest, by which I mean worldwide rather than local. I have enough stuff clogging up my email without getting announcements of dances in far corners of the world. The appropriate place for such information is the Web -- it can stay there as long as it's needed, whereas the list is ephemeral -- and there are several suitable pages already where both regular and occasional dances can be advertised, or where a link to your own page can be added. -- Anthony Stone University Chemical Laboratory, Email: ajs1-AT- cam.ac.uk Lensfield Road, Phone: +44 1223 336375 Cambridge CB2 1EW Fax: +44 1223 336362 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 07:30:17 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 07:30:14 PST From: 71332.2116-AT- CompuServe.COM Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A92F2.D99FEEEA.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: RE: Jenny Pluck Pears Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 10:02:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Gene Murrow <71332.2116-AT- CompuServe.COM> Subject: RE: Jenny Pluck Pears To: ECD list Message-id: <961001140249_71332.2116_GHL74-2-AT- CompuServe.COM> X-Envelope-to: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT This is getting a bit thick... The simple solution is this: do the "A" music at a tempo that makes the skipping, setting, etc. feel right, and do the "B" music at a tempo that makes the "handing" of one's partner into the center and honors feel right. The important thing for dance leaders is to decide for yourself what tempos YOU like, and communicate them accurately to the band through your movements. Don't worry about all that technical stuff! In the 30 years I've been doing the dance, no group has had difficulty with a change in perceived tempo for the reasons noted in the forum-- the first "B" move is by one couple, and is a free-form action. For my taste, keeping the measures equal works (based on how I like the dance to feel and my experience with a wide range of contemporary instrumental music using the 6/8 with 3/4 pairing to mean 3 beats in the time of 2), but "different strokes for different folks," and, I could be dead wrong. I look forward to trying it other ways.... Gene Murrow EC Dancer and eschewer of obfuscation ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 07:40:20 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 07:40:17 PST From: dgilli-AT- slip.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A93BD.6BC4AF93.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: music for Juice of Barley Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Wed, 2 Oct 1996 7:40:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ferret.slip.net ("port 36504"-AT- ferret.slip.net) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IA5RC1P8FM0001UY-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Wed, 02 Oct 1996 07:40:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from barbl.lsc.nbs.gov [159.189.34.156] by ferret.slip.net with smtp (Exim 0.56 #1) id E0v8ST5-0004K7-00; Wed, 02 Oct 1996 07:40:11 -0700 Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 07:40:11 -0700 From: dgilli-AT- slip.net (Dan Gillespie) Subject: music for Juice of Barley X-Sender: dgilli-AT- slip.net To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hi from West Virginia: Can anyone recommend a nice recording for the dance "Juice of Barley"...although the music is nearly identical to "Stingo", the tempo is rather different. If possible, I would prefer an early music type rendering. All suggestions are welcome. I learned this one recently & would love to bring it to my local dance that isn't fortunate enough to have access to a live dance band. With thanks, Dan Gillespie ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 08:11:07 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 08:11:05 PST From: mls-AT- panix.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A93C1.B8FFAEC6.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: music for Juice of Barley Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Wed, 2 Oct 1996 8:11:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail1.panix.com ("port 2959"-AT- mail1.panix.com) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IA5SF7CZAG0001PR-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Wed, 02 Oct 1996 08:11:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from [166.84.193.89] (mls.dialup.access.net [166.84.193.89]) by mail1.panix.com (8.7.5/8.7.1/PanixM1.0+) with SMTP id LAA25525 for ; Wed, 02 Oct 1996 11:10:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 11:13:51 -0400 From: mls-AT- panix.com (Sharon Green) Subject: Re: music for Juice of Barley To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Dan: CDSS has an LP (CDS 9) entitled "Juice of Barley-Simple English Country Dances" played by the Claremont Country Dance Band. Contact them at office-AT- cdss.org Good luck! Sharon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 09:51:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 09:51:50 PST From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A93CF.CC0F4B85.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: RE: music for Juice of Barley Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Wed, 2 Oct 1996 9:51:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU ("port 1904"-AT- george.bakeru.edu) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IA5VX2SXVG0001PR-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Wed, 02 Oct 1996 09:51:46 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 11:50:49 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Subject: RE: music for Juice of Barley To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: <961002115049.6aaa-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT One of the more musical versions for this is, as I recall, on the first album by Bare Necessities. These delightful renditions are listened to as chamber music at our house. Hear something new each time we play it. Preview the cut to make sure it will fit the dance needs of your group. Forbes/Baker University ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 20:31:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 20:31:11 PST From: mgoodman-AT- albany.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A9816.F0E58F3C.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Is everyone too pooped to write? Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Mon, 7 Oct 1996 20:31:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from keeper.albany.net (root-AT- keeper.albany.net) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IADHPHQ9460002Y1-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Mon, 07 Oct 1996 20:31:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from [206.72.193.205] (max2ip38-albny.albany.net [206.72.193.205]) by keeper.albany.net (8.7.6/8.7.6-MZ) with SMTP id XAA22575 for ; Mon, 07 Oct 1996 23:30:59 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 23:33:39 -0400 From: mgoodman-AT- albany.net (Mary Beth Goodman) Subject: Is everyone too pooped to write? X-Sender: mgoodman-AT- mail.albany.net To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Gosh, that ball up in Vermont must have been a humdinger of a good time! Mary Beth <-- wishes she'd been there! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 21:32:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 21:32:34 PST From: galloway-AT- xis.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A981F.846C4D01.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped to write? Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Mon, 7 Oct 1996 21:32:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from xis.com (root-AT- xis.com) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IADJUM1IXI0002Y1-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Mon, 07 Oct 1996 21:32:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from galloway.xis.com (dial45.xis.com [205.252.37.45]) by xis.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id AAA13802 for ; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 00:40:59 -0400 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 00:34:57 +0000 From: Rich Galloway Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped to write? To: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: <199610080440.AAA13802-AT- xis.com> X-Envelope-to: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.42a) Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal Comments: Authenticated sender is > Gosh, that ball up in Vermont must have been a humdinger of a good > time! > > Mary Beth <-- wishes she'd been there! Well, the one in Baltimore certainly was! Many very fine dancers in attendance. ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 04:38:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 04:38:16 PST From: kcooke-AT- sover.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A985A.FC960DC7.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped to write? Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 4:38:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from maple.sover.net (root-AT- maple.sover.net) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IADYQDUETU0002Y1-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 04:38:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from ..sover.net (pm0a1.bratt.sover.net [204.71.18.101]) by maple.sover.net (8.7.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA25133; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 07:38:07 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 07:38:07 -0400 (EDT) From: kcooke-AT- sover.net (Kevin M. Cooke) Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped to write? X-Sender: kcooke-AT- sover.net To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: <199610081138.HAA25133-AT- maple.sover.net> X-Envelope-to: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT The Strafford Ball was once again a wonderful chance to dance. And what did I like best about it, and what makes it a "good" dance? Well... The hall is almost perfect for a group of a hundred dancers. A bit crowded at times, but with the stars twinkling above us, soft light on the sides, and large windows to open for coolness, it was a real pleasure. The drive up from Putney, about an hour and a half total, was a study in Fall leaf peeping. The colors are just starting in the south of Vermont, and going full tilt in South Strafford. A real treat for the eyes. The town is tiny, and gorgeous. Practice dances were another chance to dance, and to get to know old friends not seen in a while. The dances were concise, enough to let us remember the old and learn the new, but not too much that we were pooped before we started the main event. The changes this year were VERY much appreciated by this humble little dancer. I don't know how they arranged it, but there was perfect weather this time. No rain, clear cool skies, and that sense of Autumn that makes you want to laugh while you walk around in it. The attendees were a little fewer, letting us pack into the hall with a little less effort than last year. I hope that the critical mass was attained for financial success, and I know that this can be one of the unpleasant and unspoken realities of big wingdings like this. And the FOOD!!! Yum. And the DESSERTS!!! Double yum. Definitely a big plus over last year. Most appreciated was the courage of the organizers to allow clothes changing in the hall. I hope they see the tremendous success of it, and never go back to the "down the street and a walk in the rain" deal. Space limitations are tolerable if it is less tiring in the long run. I am a Bare Necessities groupie, and freely admit it, so I'll keep it short. The band was damn good. Thank you, all. The dance lineup for the evening was just about perfect for a Ball. I know there are some out there who see a Playford Ball as a talent contest to see who is best at the hardest dances. For me it is a chance to dance the dreamiest dances with the best dancers, to know that the person coming toward me in the line knows what to do,and to focus on the flow of the dance and the company of my partner. I feel an especial load of gratitude for being able to dance Well Hall as the last dance with my sweetie. It's "our dance", and to be able to wrap up a wonderful evening casting down into her arms left me breathless. So, thank you, all, for another chance to dance. And we'll see you next year. Kevin Cooke ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 07:34:14 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 07:34:12 PST From: barbara.ruth-AT- yale.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A9873.9055884F.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 7:34:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu ("port 58653"-AT- mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAE4VI7E3I0002Y1-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 07:34:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from quickmail.yale.edu ([130.132.144.199]) by mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu with SMTP id AA03413 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for ); Tue, 08 Oct 1996 10:32:51 -0400 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 10:29:08 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 3.0.3 b1 d5 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Reply to: RE>>Is everyone too pooped to write? -------------------------------------------- The attendees were a little fewer, letting us pack into the hall with a little less effort than last year. I hope that the critical mass was attained for financial success, and I know that this can be one of the unpleasant and unspoken realities of big wingdings like this. ......... For me it is a chance to dance the dreamiest dances with the best dancers, to know that the person coming toward me in the line knows what to do,and to focus on the flow of the dance and the company of my partner. I feel an especial load of gratitude for being able to dance Well Hall as the last dance with my sweetie. It's "our dance", and to be able to wrap up a wonderful evening casting down into her arms left me breathless. So, thank you, all, for another chance to dance. And we'll see you next year. Kevin Cooke --------------------------------------- Bear in mind, when rhapsodizing about balls and what wonderful opportunities they are to dance the best dances with the best dancers etc. etc., that for single women who don't have sweeties, or male friends for whom it is convenient to pose as an escort, the "opportunities" to join in can be extremely limited. This is another one of the unpleasant realities of these events. You weren't dancing with the best women dancers. You were dancing with the best women dancers whose association with a man allowed them entree to the event. Barbara Ruth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:25:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:25:43 PST From: dodson-AT- violet.berkeley.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A987A.C2DA43B2.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 8:25:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uclink4.Berkeley.EDU ("port 3339"-AT- uclink4.Berkeley.EDU) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAE6OEBK1I0002QU-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:25:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from violet.berkeley.edu (violet.berkeley.edu [128.32.155.22]) by uclink4.berkeley.edu (8.7.6/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA00745 for ; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:25:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [136.152.108.221] by violet.berkeley.edu (8.7.5/1.33-960227) id IAA08005; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:25:32 -0700 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:25:32 -0700 From: dodson-AT- violet.berkeley.edu (allen and alisa dodson) Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Eudora Pro 2.1.3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Barbara Ruth writes: >Bear in mind, when rhapsodizing about balls and what wonderful opportunities >they are to dance the best dances with the best dancers etc. etc., that for >single women who don't have sweeties, or male friends for whom it is >convenient to pose as an escort, the "opportunities" to join in can be >extremely limited. This is another one of the unpleasant realities of these >events. You weren't dancing with the best women dancers. You were dancing >with the best women dancers whose association with a man allowed them entree >to the event. >Barbara Ruth This is not a problem at *all* such events! The San Francisco Bay Area Playford Ball has a size limit, but no gender-balancing. So far, this has been fine for everyone. We have a beautiful hall, friendly dancers, fine music, and great food. The next Ball is on April 5, '97 and features Bruce Hamilton as Dance Ogre. If anyone wants a registration form or more info, e-mail me privately. Alisa Dodson ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:26:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:26:32 PST From: MCKINLEY-AT- MAIL.LOC.GOV Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A987A.E012715C.8-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 8:26:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MAIL.LOC.GOV ("port 7330"-AT- ibm2.loc.gov) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAE6PD3VNG0002QU-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 08:26:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by MAIL.LOC.GOV (Soft*Switch Central V4L380P7) id 985324110096282FEMAIL; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:24:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:24:11 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-to: MCKINLEY-AT- MAIL.LOC.GOV Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Comment: GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS re: women at balls: ooh, barbara, did you maybe not get into a ball because of gender balance? at baltimore (home of the infamous gender balance case of a year or two ago) we no longer have gender balance at the playford ball, so i'll expect you next year. we had probably 10 or so more women than men, providing me with the opportunity to dance with some of MY favorite dancers, so many of whom are other women. yes, there are those for whom this creates some difficulties: newer dancers, out-of-towners (although we encourage people to dance with folks they don't know), and women who don't enjoy dancing with other women. but as one out-of-town guest said, "i just love to dance. i'm not so concerned with the gender of my partner." if more individuals and communities could adopt that attitude, we wouldn't have to prevent some people from attending our events because of their gender (and our budget can't afford to do that, anyway). think about it, folks. if you just love to dance, dance with everybody.... sharon "single woman" mckinley mckinley-AT- mail.loc.gov, and not an official balancer for any government agency ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 10:13:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 10:13:45 PST From: barbara.ruth-AT- yale.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A9889.DA80A9B6.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 10:13:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu ("port 39140"-AT- mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAEAGBCLGM0002QU-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 10:13:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from quickmail.yale.edu ([130.132.144.199]) by mail-relay1.cis.yale.edu with SMTP id AA21792 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for ); Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:12:23 -0400 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:11:56 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Subject: Re: GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 3.0.3 b1 d5 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Reply to: RE>GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS Well, since I've gone and opened this particular can of worms, I'll continue putting in my 4 cents worth (hey inflation is everywhere). I know all the arguments in favor of gender balancing and how many women aren't comfortable dancing with other women, and how it's particular women who get excluded from dancing with male partners when there is an imbalance, that men feel predated on etc. But I keep coming back to a few key experiences, like the afternoon English session at the last Brattleboro Dawn Dance where women significantly outnumbered men, and after fighting for a partner for the first two dances I just decided that I didn't feel competitive and switched gender roles. With a couple of exceptions, I spent the entire rest of the afternoon dancing with women partners and I had a fabulous time. Not only was I dancing with good partners, there was a tremendous rush of empowerment at being the one to go out to the people sitting out on the side and bringing them into the dance. Then there was the one completely open ball (no preregistration) I attended last spring, out of town. Predictably, women outnumbered men, and since I was not known there I got to be one of the ignored by male partners women. Except for the three or four men who knew me personally (including the two I'd driven there with) not one man asked me for a dance. But plenty of women strangers did, and oddly enough instead of feeling disgruntled and thinking that if only this ball had a sensible gender-balance policy the men would have asked me to dance, I found myself grateful to the women who made me feel welcome. And then there was summer at Buffalo Gap where men outnumbered women! Yes it's true. And halfway into the week women started looking at each other and saying, "Hey, something's wrong here. We're not dancing with each other. " And then went ahead and danced together *even though we didn't have to.* So Sharon, next year in Baltimore! And whatever did happen with that court case? Barbara Ruth (Ambigendered English and contra dancer) - re: women at balls: ooh, barbara, did you maybe not get into a ball because of gender balance? at baltimore (home of the infamous gender balance case of a year or two ago) we no longer have gender balance at the playford ball, so i'll expect you next year. we had probably 10 or so more women than men, providing me with the opportunity to dance with some of MY favorite dancers, so many of whom are other women. yes, there are those for whom this creates some difficulties: newer dancers, out-of-towners (although we encourage people to dance with folks they don't know), and women who don't enjoy dancing with other women. but as one out-of-town guest said, "i just love to dance. i'm not so concerned with the gender of my partner." if more individuals and communities could adopt that attitude, we wouldn't have to prevent some people from attending our events because of their gender (and our budget can't afford to do that, anyway). think about it, folks. if you just love to dance, dance with everybody.... sharon "single woman" mckinley mckinley-AT- mail.loc.gov, and not an official balancer for any government agency ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:39:29 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:39:27 PST From: pstamler-AT- crl.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A9895.D2F6F20C.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 11:39:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.crl.com ("port 4163"-AT- mail.crl.com) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAEDFL12P00002QU-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:39:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from crl11.crl.com by mail.crl.com with SMTP id AA04038 (5.65c/IDA-1.5 for ); Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:40:14 -0700 Received: by crl11.crl.com id AA04174 (5.65c/IDA-1.5 for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.Stanford.EDU); Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:28:36 -0700 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 11:28:36 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Subject: Re: Is everyone too pooped In-reply-to: <009A9873.9055884F.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Cc: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT On Tue, 8 Oct 1996 barbara.ruth-AT- yale.edu wrote: > Bear in mind, when rhapsodizing about balls and what wonderful opportunities > they are to dance the best dances with the best dancers etc. etc., that for > single women who don't have sweeties, or male friends for whom it is > convenient to pose as an escort, the "opportunities" to join in can be > extremely limited. This is another one of the unpleasant realities of these > events. You weren't dancing with the best women dancers. You were dancing > with the best women dancers whose association with a man allowed them entree > to the event. Barbara, does this mean that the Strafford Ball and other east coast balls restrict attendance to (heterosexual) couples only? If so, y'all should come out to the ball in St. Louis, where all warm bodies are welcomed--single, paired, or whatever. Restricting admission to one type of paired couple seems cruel and exclusionary to me (and yes, I've heard the argument about how gender imbalance ruins a dance, and I don't buy it). Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:12:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:12:23 PST From: meier-AT- SSRL.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A98A2.CF11089B.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Why don't more men sign up? Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 13:12:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ssrl.slac.stanford.edu ("port 1139"-AT- SSRL.SLAC.Stanford.EDU) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAEGOTDSJK0002QU-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:12:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by ssrl.slac.stanford.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) id 3; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:12:15 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:12:15 -0800 (PST) From: meier-AT- SSRL.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Subject: Why don't more men sign up? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: <009A98A2.C9E51B32.3-AT- ssrl.slac.stanford.edu> X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I realize that this list is going to be full of people who love to dance and are less particular about dancing with the opposite sex. But maybe you've heard from other people who require an opposite-sex partner, or from people who usually sit out dance camps. So what ARE the reasons that more women than men sign up for dance camps, yet at regular dances one is on the whole more likely to see lots of extra men? Has this conundrum ever been unraveled? Vanessa =============================================================================== Vanessa Schnatmeier MEIER-AT- SSRL750.BITNET or MEIER-AT- SSRL01.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 18:35:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 18:34:58 PST From: dschmit-AT- ix.netcom.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A98CF.DF3EECD8.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Tue, 8 Oct 1996 18:34:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com ("port 4685"-AT- dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAERXRHURO0002QU-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 18:34:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from was-dc5-22.ix.netcom.com (dschmit-AT- was-dc5-22.ix.netcom.com [207.94.235.54]) by dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA15028 for ; Tue, 08 Oct 1996 18:34:19 -0700 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 18:34:19 -0700 From: Diane Schmit Subject: Re: GENDER BALANCE AND BALLS X-Sender: dschmit-AT- popd.ix.netcom.com To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: <1.5.4.16.19961008212317.0a371228-AT- popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (16) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT A> >So Sharon, next year in Baltimore! And whatever did happen with that court >case? > >Barbara Ruth (Ambigendered English and contra dancer) > > Barbara, I'm not Sharon, but since I was chair or co-chair of the Baltimore Ball for the first 14 of them (we just had the 15th), I'll answer this. First, it wasn't a court case, it was a legal action. Short version is that after much time spent on this, the Baltimore City Commission (whose name I keep forgetting) decided that the instigator of this legal action had not been harmed (she did go to the ball) and she had no complaint, so it was dropped. In the early years we did not gender balance, and for the past 2 years we have not gender balanced again. With no attempt at gender balancing, the overall balance hasn't been much different than what we had with balancing. In addition, it is MUCH easier from an administrative point of view for the ball organizers, and I think more fair to all dancers. In reality, there was only one year where women on the waiting list did not get in at the last moment when the single men finally decided to register. Now, the women who used to register early to make sure they got in, wait until later just as the men do. It does make things a little more difficult when you need to tell the caterer how many people you are having, though. Oh, well. Anyway, as one of the single women at the ball, I had a GREAT time, and danced with many of my favorite dancers of both genders! And Devil Among the Taylors was wonderful! And it was also great to have less responsibility this year than in the past! (Thanks, Sharon!) And Barbara, I hope to see you there next year! Diane Diane Schmit dschmit-AT- ix.netcom.com ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 23:35:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 23:35:21 PST From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A99C3.002D8EEC.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: gender balance and balls Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Wed, 9 Oct 1996 23:35:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emerald.oz.net ("port 24554"-AT- emerald.oz.net) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAGGQKCTCG00034W-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Wed, 09 Oct 1996 23:35:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from [206.61.156.205] (shorter.oz.net [206.61.156.205]) by emerald.oz.net (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA04960 for ; Wed, 09 Oct 1996 23:28:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 23:28:26 -0700 (PDT) From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Subject: gender balance and balls To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: <199610100628.XAA04960-AT- emerald.oz.net> X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Barbara Ruth wrote that she didn't have a sweetie with whom to go to the ball. Dear Barbara, I guess the ball you didn't go to had a gender balance policy. But not all do, so if you felt excluded from your local ball, try dancing in another community. Here in Seattle we've never turned anyone away, either for reasons of gender or for reasons of hall size. This is partly a matter of philosophy-- we feel very strongly that the Ball is a celebration for the whole community, and we didn't want to limit access to women, or to the 101st person, or to those who don't feel up to memorizing 18 dances, or to out-of-towners who haven't been to our dances all year and aren't familiar with our repertory. Some of our other decisions such as the quick walk -throughs before most of the dances, and the free workshop to teach the "for those who know" dances, also support this policy of inclusiveness. For those of you concerned with gender balance-- we did notice that single women tended to register early, and couples and single men later. So limiting the number of registrants would also greatly increase the gender gap! Instead of limiting size, we've moved to a larger hall almost every year so that we could continue to take everyone who wants to come. Vicky Bestock, Seattle English Country Ball Committee ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:32:09 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:32:06 PST From: mmodica-AT- obgyn.amc.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A9A1E.BF8ED623.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Re: gender balance and balls Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:32:05 -0700 (PDT) X-PMrqc: 1 Received: from amc.edu ("port 4044"-AT- is.amc.edu) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IAH3NUH4OK00036I-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:32:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from [167.244.4.4] by amc.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/3.1.090690-Albany Medical Center) id AA24360; Thu, 10 Oct 1996 13:27:21 -0400 Received: from OB_ONE/SpoolDir by obgyn.amc.edu (Mercury 1.21); Thu, 10 Oct 1996 13:28:23 +0000 (GMT) Received: from SpoolDir by OB_ONE (Mercury 1.30); Thu, 10 Oct 1996 13:28:15 +0000 (GMT) Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 13:28:07 +0000 (GMT) From: Margherita Modica Subject: Re: gender balance and balls To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-id: Organization: Albany Medical College X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.42a) Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal X-Confirm-Reading-To: "Margherita Modica" On Wed, 09 Oct 1996 Vicky Bestock wrote: > For those of you concerned with gender balance-- we did notice that single > women tended to register early, and couples and single men later. So > limiting the number of registrants would also greatly increase the gender > gap! Instead of limiting size, we've moved to a larger hall almost every > year so that we could continue to take everyone who wants to come. This is an admirable policy if one can do it. However, it is not a solution in many places where larger halls are unavailable at an affordable price. Margherita Modica ************************************************************************ Margherita M. Modica mmodica-AT- obgyn.amc.edu Obstetrics & Gynecology (518) 262-6405 Albany Medical College (518) 262-5292, fax ************************************************************************ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 10:18:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 10:18:05 PST From: howard-AT- hmitchell.tcp.co.uk Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu To: ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A9C78.49990B5D.1-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu> Subject: Marple Folk Festival Return-Path: Received: from SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU by ssrl04.slac.stanford.edu with SMTP; Sun, 13 Oct 1996 10:18:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns0.tcp.net.uk ("port 44361"-AT- ns0.tcp.net.uk) by SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IALA2GLZ760003TH-AT- SERV04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU; Sun, 13 Oct 1996 10:18:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from tcpaaa11 (am168.du.pipex.com [193.130.252.168]) by zeus.tcp.net.uk (8.7.6/8.7) with SMTP id SAA25852 for ; Sun, 13 Oct 1996 18:17:51 +0100 (BST) Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 18:18:40 +0000 From: hmitchell-AT- tcp.co.uk Subject: Marple Folk Festival To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-to: howard-AT- hmitchell.tcp.co.uk Message-id: <199610131717.SAA25852-AT- zeus.tcp.net.uk> X-Envelope-to: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.40) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal Comments: Authenticated sender is The 4th Marple Folk Festival will take place on Saturday 16 November 1996 from 10.30 am - 11 pm at Ridge Danyers College, Buxton Lane Site, Marple, Cheshire, UK. There will be: DANCE WORKSHOPS ALL DAY CHILDREN'S EVENTS MUSICAL ACTIVITIES BARN DANCE/CEILIDH 18th CENTURY ASSEMBLY For full details see http://www.tcp.co.uk/~mitchell/marple.html ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 13:47:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 16:47:35 -0400 From: ab684-AT- freenet.carleton.ca (Walter Brown) Subject: London Pro Musica on the Net? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <199610142047.QAA03128-AT- freenet3.carleton.ca> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I have a copy of "Playford Dances - Volume 1", by Bernard Thomas. It's very useful, and I wish to know if volumes 2 or 3 are available. Does anyone know the e-mail or web address for the publisher, London Pro Musica? Thanks, Walter Brown Ottawa, Canada ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 15:25:12 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 17:31:16 -0500 From: sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: London Pro Musica on the Net? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >I have a copy of "Playford Dances - Volume 1", by Bernard Thomas. It's >very useful, and I wish to know if volumes 2 or 3 are available. > >Does anyone know the e-mail or web address for the publisher, London Pro >Musica? They are not yet available to th best of my knowledge....sure wish they were! Eric Haas at Early Music Shop o' NE will know more: vonhuene-AT- world.std.com Sheila Beardslee Bosworth sheilab-AT- tiac.net Editor, Boston Early Music News >>next BEMN Deadline 10/22 for 11/15 issue! 29 Main Street, Acton MA 01720-3505 voice: 508/263.9926 fax: 508/263.2366 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 06:29:04 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 08:27:42 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Message-ID: <961015082742.9a14-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT 1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list members approach this problem? ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 06:33:52 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 08:32:34 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Message-ID: <961015083234.9a14-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On the chance that an earlier message had an addressing error, let me try this again. Over the years I have been asked to teach a dance to the cast of our college's play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the recently discussed "Jenny Pluck Pears" for Shakespeare's Midsummer Night's Dream and, for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," we've taken on "Gathering Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related nonsense which the directors insist upon at that moment. I never get the feeling that the dance reaches out and relates to the audience. How you some of you discussion list members approach this problem. Forbes/Baker University ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 06:46:41 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 08:45:22 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: REsearch Query2??? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Message-ID: <961015084522.9a14-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT The burst of enthusiasum that new dance history researchers bring to the discipline occasionally causes them to believe anything in print, no matter how absurd. Here is an example. Some years ago I was reviewing a publica- tion for a periodical and I was astounded to read something to the effect that apes had been observed participating in something that looked like square dancing (I wish I was making this up, but I'm not). The secondary source given for this amazing concept was something title "Typing Tips." I have done a bit of rooting around in eary works of Sociology, during the 1920s, and have come across descriptions of chimpanzees involved in some repetitive motion patterns that the author labeled "Dance" so I'm assuming that my square dance reference comes from the same period. Any help? (No, I'm not the least bit interested in poking fun at square dancers or square dances, or square dancing in general) Forbes/Baker University ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 08:23:35 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 10:23:30 -0500 (CDT) From: Jonathan Sivier Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Message-ID: <199610151523.KAA22831-AT- ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU writes: >1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's >play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the >previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, >for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering >Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related >nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs >of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance >reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list >members approach this problem? I haven't, personally, had any experience in this area. However one of the other teachers in our local ECD group, Jane Hobgood, has. She isn't currently net-enabled, but says she will be RSN. Her husband was the former head of the theatre dept. here at the Univ. of Illinois and so she had many opportunities to do dances for various shows. One that I recall her mentioning was Dargason. She had them dance in a line along the front of the stage. This would seem to be have more opportunities for being open to the audience. Another obvious idea would be to do a long-ways dance with the head of the set pointing at the audience. Dances where not all the couples were moving at once might tend to be less confusing to those watching. Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------- | Jonathan Sivier | Ballo ergo sum. | | j-sivier-AT- uiuc.edu | (I dance therefore I am.) | | Flight Simulation Lab | - des Cartwright | | Beckman Institute | | | 405 N. Mathews | SWMDG - Single White Male | | Urbana, IL 61801 | Dance Gypsy | | Work: 217/244-1923 | | | Home: 217/359-8225 | Have shoes, will dance. | ------------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 09:02:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 11:01:21 -0500 (EST) From: morganj-AT- indyunix.iupui.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU, FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Step Stately ends in a nice sweep forward to the presence that might be of use in the plays. And most of the longways might look interesting if the audience is at the head of the set and dance has a figure where all promenade forward. Jim Morgan morganj-AT- indyunix.iupui.edu On Tue, 15 Oct 1996 FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU wrote: > 1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's > play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the > previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, > for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering > Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related > nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs > of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance > reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list > members approach this problem? > ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 11:08:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 18:47:31 +0000 From: Bob Archer Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <845401656.6584.0-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > Over the years I have been asked to teach a dance to the cast of our college's > play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the > recently discussed "Jenny Pluck Pears" for Shakespeare's Midsummer Night's > Dream and, for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," we've > taken on "Gathering Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational > bits and related nonsense which the directors insist upon at that moment. > I never get the feeling that the dance reaches out and relates to the > audience. How you some of you discussion list members approach this problem. I have seen Gathering Peascods done as the opening to the second half with two invited 'volunteers' from the audience. The cast helped them through, then sent them back to their seats to a loud burst of applause. Bob ---------------------------------------------------------- -- Bob Archer bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 13:14:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 13:14:06 -0800 (PST) From: meier-AT- SSRL.SLAC.Stanford.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <009A9E23.35134336.3-AT- ssrl.slac.stanford.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's >play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the >previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, >for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering >Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related >nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs >of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance >reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list >members approach this problem? This is something I've been grappling with lately as part of choreographing an ECD-based dance performance. Don't know if this is close enough to your preferred period, but the dance I chose to work with was Dublin Bay, circa 1710. There's interaction facing into and out of the set, several interesting turns, and the four-in-line sweeps with that sudden flip in the middle, very catchy and even a bit flashy. A lot of chance for eye contact with the audience, visible flirtation, and so forth; a more horizontal dance than a lot of line dances. Vanessa Schnatmeier =============================================================================== Vanessa Schnatmeier MEIER-AT- SSRL750.BITNET or MEIER-AT- SSRL01.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 13:37:51 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 15:37:29 -0500 From: seniort-AT- newtrier.k12.il.us (Thomas J. Senior) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT For what it's worth, a local theater coriographer visited our dance and came away with some ideas resulting in a melange of Rufty Tufty and a few other dances. The leading away in the chorus looked good on stage. Tom Senior >1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's >play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the >previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, >for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering >Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related >nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs >of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance >reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list >members approach this problem? Those who can, do. Those who understand, teach. Thomas J. Senior New Trier High School 1232 St. Johns Ave 385 Winnetka Ave Highland Park, IL 60035-3425 Winnetka, IL 60093-4295 847-433-8704 847-446-7000 x2128 seniort-AT- newtrier.k12.il.us ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 21:19:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 00:15:05 +0000 (GMT) From: Margherita Modica Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Christine Helwig has researched a collection of dances by the dance master Thomas Bray (17th Cent, I believe) who created dances for the stage. These dances are characterized by figures which look well to an audience (pousettes, leading out the sides, changes in direction). Christine directs Chelsea English Country Dancers which has used many of these dances to good effect. The only problem is that they are not "playful" and might not give the chance for cuttin- up that the directors want. BTW, Chelsea has also used Gathering Peascods as a signature dance, full of fun and energy. The trick is to have the tune played joyfully, and the slipping circles have to really move. The moves into the center, claps and turns single back to place give a nice effect. Margherita Davis > 1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's > play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the > previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, > for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering > Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related > nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs > of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance > reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list > members approach this problem? ************************************************************************ Margherita M. Modica mmodica-AT- obgyn.amc.edu Obstetrics & Gynecology (518) 262-6405 Albany Medical College (518) 262-5292, fax ************************************************************************ ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 22:17:12 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 22:10:16 -0700 (PDT) From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610160510.WAA10941-AT- emerald.oz.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's >play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the >previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, >for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering >Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related >nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs >of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance >reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list >members approach this problem? There is nothing wrong with Gathering Peascods! It makes a great demonstration dance because of the beautiful patterns--the men's and women's slipping circles, the doubles in and out. Don't overlook the chance to relate to the audience on the turn singles-- each one is a four-count chance to make eye contact, to bring them in, as though to say "Can you tell what fun we're having up here?" But if you want to include the audience more-- longways dances (head of set is the audience) with lines that come toward the presence is a really nice way to do it. Mr. Isaac's Maggot, and Step Stately are particularly beautiful as demonstration dances, but Apley House, Jacob Hall's Jig and many others also have this figure. Playford style (U-S-A) dances such as the Black Nag start with an up-a-double toward the audience. You can also turn a longways set sideways, which gives you one line with backs to the audience, the other facing. Choose a dance that has a back to back, so the facing line comes through toward the audience. Or one where neighbors lead away from the set toward the audience. I admit I cheat when staging dances for Nonesuch, our local performing group, by adding small bits of staging to keep the audience interested and the patterns unpredicatable. But I don't recommend turning a dance inside out and having the dancers face the audience and not each other. ECD is a social dance form, and needs the interaction among the participants. The audience gets to peek in and enjoy their enjoyment. If you try to have the dance orient to the audience too much, you lose all the flirtation and social interaction that is essential to the structure and style. Vicky Bestock, Nonesuch English Country Dance ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 02:54:55 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 05:50:33 +0000 (GMT) From: cclark-AT- vicon.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610160550.FAA19242-AT- vicon.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT If you're working with actors who don't know much about dancing, I'd suggest (just off the top of my head) New Boe Peep, Kemps Jegg, Rufty Tufty, Hearts Ease, or one of the old English almaines. If you have a few good dancers who'd like to show off, try Parsons Farewell, St. Martins, or a galliard. Alex Clark ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 09:53:36 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 12:57:21 -0400 From: mls-AT- panix.com (Michael L. Siemon) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT At 8:27 AM 10/15/96, FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU wrote: >1. Over the years I have been asked to prepare a dance for our college's >play-of-the-moment, usually from the 16th or 17th century. I've done the >previously discussed "Jenny pluck Pears" for "Midsummer Night's Dream" and, >for the current "The Curate Shakespeare As You Like It," "Gathering >Peascods." Both have opportunities for improvisational bits and related >nonsense which the directors insist upon. Both dances, following customs >of the period, "look into the set." I never get the feeling that the dance >reaches out and relates to the audience. How do some of you discussion list >members approach this problem? Dances in which partners slip past each other while facing up, i.e., downstage, can work [Maid Peeped Out at the Window, in addition to Nonesuch & Step Stately[. When you have your longways set parellel to the front of the set, a long cast, as in Maid, or a dance around, as in Picking Up Sticks, gives the dancers a chance to connect with the audience. And the Sheepskin Hey, with its potential confusions, gives lots of chances to play to the house by almost making a mistake and then miraculously completing the pattern. [Good sword teams use this technique a lot in grabbing their audience.] Nice query, John! Happy dancing, Sharon Green ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 14:22:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 14:22:08 -0800 (PST) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009A9EF5.E0559FC8.54-AT- ssrl01.slac.stanford.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Margherita Modica wrote: Christine Helwig has researched a collection of dances by the dance master Thomas Bray (17th Cent, I believe) who created dances for the stage. These dances are characterized by figures which look well to an audience (pousettes, leading out the sides, changes in direction). Christine directs Chelsea English Country Dancers which has used many of these dances to good effect. The only problem is that they are not "playful" and might not give the chance for cuttin- up that the directors want. Lucid directions and accompanying cassettes are available through CDSS. The date 1699 leaps to mind for Bray. What I think I recall about these dances are, first, that Bray was creating them not for integration into the plays but as afterpieces, which might be done a very few times through, and second, that they tend to be fairly tricky. I think "The Spring" is the only one that has achieved enough non-demo popularity to end up in the Barnes book. -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 415/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 00:35:02 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 00:34:33 -0700 (PDT) From: HUGH-AT- edsug.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Anyone recognise these dances? To: ecd-AT- edsug.com Message-ID: <01IAQAU80L6A005FCY-AT- UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I'll try the mailing list before I try blasting rec.folk-dancing... Someone has lent me a tape labelled "Pinewoods EAD '84", which I think was probably something the sound man for that week put together and sold copies on the last day -- it is probably comes by fair means rather than foul, but has no sleeve notes. Basically the tape is of assorted dances, with calls, but no walk-throughs, and often no identification of the dances. Can anyone identify the following:- Proper Contra A1 1s cross down through 2s to face out in a tidal wave, balance; allemande left into 1s join right hands for a diagonal line, balance in that line A2 Hey on that diagonal B1 1s meet and swing B2 1s lead up through their 2s and cast around; lines forward and back. English, proper, duple minor Star right; star left. 1s cross, cast; half figure eight up. Circular hey: four changes All cross hand swing partners. I'd also be interested to know who the bands and callers were, but not to the point of asking anyone to go to great effort to find out. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 11:06:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 14:06:12 -0500 (EST) From: AAHAYDEN-AT- amherst.edu Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Anyone recognise these dances? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <01IAR2YT7IHE94EN45-AT- amherst.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hugh, I went and looked up the staff list for EAD 84 at CDSS this morning. These are only clues, of course: campers might also have called a dance. But for what it's worth, here's who was on staff that week: Helene Cornelius (teaching ECD) Laurie Andres Peter Barnes Andra Barrand (now Horton) Brad Foster (teaching contras and squares) Earl Gaddis Mary Lea Steve Hickman Gene Murrow Sue Salmons (teaching ECD) Ted Sannella (teaching contras and squares) Jacqueline Schwab Cathy Henson Spicer (teaching ECD) Chris Walker Jeff Warner Email me privately if you want further details about who was playing what instruments, according to the brochure. Robin Hayden ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 15:33:25 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 18:37:12 -0400 From: mls-AT- panix.com (Sharon Green) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Research Query? To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT At 2:22 PM 10/16/96, Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing What I think I recall about these dances are, first, that Bray was creating >them not for integration into the plays but as afterpieces, which might be >done >a very few times through, and second, that they tend to be fairly tricky. I >think "The Spring" is the only one that has achieved enough non-demo popularity >to end up in the Barnes book. Hi Alan: Actually Love and a Bottle, Scotch Measure & Bartlett House all made it into Barnes II. The last of the three, Bartlett House, has been on several ball programs and might make a good demo dance--casts with a pursuit, flowing into a lead out, plus there's a great moment after the 2 changes when, men facing in to the set, women facing out, all set L & R.. Great dance. Cheers, Sharon ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 19:07:32 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Resent-Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 22:09:39 +0000 Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 21:55:41 +0000 Resent-From: Rich Galloway From: Rich Galloway Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Anyone recognise these dances? Resent-To: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU To: ecd-AT- edsug.com Resent-Message-ID: <199610180207.WAA16599-AT- xis.com> Message-ID: <199610180153.VAA16555-AT- xis.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > Can anyone identify the following:- > > English, proper, duple minor > Star right; star left. > 1s cross, cast; half figure eight up. > Circular hey: four changes > All cross hand swing partners. That would be The Kentish Cricketeers. It was published in the first "Kentish Hops" book (and, of course, would be in the combined publication.) ==================================================== Rich Galloway Silver Spring, MD ==================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 01:38:06 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 01:37:39 -0700 (PDT) From: HUGH-AT- edsug.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Anyone recognise these dances? To: ECD-AT- edsug.com Message-ID: <01IAVY7KFDK20074ML-AT- UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Thank you all, especialy Richard Sauvain who managed to find the original liner notes from the tape. The two dances were Semi-Centennial Reel (by Ted Sannella, in Zesty Contras) and Kentish Cricketers (the first dance in the first Kentish Hops leaflet) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 10:02:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 13:01:21 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Waltz question To: ECD discussion list Message-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Time: 1:50 PM OFFICE MEMO Waltz question Date: 10/21/96 This is not strictly an ECD matter, but this seems like a good group from whom to get an answer to a question that came up while listening to the most recent Bare Necessities CD. What is it, in terms of music theory and the psychophysiology of hearing, that makes music in 3/4 time so bone-deep sensual to the human ear? Is this a universal, or is the response specific to European-based cultures? Am I correct in believing that at one time the Church tried to ban all 3/4 time music? Barbara Ruth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 12:19:44 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 14:14:25 -0500 (CDT) From: FORBES-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Waltz question To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <961021141425.d33-AT- GEORGE.BAKERU.EDU> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT A good puzzler. I would expand your definition of a waltz to include "in measures of 3 counts; the first one strong, the next two weaker." My concept of Playford and before is that there may be three beats per measure, but the first is not that much heavier than numbers 2 and 3. Also, as a question, does temp have an impact? Some waltzes are "sensual" (Sensuous?) at one 'beat' per measure, others where all three are enjoyed and distinct. But it may depend upon your partner of the moment as to the degree/level of bone-deep sensuality. Your question is a good one--thanks Forbes/Kansas ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 13:01:38 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 16:01:30 -0400 From: Harold Cheyney Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Waltz question To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <2.2.16.19961021155816.31b70f60-AT- magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT I don't have a feeling for the "why" in this question but there does seem to be an optimal tempo range. Too fast and the effect is lost. Too slow and I seem to want to dance ahead of the music. If the music lacks a stronger first beat then it doesn't seem like a waltz. Harold ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 13:43:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 16:43:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Waltz question To: ECD discussion list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Mon, 21 Oct 1996, Barbara Ruth wrote: > Subject: Time: 1:50 PM > OFFICE MEMO Waltz question Date: 10/21/96 > > This is not strictly an ECD matter, but this seems like a good group from whom > to get an answer to a question that came up while listening to the most recent > Bare Necessities CD. What is it, in terms of music theory and the > psychophysiology of hearing, that makes music in 3/4 time so bone-deep sensual > to the human ear? Is this a universal, or is the response specific to > European-based cultures? Am I correct in believing that at one time the Church > tried to ban all 3/4 time music? > > Barbara Ruth > > As I recall in the days before music notation had really settled down, there was "tempus perfectus" for the subdivision of the principal note value (presumably the "longa") into three shorter ones ("brevis"), and "tempus imperfectus" for the division into two. Similar subdivisions might be carried out at lower levels as well. The symbol for "tempus perfectus" was a circle, also regarded as being a perfect form, while "tempus imperfectus" was indicated by a broken circle -- hence, the origin of the use of a "C" for rhythmic structures divisible by two, four, etc. As to the church trying to prohibit it? I hadn't heard of that; three was considered perfect in part, at least, because of allusion to the Trinity. But it was also regarded as "perfect" in some aesthetic sense as well; perhaps this is the same sense that you perceive... Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 14:28:10 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 16:34:16 -0500 From: sheilab-AT- tiac.net (Sheila Beardslee Bosworth) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Waltz question To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT In answer to Barbara Ruth's question about waltzes..... Eric Arnold wrote: > "tempus perfectus" for subdivision... into three shorter ones, and >"tempus imperfectus" for division into two. ... The symbol for "tempus >perfectus" was a circle, also regarded as being a perfect form, while >"tempus imperfectus" was indicated by a broken circle -- hence, the origin >of the use of a "C" for rhythmic structures divisible by two, four, etc. This is true.... by changing the "fractions" of the time signatures you can end up with triple/triple (modern 9/8 time), duple/triple (6/8), duple/duple (4/4 or even 2/2) and triple/duple (3/4)... >As to the church trying to prohibit it? I hadn't heard of that; three was >considered perfect in part, at least, because of allusion to the Trinity. The theological duple reference symbolized Christ's dual nature as God and man. (or one might choose the eternal aspects of heaven and hell, or a long list of other [x] + [y] choices). That's the end of today's little musicological trivia note... Back to the salt mines.... Sheila Beardslee Bosworth sheilab-AT- tiac.net Editor, Boston Early Music News >>next BEMN Deadline 10/22 for 11/15 issue! 29 Main Street, Acton MA 01720-3505 voice: 508/263.9926 fax: 508/263.2366 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 05:27:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 08:26:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Praetzel Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Playford 1651, music, country dances To: ecd-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610221226.IAA29737-AT- watt.uwaterloo.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've started a project and I'm curious to see if anyone is interested. All of the text for 1651 Playford has been typed in and I've scaned the music from a 1933 edition; but just have not put it all together yet. I've typed in all of the music into a PC program called Noteworthy Composer. That has also been saved in the MIDI format. I've also typed in the dance songs in a book called The Apted Book of Country Dances, 1933 by Porter, William - 24 country dances from the last years of the 18th century with tunes and instructions I'm tempted to type in all of the dance instructions but there is the copy- right issue. All proceeds from the book are to go to the English Folk Dance and Song Society (in England I assume). The project that I am reaching for is to have all music in an accessable form. Ie I can play multi-part music on my sound card and make dance tapes (the goal is to blast a CD since a blank is only about $15 Cdn). I'd use live music if possible (an SCA related project is hoping to have everything live). Various files are on my web page http://ece.uwaterloo.ca/~praetzel/music.html SCA arrangements (basically the music from Pennsic 25) are not on the web page. They are freely distributable within the SCA though. - Eric (http://ece.uwaterloo.ca/~praetzel) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 05:51:13 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 05:50:48 -0700 (PDT) From: HUGH-AT- edsug.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Playford 1651, music, country dances To: ECD-AT- edsug.com Message-ID: <01IAXLAC47XE008RV9-AT- UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Are you aware of http://www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/org/sca/src/contributed/pc2d-AT- andrew.cmu.edu/dance/playford.html which is some other SCA "let's type in Playford" campaign -- he is trying to get the music into Chris Walshaw's ABC format (http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/) ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 06:52:47 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 09:52:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Praetzel Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Playford 1651, music, country dances To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610221352.JAA29878-AT- watt.uwaterloo.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Are you aware of > http://www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/org/sca/src/contributed/pc2d-AT- Yep. I was trying to convert from the Noteworthy format to MIDI and then from MIDI to ABC. It was an exercise in futility. I typed in all of 1651 Playford over the space of a week of lunch hours and snippets of time. It is quite done. Noteworthy is shareware and even the shareware version prints. I'm was going to export the music straight into the document. I was actually going to reformat the document for min. number of pages when printed by re-arranging the pages. The idea would be to get the original text with modern music notation out to people. But that is pretty low on my priority. I'm working with people in Australia and Ann Arbor, MI to get a CD of SCA dance music that we can use. I've just about had it with 20 songs to a tape where I can't find the songs; or 20+ tapes with one song/tape and lots of songs that I've never heard of and don't have the steps to while I don't have music for the really common stuff. I may type in the Playford in ABC at some point; just to force myself to learn the note vs position on the staff. I can play recorders and flutes from sheet music; but don't ask me what notes I'm playing! - Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 19:26:11 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 22:24:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Gene Murrow <71332.2116-AT- CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Waltz question To: ECD list Message-ID: <961023022457_71332.2116_GHL145-1-AT- CompuServe.COM> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT IMHO, Barbara is responding to cultural "conditioning" more than any inherent quality of 3/4 time. The waltz is a dreamy dance that has inspired some of the most beautiful dance music around. Pleasant associations abound. Actually, duple meter is more "bone deep" than triple when applied to movement: humans have only 2 legs (not 3), and our hearts beat in a duple pattern. Nearly all rock n' roll is in duple, and we all know what lascivious, corrupting, morality-trashing music/dance that is! One of the most breathtaking and bone-resonating concerts I ever attended was by "Kodo" (??), the drumming commune/performing troupe from Japan. Afterward, when we were discussing the concert and the overwhelming effect of the music (all persussion) with friends who attended with us, Sally Logemann Johnson, former director of the NY Renaissance Band, made the observation that all the pieces were in duple time-- not a triple to be found anywhere. Didn't think much about that remark until now.... Gene Murrow EC Dancer who'd waltz with Barbara Ruth anytime ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 14:24:23 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 14:24:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <961023142413.2280bf02-AT- ssrl01.slac.stanford.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Folks -- I'm curious about how regular English dances (as distinct from balls) are programmed in your area, and I have a related question about ceilidh dances. Here are the models I have encountered. Please correct me if your observations are different. In the Bay Area: A regular dance is typically 2.5 hours long altogether, starts at 8:00, has one 15-minute break around 9:15 (usually with some refreshments including juice or punch available), and resumes after the break. There is not usually much difference between the first and second parts of the dance, although dances programmed tend to get simpler as it gets later after the break. All dances are taught all the time ('for those who know' is *very* rare.) The Palo Alto Friday ECD has lately started taking requests in the second half, and the request dances are also taught. In Boston: The first part of the dance is definitely a class, with complicated dances taught in detail. After a break, the second half is more of a dance party, operating mostly from requests, with at most brief prompting of dances. The hard dances from earlier in the evening often get repeated here. I don't remember how long the sessions are or at what time they're held. How do you do it where you are? Have you encountered a different way of organizing a regular ECD series? For ceilidh people: How often do you have breaks, and how long do they tend to last? Do people just head over to the bar when they're thirsty, regardless of whether they're missing another dance? What proportion of rants get done compared to everything else? How long do you let pass between dances? Thanks for your input, -- Alan PS: I think it's okay to post answers to the list, since this is of some general interest. If you disagree, reply to me and I'll summarize responses next week. -- APW PPS: All three "social dance" leaders at the BACDS Fall Weekend are subscribed to this list, and all did terrific jobs. (I've been reading the evaluations.) Congratulations, and thanks, to Mary "the details" Devlin, Brad "Hornpipe" Sayler, and Sue "Jersey Devil" Dupre. Brad even had 16 people ranting at around midnight Saturday. Event organizers: hire these people! -- APW ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 16:03:08 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 18:46:43 +0000 From: Mary Stafford Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: "'ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu'" Message-ID: <01BBC114.797C0C20-AT- mes.world.std.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BBC114.7983AD40" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT ------ =_NextPart_000_01BBC114.7983AD40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alan- Currently in Boston (actually in Cambridge) the format is: first portion = of evening, starting at 7:30pm is "taught", but features easy to medium = hard dances, taught by first caller of evening; second portion of = evening, "taught" dances, harder, taught by second caller. Helene = Cornelius is usually the second person, but sometimes she switches with = another caller to allow them a chance at the harder dances. There is a = break at about 9:30-9:45-ish, and after the break there is about a half = hour of dances, mostly requests, but a few from the earlier taught = dances repeated with less calling. Once a month there is a "Party" = format dance, using all available callers, and featuring moderately easy = dances from our usual repertoire. It should be said here that for a = recent special dance called "Fall Favorites" we were offered a vote for = five favorite dances from the repertoire if we signed up in advance, and = I believe the list of dances done in 1995-96 was over 300! We are = blessed in Boston/Cambridge with both fine dance musicians and premiere = callers. Mary Stafford Allston, MA ---------- In Boston: The first part of the dance is definitely a class, with = complicated dances taught in detail. After a break, the second half is more = of a dance party, operating mostly from requests, with at most = brief prompting of dances. The hard dances from earlier in the = evening=20 often get repeated here. 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If you're going to put that much effort into the project you describe, at least do it with better sources. If you must, use the Jeremy Barlow work on Playford tunes. Better yet, do them yourself and compare with Barlow. I'm embarassed to inform that you'll catch on quickly. Forbes/Kansas ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 03:24:27 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 03:24:31 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul J. Stamler" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT In St. Louis dances happen twice a month, and run from 7:30-9:30 p.m.. There is a short break about 8:30; all dances are taught. One of our callers makes it a practice to put the dance that is hardest and/or will require the most teaching right after the break. There is no "class" segment at the dances per se, but we've recently begun having an additional evening once a month that's billed as a workshop, at which there's a lot more discussion of styling and teaching of hard dances or ones that are new to the callers. Peace. Paul ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 04:39:24 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 04:38:32 -0700 (PDT) From: HUGH-AT- edsug.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- edsug.com Message-ID: <01IB0BEALAWY007JGS-AT- UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >> Folks -- >> >> I'm curious about how regular English dances (as distinct from balls) are >> programmed in your area, and I have a related question about ceilidh dances. In England (says he, from a small sample of clubs) we generally have dance clubs that meet typically weekly during school term (often disguised as evening classes). Clubs often arrange Saturday night dances to which they invite all the other clubs in their area; a given club will arrange anything from 0 to half a dozen such dances a year. I guess I should count a "regular English dance" to be the weekly meeting, which is typically 2 to 2 1/2 hours, generally to recorded music, with a 10-15 minute break. Generally one caller calls for the whole evening, with no particular convention for where to place easy and lethal dances. Some clubs are effectively run by one particular caller, but most will have a small pool they work through. The Saturday night dances ("as distinct from balls"?) typically run for 3 1/2 to 4 hours with a half hour break when some snack is served. These dances usually have a live band and caller imported from outside the club's area. Again there is no convention for what dances to have where, although particular callers will have reputations for doing particular styles of dances. An English dance club will usually do a mixture of Playford, American and English-Traditional dances; the ratio will vary depending on the callers and the club membership, some clubs will concentrate on one particular style. >>I have a related question about ceilidh dances Ceilidhs in England are distinct from dance clubs. Generally they are organised by a school PTA (or similar) wanting a social/fund-raising event. Generally the organiser contacts a band who will supply a caller. The organisation is similar to the "Saturday night dance" above in that there is generally a break in the middle for food, but it is common for people not to dance every dance (it is a social event, not a dance); a bar is standard practice. At a ceilidh as described above I would expect zero rants (too difficult to teach!), but I would expect a couple of step-hop dances and many dances with stepping ("slow reels") so dancing them is hard work. Intervals between dances would be longer than for a dance-club dance. You also get Ceilidhs at folk festivals which have the same principles but where the dancers tend to know what they are doing. Rants are common there (i.e. 2 or 3 in the evening) -- but bear in mind that in that context a rant is no more energetic than any other dance (or vice-versa). All the above is a sweeping generalisation. YMMV. Other disclaimers apply. I'm not sure I've actually answered your question after all that. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 05:44:45 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 08:44:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Praetzel Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610241244.IAA06540-AT- watt.uwaterloo.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Southern Ontario (Toronto area). > I'm curious about how regular English dances (as distinct from balls) are 1 ball/yr 0 dances/yr but there is a group 1.5 hours away that does some Playfordish dances at their monthly "coutra/country dances". Unfortunately it is all on a tile floor. Live music, smallish group (20 attendees typical perhaps). The people who show up for the ball (or the 1800's Vintage ball) don't really attend the regular dances that I've mentioned below. Contra dances are the most common; one being held monthly (70 min. drive) and another bi-monthly (90 min. drive). Both of those pull 30 .. 40 attendees (one is in a city of several million!) and they will call dance after dance till a 15 min. break at half time. Once in a blue moon we get to do a square and 3 couple or 3 couple minor dances are never seen. Circle mixer dances are done at times. There are other dance groups but they tend to be more elderly and of the "modern square" crowd (ie have their funky outfits, come with partners, never mix, use only canned music and/or never do a walk thru and teaching of any sort). Generally dances are 3 hours long. All dances called (except waltzes). In all cases we seem to have an occasional influx of new dancers and so the night will be spent doing simpler dances. Two dances like that leaves me aching for a woman who can spin without giving me the impression that she is on a pogo stick or walking thru taffee. Irish Ceili dances are held 4 or 5 times a year. They draw 300 .. 700 people (not bad for a university town of 90,000). People don't tend to mix anywhere near as much as other social dances. Due to the number of people, teaching is difficult and the few of us who know how to do the dances are either doing set dances to the side or trying to keep couples together on the main dance floor. Lots of fun; but not a place that the "real" (or is that reel?) dancers go. There is never anything hard at this event given the infrequency of it; and the sheer problems of trying to call for that many people who don't go to classes (they've started classes but attendance is quite low). > How often do you have breaks, and how long do they tend to last? Do Ha. The musicians don't stop; why should we :-) > whether they're missing another dance? What proportion of rants get What is a rant? Oh yea; we have one SCA/EC dance event in the area yearly. It is held by an SCA group; labeled by the real dancers because they do non-period EC dances and will hopefully be well organized this year. - Eric ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 08:14:42 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 11:12:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Brad Sayler Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: brs6c-AT- uva.pcmail.virginia.edu Message-ID: <199610241512.LAA07618-AT- uva.pcmail.Virginia.EDU> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hello everyone, In response to Alan's question, our Charlottesville VA English dance meets once a month and goes from 8:00 to 10:30 with a 15 min break with refreshments about 9:15 or 9:30. Dances start easy and get more challenging as the evening goes on, and then get easier again towards the end. We do a variety of Historical /Playford style dances as well as traditional dances. I am curious about the following reference to slow reels. Hugh, can you or someone else give me an example of such a dance or describe the step or movement used? On Oct 24, 8:01am, HUGH-AT- edsug.com wrote: > Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) > At a ceilidh as described above I would expect zero rants (too difficult > to teach!), but I would expect a couple of step-hop dances and many > dances with stepping ("slow reels") so dancing them is hard work. > Intervals between dances would be longer than for a dance-club dance. > -- End of excerpt from HUGH-AT- edsug.com Brad Sayler brad-AT- virginia.edu Civil Engineering & Applied Mechanics University of Virginia (804) 924-6379 ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 08:26:48 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 08:26:21 -0700 (PDT) From: HUGH-AT- edsug.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- edsug.com Message-ID: <01IB0J6VDTGI007Z8G-AT- UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >> I am curious about the following reference to slow reels. Hugh, can you Sorry -- I knew I would get myself in trouble there. Many ceilidh bands play a slowish polkaish tune which sort of forces you into a Scottish skip change of step except it is a lot slower and with a strong step at the start (similarish to a travelling rant). Listen to Flowers and Frolics / Sold Out for a good example of what I am trying to describe, or the Old Hat/ Mellorphone CD for something more recent. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 08:32:28 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 11:30:05 -0400 From: Barbara Ruth Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: NOMAD To: ECD discussion list Message-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Time: 12:07 PM OFFICE MEMO NOMAD Date: 10/24/96 Really should have announced this sooner, but for those who are in the vicinity and might not already know, the NOMAD traditional music and dance festival is taking place this weekend at the Newtown Middle School in CT (near Danbury, exit 10 off of I-84). It runs from Friday night 7:30 p.m. until Sun. 5:00 p.m., and there is going to be *lots* of English dancing this year. There is an an hour of English called by Peggy Vermilya on Friday night, followed by an hour of waltzing (Gene Murrow take note!), and English sessions called by Fried Herman, Christine Helwig, Helen Davenport, Sharon Green, Andreas Haydn, Cyril Hendrickson, Marjorie Potter and Hanny Budnick throughout Saturday and Sunday, performances by Chelsea English Country Dancers and Reel Nutmeg, as well as workshops, sessions and performances in a myriad of other dance types including among others Minuet, Scandanavian, contras, Native American, Cajun, swing, and folk music performances and participatory singing. Admission runs from $9.00-$30 depending on amount of time. If you would like more information let me know. Barbara Ruth ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 09:19:30 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 11:15:13 -0500 From: Tom Roby Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU CC: ECD-AT- edsug.com Message-ID: <9610241615.AA11180-AT- alpha3.math.wisc.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > Many ceilidh bands play a slowish polkaish tune which sort of forces > you into a Scottish skip change of step except it is a lot slower and > with a strong step at the start (similarish to a travelling rant). Your descriptions sounds roughly like the strathspey step in Scottish Country Dancing. Could you or someone else comment on how these two steps compare? Tom ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 09:57:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 09:57:36 -0700 (PDT) From: HUGH-AT- edsug.com Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- edsug.com Message-ID: <01IB0MGVOI360098HP-AT- UG.EDS.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >> Your descriptions sounds roughly like the strathspey step in Scottish >> Country Dancing. Could you or someone else comment on how these two >> steps compare? They don't!! The one is done by a bunch of semi-drunk people who have no idea what they 'ought to be doing', the other is (in theory) done by people who have been taught style and technique for hours. I've dug a big hole here -- I think someone (Bob?) ought to throw me a lifeline! ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 11:17:26 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 10:42:24 -0700 From: EVANS Nan E Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: English Dance Programming To: ecd (Return requested) Message-ID: <"06A7A326FAA80001*/c=us/admd= /prmd=or.gov/o=PRD/ou=MSMail/s=EVANS/g=Nan/i=E/"-AT- MHS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT In response to Alan's question about regular English country dance programs: In Portland Oregon, we have English country dances on the 2nd and 4th Fridays (a single series organized by the Portland English Country Dancers) and the 1st Saturdays (organized by the Portland Country Dance Community). The Friday night series tends to be more of a dance party aimed at folks who know something about dancing, although beginners are always welcome. The Saturday series tends to be aimed at mostly beginning dancers. All dances have live music, Since I teach mostly on the Friday series, I will comment on those. I tend to program them much like Tony Parkes recommends programming contra dances. Building skill levels and energy in the first half (8:00 to about 9:15), a break (15 minutes or so), then the second half takes a little dip in energy on the first dance after the break to get people going again, and then building to a peak (a mix of energy and complexity) by about the second or third dance after the break and then calming down with easier dances towards the end (about 11:15). (By "energy" I guess I mean intensity of the dance experience - certainly not speed!). I usually try to emphasize a few basics in the first couple of dances in the evening to encourage "greater dancing enjoyment by all" - e.g., awareness of phrasing and how a specifc dance movement fits the phrase, really connecting with others dancers by giving weight on a gate, giving clues to other dancers with only the eyes or slight movements of the body (rather than talking or pushing), or varying walking steps with a skip change on certain dances. After these first few dances, then the evening becomes much more of a social, dance party. During the summer months I also try out possible ball dances. During the fall and winter, I try to program evening dances so that each night we do a few of the dances which are on the Portland, Seattle, and/or Bay Area Ball programs. I have discovered that during the summer months when it is daylight outside late into the evening and dancers tend to arrive later, that my programming ideas need to be very flexible. I will often start summer evenings (on time) with set dances for however many dancers are there. It has proved to be a lot of fun - and unpredictable, too. The 1st Saturday series starts with a teaching session at 7:30, then the dance at 8:00, no break and ends at about 10:00. When I call at these dances, I keep the program pretty basic and accessible to all. I often will do a quick "for those who know" set dance from our standard repertoire (e.g., Fandango, Prince William) instead of a break to show new dancers how much fun can be had. Thanks for the question Alan. I am enjoying reading how things ar in other cities. Nan Evans ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 22:02:59 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 01:03:20 -0400 From: eferguson-AT- umassd.edu (Emily L. Ferguson) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT >Folks -- > >I'm curious about how regular English dances (as distinct from balls) are >programmed in your area, and I have a related question about ceilidh dances. > >Here are the models I have encountered. Please correct me if your observations >are different. > >In Boston: > > The first part of the dance is definitely a class, with complicated > dances taught in detail. After a break, the second half is more of > a dance party, operating mostly from requests, with at most brief > prompting of dances. The hard dances from earlier in the evening > often get repeated here. I don't remember how long the sessions are > or at what time they're held. > >How do you do it where you are? Have you encountered a different way of >organizing a regular ECD series? > I want to add a word to Mary Stafford's posting to the list. In addition to the weekly dance, which is divided into three hours - beginner/intermediate, intermediate/advanced, talk-through only - with a brief break between hours two and three, and final Wednesday "parties" called by as many of the stable of leaders as can get there (4-8 people depending), and a ball and special holiday dance around Christmas and the Fall Favorites, (big breath here) we also offer a First Friday dance which is aimed at intermediate to experienced, usually presents one or more thoroughly unfamiliar dances per evening, talk-throughs of the better known repertoire, and reiterations of the more advanced repertoire around. Our repertoire is very wide and includes "traditional" dances (from CDM), although our group is generally aging and loves skipping only a bit more than ranting. Barnesoft '95 covers probably about 90% of our repertoire, but new material is constantly being explored during that second hour every week and our artistic director - Helene Cornelius - is in touch with all choreographers and leaders around the world, often bringing their material to us before it is published. Judging from the answers which I've read thus far, it seems we have a lot of dance opportunities in the Boston area, 5 to 6 regularly scheduled English Country Dances each month from September to June, plus special events. Oh yes, I forgot, from time to time we are able to offer special workshops with visiting leaders - Fried came up last year and Colin has been in the last couple of years. We've had Nibs Matthews and Nicholas Broadbridge as well. Emily L. Ferguson - Cape Cod, Massachusetts Photographer, English Country Dance leader, weaver/spinner No matter which side of the fence you're on, the grass will always turn brown if you don't water it. ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 00:51:34 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 08:47:32 +0000 From: Bob Archer Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <846229690.28907.0-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT > >> Your descriptions sounds roughly like the strathspey step in Scottish > >> Country Dancing. Could you or someone else comment on how these two > >> steps compare? > They don't!! The one is done by a bunch of semi-drunk people who have no idea > what they 'ought to be doing', the other is (in theory) done by people who > have been taught style and technique for hours. > > I've dug a big hole here -- I think someone (Bob?) ought to throw me a lifeline! > I'm having a lot of fun watching you digging Hugh :-). This is the problem with trying to describe something visual and audible like dance on a text only medium. The basic step is the same - one, two, three, hop (in fact I teach a strathspey step by pointing out to people that it is basically a morris double step done with a bit of style and elegance). I'm going to have to think about this a little more to really give a good answer - I might try measuring the speeds of some recordings over the weekend to try and get a more quantitative measure of the difference. Bob ---------------------------------------------------------- -- Bob Archer bob-AT- hottub.demon.co.uk ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 06:30:31 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 09:30:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Dance party/class formats (ceilidh folks please read) To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT In Ann Arbor, there are two main ECD events scheduled regularly. One is a dance "workshop" which meets every other Tuesday from 7:30 to 10pm. Depending on the way that Tuesdays fall, there are two or three of these per month. The other is a fourth Saturday social dance which goes from 8 to 11pm. Both events have a break of 10-15 min in the middle. We generally try to have some sort of refreshment during the break. Music is always live. The workshop format is enough like a social dance that many people come to it primarily for its social side, but there is more emphasis made on style points, and more time is given to learning a variety of dances, than at the Saturday social dance. At the workshop it is not uncommon to stop a dance in the middle to make a style point. At the Saturday dance this would be extremely rare, and only if a dance gets seriously chaotic is it likely to be stopped at this event. The workshop may have a theme for the evening or sometimes for the semester or season, but it doesn't always. "for those who know" dances are uncommon, but there is an effort to establish a base of dances and dancers to begin to do some this way. The variety at the workshop is good: Playford-era, traditional, and contemporary ECD all make their way onto the program with some regularity, and a few early American ECD-style dances as well. Calling is shared principally between three callers, two with considerable experience (decades) and one more recent (4th year). Opportunity and encouragement for those interested in learning to call is provided at the workshop as well; at the Saturday dance the calling is mostly by the two experienced callers, with the newer one assisting when one of the regulars can't be there. Fairly standard ideas of programming are used in general, and the callers are flexible in their programs to choose material which fits the folks who show up on any particular occasion. The workshops usually get at least twenty and rarely as many as forty dancers; the Saturday dance perhaps 20-25% more than this typically. We do not have any regularly scheduled annual ECD events, but we do have occasional ones; the last was a joint ECD-contra ball a couple of years ago for the CDSS leadership workshop held here in January, and the next will be this coming January, with Hold the Mustard & Scott Higgs doing an advanced dance, workshops, and a mixed ECD/contra ball on the last weekend. Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 10:26:50 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 18:26:43 +0100 (MET) From: "Dilip Soni ZT AN 1 T.44984 R.53354 T=Work" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Hi To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610251726.SAA02300-AT- juist.mchp.siemens.de> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hi Sharon, I have made it safely to Munich. I do not get to the office much until two more weeks later. I received a letter from Alan Davies with a lot of info. I also went to a Bayerish (South Germany)/Austrian Folk Dance here. Quite nice. People were nice and friendly. Cheers, Dilip ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 11:14:53 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 19:14:45 +0100 (MET) From: "Dilip Soni ZT AN 1 T.44984 R.53354 T=Work" Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Private EMail to the list To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610251814.TAA02363-AT- juist.mchp.siemens.de> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Foks, I am really sorry that I inadvertantly sent the message to the entire list! Guess, I am still not over the jet lag. It will not happen again. My sincere apologies. Dilip Soni ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 11:47:00 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 14:46:37 -0400 (EDT) From: M.Beth.Lewis-AT- VALLEY.NET (M. Beth Lewis) Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: Re: Hi To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <1831686-AT- hanover.VALLEY.NET> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Did you mean to send this to me? --- You wrote: Hi Sharon, I have made it safely to Munich. I do not get to the office much until two more weeks later. I received a letter from Alan Davies with a lot of info. I also went to a Bayerish (South Germany)/Austrian Folk Dance here. Quite nice. People were nice and friendly. Cheers, Dilip --- end of quoted material --- ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 06:35:16 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 09:33:09 -0500 (EST) From: SHARON MCKINLEY Subject: REPLIES SENT TO WHOLE LIST To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT re: replies: to the list: i THINK dilip was actually writing to me (but maybe not; there's other sharons around). of course, the person who wrote to ASK me if he was, also sent THAT message to the entire list. i find it hard to deal with the problem of remembering to extract the sender's name and address from the message if i want to reply. another list i'm on replaces the list name and address with the sender's for every message. is it possible to do this with the ECD list? it would avoid a lot of the confusion about replies that i've seen on the list lately. thanks. sharon mckinley ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 06:58:18 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 06:58:13 -0800 (PST) From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing Subject: RE: REPLIES SENT TO WHOLE LIST To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: <009AA693.84F07BA8.7-AT- ssrl01.slac.stanford.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Sharon inquires whether I can configure the list so that it replaces the list name with the sender name, so replies will go just to the originator of the message. Well, yes, I can, but I don't want to. I'd rather that replies ordinarily go to the whole list, because most of the point of this exercise is to have conversations in "public", where the rest of the list can get in on the act. If the default is that replies only go to the originator, you would have as much hassle sending to the list as you do now to get to the originator. If most of the list would *greatly* prefer that it be changed, I would be willing to change it, but my personal preference is that it stay the way it is now. (Sorry if this is incoherent; I'm only up this early because I'm still up, as I've been futzing with system stuff on the servers here at work. I think they're working now, so I'm off to breakfast and then to bed.) -- Alan =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON-AT- SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 415/926-3056 Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 94309-0210 =============================================================================== ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 07:09:37 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 10:09:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Arnold Subject: Re: REPLIES SENT TO WHOLE LIST To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Sat, 26 Oct 1996, SHARON MCKINLEY wrote: [snip] i find it hard to deal with the problem of remembering to > extract the sender's name and address from the message if i want > to reply. another list i'm on replaces the list name and address > with the sender's for every message. is it possible to do this > with the ECD list? it would avoid a lot of the confusion about > replies that i've seen on the list lately. thanks. sharon > mckinley > I, for one, like the replies going to the ECD list; I have the option locally tosend to the individual if I want to reply privately. Since private replies are much less frequent to things from the list than public ones are, it would be a big nuisance for me to re-direct each message that was intended to be public, and you can be sure that many messages that were intended as public comment would not get public distribution. On the other hand, maybe that *would* be a benefit . . . (;-^) Perhaps as an alternative, this could be set up as one of the options that individual list members could set for the way the list responds to them, with the default being to reply to the list. How about it, Alan? Eric Arnold Ann Arbor ================================================================================ Archive-Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 08:54:15 PST Sender: owner-ecd-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 07:47:19 -0800 (PST) From: bestockp-AT- oz.net Reply-To: ECD-AT- playford.slac.stanford.edu Subject: RE: REPLIES SENT TO WHOLE LIST To: ECD-AT- SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Message-ID: <199610271547.HAA12631-AT- emerald.oz.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Alan, Please leave it the way it is! I agree that MOST messages go to the whole list, so the reply to the list should be the automatic one, and the reply to the sender, the one we have to futz with. I don't see that its all that much trouble to copy and paste an e-